28 réponses à ce sujet

[CrissN7]

 So one of my friends was able to figure out how to save Ashley and Kaidan on Virmire but how? she won't tell me and I don't see how she figured it out or can do that...glitch maybe? or can you really, I'm a level 60 character and I haven't figured anything out...
Anybody else know why?

[JLBoyyy]

mods

[The Grey Ranger]

Yep, in a normal game there is not any way to save both characters. One will always die.

[FuturePasTimeCE]

The Grey Ranger wrote...

Yep, in a normal game there is not any way to save both characters. One will always die.

what he said...

kaidan's more valuable... dude's a biotic, plus tech specialist... ashley williams' character is a xenophobic hypocritical racist who probably got her own original squad killed (especially in mass effect  2)... 

[V-rex]

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...

The Grey Ranger wrote...

Yep, in a normal game there is not any way to save both characters. One will always die.

what he said...

kaidan's more valuable... dude's a biotic, plus tech specialist... ashley williams' character is a xenophobic hypocritical racist who probably got her own original squad killed (especially in mass effect  2)... 

I knew this would show up so let me quickly make a statement:

ASHLEY ISN'T RACIST!

She does not dislike Aliens on the basis that they are a different species/culture nor does she believe in any way that humanity is superior to alien races. Her distrust of aliens is not racially motivated but rather because of a lack of personal experiance working with aliens and her family's history in the First Contact War. Specifically her granfather being forced to surrender to the Turians and being the first and only human ever to surrender to an alien race thus making the Williams name blacklisted in Alliance military, as a result Ashley feels she has to strive out and do the family name proud, that's why she distrusts aliens. That's it.

That being said she still happily volunteers to assist the Salarians on Virmire and works very well with them, comfortably fighting alongside of them with a great deal of respect for their skills and determination. She also hates the policies of Terra Firma of whom are far more close to 'xenophobic' than she would ever be.

Also if the right dialouge is pursued Ashley's views on aliens can drastically change. Shepard makes her accept what she admits she always knew from the beginning: That she can't blame the Council or Turians for what happened to her Grandfather as it was the Alliance who blacklisted the Williams name.
As a result she grows to actually like aliens signifcantly more even becoming proud to fight alongside aliens and refers to Shepard as 'Mr. Negativity' if he announces disbelief that the Council didn't listen to him arguing that he 'taught her to trust the Council and he can't back out of that now'.
She had trust issues against the Council and aliens in general but it was never actual racism and she can work past that and get over her trust issues with genuine character development.

Also, her team died on Eden Prime but if that video before the mission was any indication she was determinedly fighting alongside her team, not just 'abandoning them to die' like so many people say she does. She was just lucky and made it out alive, plus she clearly still cares greatly for them as can be evidenced by the meeting of Samesh Bahtia (husband of one of the soldiers in her unit) and her taking the time to comfort him for his loss and assure him how much his wife loved him.

Seriously, Ashley isn't anywhere NEAR as bad as people claim her to be.

/rant.

OT: Okay now seriously, yes I do believe that it's something that can only be done with a modded version of the game or some kind of glitch but either way it seems unlikely that many people would be able to do it.

EDIT: Sorry if I kind of flew off the handle back then, I probably shouldn't have overreacted like that. Note that I mean no offence on a personal level in the above text wall.

Modifié par V-rex, 25 juillet 2010 - 03:02 .

[V-rex]

Okay, making another full response to this thread:

I certainly think it would be cool to save both as it always hurts having to leave Kaidan behind but of course the game was meant to have that choice and in the standard game there is no way to do it. So my guess is that it was a Mod of some kind so if you are interested in doing so just find out what Mod it was, as a simple gamer myself I wouldn't know such crazy things but look for someone who would.

[Simpfan]

hax

[FuturePasTimeCE]

V-rex wrote...

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...

The Grey Ranger wrote...

Yep, in a normal game there is not any way to save both characters. One will always die.

what he said...

kaidan's more valuable... dude's a biotic, plus tech specialist... ashley williams' character is a xenophobic hypocritical racist who probably got her own original squad killed (especially in mass effect  2)... 

I knew this would show up so let me quickly make a statement:

ASHLEY ISN'T RACIST!

