3015 réponses à ce sujet

[Melca36]

Sarah1281 wrote...

+1 constitution, maybe? She's pretty resilient and no matter what happens all game she manages to hang on and end up alright.

That's a good idea too and very fitting!!!

[Sarah1281]

So I just realized something. The elves have Cammen, the humans have Jowan, and even the darkspawn have the Architect. Who, exactly, is the Cammen/Jowan/Architect of dwarves? I mean, obviously whoever it is would fail a lot less than those three by virtue of being a member of the master race but every species has to have one. My first thought was either Harrowmont or Lord Helmi.

[Zjarcal]

That's gotta be Harrowmont.



What exactly does Lord Helmi do that would make him a candidate? I don't think I paid much attention to him really.

[Sarah1281]

Everyone, including his own mother, thinks of him as a disgrace and he lets her control his vote. He is hated by everyone in the Assembly and hates them right back. He thinks the caste system should be abolished and that everything is equal on the surface. He was actually punched by a fellow deshyr recently for pointing out that if the Ancestors truly decide who wins the Provings and the casteless have no Ancestors then it shouldn't matter if they're allowed to enter or not because they'd always lose (and we know from the Proving that the DC enters regardless of if you play her). He is so very disillusioned that he spends all his time in Tapsters trying to see the 'real' Orzammar and doesn't even want to see the fake note Vartag gives you saying that House Helmi's been cheated.



I mean, don't get me wrong, I heart him but he does fit the bill.

[Zjarcal]

Wow, I missed a lot of that stuff! I did hear him say that the caste system should be abolished but I hadn't heard the rest (except the fake letter).



I suppose he does fit the bill but I'd still pick Harrowmont over him, if only because Harrowmont screwups end up having a meaningful impact, while Helmi is pretty meaningless in the big scheme of things.



So aside from those who else would fit the bill? I vote for the nug wrangler. I mean, he can't catch nugs even if they are standing in plain sight? Useless tool.

[Giggles_Manically]

He is more of a sad SOB than an failure.



I mean his idea that "most merchants and shopkeepers" would be good deshyers if given the chance, and his line "well dressed blood sucking cave ticks" is spot on.



Besides the Dwarves are the master race, no outstanding defects here.

Brother Burkel may come close.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Sarah1281 wrote...

So I just realized something. The elves have Cammen, the humans have Jowan, and even the darkspawn have the Architect.

Not sure about the Architect. And humans have Cailan.

As for the Dwarves. Harrowmont. I would say the entire assembly, but it's easier to blame all the fail on him.

[Giggles_Manically]

Jowan= Epic fails all over the place.

The Architect =Epic fails all over the place, name one big success he had.

Cammen= Is made of Epic fail

[Sarah1281]

The Architect =Epic fails all over the place, name one big success he had.

Successfully started the first Blight in 400 years?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Giggles_Manically wrote...
The Architect =Epic fails all over the place, name one big success he had.

Freed quite a few of his bretheren, who do follow him willingly. Presumabely even taught them not to kill when unnecessary, or maybe the Withered came up to this by himself, which is also a success for the Architect if he wants to free his people. Somehow managed to protect a Qunari merchant from the taint, which could be a scientific breakthrough. Is breeding dragons.

So I do see some success, with fail in the mix, but he's learning through trial and error.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 24 novembre 2010 - 03:53 .

[Giggles_Manically]

That dosent count KoP.

At least half the ones he wakes up go berserk, like the Mother.

He cant even control the ones who listen since they run around doing what they want as soon as they are able to.



The only thing he manages to do is slow the taint's progress down, which Avernus also did by himself and blood magic. Also there are places all over it seems that have dragons or are breeding them so he's just one of a group right now.



So he still fails.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

That dosent count KoP.
At least half the ones he wakes up go berserk, like the Mother.
He cant even control the ones who listen since they run around doing what they want as soon as they are able to.

And he'll learn from that mistake. Surely, freeing a species from a song eminating from old Gods is not a simple task as to succeed in the first try.

As for his inability to fully control his followers. Well not only is that not his intention, it's not like human rulers can actually control all their followers either, without some form of organisation tha the Architect can't be familiar with right now.

Yea, he isn't a state builder and he isn't a perfect scientist capable of providing the perfect results on his first try. I wouldn't call that however him being full of fail, I'd very much like to see how others would fare. Learning from failures is instrinsically part of success and I believe he is learning.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 24 novembre 2010 - 04:07 .

[Sarah1281]

But will the Architect learn from his mistakes before his mistakes end up killing everyone?

[Giggles_Manically]

Sarah1281 wrote...

But will the Architect learn from his mistakes before his mistakes end up killing everyone?

I would far rather deal with dumb monsters than intelligent monsters.

He can sell it all he wants, wont stop me from stomping his mutated diseased ass into paste, just like the rest of his pathetic species.

Oooh I am sound like a space Marine tonight.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Sarah1281 wrote...

But will the Architect learn from his mistakes before his mistakes end up killing everyone?

