244 réponses à ce sujet

[NICKjnp]

Simpfan wrote...

If we are going to complain about missing RPG elements...why cant I be an elf?

Well... to keep it Mass Effect related... I want my Shepard to start out as a Krogan and be able to specialize as a Battlemaster!

[LPPrince]

Whoa, that was a weird page flip thing.



Clicked on page 4, took me to page 5.

[Dragonfliet]

LPPrince wrote...

In ME1, you could have 5 of the same assault rifle.

Say you had 5 Spectre Assault Rifles-

#1. Polonium Rounds/Scram Rail/Frictionless Materials

Reason-Ultimate Krogan Killer. Weapon's strong, stops regen, and has more power while being able to constantly fire.

#2. Hammerhead Rounds/Frictionless Materials/Kinetic Coil

Reason-Extra damage with no worry of accuracy or overheating. Your basic weapon if you don't need anything specific.

#3. High Explosive Rounds/Frictionless Materials/Frictionless Materials

Reason-Using Overkill to literally turn whatever's in front of you into mist in a pinch. Your emergency damage weapon.

#4. Radioactive Rounds/Kinetic Coil/Scram Rail

Reason-The end of Biotics and Techs. You can delay their deployment of abilities while hitting them hard and keeping your accuracy to do as much damage as possible until they hit you with an ability to throw you off.

#5. Snowblind Rounds/High Caliber Barrel/Kinectic Coil

Reason-Your weapon can't overheat due to the ammo type, so you can deal massive amounts of accurate damage while lowering the accuracy of enemies tremendously.

There's no sort of variety such as that in ME2. Not even close. With ME1's inventory, there was actually strategy involved. In ME2, everyone's weapon ended up being exactly the same. Its funny because they kept hyping up each player's weapon feeling their own when they failed to do this in ME2 and already achieved a way of accomplishing such in ME1.

I do agree we could've had more WEAPON variety, but the ammo types and upgrades of ME1 more than made up for it.

In ME2, we're nowhere close to the level of customization we had in ME1, and that's due in part to the lack of inventory.

ME1's inventory system was flawed. We can all agree on that.

But an improvement would feel much more natural than simply throwing it away and not even replacing it.

This isn't even an inventory issue. It would make more sense and play better if you had, say, an ammo toggle on the weapon that you could adjust on the fly (instead of saying: I carry five of the same gun with me in a giiiiiiiiiant secret bag and change out in a firefight) or by having the player on their weapon selection screen choose how much of whichever type of ammo to take with them, making it a much more tactical choice in planning out their mission (who is best for the mission, which gun is best and which ammo will be best suited for this combination).

I can certainly agree that there needs to be a more robust combat system that even a simple forced upgrade path choice would have made better, but the inventory system is not the way to achieve this and for ME is a genre relic with no business in the equation.

[javierabegazo]

Dragonfliet wrote...


I can certainly agree that there needs to be a more robust combat system that even a simple forced upgrade path choice would have made better, but the inventory system is not the way to achieve this and for ME is a genre relic with no business in the equation.

This is how I feel. The weapons felt much more...important in ME2, vs ME1. Weapon names were near forgettable because of the overwhelming tide, and as much as I like to micro manage, I enjoy when a game takes the approach of "No no, an invisible, Mary Poppins esque bag of infinite depth is NOT suitable to this IP"s Lore"

I role play my Shep stepping in the armory, and examining his Carnifex, , opting for it over the predator for his love of beastly guns, I like thinking that when my Shep is on a planet, he only has what I can VISUALLY see on him, 

In DAO, when I was in a situation where I came up against an unexpected enemy, I would just open Inventory, and magically switch armor suits mid battle, to a one that was more suited to the newly encountered enemy. But I don't like how this doesn't make much sense with how I see my character.

[Falcon509]

You know, at first when I started playing ME2 I was like "What the hell? Only two assault rifles/pistols/sniper rifles/shotguns? One set of armor? Can't change stuff in the middle of a mission?" Then I realized something.

ME1 only had two of each weapon type anyway. None of them were unique from the others aside from the Geth Pulse Rifle. The Banshee fired the same as the Thunder. The only difference was that one was more effective than the other. I enjoy the unique nature of the weapons that Bioware introduced. I love the ability to use the armor pieces I choose, not just a whole suit. The inability to change out my armor and weapons mid-mission puts me more in the situation. The thermal clips make me think about how I fight.