She does not dislike Aliens on the basis that they are a different species/culture nor does she believe in any way that humanity is superior to alien races. Her distrust of aliens is not racially motivated but rather because of a lack of personal experiance working with aliens and her family's history in the First Contact War. Specifically her granfather being forced to surrender to the Turians and being the first and only human ever to surrender to an alien race thus making the Williams name blacklisted in Alliance military, as a result Ashley feels she has to strive out and do the family name proud, that's why she distrusts aliens. That's it.

That being said she still happily volunteers to assist the Salarians on Virmire and works very well with them, comfortably fighting alongside of them with a great deal of respect for their skills and determination. She also hates the policies of Terra Firma of whom are far more close to 'xenophobic' than she would ever be.

Also if the right dialouge is pursued Ashley's views on aliens can drastically change. Shepard makes her accept what she admits she always knew from the beginning: That she can't blame the Council or Turians for what happened to her Grandfather as it was the Alliance who blacklisted the Williams name.
As a result she grows to actually like aliens signifcantly more even becoming proud to fight alongside aliens and refers to Shepard as 'Mr. Negativity' if he announces disbelief that the Council didn't listen to him arguing that he 'taught her to trust the Council and he can't back out of that now'.
She had trust issues against the Council and aliens in general but it was never actual racism and she can work past that and get over her trust issues with genuine character development.

Also, her team died on Eden Prime but if that video before the mission was any indication she was determinedly fighting alongside her team, not just 'abandoning them to die' like so many people say she does. She was just lucky and made it out alive, plus she clearly still cares greatly for them as can be evidenced by the meeting of Samesh Bahtia (husband of one of the soldiers in her unit) and her taking the time to comfort him for his loss and assure him how much his wife loved him.

Seriously, Ashley isn't anywhere NEAR as bad as people claim her to be.

/rant.

OT: Okay now seriously, yes I do believe that it's something that can only be done with a modded version of the game or some kind of glitch but either way it seems unlikely that many people would be able to do it.

EDIT: Sorry if I kind of flew off the handle back then, I probably shouldn't have overreacted like that. Note that I mean no offence on a personal level in the above text wall.

:?right. it isn't like ashley wants to make a good impression on her commanding officer by not suddenly making as if her life long views on aliens are the same the moment shepard has a word with her...

as commander you have the choice whether to send her with the STG or kaidan (or who to pick up vice versa if she didn't or did go with the STG)... she doesn't just willingly up and go with them automatically in likes of suddenly abandoning her xenophobia/racism (she could be the one at the bomb site during the game)...

and who cares... it's just a game...  

V-rex wrote...

Okay, making another full response to this thread:
I certainly think it would be cool to save both as it always hurts having to leave Kaidan behind but of course the game was meant to have that choice and in the standard game there is no way to do it. So my guess is that it was a Mod of some kind so if you are interested in doing so just find out what Mod it was, as a simple gamer myself I wouldn't know such crazy things but look for someone who would.

kaidan's more valuable... original squad member, and a team player (who doesn't get his entire squad killed off)... superior ranking officer, have great skillsets, etc...  vs. ms racist-xenophobe who made it out alive when her entire team was killed off and all... and has disrespectful views towards a greater community (which include aliens)... 

Modifié par FuturePasTimeCE, 25 juillet 2010 - 03:20 .

[V-rex]

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...

V-rex wrote...

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...

The Grey Ranger wrote...

Yep, in a normal game there is not any way to save both characters. One will always die.

what he said...

kaidan's more valuable... dude's a biotic, plus tech specialist... ashley williams' character is a xenophobic hypocritical racist who probably got her own original squad killed (especially in mass effect  2)... 

EPIC SNIP

/rant.

OT: Okay now seriously, yes I do believe that it's something that can only be done with a modded version of the game or some kind of glitch but either way it seems unlikely that many people would be able to do it.

EDIT: Sorry if I kind of flew off the handle back then, I probably shouldn't have overreacted like that. Note that I mean no offence on a personal level in the above text wall.

:?right. it isn't like ashley wants to make a good impression on her commanding officer by not suddenly making as if her life long views on aliens are the same the moment shepard has a word with her...

