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Dwarf Thread: Now With More Schleets.


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#2976
BigBad

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I don't really have high hopes for Dragon Age as a franchise going forward. I have a feeling that elves and dwarves will remain NPC-only races, and will get one Party Member each to pal around with the human PC. Considering that the dwarven population is small, mostly isolated, and the majority of it is in an region covered by a previous game in the franchise, I fully expect dwarves to be about as relevant in DA3 as they were in DA2: not very. Elves, on the other hand, seem to be getting a little setup for later payoff, with the sucktastic DA:O Dalish being expanded into the more interesting DA2 Dalish, and all the ties that keep popping up between non-Dalish elves and the qunari.

#2977
Corker

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My favorite kill shot:

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Leveled up killing the Archdemon. Booyah!

#2978
Bhryaen

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@Corky Great screenshot! I've taken 100s of Kruklya while we've been on holiday doing the blight thing (lol), but that's one victory she hasn't managed yet. Maybe it's time to pay a visit to Morrigan's mom... except that it feels a bit wrong to kill the person who saved the Warden Treaties, saved you and Alistair, and sent you away with help... only to keep the evil brat alive who keeps lowering her approval whenever you do anything remotely good for anyone...

Gilsa wrote...
Playing as a dwarf in DAO was just an enriching experience.

It's just plain fun. They're the closest to hobbits there is in DAO, but they fortunately lack that boring idyllic background. Unfortunately it's a very harsh background story for dwarves, but it works for the environment of lava and hard stone plus constant darkspawn battles. It's hard to see playing something else at this point... though I will for variety later... I think...

Gilsa wrote...
I know people complained that the Deep Roads were too long, but I really ate up all the lore and looked in every crevice and ruins. Read every broken sign with their amusing sayings.

That's definitely my favorite part of the game- followed closely by the Fade which I also like a lot (and seems to get similar complaints). With the Deep Roads they worked in a classic dungeon crawl so seamlessly and well-integrated into the game story and lore that it seems essential rather than gratuitous. That's where you really learn what it means to be a dwarf. The elves have their own vestiges of former glory in the Dalish origin ruins and various mentions, but the Deep Roads are where you learn first-hand that dwarves aren't just ultimately callous, scheming, oppressive bastards, but are amazing builders of society and have been stemming the tide of darkspawn for eons. Love it. Plus it's down there that you learn how darkspawn form, so that really DA3 should be a wholehearted return to Orzammar by all races in order to help the dwarves clear the Deep Roads of darkspawn and broodmothers once and for all, taking on the last of the archdemons, and maybe liberating another beseiged dwarf city or two in the process. For the DAO storyline, that's almost the only direction that makes sense: ending blights at the source. Or has that been done already? hehe Haven't even finished DAO once yet... In any case, they seem to be content to write off such an epic and decisive conclusion to the saga simply because people aren't into dwarves enough. Then bloody write your darkspawn and archdemons deriving from the sky then and leave us dwarves out of it!

Gilsa wrote...
I vaguely remember hearing about statistics being dismal for the amount of people that tried out a dwarf. Pretty sure that I made up at least 2.5% of that because of how many times I replayed the game. (Lost count after the 12th dwarven playthrough!) My favorite was my first Aeducan. Made some hard decisions that really stung at the end of the game, but I wouldn't change anything though.

Sounds like an interesting story. :) Seeing your char list is fascinating... exclusively and extensively dwarves with all those different storylines. I've only just discovered my own interest.

On the race popularity stats, this is what Gaider stated on page one of that thread (which you linked to a couple pages back in this thread, albeit a year ago or so):

"I'm not going to start rattling off figures (since I don't have them in
front of me, and wouldn't be at liberty to start handing them out even
if they were) but I do recall the dwarven origins being 5% of the total
(3% dwarf noble, 2% dwarf commoner). The elven figure was higher, but
still a fair distance from the human noble and human mage."
So dwarf nobles even get played 50% more often than commoners. Kruklya is a rarity! Your own Broscas look great btw (as does your char line-up photo itself, sheesh). My first dwarf (a male) used the same tattoo as Maude- whatever use that info is. Looks like you kept the long arms too until halfway through. I'll probably try it at some point, but I'm finding that I'm partial to the long arm look right now.

