498 réponses à ce sujet

[Lyssistr]

 Boycotting for what? people usually boycott companies illegal practices, immoral behavior or for stepping beyond their "bounds".

 Unless devs smuggled blood diamonds, used animals to test their wives lipstick or violated your consumer rights, the use of "boycott" is ridiculous.

[Lyssistr]

MerinTB wrote...
 And it's an even more pathetic hurt because I'm basically a nameless, faceless customer in a crowd that they couldn't really care about if they even wanted to.

from "Return to Planescape" ™, to come soon.

[Saibh]

Kordaris wrote...

Saibh wrote...
 
I wonder why every company in the history of video games doesn't immediately turn to the most profitable form of the business?

Most them go bankrupt before they are able to. The most profitable require large amounts of money. But generally with time they go into that direction if they can. Of course another issue is specialisation. But Bioware generally has been trying to shift into FPS-like games with their ME2 while using their former RPG specialisation. A smart business move. Their next shooter will be even more professional then ME2 quite certainly, while perhaps not as professional as the one supplied by professional shooter companies.

Huh, you'd think in the fifteen years BioWare has been around they'd be able to change their scope. And that Mario. When is he going to learn that FPS is where it's at?

[Lyssistr]

Saibh wrote...

And if they sold themselves to Disney, they'd make even more!
 
I wonder why every company in the history of video games doesn't immediately turn to the most profitable form of the business?

 Not to defend the wall of text, you replied to and I didn't read, but all releasing one type product is actually bad for business. You need to diversify your risk -if you make X similar products and this type of product goes down you go under-, also if a certain market is almost saturated expanding there is not a good idea, even if those who are successful in that market are making profits.

 These days, all successful videogame companies are smartly run businesses and despite popular belief, this is good for the games they deliver.

[asaiasai]

I would have taken your poll but none of the selections are applicable to me. I will buy DA2 because i have some faith in the developers. From what i have read they are staying true to what made DAO so good, the moral flexibility afforded the main character. How they choose to present this is of no consequence to me, dialog wheels, slick graphics, voice overs are all irrelevant so long as i can play my character the way i want to just like DAO. DAO was so good because the writers wrote a story with many possible choices, then got out of the players way and let them write thier own story with in the story, so long as DA2 stays true to that idea i am in. If that changes in the next 7 months i will reevaluate my position if necessary.



Asai

[Arttis]

I like how the poll says most people like it.

[Gandalf-the-Fabulous]

Riona45 wrote...

...And, so far the most popular choice is "I like what I see and will buy the game."

Yeah but that is because Bioware fans are like sheep that will eat anything Bioware puts in their trough, just look at how successful Mass Effect was.

But I feel that the post from MerlinTB was pretty spot on and mirrors my sentiments pretty well (apart from ME2 as I felt that it was a HUGE step up from the first Mass Effect (Seriously can somebody please tell me why that game was so popular?)). In my opinion the best thing Bioware has ever produced is the Baldur's Gate series and while the games released afterwards were good they were never truely great. I like Merlin felt that DA:O was a step back in the right direction and gave me hope that Bioware would someday make a product that was as great as Baldur's Gate however with the announcement of DA2 that hope has been shattered. That being said will I buy DA2? Probably. Will I enjoy it? I am really not sure at this moment, with the shortened dev cycle it does seem like Bioware is trying to push the game out as fast as they can with little concern about its quality, while I think I will enjoy it I half expect that the game could turn out to be rubbish like the first Mass Effect, only time will tell.

David Gaider wrote...

My experience on forums like this one tells me that what you often have are the same group of really unhappy people who post here, there and everywhere to make sure everyone knows exactly how unhappy they are. This is pretty typical for human nature. Complainers want to be heard, and will generally make it unpleasant for anyone who isn't as unhappy with things as they are.

I must say I love how arrogant you are David, the only reason people dont like the way DA2 is going is because they are bitter and angry and dont like anything? Wow you must have a lot of faith in your product, but then you guys are Bioware after all, everything that comes out of your arse is a nugget of gold isnt it?

Bioware knows best ****es, deal with it.

Modifié par Gandalf-the-Fabulous, 25 juillet 2010 - 04:57 .

