64 réponses à ce sujet

[frost.mage.mari]

I'm a little concerned over the coming sequel, i'm sure it will be a good game in it's own right, but one thing that worries me is the story.  I'm not thinking that it will be a bad story, i trust Bioware enough to think they'll make a good story.  What i am worried about though, is if the story will be "ours".

I know that there's a distinct beginning/middle/end to the story.. there has to be some solid plot points for them to make story after all.  The things that i'm worried about is the voice acting for the main character(i'm sure many others have as well), and that i have heard that the game is planned to try to cut out all the "time wasting" portions so people can go from action point to action point.

I'll touch on the voice acting thing first.  In DA:O, i had felt that i was my character.  I was able to add my own voice to her, her own tones, her own take on the world.  With the upcoming sequel, i'm worried that it won't be my story at all, that it'll be the story bioware wants to tell about Hawke and i'm just the angel(or devil) on her shoulder, telling her to be angry or to be nice and then she takes it from there.  If i wanted to watch someone elses story from the sidelines, i'd just sit down with a good book and read that, or watch a movie...

I know they say we have an updated conversation wheel denoting tone, but even that takes away from it, in my opinion.  Many times in Dragon age, i could pick the same reply as other playthroughs, but the tone was always different.  In the different persuasion checks, sometimes i played her as being an innocent sorty(despite what happened) and was able to nudge hearts in the right(or rather, her) direction.. while others i played her like she was using double-talk and other wordplay to outwit people.  With the voice acting, there won't be any of that.. the "con the guy out of food" option will always be the same, the only way it will be different is if they give me an option for every way i want to con the guy out of his dinner and i don't see them putting in a nice-con, sly-con, mean-con, ect-con for every conversation.

Moving a little further though, people say that it's unfair to compare Hawke to Commandor Shepard, but i don't think it is.. For all intents, we were able to shape Shepards past in a form of an origin, we were able to choose her actions and large decisions... but at all points in the story, it was obvious that Shepard wasn't you, Shepard was Bioware's hero of the galaxy, we just guided her...  Is Hawke going to be the next Shepard? Bioware's story, Bioware's character and we're just the ones that get her from point A to point B, with perhaps a different disposition?

Enough about that though.. the next thing to touch on is the (reportedly) change to pacing in the game, that it's going to try to keep us moving from action point to action point.  When i think of this.. i think again of mass effect 2, we had the normandy and we went from planet to planet, had a few conversations, blew up things, then talked a little more, then blew up things again.  While giving us choice on what planet to visit first, it never felt very "free".  I didn't feel like i had a space ship and was cruising the galaxy, i felt that i was checking off a to-do list.  Will DA2 be the same way? Are we going to go out to do a mission, then go back to the hub and spend a few months(that will be narrated to us) until the next mission?

I really want this game to be a success.. but, from what's been said, decided and alluded to.. i'm just not feeling like this is going to be the game that DA:O was.. it already feels like it's being watered down and mainstreamed.  I hope i'm wrong.. please, prove me wrong Bioware.  Make this the RPG that we all want, make it possible for all of us to -be- Hawke, not just her concience.

Thank you for reading

[javierabegazo]

All I can say is wait for more news/videos to come out before prematurely crying "It's been watered down, etc."

[Narreneth]

The way you go about shaping Hawke is not the same as the way you went about shaping Shepard. The reason why people say it isn't fair is because the two are being handled completely differently. You didn't get to pick your name in DA:O either.

[Riona45]

frost.mage.mari wrote...
Moving a little further though, people say that it's unfair to compare Hawke to Commandor Shepard, but i don't think it is.. For all intents, we were able to shape Shepards past in a form of an origin, we were able to choose her actions and large decisions... but at all points in the story, it was obvious that Shepard wasn't you, Shepard was Bioware's hero of the galaxy, we just guided her...  Is Hawke going to be the next Shepard? Bioware's story, Bioware's character and we're just the ones that get her from point A to point B, with perhaps a different disposition?
 

The devs have said Hawke is a much less defined character than Shepard.  Right now they know more about the game than we do, so I'm going with what they've said.

Also, DA:O wasn't "mainstream?"

Modifié par Riona45, 20 juillet 2010 - 12:56 .

[Bobad]

Most importantly it's Dragon Age 2 not Dragon Age:Origins 2, the connotation in my mind being the same universe but a different game.

[MKDAWUSS]

Unless you personally wrote the plot and script, it isn't your story.

[Aggie Punbot]

frost.mage.mari wrote...
Many times in Dragon age, i could pick the same reply as other playthroughs, but the tone was always different.

And yet somehow the response was always exactly the same.

I appreciate the fact that you took the time to put forth these opinions in a polite manner but I just don't agree with any of them.  We don't know who the voice actors will be or what they sound like; we don't know how many options we'll get in the dialogue wheel; we've heard from the devs personally that Hawke will be less pre-defined that Commander Shepard.

Hows about we all just wait until we have more firm information to go on before we start claiming things are all that bad?

