93 réponses à ce sujet

[kyleh613]

I feel like NWN2 has a lot of flaws, other then Mask of the Betrayer, the other two single player campaigns were very weak. Where NWN2 really excelled however was in the modding community. Being able to make your own worlds with the powerful tool set was great.Assuming you had a high resolution, large monitor, or two. The tool set while good had a clunky and confusing interface that took up way to much screen space. This made it difficult to work with, but people seemed to get around it just fine, because there are some really impressive user created worlds out there. But i'm going to get around to why this ended up not account for much in a minute here.

The difficulty in finding this user created content was also a problem. There are some good fan sites, but it would have been nice if Bioware and obsidian set up a way in game to download this stuff. As it is right now, you can do it by connecting to a server that has the files you want, from the in-game server browser, but it can be hit or miss on whether or not it works and it can be slow.

The graphics engine, while beautiful, is horribly unoptimized, and in crowded towns the frame rate can really suffer. But I am still amazed at how great the game can look even today, despite it being what, 3 years old now? NWN2 is a really great looking RPG still.

The online community also never really took off and this is my biggest complaint, but I can't really fault the game for this. I really don't know why it didnt thrive. I mean you would think a game like this would sell very well and keep its players for a real long time. I just don't understand what happened, but the online community for the most part is dead. There just are not enough interesting servers to connect to. All of the at least half way decent ones are gone now.

I guess what it really came down to was that creating servers for this game and maintaining them was just to expensive for the player and to complex. Hosting a server is costly especially for a game like this one that can support up to I believe 128 players at once. That just can't work unless Obsidian/Atari, and the other companies involved were willing to help the community out but they weren't. For the most part they released this game, made some content for it and then called it good. They really never got involved with their playerbase or listened to us. We went largely ignored once the game came out.

I wish NWN2 would end up on Steam. At one point it looked like it was going to, but at this point I doubt that will ever happen. If it did though I think it would bring in a lot of new players and that would help a ton.

I know that is a big negative write up, but i'm not going to go into the positives, those have already been discussed in this thread and the fact that i'm still playing the game and have been since its release day says something about its quality overall.

Modifié par kyleh613, 15 août 2010 - 02:56 .

[The Fred]

Afaik, it was pretty much down to its bad release. There was a veritable dearth of advertising, PWs and custom modules of any quality obviously took a long time to spring up - meaning many people had moved on before having chance to try them, if they even knew they existed - and some really bad bugs and gameplay issues which have now been patched out turned a lot of people right off.

[dorquemada]

There's yet another aspect of NWN2 - its multitude of classes, what means tons of builds that offer distinct and different approach to the game and consequently high replayability.

[BigfootNZ]

The Fred wrote...

The problem with the 3D films is the big variation in the quality. I've seen a couple of kinda dodgy ones. Apparently some have really nice 3D effects, though.
.

Not sure exactly what you mean, but the '3d' as in true 3d with the glass etc  needs to be designed for within the film... the thing is alot of films that arent 3D films are made '3d' to cash in on the recent hype with 3d films (Alice in Wonderland was one), and they dont work well at all because of it, its like taking all the old NWN1 textures and running them through a normal map filter... sure they can be used in nwn2 and they look for the most part ok, but most look naff since they where never made to begin with, with normal mapping in mind so errors and oddities pop up constantly.

I have nothing against 3d cinema if the film is designed with that in mind, its the gross attempt to cash in by movie execs that makes me swear never to watch a 3d film ever, and think it'll just go the way of a fad in the next few years.

We still have paintings hanging in galleries... we'll still have 2d film and tv for a long time to come. If i want 3d and immersion, ill stick my head out a window.

[Adam024]

I might add this- I have been playing the game since it was released (I think in 2006) and I am continually finding new things that I have missed! Amazing job on this game! Love it!!!

[ironeye]

i love the game. i never get anywhere close to beating it because i make new char all the time

[Primalrose]

Worth playing a couple times? Sure. Original campaign better then NWN1, Mask of the Betrayer was even better and the real highlight, Storm of Zehir never played. But a horrible launch, the toolset fiasco, the much deeper complexity of the toolset made the game kinda bomb. The toolset is way more customizable but very complex compared to the first, which is a double edged sword. I lost interest in the game a while back but come back every now and then, because I'm fond of the glory days of NWN1. I would still recommend buying this game, any RPG fan should.