My only concerns are:

•  There isn't a great deal of weapon variety. Sure, the weapons are unique, but there are a few more niches to fill in the armament section. I'm sure however that my concerns will fade with DLCs. I do remember a game a while back called Extermination though. In it, you only carried one weapon. You could however modify it extensively. You could change the barrel, add a grenade launcher or scope, and even a tactical light. It would be cool to see something to that effect in Mass Effect. That way you wouldn't need to create a bunch of different weapons. You could just tweak the one you have to fit how you play. That way you wouldn't be limited to a choice between a full-auto bullet hose or a burst fire battle rifle.
  
  
• Missions need a little more flexibility. As it is now, there is a fixed path you follow through any given level. Some areas are more open, but it would be cool to see some more wide open battle zones.
  
  
• I miss the leveling system from ME1. There you could spend your points and not have to worry about having a leftover point that you couldn't spend (I'm a bit neurotic about un-utilized points). I do like that you can reassign Shepard's points though. I just wish that you could also respec your cohorts as well.

No doubt someone is going to tear this apart as complaining. These are my only real beefs with the game. Overall I love it though. A few undesirable traits in a game aren't going to discourage me from playing it. I just felt like expressing what I think would improve on an already good formula.

Modifié par Falcon509, 27 juillet 2010 - 05:11 .

[KarumaK]

javierabegazo wrote...

Dragonfliet wrote...


I can certainly agree that there needs to be a more robust combat system that even a simple forced upgrade path choice would have made better, but the inventory system is not the way to achieve this and for ME is a genre relic with no business in the equation.

This is how I feel. The weapons felt much more...important in ME2, vs ME1. Weapon names were near forgettable because of the overwhelming tide, and as much as I like to micro manage, I enjoy when a game takes the approach of "No no, an invisible, Mary Poppins esque bag of infinite depth is NOT suitable to this IP"s Lore"

I role play my Shep stepping in the armory, and examining his Carnifex, , opting for it over the predator for his love of beastly guns, I like thinking that when my Shep is on a planet, he only has what I can VISUALLY see on him, 

In DAO, when I was in a situation where I came up against an unexpected enemy, I would just open Inventory, and magically switch armor suits mid battle, to a one that was more suited to the newly encountered enemy. But I don't like how this doesn't make much sense with how I see my character.

See the interesting thing here is that while that may work for how you roleplay I find it counteractive towards my style. I liked picturing my Shepard casually strolling through battlefields switching loadouts with the push of a button.

[KarumaK]

Got dang 2x post

Modifié par KarumaK, 27 juillet 2010 - 05:11 .

[Lumikki]

When player has choise in items, it should mean something. Not be just different name with +-1% stat change.

In ME2 I liked, how many weapons really feeled different.

I played Kotor 1 and there is alot of items, but I hardly never needed more than handful of them. Now I started to play Kotor 2 and oh my God how much junk items this game has. Example loot is so random junk that you characters can be without armor many levels after starting to play the game. I have like 100 items and maybe 5 usefull. You can craft here, but you can't craft armors or all kind of basic items. I example had to craft melee weapon for one of the character, because I did not get one as loot. 100's of items what I had looted.

So, I don't really see much reason to do junk loot with 100's items, what you then have to sell or destroy. Same problem what ME1 has too. Of cause ME1's problem was more about versions than just pure junk.

So, inventory systems with huge amount of items aren't really good. Player needs choises, but choises what actually are usefull or needed.

In ME2 you loot clips, money and some items, but at least most of them are useful. I think ME2 is in right direction, but needs to add more customation for players. I want to buy/find more customation options for my guns and armors. There is multible races in Mass Effects universe and You say there is no different kind of tecnology? Where is all non combat tecno toys?

Modifié par Lumikki, 27 juillet 2010 - 06:30 .

[Shotokanguy]

LPPrince wrote...

In ME1, you could have 5 of the same assault rifle.

Say you had 5 Spectre Assault Rifles-

#1. Polonium Rounds/Scram Rail/Frictionless Materials

Reason-Ultimate Krogan Killer. Weapon's strong, stops regen, and has more power while being able to constantly fire.

#2. Hammerhead Rounds/Frictionless Materials/Kinetic Coil

Reason-Extra damage with no worry of accuracy or overheating. Your basic weapon if you don't need anything specific.

#3. High Explosive Rounds/Frictionless Materials/Frictionless Materials

Reason-Using Overkill to literally turn whatever's in front of you into mist in a pinch. Your emergency damage weapon.