.... That was... I can't understand what you just said. Yes it's true that she wants to make a good impression on her commanding officer hence why she concedes that aliens on the ship is not her decision and says that it won't be a problem and that she can deal with working with aliens if Shepard orders it.
And yes she has convictions against aliens but they clearly aren't as strong as others are and as I said before one of the final conversations has her change her mind about aliens and this isn't just her trying to 'impress' her Commanding officer as this is something that can only be done if you romance her.

Besides I know it's actual character growth because:
A. It takes the form of an argument which she finally admits Shepard won
B. Because you can do something similar with Kaidan and make him hate all alien races like crazy, hence both start out as opposites of each other and you can turn their views around.

as commander you have the choice whether to send her with the STG or kaidan (or who to pick up vice versa if she didn't or did go with the STG)... she doesn't just willingly up and go with them automatically in likes of suddenly abandoning her xenophobia/racism (she could be the one at the bomb site during the game)...

You missed my point entirely, yes you choose whether or not she goes with the Salarians on Virmire but when it comes time to pick she happily steps up and volunteers and she doesn't say it with a bitter:
"Look I'll go with these damn aliens."
She just says:
"I'll go with these guys."
Without even the slightest hint of annoyance of doing so, plus it's HER talking to Kirrahe in the beginning, not Kaidan or Liara or anyone else, it's HER who gets debriefed by Kirrahee and she has no problem doing so. Plus as is clear if you send her along to help the Salarians is that she is working with them perfectly comfortably. She doesn't 'abandon' her xenophobia, the realisation that she has no problem working with the Salarians shows that there never WAS xenophobia.

and who cares... it's just a game... 

Yes, this is true. To be honest it always suprises me how angry I can get by something that I genuinely know isn't a big deal.

V-rex wrote...

Okay, making another full response to this thread:
I certainly think it would be cool to save both as it always hurts having to leave Kaidan behind but of course the game was meant to have that choice and in the standard game there is no way to do it. So my guess is that it was a Mod of some kind so if you are interested in doing so just find out what Mod it was, as a simple gamer myself I wouldn't know such crazy things but look for someone who would.

kaidan's more valuable... original squad member, and a team player (who doesn't get his entire squad killed off)... superior ranking officer, have great skillsets, etc...  vs. ms racist-xenophobe who made it out alive when her entire team was killed off and all... and has disrespectful views towards a greater community (which include aliens)... 

Like I said before, not racist (you effectively dodged around my points instead of actually responding to them) and she survived the Eden Prime encounter because she was lucky, that's it. She survived and the rest of her team died, it's notable too that she blames herself for this failure and doesn't just act like it's no bgi deal. She houses actual guilt about what happened on Eden Prime and wishes she could have done better.
Incidently, quite a few aliens have disrespectful views towards humans yet I see no preaching about that. Indeed Wrex hates the Salarians and Turians with a passion, so why aren't there a million people complaining about HIM being racist? It holds the exact same amount of merit as complaining about Ashley.

Incidently, Kaidan's skillset is something that I already have with Tali and Garrus and Liara so he wasn't as nececcary. Plus Ashley is skilled literally at every projectile weapon in the game and since my combat style is always up close and personal I like having her around.
Plus I saved her because I liked her and that's all there is to it.

[ODST 3]

Williams was a hero. Like the Soul Survivor Shepard, she happened to live while they didn't make it. She was more than ready to die for Kaidan but I wanted sex so she wasn't going to.



Also, not racist. Just has a cynical view of the other species, believing they will always band with their own.

[sapphyreelf]

I wish that there was a way to save both. Unfortunatley, I've never saved Ash in a game yet. My personal preference for the Kaidan character makes it hard for me to not choose him.

However, I believe that both characters have their strengths and weaknesses that make them equally valuable and "correct" choices. There's really no "good" answer as to save one over the other.

[FuturePasTimeCE]

sapphyreelf wrote...

I wish that there was a way to save both. Unfortunatley, I've never saved Ash in a game yet. My personal preference for the Kaidan character makes it hard for me to not choose him.
However, I believe that both characters have their strengths and weaknesses that make them equally valuable and "correct" choices. There's really no "good" answer as to save one over the other.

 well there is liara if you cared about some ****** tang... which wasn't my reason for not saving ashley... 

liara's a team player who isn't racist... 