[MagickalMia]

I like the game, but the bugs within the game do annoy me a lot at times... Even with the latest version it is a pain to get the party to do what you want in combat.

[Ovenall]

I'm enjoying it, but there's a lot of bugs. So far nothing game breaking, but definitely annoying. Some spoiler-free examples:



• Some enemies never become hostile, and will ignore you completely as you kill them. This happens often.



• Enemy textures disappear sometimes and enemies look solid black.



• Fire effects sometimes continue long after they should be gone. I got hit with a fire spell and kept "burning" for about ten real time minutes, until I exited and reloaded.



• Voice over cuts out once in a while. A couple times I had to reload to get any voices whatsoever.



Some non-bugs but general annoyances:



• The party is often difficult to control and the camera is twitchy and annoying. I'm getting the hang of party control more and more, but it's still non-intuitive and clumsy.



• Sometimes you'll spot a group of enemies in the distance, and set up some tactical positioning and long distance spell casting to get the jump on them. Then suddenly a cut scene triggers and the stuff you did just "never happened." There's no way to tell when this will happen.



• You can see into other rooms from time to time when you should not be able to.



I'm still enjoying the game, but the bugs and annoyances are really starting to stack up and the enjoyment is fading. I'm on my first playthrough. Also, the game is really easy. I've been playing on Hardcore D&D mode and have only had one character die once. I'm not bragging, in fact I'd say I'm only an average player of games skill-wise. It's just much easier than NWN1 or the BG games, for instance.

[nicethugbert]

A lot of wasted potential is what I see as the negative aspect of NWN2, much of it inherited from NWN1, an older version of NWN1 no less. Custom Content is expected to be a cornerstone of the game yet there is lots of arbitrary limits hardcoded into the game that sabotages custom content creation and frustrate modders. The entire spellbook system is a clear example of that especially when contrasted with the feat system, which could have been used to make the spellbook system.



The custom weapon system is gimped. The stacking system doesn't let you follow the D&D rules, forget making your own stacking rules. AB caps, PrC level caps, all the caps ruin any sort of custom progression. Etc.

[Ovenall]

You know, I'm going to go against the grain here and say the class and character building system is too open. I'm pretty sure I'm in the minority with this opinion.



There are so many choices that it's mind-boggling. Reading FAQs helps some, but personally I can't get so devoted into games so as to become an expert on spreadsheets of statistics. Eventually my eyes glaze over and I just choose something. Again, since the original campaign has been so easy so far, I don't think it's hard to create a character that works. But the sheer wide open giganticness of the system is a bit of a drawback to me. How does a character have 4+ class abilities, and how will it gimp your experience points, etc. ad infinitum...



And I know it's a fantasy make believe game, but it just seems ridiculous that a character can become experienced in the middle of a dungeon and magically and suddenly be able to open locks, or start casting spells when their previous experience is as a barbarian head-basher... Just kind of silly. Or overnight while in a forest obtain monk abilities, or be able to turn into an animal.. etc., etc...

[nicethugbert]

It can't be open when it's loaded with dead ends. I see your point of view from a player's perspective. But, when you try to mod the game, you will constantly bang your head against arbitrary limits.



It's true that there are a lot of classes but there are few notable differences. It's the same in D&D but NWN2 is a small subset of D&D so once you understand your choices, it all collapses into a much smaller set than initially encountered. That's a big part of why I often play a pure cleric. If it's a SoZ type party then I make a pure rogue, pure warlock, and another pure cleric. If my clerics don't take animal domain, then I make them Storm Lords, unless I feel like making a cleric of Correllon Larethian. There is little reason to multi-class except in specific circumstances. In most cases a rogue, a warlock, and 2 clerics will do great. If the game had only those three classes, 99% of the time I wouldn't miss the rest. Few module builders make modules where the loss of the other classes would matter. You might prefer some other classes. But it would be the same situation.



D&D has in addition to arcane, divine, and invocation magic, True Naming, Incarmum, Pact Magic, Shadow Magic, and Psionics. There is also Dual Spellcasting Progression, Tome of Battle and other systems.



If The Devs had implemented one class for each of these systems then we would have a lot of choice. I would rather have more feats for the base classes than more PrCs in many cases, especially the stuff that is impossible for us to make.

[Ovenall]

I'm currently on my first ever NWN2 character. After reading some FAQs I went with one level of fighter and now I'm at 8 levels of Bard. I'm considering trying a Red Dragon Disciple, but roleplay wise I just don't get it.