[Grommash94]

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

...And, so far the most popular choice is "I like what I see and will buy the game."

Yeah but that is because Bioware fans are like sheep that will eat anything Bioware puts in their trough, just look at how successful Mass Effect was.

Or, you know, people actually liked it. Some people like the new BioWare games, *shock and horror*. Just because you don't and some others don't, doesn't mean that people didn't like Mass Effect for what it was.

Its just like suddenly if polls show that people like a game that certain others don't, they are sheep, or if they don't like a certain feature, they are complainers. It is annoying.

Not everyone constantly lives in the past, and maintains that BioWare will never surpass BG.

Modifié par Grommash94, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:07 .

[Gandalf-the-Fabulous]

Grommash94 wrote...

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

...And, so far the most popular choice is "I like what I see and will buy the game."

Yeah but that is because Bioware fans are like sheep that will eat anything Bioware puts in their trough, just look at how successful Mass Effect was.

Or, you know, people actually liked it. Some people like the new BioWare games, *shock and horror*. Just because you don't and some others don't, doesn't mean that people didn't like Mass Effect for what it was.

A sub par shooter with RPG elements and slightly above average story? Please tell me, since you loved the first Mass Effect so much what made it so great? Was it the poor AI? The stat based shooter combat that took no skill? The repeditive side missions that used the same 4 interiors over and over again? Was it the boring characters and the B grade Hollywood action movie plot?

Modifié par Gandalf-the-Fabulous, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:13 .

[Gaxhung]

I vote poll after Christmas 2010 k?

Modifié par Gaxhung, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:13 .

[Grommash94]

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...

Grommash94 wrote...

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

...And, so far the most popular choice is "I like what I see and will buy the game."

Yeah but that is because Bioware fans are like sheep that will eat anything Bioware puts in their trough, just look at how successful Mass Effect was.

Or, you know, people actually liked it. Some people like the new BioWare games, *shock and horror*. Just because you don't and some others don't, doesn't mean that people didn't like Mass Effect for what it was.

A sub par shooter with RPG elements and slightly above average story? Please tell me, since you loved the first Mass Effect so much what made it so great? Was it the poor AI? The stat based shooter combat that took no skill? The repeditive side missions that used the same 4 interiors over and over again?

Never said I loved Mass Effect. I like it, but dislike the AI, dialogue wheel, and other various annoying tidbits. It was a sound game though. I found *some* of the characters interesting, not as much as DA though, and the combat was...interesting. It was an RPG; just a different one compared to DA /BG.  Games evolve, period. Whether it is for the worse or for the best is entire up to you, but they are going to keep evolving.

Modifié par Grommash94, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:15 .

[Riona45]

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

...And, so far the most popular choice is "I like what I see and will buy the game."

Yeah but that is because Bioware fans are like sheep that will eat anything Bioware puts in their trough, just look at how successful Mass Effect was.

I guess that applies to people who liked DA:O too, then, as that game was also a success.

[MajorStranger]

If Bioware were after profit they would have change their game type for a Mario-like game or a Call of Duty FPS. Mass Effect was a great game, Mass Effect 2 was a even better game. Dragon Age was good but not as much as the other two. I don't understand how giving the character some voice-over would make the game not as much fun.



Seems to me this is a whiny rant coming from a spoiled brat. Wait to see how the game shall go before boycotting it. By the maker they didn't even released a teaser yet!!!

[Vizkos]

Lol boycotts. Never works with online people. See here for reference:

http://resetglitch.c.../11/boycott.jpg



needless to say, the woes annouced for MW2 pre-release were/are 10x worse than the ones for DA2. Honestly, the fact that there will be no more blank souless stares from my char make it all the better.



My one main wish though is that they create some sort of emotion indicator, so when your char is just standing around, they won't have a blank stare. That is one thing that annoyed me about DA and ME, blank stares when standing still, doesn't adequately show your character.

[Bahlgan]

My true opinion depends on how good the remaining DLC for the original DA:O and DA:A will be.

[David Gaider]

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...
I must say I love how arrogant you are David, the only reason people dont like the way DA2 is going is because they are bitter and angry and dont like anything? Wow you must have a lot of faith in your product, but then you guys are Bioware after all, everything that comes out of your arse is a nugget of gold isnt it?