I don't see how his failure can cause everyone to die. The worse possible thing he can do is cause another blight (which will happen anyhow if he doesn't succeed), but his journal expresses regret at trying the ritual on Urthemiel and that he was better off killing it.  So, I see that as him learning from his biggest mistake.

Of course you can kill him because it's too risky, sure.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

But will the Architect learn from his mistakes before his mistakes end up killing everyone?

I would far rather deal with dumb monsters than intelligent monsters.

If all the old Gods die during the Blights and that ends the song, which ends up freeing the darkspawn, then you are going to have to deal with intelligent monsters anyhow.

[Giggles_Manically]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

But will the Architect learn from his mistakes before his mistakes end up killing everyone?

I would far rather deal with dumb monsters than intelligent monsters.

If all the old Gods die during the Blights and that ends the song, which ends up freeing the darkspawn, then you are going to have to deal with intelligent monsters anyhow.

The only thing we know the song does is make them seek it out and start a blight.
We dont know that the song is what makes them mindless beasts, who attack everything and follow an archdemon.
If the song stops than they may just suddenly be left with no idea what to do, and not be able to start a blight.

We only know that Darkspawn exposed to grey warden blood become smart. We dont know if breaking the link is THE thing that does it, or some effect from the blood.

Still dont trust him, or any of his kin, and gleefully turn him into a stain on the floor.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Giggles_Manically wrote...
We only know that Darkspawn exposed to grey warden blood become smart. We dont know if breaking the link is THE thing that does it, or some effect from the blood.

The whole purpose of the Architect's ritual is so that the darkspawn no longer hear the song, acquiring the resistance from Warden blood. Which seems to imply that resisting the song leads to intelligence. Or rather, allows the intelligence that has always been there to resurface.  

It's at least a strong possibility and considering who knows better on that particular subject, I thought the Architect has a more solid opinion on this than I do.

But eh, I don't want to debate about him. Just thought that comparing him to Cammen was a bit excessive, he doesn't deserve it.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 24 novembre 2010 - 04:31 .

[Giggles_Manically]

Also there are already talking darkspawn before Awakening.



The Emissaries are called that because they can speak, but still choose to attack. So that shows that darkspawn are somewhat able to think even under the effect of an Archdemon. Also since Emissaries are only seen under a blight.



As much as it would be nice to, I just cant trust people who attack me, and have lame ass plans that blow up over and over again.



No no I sent a large horde of darkspawn just to talk!

No no I cant seem to get my followers to not attack people and cause havock.

oops I started a blight silly me!

[KnightofPhoenix]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Also there are already talking darkspawn before Awakening.

The Emissaries are called that because they can speak, but still choose to attack. So that shows that darkspawn are somewhat able to think even under the effect of an Archdemon. Also since Emissaries are only seen under a blight.

That doesn't necessarily mean they can think. Or think in a fashion that frees them from the desire to seek the old Gods. Since evidently, they only appear in blights and fight for the Archdemon.

The Architect is seemingly the only one of his kind who is not obssessed with finding the old Gods.
+ his freed followers.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 24 novembre 2010 - 04:33 .

[Giggles_Manically]

The architect makes no sense at all.

How was he born as the only known darkspawn to be able to resist the call.



@KoP

-The ability to speak does not make one intelligent



That seems to fit here, but talking to someone does require some intelligence even though some animals can speak, and understand language very well.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

The architect makes no sense at all.
How was he born as the only known darkspawn to be able to resist the call.

Some theorise that it was Flemeth that freed him and / or manipulated him.
But it is a mystery yea.

Giggles_Manically wrote...
@KoP
-The ability to speak does not make one intelligent

That seems to fit here, but talking to someone does require some intelligence even though some animals can speak, and understand language very well.

I do believe the darkspawn are intelligent already, they are just "drugged" by the song.
Maybe emissaries are less "drugged", but yea I wouldnt' say they are intelligent like say the Withered or the Messenger.

[Giggles_Manically]

That would be lame if Flemeth created him.



Maybe the song is like Reaper indoctrination. In that it steals your will and overrides your ability to do anything.



The only Darkspawn I liked was the Messenger to be honest, and even he spreads the taint when he travels.

[Gilsa]

Sarah1281 wrote...

So I just realized something. The elves have Cammen, the humans have Jowan, and even the darkspawn have the Architect. Who, exactly, is the Cammen/Jowan/Architect of dwarves? I mean, obviously whoever it is would fail a lot less than those three by virtue of being a member of the master race but every species has to have one. My first thought was either Harrowmont or Lord Helmi.

I'm not really sure what the common theme between those three are. You mean, the loser of each origin? I would say Ruck for the dwarves. 

[Addai]

Sarah1281 wrote...

So I just realized something. The elves have Cammen, the humans have Jowan, and even the darkspawn have the Architect. Who, exactly, is the Cammen/Jowan/Architect of dwarves? I mean, obviously whoever it is would fail a lot less than those three by virtue of being a member of the master race but every species has to have one. My first thought was either Harrowmont or Lord Helmi.

Almost the entire Diamond Quarter.