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[AntiChri5]

Grommash94 wrote...

AntiChri5 wrote...

 

The Codex.....

More than half the wealth of Orzammar comes from a single, extremely rare substance: Lyrium. The Chantry believes it to be the "Waters of the Fade" mentioned in the Canticle of Threnodies, the very stuff of creation itself, from whence the Maker fashioned the world. Only a handful of Mining Caste families hazard extracting the ore, finding veins in the Stone quite literally by ear. For in its raw form, lyrium sings, and the discerning can hear the sound even through solid rock.
Even though dwarves have a natural resistance, raw lyrium is dangerous for all but the most experienced of the Mining Caste to handle. Even for dwarves, exposure to the unprocessed mineral can cause deafness or memory loss. For humans and elves, direct contact with lyrium ore produces nausea, blistering of the skin, and dementia. Mages cannot even approach unprocessed lyrium. Doing so is invariably fatal.
Despite its dangers, lyrium is the single most valuable mineral currently known. In the Tevinter Imperium, it has been known to command a higher price than diamond. The dwarves sell very little of the processed mineral to the surface, giving the greater portion of what they mine to their own smiths, who use it in the forging of all truly superior dwarven weapons and armor. What processed lyrium is sold on the surface goes only to the Chantry, who strictly control the supply. From the Chantry, it is dispensed both to the templars, who make use of it in tracking and fighting maleficarum, and to the Circle.
In the hands of the Circle, lyrium reaches its fullest potential. Their Formari craftsmen transform it into an array of useful items from the practical, such as magically hardened stones for construction, to the legendary silver armor of King Calenhad.
When mixed into liquid and ingested, lyrium allows mages to enter the Fade when fully aware, unlike all others who reach it only when dreaming. Such potions can also be used to aid in the casting of especially taxing spells, for a short time granting a mage far greater power than he normally wields.
Lyrium has its costs, however. Prolonged use becomes addictive, the cravings unbearable. Over time, templars grow disoriented, incapable of distinguishing memory from present, or dream from waking. They frequently become paranoid as their worst memories and nightmares haunt their waking hours. Mages have additionally been known to suffer physical mutation: The magister lords of the Tevinter Imperium were widely reputed to have been so affected by their years of lyrium use that they could not be recognized by their own kin, nor even as creatures that had once been human.
--From In Pursuit of Knowledge: The Travels of a Chantry Scholar, by Brother Genetivi

Take note of the bolded parts......I think the taint is simply an unexpected result of the attempt to enter the fade, which used agreat deal of Blood Magic and Lyrium.

Source

Interesting. It only says that they suffer from a physical mutation though. The Darkspawn are mindless, only driven to free the Old Gods.

Dont forget how connected our body and minds are. A physical change could certainly alter an individuals brain, destroying identity and making them vulnerable to whatever psychic call the Old Gods send out.

[Grommash94]

True. Still, it would be strange if no one would have made the connection; if the Tevinter mages knew of it, then they would probably stop all experimentation with lyrium and the fade.

[AntiChri5]

And then their power base begins to dissolve.



They were the rulers of Thedas' greatest empire, and built that rule on their command of magic (including blood magic).



It was only when the first Blight hit that their power started to wane.

[Grommash94]

Mmm. But, there is nothing in the article that says that the deformations are contagious.



Then again, in a world like Thedas, where the lore isn't always clearly defined, anything is possibl.e

[AntiChri5]

It was....ummm...the Blood Magic.......yeah......

[Kaiser Shepard]

My guess is that the taint is the result of the Magister entering the Fade with their physical bodies, and when they were cast out by the entity know as the Maker some part of the Fade essentially clung unto them.



I have another theory on this one, but that one would be nonsensical without a decent knowledge of Elven lore, so I'll keep that one away from here.