Modifié par TS2Aggie, 20 juillet 2010 - 01:04 .

[Mecha Tengu]

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Unless you personally wrote the plot and script, it isn't your story.

yep

we're paying for a video game that someone else wrote and created. Its not yours obviously. If you wanted your own perfect fantasy adventure, go write one yourself instead of complaining that Bioware isnt catering to your specific needs

[AlexXIV]

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Unless you personally wrote the plot and script, it isn't your story.

Well in that case I hope Bioware learns from their mistakes and next time let us write our own stories!

[Aggie Punbot]

As for the pacing, I don't agree with your concerns. I loved Dragon Age: Origins, but the pacing did tend to stall at times (the Fade and the Deep Roads quest spring immediately to mind).

[frost.mage.mari]

@javierabegazo - I'm not "crying", i'm forming an opinion based on what information i have available to me. Unfortunately, the information i have access to is not pleasing to me, so i am voicing that opinion and concerns that go along with that opinion. If Bioware and others take them to be worthwhile concerns or opinions that deserve answers or other thoughts, then all the better. Staying silent gets you nothing, only by letting those that make decisions know of your concerns early on can things become better.



@Narreneth - I'm not concerened about the name, honestly.. what's in a name, right? Hawke is a last name and is there for other people to talk to me. The only reason i was referring to the character by the last name is because that is the last name that Bioware picked for us all, and it would seem stupid for me to refer to the character we'll be playing as Nancy. And i'm just concerned that i'll be the voice in the back of her head, rather than be the character. Having voice acting that always plays out the same way can be -very- limiting when playing a role-playing game.

[Mecha Tengu]

AlexXIV wrote...

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Unless you personally wrote the plot and script, it isn't your story.

Well in that case I hope Bioware learns from their mistakes and next time let us write our own stories!

pffft, half the community will write terrible marrsuefapfic stories with the awesome protagonist that has a power level of >9000 and rapes everything, is the complete good guy and knows exactly what to do and gets laid with rommance option

[tallon1982]

Um technically speaking you did have a voice in DAO you picked it during character creation.

[frost.mage.mari]

*Smile* There's been a few who are making the comment that unless i write it, it's not my story. I have to both agree and disagree. Yes it's bioware who crafted the over-arcing story, and coded the game.. but it was me(and everyone else) who made the story flow to what we wanted. I could choose to spare, kill or help the werewolves in the forest. Actively shaping which way the story plays makes it my story because my story won't nessacarily be the same as someone elses.

And to a comment made earlier, i know it seems silly to think of a character using the same response in a different tone, because that response will always end up the same in the game. I can't help that.. but, when voice acting enters into it.. if it was "give me the food or you'll end up face first on the floor" or "please sir, i'm ever so hungry", it will always be those voice-overs. This is why i truly hope that Bioware does a wonderful job on this part. If they can give us several voiced responses to each problem that convey an array of different emotions other than "strong arm him" or "smooth talk him", then i will be happy.

Um technically speaking you did have a voice in DAO you picked it during character creation.

In the blandest sense, yes.. but having a character spout two lines in a battle or when i go to pick something up isn't exactly what i would called a "voiced character".

Modifié par frost.mage.mari, 20 juillet 2010 - 01:17 .

[London]

I'm a little concerned about the voice acting of the main character, because I think it really does break immersion for the player. I think voiced protagonists have largely been very annoying (sorry Tidus, I'll take my silent Cloud any day). This at least makes you feel that the Companions are reacting to YOU and not a completely scripted part.



I really enjoyed scriped RPG's like Final Fantasy IV, VI, VII, etc. where nothing you do will change the story - your role as the player is to just sit through it and observe. But after DA:O I've really grown attached to the concept of feeling more like I *am* the protagonist, and not just pressing buttons as the protagonist says whatever he wants. I hope this feeling continues in DA2.



That said, I'm NOT concerned that they are confining us to Hawke with a pre-determined origin. Though we had 6 origins in DA:O, it didn't change the fact that we still didn't completely build a character from scratch. The Human Noble was always the younger Cousland. You couldn't roleplay any other role from Castle Cousland - you were stuck in the background the game created for you. The only difference is, is that players got 6 backgrounds they could get stuck in. But, once in this background you're no better off than Hawke is now.



If DA2 treats Hawke as DA:O treats your Warden after leaving your 1-2 hour Origin story scenerio (which is also mostly scripted), then I have a lot of faith that it will be "Our Hawke", and not "Bioware's Hawke."

[Malanek]

frost.mage.mari wrote...
Enough about that though.. the next thing to touch on is the (reportedly) change to pacing in the game, that it's going to try to keep us moving from action point to action point.  When i think of this.. i think again of mass effect 2, we had the normandy and we went from planet to planet, had a few conversations, blew up things, then talked a little more, then blew up things again.  While giving us choice on what planet to visit first, it never felt very "free".  I didn't feel like i had a space ship and was cruising the galaxy, i felt that i was checking off a to-do list.  Will DA2 be the same way? Are we going to go out to do a mission, then go back to the hub and spend a few months(that will be narrated to us) until the next mission?