What I don't like about Gaider's (and the DA team's) obsession with the telemetry readings is that it's totally not how DAO was made in the first place. Clearly, given how essential the dwarf story is to the game and how extensive the dwarf experience is, it appears that they simply wrote a great story regardless of telemetry... and, lo and behold, people liked it. DA2 seems to have been made with the DAO telemetry in mind, and, well, cynicism reigns and interest has waned. Hopefully what you said about the popularity of Varric will influence their DA3 telemetry figures hehe... Not likely.

#2979
Corker

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FWIW, I see... not signs, exactly, but hooks that were inserted into DA2 that would make it possible to spring a substantial dwarf plot in a future game. Whether or not anything will be hung on those hooks remains to be seen, but... Come on, walk with me.

1. Dwarves are the only race that doesn't dream, doesn't have a Fade connection, doesn't have mages. That's a little odd, but you roll with it in DAO.

(2. Genlocks do have magic, but we've been told darkspawn mages get their power "from the taint" or something, so let's set that aside as irrelevant.)

3. In DA2, we find a primeval thaig that contains things which could only have been made by magic. Wellll, perhaps that's the result of the ancient dwarven/elven relations (although the dating of the Primeval Thaig relative to the fall of Arlathan isn't known). But then there's also...

4. Sandal's prophecy. "One day the magic will come back. All of it. Everyone will be just like they were. " Magic come back? Magic hasn't left Thedas.

Magic left the dwarves. Or the dwarves left magic.

With a creepy codex entry like the one for Valdasine Thaig laying around, and never mind what happens in DA2 with respect to that red lyrium idol - which the dwarves of the Primeval Thaig evidently revered - I wonder if, in ancient times, after some traumatic event, the entire magic-capable dwarven race decided to Tranquilize itself.

Obviously, it's not exactly the same as the Chantry ritual, as their emotional centers were left intact and it passed to their children. But it *is* possible to sever a Fade connection. So...

(Or, I suppose Sandal isn't speaking about his own people at all. I thought it would have been very clever of the authors to have him be speaking about the dwarves, his people, while most players would assume he was talking about humans, the important race. But given the events in the Asunder book, *redacted for spoilers* could be the case as well. Hmph.)

#2980
Bhryaen

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Corker wrote...
4. Sandal's prophecy. "One day the magic will come back. All of it. Everyone will be just like they were. " Magic come back? Magic hasn't left Thedas.

Magic left the dwarves. Or the dwarves left magic.

With a creepy codex entry like the one for Valdasine Thaig laying around, and never mind what happens in DA2 with respect to that red lyrium idol - which the dwarves of the Primeval Thaig evidently revered - I wonder if, in ancient times, after some traumatic event, the entire magic-capable dwarven race decided to Tranquilize itself.

Obviously, it's not exactly the same as the Chantry ritual, as their emotional centers were left intact and it passed to their children. But it *is* possible to sever a Fade connection. So...

Wow! This is so wow... would go so far in explaining it. One could also see how dwarves might need a "tranquilizing" in order to live so near the lyrium without going insane, though it does happen anyway obviously. Anyone seen my lunch?

I've not yet gotten around to pursuing what happens with Dagna going to the Circle. Developments from that might be interesting. She's definitely one of the more endearing NPCs worth a come-back in a DA3.

Dwarf-related question:
After traveling the Deep Roads more than enough by now, repeatedly watching the blood red line paving its way across the map, I've never once had a travel encounter. Is there one to be had or is the game just worrying me unnecessarily? Of all the places one might expect to be accosted during travel, the Deep Roads makes the most sense...