And again, there's the easy factor. As Fighter 1, Bard 8 I have never died. I take off armor and shield to cast buff spells and a few times I forgot to put it back on. I went through fights in my underwear and still didn't die. I took a little more damage, but nothing too drastic. With the multiclassing, having 1 level Fighter lets you wear any armor. So what's the drawback to going Bard? And why would anyone go pure Fighter?



Maybe I just don't get the multiclassing, but I'm not a powergamer. I don't want to have to figure out how to "game" the game and max out a bunch of numbers... I want to play, dammit.

[painofdungeoneternal]

You don't have to.



Just because options are there, does not mean you need expertise in all of it to enjoy the game, the game is designed so you can just use a fighter, rogue, cleric or wizard and not be limited in any way. The other classes are really variants of those, which add limitations in return for extra boosts which make the game play different.



Lots of options which can just be ignored, they are not a requirement. But it adds replay value, in that it allows things you can't do as a pure character. But you can spend years exploring the options in just pure classes before splashing other classes, or you might stumble upon a PRC that matches up with what you want to roleplay.



Later games get harder as you get the expansions, or play things from the vault or on PW's. Even then a pure character, if you know what you are doing ( as in what armor to wear, what to cast or other details ) will work just fine. But by then you will understand how things work and can start branching out into other prc's as needed.

[The Fred]

The annoying thing with a lot of the hardcoded limitations is that a lot of them are things they really should have known better about. Spellbooks for example are much improved over NWN1, where you couldn't really do PrC spell progression properly. So they've clearly looked at spells and thought "people like spell-casting PrCs, let's allow them to make those" which is great, but then completely missed the fact that people would also like new spell-casting base classes. That's just an example but there are loads of places where they've "soft-coded" things which were hardcoded in NWN1 (which is great, by the way, so hats off to them for that) but then left hardcoded dead-ends just a bit further along. It's not so much that the game is littered with bad things, but that it could have been full of so much more good things. As NTB put it, wasted potential.
As for the difficulty, I think it's designed so that a person who doesn't understand the rules can come along and throw together a bad character and still do OK and not get destroyed. However, this frustrates the experienced players a bit who want to be challenged and want to be motivated to make awesome chars. After all, if you're saying you really don't understand the classes and yet you still managed to thrash mobs with no armour on, that says something (I mean I'm in favour of the game being accessible to new people, but dying and realising you died because you weren't wearing armour is, to my mind, fair game - however experienced you are, that's just common sense ).

[Ovenall]

Update- I'm enjoying NWN2 more and more.



The beginning is just really slow. But now I'm in Neverwinter doing various quests there (extremely minor spoiler: I'm still trying to get into Blacklake) And it has gotten much more interesting.



I'm way better at controlling the party now, though it's still frustrating that there seems to be no way at all to get characters to not run off attacking other than going into Puppet Mode. I use the Broadcast Commands all the time, which I find faster than finding the correct slot on the hotbars. But really, there should be a way to quickly toggle Puppet Mode. I cast an are effect spell and still sometimes my guys will run into the fire, requiring a pause and manually have them run out of it. Yes, this is frustrating, BUT...



I have the magic user NPC now (trying to be spoiler-free) and the game is even easier. Again, I'm on Hardcore mode. Having the long distance damaging spells has made the game even easier than before. I now have almost no damage done to any of my characters in any of the battles. The ONLY time I get damage, and the one death I've had so far is when a character ran off and I didn't notice. OK, I get a little health chipped away on a few characters from time to time. With the area effect spells it's sometimes really hard to see where your characters are. So, the OC is still really easy.



Minor nit-pick: Too many magic items. Not Diablo-level magic drops, but still they are a little too common for my taste. Not a big deal, but thought I'd mention it.

[Drewskie]

Concerning Bg/bg2 &IWD, I'd have more trouble going back to 2nd edition d&d rules than with the graphics. They are only dated in that they aren't 3d. They still look good.



NWN2 is a good game... it just needs a couple more patches.

[Wintermist]

My opinion is that this is definately one of the best RPG's so far!

[miltos33]

I was one of the lucky ones who got the game in late 2007 when Mask of the Betrayer was released. As most of the bugs that plagued the initial release had been ironed out by then I really enjoyed the game and until I was distracted by Fallout 3 in late 2008 I hardly played anything else.