I want them to at least look at the pacing. They could have paced things a little bit better just by removing the incentives to back track. I'm thinking about in the fade where you had to unlock the spirit form and then go back to pick up all the attribute points, or in the deeproads to assemble topsiders honour. I think they overdid some of those random encounters during overaland travel as well.

I thought ME2 pacing was brilliant. The only comment I would make on it in regards to this is everything felt a bit symetrical. It went recruitment then loyalty for each character with too little main plot involved. However I don't think this is directly to do with the pacing.

Modifié par Malanek999, 20 juillet 2010 - 01:20 .

[tallon1982]

It's still voiced and gives you the idea of what they sound like. I honestly don't care if it's a fully voiced game. If the story is good and the characters in the game have interesting backgrounds that's fine. It shouldn't make the game horrible if there is a voice for who you're playing.

[London]

As far as "time wasting" what exactly is time wasting? Sitting around in Camp, exploring towns and hoping the characters start talking to each other was some of my favorite moments in DA:O.



I hope we don't get thrown into one dungeon to another.

[Mecha Tengu]

Malanek999 wrote...


I thought ME2 pacing was brilliant. The only comment I would make on it in regards to this is everything felt a bit symetrical. It went recruitment then loyalty for each character with too little main plot involved. However I don't think this is directly to do with the pacing.

what

 ME2 was basically get a squad, deal with their issues, GTFO to mass relay

[Wishpig]

Rest assured Frost... Hawke will offer more "freedom" then shepard according to the devs. Shepard had a very defined role, he's a marine with a very specific goal. This is not the case with Hawke, both personality wise and story-wise, you will have more freedom.



Will it be YOUR story... not as much as DA:O was, ultimately it will be always be Hawke's story. But supposedly we'll have more options then in ME.

[Malanek]

Mecha Tengu wrote...

Malanek999 wrote...


I thought ME2 pacing was brilliant. The only comment I would make on it in regards to this is everything felt a bit symetrical. It went recruitment then loyalty for each character with too little main plot involved. However I don't think this is directly to do with the pacing.

what

 ME2 was basically get a squad, deal with their issues, GTFO to mass relay

What do you disagree with? Did you think the main plot in ME2 was deep? Or do you think this is directly related to the pacing?

[Mecha Tengu]

ME2 plot wasnt a plot, but it was a nice collection of facts and opinions of people in the ME2 universe. Pacing was ok I Guess

[Dick Delaware]

TS2Aggie wrote...

frost.mage.mari wrote...
Many times in Dragon age, i could pick the same reply as other playthroughs, but the tone was always different.

And yet somehow the response was always exactly the same.

This is important to consider. Imagining a different voice that isn't there isn't role-playing. You're getting the exact same responses back and doing the exact same quests, so you're not really experiencing situations any differently. Any depth that you get is what you have imagined. It's like playing a D&D game, creating a chaotic good Drow Ranger, and all of a sudden deciding that you're playing as Drizz't Do'Urden, even though nobody in the game responds to you as such. It's all stuff that you made up.

You have laid things out in an articulate manner, but I have to agree with Aggie here. It kinda reminds me of Oblivion fans claiming that Oblivion allows deep roleplaying because they can enter a temple and pretend to pray with their character. Yeah, they actually do this:

http://www.uesp.net/...ion:Roleplaying

"Give your character a personality with preferred foods, activities, and clothes. What creature or race does he/she hate/like the most?"

[frost.mage.mari]

tallon1982 wrote...

It's still voiced and gives you the idea of what they sound like. I honestly don't care if it's a fully voiced game. If the story is good and the characters in the game have interesting backgrounds that's fine. It shouldn't make the game horrible if there is a voice for who you're playing.

The game being good or bad isn't what i'm truly worried about, i said at the beginning that i'm sure it will be a good game.

I'm not thinking you understand my concern over why i'm against the main character being voice acted(to the person i quoted).  I don't expect everyone to, of course.  Not everyone is big into role-playing.  I'm an avid role-playing fan though, if a game can make me feel like i'm guiding the story, that i'm the person on the screen, i have alot more fun.. having a voiceover for all her conversations takes a little bit of that away.

[frost.mage.mari]

*smiles* i'm glad that i can get people talking here. I know alot of people will disagree with me and i'd have it no other way.

Maybe in a months time, bioware will show me something that will put all my fears and apprehentions(i'm sure i spelled that wrong...) to rest. In truth, i hope they do! I just felt that as a fan of bioware, i should give my opinion to their new game and give them one more voice to take into consideration in the final crafting of the game.

And for the oblivion thing, i wouldn't say that i'd go that far, at least not in this setting.. in an MMO-roleplaying server, all bets are off.

Modifié par frost.mage.mari, 20 juillet 2010 - 01:42 .