#2981
BigBad

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No travel encounters in the Deep Roads, unfortunately, because most of the darkspawn are heading for the surface. Incidentally, this is really the only reason you can even travel the deep roads without being totally overrun and killed/eaten/broodmothered/driven insane.

#2982
Bhryaen

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BigBad wrote...
No travel encounters in the Deep Roads, unfortunately, because most of the darkspawn are heading for the surface. Incidentally, this is really the only reason you can even travel the deep roads without being totally overrun and killed/eaten/broodmothered/driven insane.

Actually I was also anticipating some mass surround by deep stalkers or an ambush by angry Bhelen/ Harrowmont supporters, but clearly even with the blight there's still plenty of darkspawn down there for an encounter- even an "ancient" emissary or yet more shrieks or an ogre... Yeah, done those already in the static areas I suppose... Oh ok...

#2983
TEWR

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BigBad wrote...

No travel encounters in the Deep Roads, unfortunately, because most of the darkspawn are heading for the surface. Incidentally, this is really the only reason you can even travel the deep roads without being totally overrun and killed/eaten/broodmothered/driven insane.


Eh, this isn't a good reason. The Deep Roads are supposed to be safer during a Blight. Not entirely safe, but just safer to travel. And since they're heading towards the surface, then you should have random encounters with them since they use old Dwarven mineshafts to access the surface.

#2984
BigBad

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Well, there's always the fact that random encounters in the Deep Roads are gonna give you three types of enemies: spiders, deepstalkers, and darkspawn. Since the Deep Roads quest is one of the longest in the game, where you wind up pretty much nonstop fighting spiders, deepstalkers, and darkspawn . . . what would be the point of random encounters that give you the exact same environment and enemies as the dungeon maps? You even get ambushed a few times on the regular maps.

#2985
TEWR

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BigBad wrote...

Well, there's always the fact that random encounters in the Deep Roads are gonna give you three types of enemies: spiders, deepstalkers, and darkspawn. Since the Deep Roads quest is one of the longest in the game, where you wind up pretty much nonstop fighting spiders, deepstalkers, and darkspawn . . . what would be the point of random encounters that give you the exact same environment and enemies as the dungeon maps? You even get ambushed a few times on the regular maps.


There's also wild brontos, Dwarven ghosts, Golems, undead, Male Dwarven ghouls, etc.

I'd prefer to have some random encounters in the Deep Roads to make it seem more realistic.

#2986
BigBad

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I don't think wild brontos exist, actually. And dwarven ghosts, undead, and golems are all big parts of the areas you visit. So, again, a random encounter (I don't like this term since none of them are actually that random) would be just more of the same.

Since the random encounters on the surface are actually finite and scripted, you could consider the stops at Caridin's Cross, Ortan Thaig, and the Dead Trenches to be your random encounters on the way to the Anvil of the Void. Further encounters while travelling between these maps would just pad out the quest, and this quest is one that does not need to be extended. It's quite long enough already.

#2987
TEWR

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BigBad wrote...

I don't think wild brontos exist, actually




"There's only two things a noble will step aside for: Paragons and angry brontos."
--Dwarven saying.

This hulking beast was originally bred by the dwarven Shaperate as a beast of burden and food source, the rough equivalent to surface oxen and cows. Some versions of bronto have even been developed as dwarven mounts, valued far more for their sure-footedness and stamina than for their speed.

While present within Orzammar in large numbers, some bronto still exist in packs within the Deep Roads, having returned to a wild state after the fall of the dwarven kingdoms. They require remarkably little sustenance, consuming organic material from water, fungus and even rocks (hence the "rock-licker" appellation used by many dwarves to describe bronto), and exist in primarily dormant states until provoked. An angry, charging bronto is considered to be a rather dangerous opponent.


They do. You even fight a few throughout the game. One in the Deep Roads, One in the Ruined Temple, and another in Cadash Thaig IIRC.