[kennyv217]

lol how screwed up would it be if you sent Kaidan with the salarians, said you'd save him and then go back and save Ashley instead lol

[FuturePasTimeCE]

kennyv217 wrote...

lol how screwed up would it be if you sent Kaidan with the salarians, said you'd save him and then go back and save Ashley instead lol

it's not like ashley's michael jackson or something... "screw kaidan...need to rescue the moonwalker... or save the blue alien space princess laila (who could be a great friend, professional partner, assistant, and great ally-supporter who has a nice ass+******)..or some humanoid goat mermaid lady who's more important than ashley and or kaidan combined.", but she's not michael alien princess jackson... 

shepard should have a entourage of female personal "assistants/councilors"... probably 6 or more of them... or 4.

Modifié par FuturePasTimeCE, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:26 .

[kennyv217]

Da Shadow Master wrote...

kennyv217 wrote...

lol how screwed up would it be if you sent Kaidan with the salarians, said you'd save him and then go back and save Ashley instead lol

This is beyond evil.:oMakes me think though.

It truely is evil haha. 

Shepard: Kaidan, I'm coming for you.
Ashley: It's the right choice.
Kaidan: Thanks Commander.

*Ten minutes later*

Kaidan: Where's Shepard. *sees Normandy leave.* That little son of a-

[Gibb_Garrus]

why do people percist that shes such a racist? She is about as racist as every other human on that ship, all humans and aliens for that matter are all mildly racist. Plus if you convince ash to trust aliens more, she will see things from your point of view (If your a paragon character).

[DanaScu]

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...

kaidan's more valuable... original squad member, and a team player (who doesn't get his entire squad killed off)... superior ranking officer, have great skillsets, etc... vs. ms racist-xenophobe who made it out alive when her entire team was killed off and all... and has disrespectful views towards a greater community (which include aliens)...

Did you ever "talk" to Kaidan and Ashley in the council/tower? Kaidan thinks the fountains are soothing. The stairs leading up to the council are symbolic. He said nothing about the trees. He didn't notice the salarian attempting to scan the keeper, even after Ashley pointed it out. He is a biotic with a few abilities. He does have an open viewpoint on aliens.



Ashley points out the stairs would make good defensive positions. The cherry trees are blooming. She wonders what the salarian over near the keeper is doing because it seems suspicious. She has the ability to use every weapon in the game. Due to family issues, she isn't very accepting of aliens, but can be shown that aliens, like humans, have their good examples, and their bad examples. [Udina and Harkness come to mind for the down side of humans.] I don't see that the geth killing her squad is any more her direct fault than the thresher maws killing all of sole survivor Shepard's squad was Shepard's fault.



Of the two, considering the mission, I usually end up saving the fighter, not the philosopher. And that is with my femShep.

[Never]

I wish we could save both. I've yet to leave Kaidan behind, but I feel bad every time. And I don't think Ash is a racist either! She's a little less trusting of them perhaps, but she explains why.

[FuturePasTimeCE]

DanaScu wrote...

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...
kaidan's more valuable... original squad member, and a team player (who doesn't get his entire squad killed off)... superior ranking officer, have great skillsets, etc... vs. ms racist-xenophobe who made it out alive when her entire team was killed off and all... and has disrespectful views towards a greater community (which include aliens)...

Did you ever "talk" to Kaidan and Ashley in the council/tower? Kaidan thinks the fountains are soothing. The stairs leading up to the council are symbolic. He said nothing about the trees. He didn't notice the salarian attempting to scan the keeper, even after Ashley pointed it out. He is a biotic with a few abilities. He does have an open viewpoint on aliens.

Ashley points out the stairs would make good defensive positions. The cherry trees are blooming. She wonders what the salarian over near the keeper is doing because it seems suspicious. She has the ability to use every weapon in the game. Due to family issues, she isn't very accepting of aliens, but can be shown that aliens, like humans, have their good examples, and their bad examples. [Udina and Harkness come to mind for the down side of humans.] I don't see that the geth killing her squad is any more her direct fault than the thresher maws killing all of sole survivor Shepard's squad was Shepard's fault.

