56 réponses à ce sujet

[bzombo]

isometric definitely needs to stay. as does controlling my party.

[B3taMaxxx]

Lord Gremlin wrote...

B3taMaxxx wrote...

Lord Gremlin wrote...
There are RTS games on consoles, so top/down view was cut from DAO on consoles because of laziness and lack of money.

 I disagree, I think it was poor implementation caused by lack of knowledge/enginuity from Edge of Reality.

Well, that's what I suggested actually. Port by lazy ass Edge of Reality & small port budget.

 True. I just took issue with the "laziness" comment. The budget in which they recieved could have been a major issue, but I don't have access to this information.

 I think it was more connected to ignorance/lack of knowledge.

[Waage25]

The console version don't need it becaus the game has a different combat system, but having a tactical combat system on the PC and removing the ISO-view would be stupid.



Also FYI if you want the ISO-view and tactical combat get the PC version.

[Lord Gremlin]

Whatever issues Edge of Reality had, they were severe. Flaws are just unacceptable, well, acceptable in beta-test phase maybe.

[B3taMaxxx]

Waage25 wrote...

The console version don't need it becaus the game has a different combat system, but having a tactical combat system on the PC and removing the ISO-view would be stupid.

Also FYI if you want the ISO-view and tactical combat get the PC version.

 What was different about the combat system? (< Loaded question alert)

Modifié par B3taMaxxx, 23 juillet 2010 - 06:47 .

[Eleinehmm]

I have never used anything but ISO-view in combat...

[Waage25]

B3taMaxxx wrote...

Waage25 wrote...

The console version don't need it becaus the game has a different combat system, but having a tactical combat system on the PC and removing the ISO-view would be stupid.

Also FYI if you want the ISO-view and tactical combat get the PC version.

 What was different about the combat system? (< Loaded question alert)

Well if you are speaking about the console then you will more or less have the same system that Star Ocean uses on the console.

Only slower.

Modifié par Waage25, 23 juillet 2010 - 06:55 .

[Lord Gremlin]

B3taMaxxx wrote...

Waage25 wrote...

The console version don't need it becaus the game has a different combat system, but having a tactical combat system on the PC and removing the ISO-view would be stupid.

Also FYI if you want the ISO-view and tactical combat get the PC version.

 What was different about the combat system? (< Loaded question alert)

The fact that on consoles game was truly hardcore, with no way to use easy top/down mode.^^

[B3taMaxxx]

Waage25 wrote...

Well if you are speaking about the console then you will more or less have the same system that Star Ocean uses on the console.

Only slower.

 The response was towards differences of DA: Origins. Other than isometric view, they both still used pause & play combat. There was no real difference, just a crappy port.

 Of course, it's successor will have vast differences, which is why I would love to demo both versions so I can decide and then pre-order so to obtain pre-order items.

[B3taMaxxx]

Lord Gremlin wrote...

The fact that on consoles game was truly hardcore, with no way to use easy top/down mode.^^

 LOL  > The console version was made more hardcore because of crappy implementation.


 Though I did find satisfaction in this once completing solo nightmare playthroughs.

[DPB]

Lord Gremlin wrote...

The fact that on consoles game was truly hardcore, with no way to use easy top/down mode.^^

Actually, they toned down the difficulty to balance the reduced control - each difficulty setting is effectively one lower than the PC equivalent (e.g. console normal - no friendly fire, PC normal - 50% friendly fire).

Anyway, please could we try to keep this on topic and not turn into yet another platform war? This feature is really important to me and probably a lot of other people, and I hope Bioware will get the message.

Modifié par dbankier, 23 juillet 2010 - 07:02 .

[FedericoV]

Well, I don't understand. I've allways been very supportive with Bioware devs but now I'm confused.

I must admit that if they are really thinking to remove the isometric view for PC, it seems that the combat system wil change a lot... I mean A LOT. I mean, if a player do not need the isometric view to play combat in DA2, it seems to me that the game is shifting toward action and loosing its tactical focus. The dev should be clear about that and clear if the rumor is true or not and especially explain us why they think we do not need isometric view in DA2 PC.