. And dwarven ghosts, undead, and golems are all big parts of the areas you visit. So, again, a random encounter (I don't like this term since none of them are actually that random) would be just more of the same.


Yes, I know they're fought throughout the trek. But that doesn't mean they shouldn't exist elsewhere.

Regarding the bolded, I agree somewhat. It's all pretty much scripted to a degree, but it's a sort of scripted randomness. There's no guarantee that when you travel you will have a random encounter.


Since the random encounters on the surface are actually finite and scripted, you could consider the stops at Caridin's Cross, Ortan Thaig, and the Dead Trenches to be your random encounters on the way to the Anvil of the Void. Further encounters while travelling between these maps would just pad out the quest, and this quest is one that does not need to be extended. It's quite long enough already.


I could, but I won't. 

The encounters don't have to happen while you're traversing the Deep Roads en route to the Anvil's location during A Paragon of Her Kind. They could happen if you decided to go back to the Deep Roads, for whatever reason.

Alternatively, the Deep Roads areas could just have Darkspawn, Giant Spiders, and everything else respawn after the questline is officially over. And it would continue to do so. Without giving off experience that is, when they're slain.

I just despise how after the quest is over, the Deep Roads apparently become completely safe for the time being. As soon as you're done, there is no threat anymore. The area doesn't change to accomodate what's happened. The Deep Roads are supposed to be crawling with Darkspawn, even during a Blight. The Darkspawn use the old Dwarven tunnels as ways to access the surface.

Which means that there should still be Darkspawn throughout the Deep Roads. And during a Blight, their hivemind is stronger so that would mean that the Archdemon would warn the rest of the Darkspawn stationed in the Deep Roads that some of its men have been fought and killed.

Not all. It still wants to take down the surface. But it's also not going to leave the Deep Roads completely abandoned.

It's gameplay-story segregation and I can ignore it. I can accept it and live with it. But... I don't have to like it.

That's why one of the things I'm going to mod for DAO is to give a Dwarf Noble exclusive content that continues the Deep Roads stuff. Taking the throne, going to certain areas of the Deep Roads, give more Dwarven lore -- fanmade of course -- if that's possible, etc.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 08 avril 2012 - 03:22 .


#2988
BigBad

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Eh, I forgot entirely about the bronto thing. Just remembered that they were specifically bred by the Shaperate.

#2989
TobiTobsen

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Oh man... to bad I just found this thread, because I really love the dwarves in the DA universe!

Especially my little girl Natia Brosca!

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Showing the Wardens since 9:30 Dragon what it means to be a duster!

Modifié par TobiTobsen, 08 avril 2012 - 06:01 .


#2990
Bhryaen

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@TobiTobsen Love your Natia! Tough duster girls FTW!
:devil:

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
"There's only two things a noble will step aside for: Paragons and angry brontos."
--Dwarven saying.

...

I just despise how after the quest is over, the Deep Roads apparently become completely safe for the time being. As soon as you're done, there is no threat anymore. The area doesn't change to accomodate what's happened. The Deep Roads are supposed to be crawling with Darkspawn, even during a Blight. The Darkspawn use the old Dwarven tunnels as ways to access the surface.

...

That's why one of the things I'm going to mod for DAO is to give a Dwarf Noble exclusive content that continues the Deep Roads stuff. Taking the throne, going to certain areas of the Deep Roads, give more Dwarven lore -- fanmade of course -- if that's possible, etc.

Love it! hehe

Actually stumbling on a herd of wild bronto rocklickers might be a good encounter- or maybe saving from darkspawn some exiled casteless or noble who'd been wandering the Deep Roads alone after those doors shut behind them. Or chancing on some small settlement of winding streets of deepstalkers like in Cadash. Even an extra nest of tougher spiders might be cool, just the sense that it's dangerous to travel down there as well as arrive. I don't really "despise" the way it's all cleared out once you've paved through it all since it's nice to have made an impact, and besides, the queen spider is dead as well as the broodmother, and really, hard to beg for more XP at that point. Still, I'd love to see more, and I wish you wouldn't keep it all Noble content since I'd like any character to see it, though there might be some special touch of Aeducan to it or some such that only a Dwarf Noble can access. But it makes my Dwarf Commoner resentful! hehe

And I wouldn't make her mad...