Uh-huh.

I like how you refer to anyone who might like the games we make as "sheep", as if that's the only reason they could like it. As if they were just braver or, I don't know, smarter? They would realize the truth? And then you call me arrogant?

I never said that the only reason someone isn't going to like DA2 is because they are "bitter and angry and don't like anything". Never have. But the ones who are bitter and angry certainly like to do a great deal of posting. By all means this doesn't mean their opinions are irrelevant, but it does mean that they shouldn't be mistaken for representing more than they do. Sorry, but that's simply my observation from years (eleven, now?) of watching the various tempests-in-a-teapot that brew on our forums, and their aftermath.

Modifié par David Gaider, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:32 .

[Forever Fire]

David Gaider wrote...

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...
I must say I love how arrogant you are David, the only reason people dont like the way DA2 is going is because they are bitter and angry and dont like anything? Wow you must have a lot of faith in your product, but then you guys are Bioware after all, everything that comes out of your arse is a nugget of gold isnt it?

Uh-huh.

I like how you refer to anyone who might like the games we make as "sheep", as if that's the only reason they could like it. As if they were just braver or, I don't know, smarter? They would realize the truth? And then you call me arrogant?

I never said that the only reason someone isn't going to like DA2 is because they are "bitter and angry and don't like anything". Never have. But the ones who are bitter and angry certainly like to do a great deal of posting. By all means this doesn't mean their opinions are irrelevant, but it does mean that they shouldn't be mistaken for representing more than they do. Sorry, but that's simply my observation from years (eleven, now?) of watching the various tempests-in-a-teapot that brew on our forums, and their aftermath.

Haters 1 David Gaider 50000

[MerinTB]

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...
But I feel that the post from MerlinTB was pretty spot on and mirrors my sentiments pretty well (apart from ME2 as I felt that it was a HUGE step up from the first Mass Effect (Seriously can somebody please tell me why that game was so popular?)).

It had a popular generic "time-spanning space opera storyline" the very similar likes of which can be found in Babylon 5, the Star Control series of games, etc.

And it took shooter elements and RPG elements and tied them to BioWare's patented story-focused party-based adventure game formula.  In a sense it was a revolutionary, successful blending of styles with a good story.

Honestly, I played the game 3 times through and it was only on the third time that I started feeling some of the bad game design shining through.  And now that I played ME2 (and, yes, ME2 made HUGE game mechanics improvments IMO) I think it'll be hard for me to go back and play ME1 again.
My problems with ME2 had to do with theme, shades of gray morality, disposition of party members (reason I loved Tali so much in ME2 is because she's the only one not happy (or at least absolutely willing) to kill anyone in sight), and forced-to-work-with-Cerebus storyline railroading.  Not with game mechanics.

The game mechanic improvements, and the fact that the story design around the recruiting of your crew made me at least somewhat like everyone impressed me enough that I can tolerate the other parts.

I fully expect DA2's story and design to make me enjoy the game despite how it (most probably) is crushing any hope I had of an old school cRPG renaissance.

[Gandalf-the-Fabulous]

Grommash94 wrote...

Never said I loved Mass Effect. I like it, but dislike the AI, dialogue wheel, and other various annoying tidbits. It was a sound game though. I found *some* of the characters interesting, not as much as DA though, and the combat was...interesting. It was an RPG; just a different one compared to DA /BG.  Games evolve, period. Whether it is for the worse or for the best is entire up to you, but they are going to keep evolving.

I am sorry but you say you diddnt like the features in Mass Effect so how is that good evolution? I agree games need to evolve but the changes are supposed to make a game better, not worse.

Riona45 wrote...

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

...And, so far the most popular choice is "I like what I see and will buy the game."

Yeah but that is because Bioware fans are like sheep that will eat anything Bioware puts in their trough, just look at how successful Mass Effect was.

I guess that applies to people who liked DA:O too, then, as that game was also a success.

I am sorry but what is your point? Are you saying that some of the people who bought DA:O were sheep as well? Perhaps they were and the only reason they liked the game is because it was made by Bioware, just like Mass Effect. I liked the game because I felt it was a pretty good one (not a great one mind you), I never said Bioware were incapable of making good games I just said that Mass Effect wasnt one of them.