Wich is not necessarily a bad thing , maybe a pure hack and slash combat system would be better for the DA franchise than the action/tactical mix of DA:O (that I never loved, maybe also because of level scaling). I prefer tactical combat systems and I think that BG2 was the best one, but if they cannot pull out another BG2, I can live with an action system if done well.

I mean, I can't say what is best for DA2 and I respect the choices of the devs, but they cannot say that combat will remain tactical and then remove isometric view on the fly because that's a nonsense in my eyes.

Modifié par FedericoV, 23 juillet 2010 - 07:25 .

[milkymcmilkerson]

[quote]FedericoV wrote...

Wich is not necessarily a bad thing , maybe a pure hack and slash combat system would be better for the DA franchise than the action/tactical mix of DA:O (that I never loved, maybe also because of level scaling). I prefer tactical combat systems and I think that BG2 was the best one, but if they cannot pull out another BG2, I can live with an action system if done well.

I mean, I can't say what is best for DA2 and I respect the choices of the devs, but they cannot say that combat will remain tactical and then remove isometric view on the fly because that's a nonsense in my eyes.[/quote]

Is the console version hack and slash? That IGN preview made it sound that way, but it was also poorly written and it was obvious the writer didn't know this franchise, or Mass Effect, that well.[/quote]

Honestly, the combat system for the console version (which was the one previewed at SDCC) doesn't sound all too different than DA:O's. It seemed that the previewer from IGN was actually describing warrior talents (i.e. Shield Bash, double sweep, etc...) since he mentioned that the moves have to "cool down" before they can be used again (just like in DA:O), and I think (don't remember, it's been a while since I played the 360 version) that's pretty much how the controller was set up for DA:O. 

[andar91]

I liked having the option for when I needed to be able to see more, but I stayed zoomed in the majority of the time. To be honest, I don't think I'll be that upset if they don't keep it. I don't see why they won't, though.  And I'm sorry, but I think I played the game very tactically and I play with the camera close-up. Maybe I'm just weird, but I don't get why people think that tactical abo****ely requires an isometric view. I get the benefits of being able to see, but I could see when I was close up.

Modifié par andar91, 23 juillet 2010 - 10:03 .

[milkymcmilkerson]

B3taMaxxx wrote...

Lord Gremlin wrote...

The fact that on consoles game was truly hardcore, with no way to use easy top/down mode.^^

 LOL  > The console version was made more hardcore because of crappy implementation.


 Though I did find satisfaction in this once completing solo nightmare playthroughs.

The difficulty was pushed WAY down on the console version. I have both, and the PC version was a lot harder, even on equal difficulty levels. It seems that the AI was slightly smarter, and there were more enemies on the PC version. Also, friendly fire is turned on when you play normal on PC.

[SirOccam]

I hardly ever used it...it was way too limiting. Few of my battles were so closely bunched together that such a view would be able to take it all in. I only ever used it when I was having trouble targeting something. But more often than not, I'd be trying to get a better vantage point, and top-down made it worse instead of better.

So I voted I don't need it, but that doesn't mean I demand they remove it or anything.

[andar91]

SirOccam wrote...

I hardly ever used it...it was way too limiting. Few of my battles were so closely bunched together that such a view would be able to take it all in. I only ever used it when I was having trouble targeting something. But more often than not, I'd be trying to get a better vantage point, and top-down made it worse instead of better.
So I voted I don't need it, but that doesn't mean I demand they remove it or anything.

This is exactly how I feel.  I only quote because I think you put it in better words than I did. I like having the option, but I hardly ever needed to use it.

[Lord_Saulot]

B3taMaxxx wrote...

Slash_luke wrote...

 I don´t care about console version, but please, don´t ruin PC version.

 Don't you want the game to succeed on all levels? Maybe it's just me, but some of the pc only crowd seem to care less for the experience of others.