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Modifié par Bhryaen, 10 avril 2012 - 06:21 .


#2991
cJohnOne

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I think I will try out a new Avatar when DA3 comes out. If it looks half decent I will go Dwarf. Yay!

Modifié par cJohnOne, 11 avril 2012 - 01:19 .


#2992
TEWR

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Bhryaen wrote...

Love it! hehe

Still, I'd love to see more, and I wish you wouldn't keep it all Noble content since I'd like any character to see it, though there might be some special touch of Aeducan to it or some such that only a Dwarf Noble can access. But it makes my Dwarf Commoner resentful! hehe


I'll probably gear some specific stuff towards a Dwarf Noble only type of thing while Dwarf Commoners get access to a different quest arc. With luck, I may just be able to make it so that each Origin story has access to unique content.

But I don't know how feasible that is for DAO even with the toolset.

#2993
Bhryaen

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@Ethereal Writer Redux: I haven't the faintest on building DAO areas. I had a hard enough time trying to make basic stuff work for an NWN mod I abandoned...

@corker: I finally got around to letting Kruklya kill that third dragon... Unlike with Lorelai when Kruklya got the final blow she was literally only 130XP from leveling up! lol I saw her being so close and had her killing everything she could manage to get her daggers or arrows into so as to level up on the strike, but noooo...

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Kruklya Brosca... Duster Dragonrider...
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Kruklya: "Don't panic. I have everything under control..."

Modifié par Bhryaen, 22 avril 2012 - 08:36 .


#2994
Bhryaen

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Just a question that nagged me a lot during this last mostly-dwarf run with a dwarf commoner...

The DC has a father who apparently walked out on the family to seek better fortune on the surface. I looked for any sign of him I could, thinking it possibly likely I'd meet up with him. I mistook all sorts as potentially her father, including Dwynn, Bodahn, and that curious merchant Ahren outside Orzammar who I was never able to find anything other than a brief discussion with. (Is there supposed to be something more to him?) Then there came Awakening with its dwarf surfacers, including Dworkin, Voldrik, and the bartender... and still nothing turned up for my DC. Did I miss something or did they hint at a fantastic DC surface encounter that they never wrote in?

#2995
Bhryaen

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Maybe DC Dad was one the scores of dwarf mercenaries I killed lol

#2996
Bhryaen

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@Bhryaen No idea about the DC's father. Ask around, maybe someone else will know.

So it's Orzammar Appreciation Day again! Hooray!... OK, but there should be such a day. And in honor of the should-be holiday, I submit numerous Kruklya memoirs photos, albeit a bit off due to not learning until game's end that one can just hotkey away all the screen clutter...

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The breathtaking entry. Denerim, eat your estates out.

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That huge stone in the center... I do think the designers did a great job with the dwarven city, the massiveness of the stone, the permanence of the molten, the motif of dwarf society holding up against it.

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Love the huge heads. Bearded male dwarf heads everywhere you go, just in case you forget.

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These views of distance from the Provings bridge hold a lot moreto see than I captured, but still...

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May not be New York in size, but it sure has the cosmopolitan look for such an otherwise little city.

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Symmetry between the Palace and Assembly. :-)

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The looming figure of dwarfdom to greet those emerging from the Deep Roads...

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And a back alley of the Orzammar Alienag- erm, Dust Town. Those clothes never came down from the line either. You'd think they'd be dry by now. Or are they old flags? Dust Town deserves a Banner of the Brands.

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For a slums that upper area looks pretty nice, albeit sporting a broken sculpture. Wonder who owns it...

