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How Morrigan can get the child even if you refuse the ritual


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#176
Tirigon

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Wowlock wrote...

She is young,beautiful , manipulative , seductive , doesn't care about love , more into the intimate stuff.

That can explain it.


Wouldn´t that make everyone like her?

At least in Real Life the girls with these characteristics are usually the ones with the most lovers......

#177
Svest

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In Exile wrote...

Svest wrote...
All it is is an alternate ritual.  Besides, as i said it took me 5 min to come up with something slightly plausable, how long do you think it would take a real writer to come up with something good?  Not very.  You are right in that I'm pulling stuff out of my ass.  I'm not a writer and you guys are nitpicking what the hell do you expect?


It's slightly plausible in the same way my laser beam from space scenario is plausible: there are few things that explicitly contradict it, since you seem to reject reasonable inference as a possible critique.

Since what you did was actually good or plausible in any meaingful sense of the word, whether or not a real writer could even do it is up for debate.

We're not nitpicking. We're saying the idea is bad. You could re-animate Shakespeare and it wouldn't do you much good.

Actually, if you paid attention to the story in game we do have very strong indication of that.  Or how do you explain the AD's sould going to Morrigan's child when you perform the normal DR?  The warden is still closer to the AD, yet somehow the soul goes to Morrigan.  If you accept "magic" as the answer to this, then what's wrong with accepting it as the answer to the other problem?


According to David, what was supposed to happen is that the soul first goes to the Warden, and then goes to the baby. The Warden is a conduit, so to speak, and it is through that the Warden lives. Since this was cut for a variety of reasons, David said players are free to imagine what they like... but that is the authorial intent.

So we are right back to what I said responding to your first point.

And I don't accept "magic" as an answer to anything. Magic, in RPGs, is nothing like "poof" magic. It has rules; it's like metaphysical engineering.


LOL so what you're saying is that when you do the DR the old god's sould first goes into the Warden and then into Morrigan.  Hmm where have I heard that before?  Ohh yeah that's exactly what I said would happen for my proposed ritual too.  So why is it you are fine with the magic doing it one way but not another?  You are making no sense.  Just because you personally don't want the god child story line to continue (and I might even agree with you there) doesn't mean there doesn't exist a plausable way for it to happen.  You have rejected the idea of a god child outright and therefore will nitpick to find any flaw, no matter how minor, in any explanation offered for how it could happen.  At least Ryzaki's nitpicking is amusing, you're just spouting nonsense.

#178
Ryzaki

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Tirigon wrote...

Wowlock wrote...

She is young,beautiful , manipulative , seductive , doesn't care about love , more into the intimate stuff.

That can explain it.


Wouldn´t that make everyone like her?

At least in Real Life the girls with these characteristics are usually the ones with the most lovers......


There's a difference between liking someone and wanting to screw them. I'm sure she'd get a lot of the latter and but not so much of the former. Not many people like a b****.,

#179
In Exile

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Svest wrote...
LOL so what you're saying is that when you do the DR the old god's sould first goes into the Warden and then into Morrigan.  Hmm where have I heard that before?  Ohh yeah that's exactly what I said would happen for my proposed ritual too. 


No, you came up with some stupid "Morrigan is a sniper!" theory and she secretly carried out this elaborate blood magic ritual (according to David, that was what the ritual was supposed to be - it was cut to sex for the purpose of brevity) against his will.

Your theory is terrible not becaue it involves the soul going into the Warden and then into the baby through the power of the ritual, but because you want some contrived BS scenario where this always happens.

To be blunt: your attempt at a retcon is what is stupid, not David's process.

So why is it you are fine with the magic doing it one way but not another?  You are making no sense.  Just because you personally don't want the god child story line to continue (and I might even agree with you there) doesn't mean there doesn't exist a plausable way for it to happen. 


What the hell are you talking about? I happen to love the gold child, and actually hoped DA2 would go the voiced protagonist route not with Hawke, but with god child. I just want a cannon ending instead of a stupid ending.

You have rejected the idea of a god child outright and therefore will nitpick to find any flaw, no matter how minor, in any explanation offered for how it could happen.  At least Ryzaki's nitpicking is amusing, you're just spouting nonsense.