[Daxne Kettel_]

Here's what I think is the truth behind the Darkspawn:

Andraste was not the Maker's chosen, nor was she his bride. She was an escaped slave from Tevinter, but instead of being divine or chosen by the Maker, she was instead a powerful mage, and, instead of leading a "holy march" against the Imperium, she wanted to get back at them for what they did to her, so she called forth and army and  prepared to assault the Tevinter Imperium. Realizing that the Tevinter Imperium was strong and fortified, Andraste called on ancient blood magic (perhaps as ancient as Morrigan's Blood Ritual), and brought down a terrible and viral plague that swept through Tevinter. Instead of killing the victims, however, it transformed them into twisted and monstrous creatures. The first Darkspawn. These first darkspawn fled and vanished deep underground to find the Old God Dumat. When they did, they emerged onto the surface and began attacking the Tevinter Imperium. The First Blight. When it was finally quelled, Tevinter lay in ruins. Andraste then chose to make her assault. However, her husband, Maferath, found out about her blood magic, and decided to use this to his advantage. He betrayed her to the Tevinter Imperium, explaining that she had been the cause of their downfall. He offered to give her to them so that they could have their revenge. In return, the Tevinters let him keep the territory that she conquered. The Tevinters agreed to this deal, and so Andraste was captured by the Tevinters and burned at the stake. Her remains were then put in a simple jar and discarded. 

Many years later, the Chantry somehow discovered her remains, and, realizing that these ashes were of the "Maker's chosen," they brought it to an ancient temple, and put the ashes in a more ornate urn. However, while inside the temple, they happened to find many books written by Andraste. What the priests read horrified them. In great detail, Andraste wrote how she was a mage who had cursed the Tevinters with a vile plague that transformed many of them into monsters, and unintentionally started a near-apocalyptic invasion of the land. Realizing that this knowledge would lead to the Chantry's downfall, the priests destroyed any sort of evidence linking to the truth about Andraste. They then wrote a fictional work called, "The Chant of Light," and claimed that it had been written by Andraste herself. Her remains were then blessed by the priests to have extraordinary healing powers, and the truth about Andraste died with these old priests. The Chantry continued to worship Andraste, completely oblivious to the hypocrisy that they were living regarding blood magic.    

[Daxne Kettel_]

Then there is the matter of where Andraste learned such a terrible spell. Its creator whispered to her from across the Fade, called to her in her dreams. It promised her vengeance against the Imperium. That was all Andraste needed to hear in order to give all of her attention to it. The owner of this voice was a forgotten Old God, one that had long been forgotten in the minds of the Tevinter Imperium. In the records, only seven Old Gods were worshipped. They were known as:


Dumat, the Dragon of Silence and the archdemon of the First Blight
 
Zazikel, the Dragon of Chaos and the archdemon of the Second Blight
 
Toth, the Dragon of Fire and the archdemon of the Third Blight
 
Andoral, the Dragon of Chains and the archdemon of the Fourth Blight
 
Urthemiel, the Dragon of Beauty and the archdemon of the Fifth Blight
 
Razikale, the Dragon of Mystery
 
Lusacan, the Dragon of Night 

However, there was an eighth Old God, one whom had been forgotten in the minds of the Tevinters because of the terrible deed he had done against his fellow Old Gods. This forgotten Old God was known as Duran, the Dragon of Desire, and the youngest of the Old Gods. Originally, the eight Old Gods had arrived in Thedas from the Fade, summoned by an unknown godly force as the guardians of the land. From their sections (or island spots) in the Black City, they would watch over Thedas and protect it. The Old Gods taught the races of Thedas the secrets of magic, but implored them to use it carefully, as it could be as much as a curse as it was a gift. However, one Old God did not agree with this. Duran was disgusted by his brothers' caution. They themselves had utilized magic freely, and it had given them great potential and power. He did not understand why the mortal races had to be treated so differently. Whast he failed to realize, however, is that man is, by his very nature, corrupt. Duran also was appalled by the way that things were run. Heinous acts were looked upon far too mercifully, in his opinion. He was never a big part of making decisions, as most of his decisions led to catastrophic consequences. The final straw was when The Old Gods were deciding on how to deal with man's flaws and heinous crimes they had committed over the centuries. Duran, without consulting his brothers, entered the mortal realm and laid waste to several human regions, killing many. The other Old Gods were outraged at their youngest for behaving so foolishly violent and giving people the wrong idea about them. As such, Duran was kicked out of the Black City, and out of the Fade, punished to roam the mortal realm for eternity. Enraged and aggrieved, Duran plotted his return and revenge against his older brothers for what they did to him. And he did return, many years later. He broke his way into the Fade and surprised his brothers with his presence. He then proceeded to curse them all into eternal rest. He then spirited them all away deep into the underground Deep Roads, where the dwarves lived. As the Old Gods slept, their spirits still roamed the Fade, and they called for help; anyone who would awaken them. Duran detected these cries for help, and he finally decided to put his plan into action; have his brothers killed, and then he alone would be the single guardian of Thedas. He could rule it in whatever way he wished. Make whatever decisions he wanted. But he needed someone to take the fall for it all; to draw as little attention to himself as possible. It was then that he sensed an angry woman's spirit roaming across the Fade as she dreamt, wanting vengeance on the Tevinter Imperium. This woman was none other than Andraste, the supposed "Maker's chosen." Duran spoke to her in her dreams one night, and offered her a chance to get her revenge on the Tevinter Imperium. However, he did not tell her his true plans. He taught her a terrible magic curse that would make any who were afflicted by it become mindless beasts, twisted monsters with the desire to destroy all life. Blinded by her burning passion for revenge, Andraste accepted Duran's teachings without question. Thus, Andraste cast the dreaded curse, and the Darkspawn came into being. In secret, however, Duran had command over the darkspawn hordes. He ordered them to go underground and seek out the Old Gods. They would then awaken the first one they found, tainting it with their curse, and binding it to them. The Old God, now a vessel of evil, would lead the darkspawn in a full-scale invasion of the land; a Blight. Duran then quitely slept in the Black City, waiting; waiting for his time. The Old Gods would invade the land, and each time, be killed, and the darkspawn driven back. After all seven of his brothers were dead, Duran would finally awaken, and reveal himself to all the mortals. The land of Thedas would be his to do with as he pleased. It could be run the way he wanted it to be run.