#4. Radioactive Rounds/Kinetic Coil/Scram Rail

Reason-The end of Biotics and Techs. You can delay their deployment of abilities while hitting them hard and keeping your accuracy to do as much damage as possible until they hit you with an ability to throw you off.

#5. Snowblind Rounds/High Caliber Barrel/Kinectic Coil

Reason-Your weapon can't overheat due to the ammo type, so you can deal massive amounts of accurate damage while lowering the accuracy of enemies tremendously.

There's no sort of variety such as that in ME2. Not even close. With ME1's inventory, there was actually strategy involved. In ME2, everyone's weapon ended up being exactly the same. Its funny because they kept hyping up each player's weapon feeling their own when they failed to do this in ME2 and already achieved a way of accomplishing such in ME1.

I do agree we could've had more WEAPON variety, but the ammo types and upgrades of ME1 more than made up for it.

In ME2, we're nowhere close to the level of customization we had in ME1, and that's due in part to the lack of inventory.

ME1's inventory system was flawed. We can all agree on that.

But an improvement would feel much more natural than simply throwing it away and not even replacing it.

Are you kidding me with this crap? How could you possible notice enemy accuracy decreasing? How did stopping krogan health regen help? They only really got it when they died. Radioactive rounds went up to like, level 2. You held on to them the whole game just so you could cut down the few biotic/tech enemies in the game's cooldown times by 7%?

There was definitely more control over your weapons in ME1, but does that really matter when they didn't do anything meaningful?

[LPPrince]

Shotokanguy wrote...

Are you kidding me with this crap? How could you possible notice enemy accuracy decreasing? How did stopping krogan health regen help? They only really got it when they died. Radioactive rounds went up to like, level 2. You held on to them the whole game just so you could cut down the few biotic/tech enemies in the game's cooldown times by 7%? 

There was definitely more control over your weapons in ME1, but does that really matter when they didn't do anything meaningful?

Is it so hard to believe people played ME1 tactically? Wow.

You could notice, BARELY, that enemy accuracy decreased, until you were on Insanity. Then it really became noticeable, especially on my health bar.

Stopping krogan regen is a HUGE help. Krogans are already hard enough as it is, but it sucks when you finally take one down and they regen with immunity right in your face.

And stopping enemy biotics and tech could save you from getting stuck into a wall(damn glitches, lol) or just getting knocked down only to die because you couldn't get up.

Surprisingly, YES, all of that matters. All of it IS meaningful. It may not be how YOU played, but others did.

[snfonseka]

Whatever change that BW going to make for the inventory, I wish that they won't implement ME1 inventory system as it is in ME3. Because it is much of a useless system according to my opinion.

[LPPrince]

snfonseka wrote...

Whatever change that BW going to make for the inventory, I wish that they won't implement ME1 inventory system as it is in ME3. Because it is much of a useless system according to my opinion.

Definitely. No one's gonna back up that exact system returning.

We need a revamped inventory. Elements of ME1's, some elements of what we got in ME2(I refuse to call that an inventory system), and some elements not introduced before(like the previously mentioned idea of every class having every ammo available at any time, independent of inventory and powers).

[Massadonious1]

LPPrince wrote...
Surprisingly, YES, all of that matters. All of it IS meaningful. It may not be how YOU played, but others did.

Well, more power to you if you played that way, but I'll have to agree with the premise that the returns on doing such were minimal, especially on New Game+ playthroughs where anything in your path will get mowed down by Spectre X weapons regardless of which mods you were running.

I have no problem playing "tactically", but switching your entire loadout (I'm assuming you did this for the rest of your squad as well) for the 4 or 5 specific enemies on any particular level seems like an exercise in futility.

I much rather prefer the way ME2 handles this in that regard. I shouldn't have to slog through an inventory to be able to strip shields or armor with any sort of effictiveness.

Modifié par Massadonious1, 27 juillet 2010 - 07:26 .

[LPPrince]

Massadonious1 wrote...

LPPrince wrote...
Surprisingly, YES, all of that matters. All of it IS meaningful. It may not be how YOU played, but others did.

Well, more power to you if you played that way, but I'll have to agree with the premise that the returns on doing such were minimal, especially on New Game+ playthroughs where anything in your path will get mowed down by Spectre X weapons regardless of which mods you were running.

I have no problem playing "tactically", but switching your entire loadout (I'm assuming you did this for the rest of your squad as well) for the 4 or 5 specific enemies on any particular level seems like an exercise in futility.

I much rather prefer the way ME2 handles this in that regard. I shouldn't have to slog through an inventory to be able to strip shields or armor with any sort of effictiveness.