Or you could just be wrong. Yeah, let's go with you being wrong, since you apparently base all of this on my hating a character I like.

#180
Ahisgewaya

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Wowlock wrote...

She is young,beautiful , manipulative , seductive , doesn't care about love , more into the intimate stuff.

That can explain it.


Jealousy?

Modifié par Ahisgewaya, 21 juillet 2010 - 08:50 .


#181
Ahisgewaya

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Tirigon wrote...

Wowlock wrote...

She is young,beautiful , manipulative , seductive , doesn't care about love , more into the intimate stuff.

That can explain it.


Wouldn´t that make everyone like her?

At least in Real Life the girls with these characteristics are usually the ones with the most lovers......


Ah. clearly jealousy then.

#182
Ahisgewaya

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Ryzaki wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

Wowlock wrote...

She is young,beautiful , manipulative , seductive , doesn't care about love , more into the intimate stuff.

That can explain it.


Wouldn´t that make everyone like her?

At least in Real Life the girls with these characteristics are usually the ones with the most lovers......


There's a difference between liking someone and wanting to screw them. I'm sure she'd get a lot of the latter and but not so much of the former. Not many people like a b****.,


See, that's just it though. She didn't come off as a **** to me, just a very strong woman who sees no reason for love. Everything she does is practical and makes sense. If you take the time to actually, you know, be nice to her then she becomes a more interesting character, but she's never a normal person. That would be impossible with her upbringing, power, and intelligence. I really don't get why more people don't like her.

#183
Quinnzel

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Ahisgewaya wrote...

See, that's just it though. She didn't come off as a **** to me, just a very strong woman who sees no reason for love. Everything she does is practical and makes sense. If you take the time to actually, you know, be nice to her then she becomes a more interesting character, but she's never a normal person. That would be impossible with her upbringing, power, and intelligence. I really don't get why more people don't like her.


The bit that really made me love Morrigan is when, after shes told you the tale regarding the Mirror she stole (which Flemmeth destroyed) and you find one like it in Orzammar, giving her it she sounds truly thankful, and sad at the life she doesnt know, and is perhaps a small moment of genuine charecter redemeption for those that didnt already like her (IMO anyway)

Im totally biased in anycase. Claudia Black in anything makes me go all fuzzy inside.

Modifié par Quinnzel, 21 juillet 2010 - 09:13 .


#184
Ahisgewaya

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Quinnzel wrote...

Ahisgewaya wrote...

See, that's just it though. She didn't come off as a **** to me, just a very strong woman who sees no reason for love. Everything she does is practical and makes sense. If you take the time to actually, you know, be nice to her then she becomes a more interesting character, but she's never a normal person. That would be impossible with her upbringing, power, and intelligence. I really don't get why more people don't like her.


The bit that really made me love Morrigan is when, after shes told you the tale regarding the Mirror she stole (which Flemmeth destroyed) and you find one like it in Orzammar, giving her it she sounds truly thankful, and sad at the life she doesnt know, and is perhaps a small moment of genuine charecter redemeption for those that didnt already like her (IMO anyway)

Im totally biased in anycase. Claudia Black in anything makes me go all fuzzy inside.


Yeah, I like Claudia Black too. Maybe I'm seeing more Claudia than Morrigan when I look at her........

#185
Svest

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In Exile wrote...

Svest wrote...
LOL so what you're saying is that when you do the DR the old god's sould first goes into the Warden and then into Morrigan.  Hmm where have I heard that before?  Ohh yeah that's exactly what I said would happen for my proposed ritual too. 


No, you came up with some stupid "Morrigan is a sniper!" theory and she secretly carried out this elaborate blood magic ritual (according to David, that was what the ritual was supposed to be - it was cut to sex for the purpose of brevity) against his will.

Your theory is terrible not becaue it involves the soul going into the Warden and then into the baby through the power of the ritual, but because you want some contrived BS scenario where this always happens.

To be blunt: your attempt at a retcon is what is stupid, not David's process.

So why is it you are fine with the magic doing it one way but not another?  You are making no sense.  Just because you personally don't want the god child story line to continue (and I might even agree with you there) doesn't mean there doesn't exist a plausable way for it to happen. 