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Superior dwarven construction from Jarvia's hideout. Voldrik would be right proud.

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Don't let it be said that Kruklya is not a patriot of her city despite the scorn and abandon it offers for her. Fly high (in the rafters anyway) the Blue, White, and Gold!

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Gotta love dwarven scultpure. The future Paragon poses by the Paragons.

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Sculpture + architecture... niiice... The ever-flowing molten hammer that paves the way through the mountain...

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And at the Provings it's large red with gold banners...

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The only place in Orzammar brimming with books... except maybe parts of the Palace.

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The marble-like Assembly halls, adorned with orange banners, it seems. Love the subtle designs at the base of the walls. Oh, right, so which should I choose... Noble CastelessSuck or Noble CastelessMakeGoodFodder? Hmm... How 'bout... I pass...? Do I still get troops against the blight?

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Outside the Assembly you get to see more dwarven architectural decor. If you step this way you'll see the red gemwork that adorns the interior of official dwarven governing buildings. Note the Aztec-like designs with an almost Mondrian mathematics. On the wall across the hall you'll see an oddly luminescent greenish paintingish thingy. Who says dwarves don't know expressionism?

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No running in the Assembly corridors, please! Note the ventilation tunnel up into the light... yet where are the traps for rain? Whoever designed that must be a Paragon!

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Note that there is no hole beneath the vent shaft for rain to drain. Again: engineering genius. And nice for lighting effects. :-) Also note the four corners in one screenshot and another of those luminescent paintingishes. The door artistry is also nice, but dampened by dark.

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Just a sample of the Assembly's gem-crusted rafters. No one's got gems like Orzammar's got gems.

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More gemmy rafters from a mysterious location I'm not going to mention...

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Aeducans, Aeducans... just got to have the works on dwarven artistry from floor to ceiling.

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Do the ambassadors to Denerim get for accommodations such suites as these with huge sculptures, fancy designs, and stalactite ceilings? Why, no, they don't. Trian's ghost haunts the room, but still...

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Outside the Assembly. Note the prominent, massive dwarf looming up there- same one seen from below on the Provings bridge to the right. See, I love that... Oh, and don't mind Kruklya. She just decapitates people on the street. Also notable the meh design of the Harrowmont shield symbol. Odd that I couldn't buy it anywhere in Amaranthine's shops...

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And for symmetry, the massive bearded dwarf over the Palace... and the lava fountain. Hey, Denerim! Where's your lava fountain, huh?

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"See you on the battlefront, Kardol."

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"Tell me about it, Ogh. But the wind mostly blows across, not up, so..."

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Saying goodbye...

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Am I wrong or do sunrays light up the steps to Orzammar more beautifully than even the Brecilian Forest?

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One last bearded male dwarf to pose by... Still standing strong out there on the tumultuous surface world after all this time. Who says Orzammar is collapsing? The dwarves will endure!

Modifié par Bhryaen, 02 juin 2012 - 05:33 .


#2997
Corker

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Bhryaen wrote...

@Bhryaen No idea about the DC's father. Ask around, maybe someone else will know.


:P  Just don't see the point of a "lolnope" reply.  But if you insist...

Obviously, dad!Brosca, making his way down the side of the Frostbacks, encountered a despondent and half-frozen mom!Mahariel.  He nursed her back to health and they fell in love.  The ended up in a town that was later wracked with tragedy, as both the Amells and the Suranas saw their children taken to the Circle. 

Then, years later, everybody died in a darkspawn raid.



Nice screenies!  I never noticed the gemmed borders before.  (I think the glowing picture thingies are displays of lyrium crystals. They look like the tendrils you see in the Fade and the Deep Roads.)