Of the two, considering the mission, I usually end up saving the fighter, not the philosopher. And that is with my femShep.

kaidan's a sentinel, that means he's a soldier who still uses assault rifles, that has tech abilities, and can use basic biotics... that's more than o need if i'm a soldier class myself... if I need another sniper for a away team i'll use ashley or garrus then (who also uses what I prefer a squad member to use... Assault Rifles)... 

Modifié par FuturePasTimeCE, 25 juillet 2010 - 08:01 .

[CottonBALL]

+ Wrex, Ash and soldier Shep wreck havok in Pinnacle station on insanity hunts... but, kaidan and Liara does awesome job in time trials. They are both awesome. too bad one has to get screwed =/

[PrinceLionheart]

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...
liara's a team player who isn't racist... 

How is Ashley Racist though, I notice you completely dodge answering that.

[DanaScu]

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...
 kaidan's a sentinel, that means he's a soldier who still uses assault rifles, that has tech abilities, and can use basic biotics... that's more than o need if i'm a soldier class myself... if I need another sniper for a away team i'll use ashley or garrus then (who also uses what I prefer a squad member to use... Assault Rifles)... 

Your Kaidan can use an assault rifle? The one in my game couldn't. He could only use pistols and light armor. I found Ashley more useful; I had Liara, Wrex, and usually my pc for biotics or tech.

Sentinels are support-focused characters, possessing biotic and tech
abilities mostly focused around controlling the battlefield and keeping
the squad alive. They receive no specialized weapons or armor training, but are proficient with a pistol. The Sentinel is surprisingly durable, with access to many of the shield-increasing talents, along with the Barrier biotic ability.

Even in ME2 they only have pistols and submachine guns.

Everyone has their own way of playing.

[Funkcase]

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...

The Grey Ranger wrote...

Yep, in a normal game there is not any way to save both characters. One will always die.

what he said...

kaidan's more valuable... dude's a biotic, plus tech specialist... ashley williams' character is a xenophobic hypocritical racist who probably got her own original squad killed (especially in mass effect  2)... 

Prove how Ash is racist before you throw around false accusations, otherwise your just a lame troll seeking attention becuase your life is sh*t. How is Ash racist? When she hates Cerberus BECUASE of there pro-human activities. She dismisses Terra Firma as a group of xenophobic "jackals", she gets along with Tali judging by elevator conversations between them. Ash VOLUNTEERS and works well with the salarians. And if paragoned eventually Ashley comes to her senses and content to work with the Normandy's multi-species crew. I must also add if you renegade Kaidan, he developes a xenophobic view himself. A more compassionate Shepard would also save Ash seeing as she has a big family (more people will miss her)
 

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...

DanaScu wrote...

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...
kaidan's more valuable... original squad member, and a team player (who doesn't get his entire squad killed off)... superior ranking officer, have great skillsets, etc... vs. ms racist-xenophobe who made it out alive when her entire team was killed off and all... and has disrespectful views towards a greater community (which include aliens)...

Did you ever "talk" to Kaidan and Ashley in the council/tower? Kaidan thinks the fountains are soothing. The stairs leading up to the council are symbolic. He said nothing about the trees. He didn't notice the salarian attempting to scan the keeper, even after Ashley pointed it out. He is a biotic with a few abilities. He does have an open viewpoint on aliens.

Ashley points out the stairs would make good defensive positions. The cherry trees are blooming. She wonders what the salarian over near the keeper is doing because it seems suspicious. She has the ability to use every weapon in the game. Due to family issues, she isn't very accepting of aliens, but can be shown that aliens, like humans, have their good examples, and their bad examples. [Udina and Harkness come to mind for the down side of humans.] I don't see that the geth killing her squad is any more her direct fault than the thresher maws killing all of sole survivor Shepard's squad was Shepard's fault.

Of the two, considering the mission, I usually end up saving the fighter, not the philosopher. And that is with my femShep.

kaidan's a sentinel, that means he's a soldier who still uses assault rifles, that has tech abilities, and can use basic biotics... that's more than o need if i'm a soldier class myself... if I need another sniper for a away team i'll use ashley or garrus then (who also uses what I prefer a squad member to use... Assault Rifles)... 

That is so laughable it's insulting. They are both great, but you clearly have a biased opinion and it is a joke.

Modifié par Funkcase, 25 juillet 2010 - 08:20 .