What the hell are you talking about? I happen to love the gold child, and actually hoped DA2 would go the voiced protagonist route not with Hawke, but with god child. I just want a cannon ending instead of a stupid ending.

You have rejected the idea of a god child outright and therefore will nitpick to find any flaw, no matter how minor, in any explanation offered for how it could happen.  At least Ryzaki's nitpicking is amusing, you're just spouting nonsense.


Or you could just be wrong. Yeah, let's go with you being wrong, since you apparently base all of this on my hating a character I like.


To be blunt: what you want doesn't matter.  You can wish and hope and pray for it to be cannonized, but its not going to happen.  Imported saves specifically rule out the possibility of a cannon.  That doesn't mean there won't be a god child, it simply means they will have to explain how it happened for the imported saves that didn't do the DR.  You can think that's stupid all you want, it doesn't change reality.

Modifié par Svest, 21 juillet 2010 - 11:14 .


#186
David Gaider

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May I put this to rest?

If the player didn't do the Dark Ritual, or didn't get Alistair or Loghain to do it, then it wasn't done. Had Morrigan figured out some way to otherwise do it, then nobody would have died when the Archdemon was slain. If she had some way to go about getting the Archdemon's soul without resorting to the Dark Ritual as she proposed it, then why did she go through all the trouble?

We could undoubtedly come up with some complex Plan B on Morrigan's part whereby she gets the Archdemon's soul but has to do something far more terrible-- but a) that removes the player's agency in the biggest single choice of Origins and B) would probably be pretty lame.

#187
WilliamShatner

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I guess that also puts to rest any speculation that Morrigan's child could be an upcoming big plotline.

#188
iTomes

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finally

#189
Tinxa

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THANK YOU:)

Finally no more "Everything HAS to be around the god child because the warden is the father and is searching for Morrigan" never mind all the other players who had female wardens, didn't do the ritual or had Ali/Loghain do it. And an end to neverending "Hawke is really the godchild" "Bethany is the godchild" "Flemeth is the godchild" :P

#190
Lucy Glitter

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THANKYOU

#191
PriscilaSSR

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YES. THANK YOU. Yay!

#192
Deviija

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OMG.  THANK YOU!  Image IPB 

#193
Kritanakom

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<3

#194
Andraste_Reborn

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Thank you! My primary Warden did make Alistair do the ritual, but I still don't want its outcome forced on every campaign.



*does happy dance*

#195
Quinnzel

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Aaaand naow all the fangirls come out to gloat *Gets hitting stick* lol, though Im finally glad to know (and really some of the speculation in this thread...totally out there)

#196
Who is that Masked Man

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And now David Gaider is outright lying to us! Obviously he has something to hide. This is yet further proof that the officially canonized Dark Ritual and the inevitable Old Gold Child that it has spawned will play an extremely important role in--

Kidding! Only kidding.

Modifié par Who is that Masked Man, 22 juillet 2010 - 12:37 .


#197
SDNcN

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Quinnzel wrote...

Aaaand naow all the fangirls come out to gloat *Gets hitting stick* lol, though Im finally glad to know (and really some of the speculation in this thread...totally out there)



The Ultimate Defense: "So Alistair, whose better in bed, Morrigan or the Warden?."

#198
Brockololly

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I guess this begs the question how big Morrigan's role could possibly be going forward if the OGB won't be made canon? The devs have said Morrigan's story isn't over yet, but does that mean it now goes in 2 wildly divergent ways, DR or no DR? That could be neat...

#199
Quinnzel

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SDNcN wrote...

Quinnzel wrote...

Aaaand naow all the fangirls come out to gloat *Gets hitting stick* lol, though Im finally glad to know (and really some of the speculation in this thread...totally out there)



The Ultimate Defense: "So Alistair, whose better in bed, Morrigan or the Warden?."


That would be an excellent defense but then I have to entertain the thought of Morrigan x Alistair and..and.. thats just downright wrong. Think ill keep the +3 Stick of Fangirl Doom ^_^

#200
iTomes

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if this remains an "we love morrigan" treat we propably are in trouble...... on the one side the fangirls, on the other the morrigan fanboys..... were doomed