[BelSirk]

Daxne, if i remember correctly, thouhg a timeline could be neat for be sure, Andraste come after the first blight (and the first blight stay almost a full age)

Another thing, Avernus say clearly that Darkspawn are aliens to the fade's spirits

The taint it's the clave, maybe the Enchanter's didn't become darkspawn but instead ghoul, but  ghouls + captive slaves (Females and males) = Broodmother  birth

Modifié par BelSirk, 22 juillet 2010 - 12:22 .

[Weldridge]

I believe, that the "Old Gods" were corrupt to begin with and created the darkspawn OUT OF the races of world. They were very powerful, and very old dragons that had an extremely high intelligence and rare powers. After doing so they were banished deep within the world by the Maker and the darkspawn were imprisoned as well and the "key" to the prison was kept in the Golden City within the fade. And when the mages breached the City attempting to free the old gods, the darkspawn were loosed and began their search within the deep roads for their lost masters.

Just my thoughts, it seems to fit, but nobody really knows.

Modifié par Weldridge, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:10 .

[In Exile]

The taint is a magical kind of sustenance for the darkspawn. According to David, the darkspawn do not need to eat - they're fueled in some sense by the taint. Avernus argues that the taint is separate from demons, who have and can counter blood magic.

Personally, I think the old gods (and possibly the Maker) are Fade spirits, and I think the Fade itself is a Jungian collective unconscious. The Fade spirits come into being because we will them, and they exist as independent entities from then on. My theory is that the old gods are like Wynne - a spirit in a mortal shell, but in this case a male dragon instead of a person. Of course, this fails to explain the taint. I think the darkspawn taint is magical in nature insofar as it is the result of will and desire, but I happen to think that physically entering the Fade effectively allowed the mages to become pure will, and they lost their forms and became something else.

[MaaZeus]

Gill Kaiser wrote...

My opinion is that the Chantry myth is true to some extent. The problem was probably caused by one of the Tevinter Imperium's magical experiments. I don't think the Maker exists, though, so any result would have been a result of the rules of the Fade and magic. The Darkspawn are a kind of macroviral species that is able to perpetuate itself once released via parasitisation of other species. I assume the first Darkspawn were formed through some kind of magical mutation as a result of a Blood Magic ritual gone horribly wrong.
I basically think of the creation of the Darkspawn as the magical equivalent of the Chernobyl meltdown.

This is what I think too. Perhaps their attempt to enter Fade physically tore their souls out and mutilated their bodies to viral and tainted monsters like Darkspawn, or something like that.
Though I DO think Maker exists, after all the Golden/Black City exists too. (I would be really curious if the Black City lore would be expanded, very interesting stuff) But is Maker something Chantry preaches (IE. God) or just a very powerful spirit, this remains to be seen. And does Maker have anything to do with appearance of the Darkspawn, also unknown.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 25 juillet 2010 - 06:48 .

[Daxne Kettel_]

BelSirk wrote...