[StingingVelvet]

David Gaider wrote...

Roland Aseph wrote...
Based on the number of negative posts/comments I've seen here on the forums and on several other game sites reporting and showing the pictures...I would "guess" that a large percent are quite unhappy about the changes.

My experience on forums like this one tells me that what you often have are the same group of really unhappy people who post here, there and everywhere to make sure everyone knows exactly how unhappy they are. This is pretty typical for human nature. Complainers want to be heard, and will generally make it unpleasant for anyone who isn't as unhappy with things as they are.

This is not to say that they are insignificant in number at all. All I'm saying is that trying to judge how unhappy the fans in general are by the general "volume" of posts on the internet is pretty pointless. All you can really tell is that some people are really unhappy. Which I don't think would have been a stretch to predict.

This is very true, and in many cases with DA2 I think it is a small community of people being very loud about the changes, BUT... the reaction to the graphics has been resoundingly negative on just about every forum and comment thread I have read.

I am sure later pics will look better, but as of right now I would say the graphics are universally panned pretty much.

[Roland Aseph]

David Gaider wrote...

Saibh wrote...
You're right--some won't. But if I learned anything about boycotting from the comic book fandom, they're lying to prove a point, since there's no way to tell if they go see the new movie or not.

Indeed. There's also no way to know whether some information down the line has a change of heart-- not unless they come back and tell everyone they were wrong. Which is pretty rare on the Internet.

I think it was a given to expect that changes to the formula would mean some people would be upset. That's inevitable when you have fans-- if they weren't fans, they probably wouldn't care. Not to belittle their concerns, but I expect we'll see a lot of "final" declarations of interest or disinterest in the game between now and release. In the end it's a crap shoot to make predictions of where it will end up. I'm happy to say that most of the doom-and-gloom predictions for DAO (many on this very forum, in fact) were wrong.

Understood, and you make some valid points...I'm sure extrapolated from your years in business and past experiences.

But if I happen to change my opinion about the game I'll be the first to be saying such here on the forums

And to be honest, for me...it's not so much that I think or expect DA2 to be a "bad" game, as much as it's a direction and seemingly, experience that I didn't want...now. Maybe later...just not now.

I'm still chomping at the bit for "more" of the same as Origins but with new character and new locals. I don't want a whole "new" look and feel that's completely different than what I've had so much fun with thus far.

Especially when much of the "new" just doesn't seem that appealing. (plain jane over stylized cartoon graphics i'm looking at you...and you know it)

I think that's the real underlying issue, fans don't want to be done with the way you originally presented the DA World to them. The new direction is all well and good "idea" but it sucks to be force fed a new experience when you're not tired of the old one.  I really think you guys jumped the gun too soon with this. You still had/have a lot of life and interest and demand for a game like Origins left in your audience.

And time will tell. Maybe those that decide DA2 isn't for them will be replaced by new fans...or the changes might be considered too drastic and different and a lot of the original core fanbase might refuse to buy into it...

It is a gamble...

But it's just sad imo, because it's a gamble you guys didn't have to make yet...not by a long shot.

'nuff said

Thanks for your reply!

As it stands, it doesn't look like much is going to change about the current vision for DA2...but heck maybe for DA3 you guys will go full circle and come back to the roots.

A guy can hope right

Modifié par Roland Aseph, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:39 .

[Grommash94]

Gandalf-the-Fabulous wrote...

Grommash94 wrote...

Never said I loved Mass Effect. I like it, but dislike the AI, dialogue wheel, and other various annoying tidbits. It was a sound game though. I found *some* of the characters interesting, not as much as DA though, and the combat was...interesting. It was an RPG; just a different one compared to DA /BG.  Games evolve, period. Whether it is for the worse or for the best is entire up to you, but they are going to keep evolving.

I am sorry but you say you diddnt like the features in Mass Effect so how is that good evolution? I agree games need to evolve but the changes are supposed to make a game better, not worse.

I said I didn't like some of the features in Mass Effect. I liked the VA. I liked most of the gameplay.

You can hate ME, sure. But don't call people sheep for liking it; that just makes you come across as an elitist.

Modifié par Grommash94, 25 juillet 2010 - 05:38 .