I think you totally missed his point.  As a PC user, he doesn't feel the need to make recommendations about what they do with the console versions.  It is reasonable that different versions might play differently.  Those of us who will play the PC version want certain things for our gameplay, but that doesn't mean we have to insist on those being in the console version.  I want the game to succeed on all levels, but to me that could concievably mean doing one thing on PC and another on console, if 1) the different userbases want different things, or 2) different schemes work better with different controls.  I'm not a marketer or designer, so I don't know if those things are true, but they seem plausible to me - thus, I only have opinions on what I want in the PC version.

[orpheus333]

I would like a simple yes or no answer from bioware on this actually I see little point in party control if i can't see the battle field. Make the party only controllable by tactics and you have a completely different and IMO worse game.

[B3taMaxxx]

Lord_Saulot wrote...
I think you totally missed his point.  As a PC user, he doesn't feel the need to make recommendations about what they do with the console versions.  It is reasonable that different versions might play differently.  Those of us who will play the PC version want certain things for our gameplay, but that doesn't mean we have to insist on those being in the console version.  I want the game to succeed on all levels, but to me that could concievably mean doing one thing on PC and another on console, if 1) the different userbases want different things, or 2) different schemes work better with different controls.  I'm not a marketer or designer, so I don't know if those things are true, but they seem plausible to me - thus, I only have opinions on what I want in the PC version.

 ...................and you totally missed my point to his point followed up by my counter-point 

 It was the simple mention of the console  that I was eluding to. User bases are unique, but in my opinion, any and all enhancements or new game play mechanics being implented on one version to another is cause for concern, however it seems the "user bases" in this game are being handeled with great caution. I just dislike my console brotheren who opt-in for simpiler arrangements.

Modifié par B3taMaxxx, 23 juillet 2010 - 10:22 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

Not only do I want to keep the high-angle tactical camera, but I want to be able to have the low-angle third-person camera be free-roaming.

That the camera was tied to the active character when at low angles, but not at high angles, was very strange.

[Lord_Saulot]

B3taMaxxx wrote...

Lord_Saulot wrote...
I think you totally missed his point.  As a PC user, he doesn't feel the need to make recommendations about what they do with the console versions.  It is reasonable that different versions might play differently.  Those of us who will play the PC version want certain things for our gameplay, but that doesn't mean we have to insist on those being in the console version.  I want the game to succeed on all levels, but to me that could concievably mean doing one thing on PC and another on console, if 1) the different userbases want different things, or 2) different schemes work better with different controls.  I'm not a marketer or designer, so I don't know if those things are true, but they seem plausible to me - thus, I only have opinions on what I want in the PC version.

 ...................and you totally missed my point to his point followed up by my counter-point 

 It was the simple mention of the console  that I was eluding to. User bases are unique, but in my opinion, any and all enhancements or new game play mechanics being implented on one version to another is cause for concern, however it seems the "user bases" in this game are being handeled with great caution. I just dislike my console brotheren who opt-in for simpiler arrangements.

Sorry!    When I focus on a single post, my mind tends to skim over later posts.  Anyway, I hope the make the best console game possible, though I don't know what that means.  I also hope they make the best PC game possible, but I have more ideas on what that means.

[filetemo]

if there's no isometric view, that's a no-go for me. Not buying the game.

[soteria]

Well, I don't understand. I've allways been very supportive with Bioware devs but now I'm confused.

I must admit that if they are really thinking to remove the isometric view for PC, it seems that the combat system wil change a lot... I mean A LOT. I mean, if a player do not need the isometric view to play combat in DA2, it seems to me that the game is shifting toward action and loosing its tactical focus. The dev should be clear about that and clear if the rumor is true or not and especially explain us why they think we do not need isometric view in DA2 PC.

Why are you confused? There is no "rumor," only a question. They haven't said a thing to suggest this. They did say "PC combat will remain unchanged," which to me strongly suggests they'll leave the top-down view in.

[Kevin Lynch]

The top-down, angled, zoomed-out perspective is definitely great for tactical use in combat situations and I wouldn't want to do without it. It's probably one of the major reasons I liked combat in DA:O, especially when I'm controlling multiple characters. Fortunately, I'm not sure there's any reason to think they'd remove it from the PC version, at least.