Daxne, if i remember correctly, thouhg a timeline could be neat for be sure, Andraste come after the first blight (and the first blight stay almost a full age)

Another thing, Avernus say clearly that Darkspawn are aliens to the fade's spirits

The taint it's the clave, maybe the Enchanter's didn't become darkspawn but instead ghoul, but  ghouls + captive slaves (Females and males) = Broodmother  birth

Crap. My bad.

[Blacklash93]

It has something to do with the Golden/Black City and the Magisters and... that's all we know for sure.

[Tommy6860]

"The Darkspawn are a race of mostly-humanoid tainted creatures that dwell in the Deep Roads. According to the Chantry, they were created when the magisters of the Tevinter Imperium opened a portal into the Golden City, tainting the realm of the Maker with their corruption and returning as the darkspawn, their evil transfiguring them into the monsters they became. When they uncover one of the Old Gods, they expose it to the taint, changing it into an archdemon, which then leads them in an attack against the surface world called a Blight. The darkspawn are perhaps the greatest single threat to all of Thedas; they are bloodthirsty, exceptionally numerous and willing to indiscriminately kill or corrupt all in their path. "

More Reading

Modifié par Tommy6860, 01 avril 2011 - 01:58 .

[Darth Executor]

Daxne Kettel wrote...

BelSirk wrote...

Daxne, if i remember correctly, thouhg a timeline could be neat for be sure, Andraste come after the first blight (and the first blight stay almost a full age)

Another thing, Avernus say clearly that Darkspawn are aliens to the fade's spirits

The taint it's the clave, maybe the Enchanter's didn't become darkspawn but instead ghoul, but  ghouls + captive slaves (Females and males) = Broodmother  birth

Crap. My bad.

You were just pulling stuff out of your behind anyway so it doesn't really make a difference.

[Daxne Kettel_]

Darth Executor wrote...

Daxne Kettel wrote...

BelSirk wrote...

Daxne, if i remember correctly, thouhg a timeline could be neat for be sure, Andraste come after the first blight (and the first blight stay almost a full age)

Another thing, Avernus say clearly that Darkspawn are aliens to the fade's spirits

The taint it's the clave, maybe the Enchanter's didn't become darkspawn but instead ghoul, but  ghouls + captive slaves (Females and males) = Broodmother  birth

Crap. My bad.

You were just pulling stuff out of your behind anyway so it doesn't really make a difference.

Uh, okay. I don't know whether to reply with an insult or not, because the nature of your remark is somewhat vague. But who's to say that I am indeed wrong? The darkspawn just appearing, and Andraste having a sudden answer for it. To me, the Chantry's beliefs about the darkspawn's origins seems to be little more than anti-Tevinter propaganda. It was useful at the time to incite rebellion, but not aymore. And with the discovery of broodmothers, and the fact that darkspawn come from ghouls (which broodmothers are), and not the taint itself, and the Chantry saying that the magisters were the first darkpsawn, gives good reason for me to believe that the chantry is indeed wrong.

[Serpieri Nei]

The Darkspawn[/b] are a race of mostly-humanoid tainted creatures that dwell in the Deep Roads. According to the Chantry, they were created when the magisters of the Tevinter Imperium opened a portal into the Golden City, tainting the realm of the Maker with their corruption and returning as the darkspawn, their evil transfiguring them into the monsters they became. When they uncover one of the Old Gods, they expose it to the taint, changing it into an archdemon, which then leads them in an attack against the surface world called a Blight. The darkspawn are perhaps the greatest single threat to all of Thedas; they are bloodthirsty, exceptionally numerous and willing to indiscriminately kill or corrupt all in their path

Taken from http://dragonage.wik.../wiki/Darkspawn

It's also explained in the opening of DA:O

[dfstone]

If you mix the Chantry story with the Dalish story about the Trickster who imprisoned the old gods it becomes a lot clearer.

The Dalish Gods and the Tevinter Gods were probably the same thing. They were probably dragons of incredible magical power that controlled and watched over the Fade. When Fen'Harel imprisoned the other dragons, probably trapping their minds in the fade which is why they are "sleeping", they lost control over the Fade and demons were able to possess the mages. Fen'Harel is probably the source of the Darkspawn and he's using them to corrupt and destroy the other Gods (Dragons). I think Fen'Harel is passing himself off as the Maker to sow chaos because the Fade is the one place where he is vulnerable and so he's afraid of mages stopping him. 

Modifié par dfstone, 04 avril 2011 - 08:09 .