#2998
Bhryaen

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So that's what happened to him! I wondered about those footprints leading off to the side. Thanks for clearing that up! :-) Maybe that would do well for some fan fic material actually... Well, hey, I didn't know. It seems like such a potent and promising game encounter cue that I couldn't believe there wasn't a DC father somewhere, even seeing nada whatsoever via Google. I thought I might have missed something as well, like the way non-elf origins can hear about a "red-haired elf" at Ostagar.

Coulda had a V-8 moment on the lyrium in the "paintingishes." So maybe it's more of a 3D art like a lyrium growth aquarium. Funny that what's supposed to be do dangerous is adornment in the very halls of government. Dwarves are tough folk!

#2999
TEWR

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Greetings all! Apologies for having not been in this thread for some time, but I.... well.... I forgot about it!

So, I need to ask you guys something. It's about the codex called The Dead Caste and its related quest. If I understand the codex right, it's detailing how the last person of House Ferald joined the Legion.

If I'm understanding this member right, he had long argued for reforms but those arguments went unheard. So he joined the Legion of the Dead voluntarily, with no crime to make it seem like a normal act and thus sparked controversy within the hallowed halls of Orzammar.

As a result of doing so, he forfeited his seat in the Assembly.

And when he gave up his own life to protect other Legion members and his caste insignia was brought to the Memories, the Shapers began to believe that the Legion should be its own house, because of Durius Ferald's actions alone? And if they did become minor nobility, all current Legion members and all future members would be under one house name?

And would that house name be Ferald?

I think I'm correct on interpreting the codex as saying such, but I'm not sure. So I'd like to verify it by bringing it up to other Dwarf enthusiasts.


Bhryaen wrote...

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Holy crap on a **** ******! She sees us! She knows photos have been taken of her!



Bhryaen wrote...

The marble-like Assembly halls, adorned with orange banners, it seems. Love the subtle designs at the base of the walls. Oh, right, so which should I choose... Noble CastelessSuck or Noble CastelessMakeGoodFodder? Hmm... How 'bout... I pass...? Do I still get troops against the blight?


Whoo, you're going to love one of the mods I have planned out. Well... Dwarf Nobles will Image IPB.

Dwarf Commoners won't be able to do what the Dwarf Nobles will, but I'm thinking they might just be able to do something.... similar.

If I can get the $60 bucks I will be paid for mowing my neighbor's lawn soon enough, which I will then spend on the DAO UE.

I thought I ordered it many weeks ago, but it turns out it was just stuck in my "intended" area of Amazon, never ordered. And then I didn't have the money to spend on it.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 13 juin 2012 - 04:17 .


#3000
Corker

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The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

And when he gave up his own life to protect other Legion members and his caste insignia was brought to the Memories, the Shapers began to believe that the Legion should be its own house, because of Durius Ferald's actions alone? And if they did become minor nobility, all current Legion members and all future members would be under one house name?

And would that house name be Ferald?


I would say no. 

By virtue of honored ancestry and great personal sacrifice on the part of its last descendant, the joining of House Ferald and the Legion of the Dead is recognized as worthy of investigation by the Memories. If the lineage proves intact and sufficient, relations of the Legion of the Dead may be acknowledged as minor nobility, albeit with restrictions. This minor house will now undergo the generational process of admittance to the Memories. May honor come to its descendants.


"Worthy of investigation... if the lineage proves intact..." - no official action has yet been taken

"relations of the Legion of the Dead may be acknowledged" - specifically, not the Legionairres themselves - just their relations.

"This minor house will now undergo the generational process of admittance..."  - House Ferald is already in the Memories, so this minor house is something new and distinct from it.

I think the Legion would become a minor house under (the dead) House Ferald.  With the weird caveat that actual members of the Legion aren't nobles (I assume because then there'd be a flood of casteless and others eager to trade up) but their relations are.

Still, since it would be a way for dwarves to transcend their caste, I'd assume the Shaperate would quietly torpedo the thing eventually.  Allow the families of every casteless murderer who joins the Legion to be considered nobility, even "with restrictions"?  I don't see it happening.