My squad ran with a "Jack of all trades" set up so that I'd never have to change them up.

Just Shepard.

[snfonseka]

LPPrince wrote...

snfonseka wrote...

Whatever change that BW going to make for the inventory, I wish that they won't implement ME1 inventory system as it is in ME3. Because it is much of a useless system according to my opinion.

Definitely. No one's gonna back up that exact system returning.

We need a revamped inventory. Elements of ME1's, some elements of what we got in ME2(I refuse to call that an inventory system), and some elements not introduced before(like the previously mentioned idea of every class having every ammo available at any time, independent of inventory and powers).

+

customizable weapons

[LPPrince]

snfonseka wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

snfonseka wrote...

Whatever change that BW going to make for the inventory, I wish that they won't implement ME1 inventory system as it is in ME3. Because it is much of a useless system according to my opinion.

Definitely. No one's gonna back up that exact system returning.

We need a revamped inventory. Elements of ME1's, some elements of what we got in ME2(I refuse to call that an inventory system), and some elements not introduced before(like the previously mentioned idea of every class having every ammo available at any time, independent of inventory and powers).

+

customizable weapons

Definitely.

[Shotokanguy]

LPPrince wrote...

Shotokanguy wrote...

Are you kidding me with this crap? How could you possible notice enemy accuracy decreasing? How did stopping krogan health regen help? They only really got it when they died. Radioactive rounds went up to like, level 2. You held on to them the whole game just so you could cut down the few biotic/tech enemies in the game's cooldown times by 7%? 

There was definitely more control over your weapons in ME1, but does that really matter when they didn't do anything meaningful?

Is it so hard to believe people played ME1 tactically? Wow.

You could notice, BARELY, that enemy accuracy decreased, until you were on Insanity. Then it really became noticeable, especially on my health bar.

Stopping krogan regen is a HUGE help. Krogans are already hard enough as it is, but it sucks when you finally take one down and they regen with immunity right in your face.

And stopping enemy biotics and tech could save you from getting stuck into a wall(damn glitches, lol) or just getting knocked down only to die because you couldn't get up.

Surprisingly, YES, all of that matters. All of it IS meaningful. It may not be how YOU played, but others did.

I played Insanity...I didn't need to bother with the minutia of each item, I just needed to spam the most damaging abilities and weapons. Literally every single aspect of items provides almost insignificant effects. You will NOT notice a difference between Colossus X's 326 damage protection and Onyx X's 212.

[LPPrince]

Shotokanguy wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

Shotokanguy wrote...

Are you kidding me with this crap? How could you possible notice enemy accuracy decreasing? How did stopping krogan health regen help? They only really got it when they died. Radioactive rounds went up to like, level 2. You held on to them the whole game just so you could cut down the few biotic/tech enemies in the game's cooldown times by 7%? 

There was definitely more control over your weapons in ME1, but does that really matter when they didn't do anything meaningful?

Is it so hard to believe people played ME1 tactically? Wow.

You could notice, BARELY, that enemy accuracy decreased, until you were on Insanity. Then it really became noticeable, especially on my health bar.

Stopping krogan regen is a HUGE help. Krogans are already hard enough as it is, but it sucks when you finally take one down and they regen with immunity right in your face.

And stopping enemy biotics and tech could save you from getting stuck into a wall(damn glitches, lol) or just getting knocked down only to die because you couldn't get up.

Surprisingly, YES, all of that matters. All of it IS meaningful. It may not be how YOU played, but others did.

I played Insanity...I didn't need to bother with the minutia of each item, I just needed to spam the most damaging abilities and weapons. Literally every single aspect of items provides almost insignificant effects. You will NOT notice a difference between Colossus X's 326 damage protection and Onyx X's 212.

Maybe you didn't, but I did. Hell, I wore Predator M X(Vanguard), and equipped my squad with Colossus X.

Colossus does a better job of keeping damage off you, but I wore Predator for the look, strength of it, and I figured I could make up the difference with tactics.

[JedTed]

When i originally played ME2 i didn't really miss the inventory all that much. I disagree with those who say it's not really an RPG anymore because there is no inventory. What about the dialog trees, character customization, skills which make your abilites stronger, researchable upgrades, exploration, or engaging story? All of those elements make up an RPG too, collecting loot is just a small part of it.



I'd like it if they had more weapon and armor options in ME3, aswell as the ability swap load outs mid mission but loot is not the main reason i play the game.



Just my 2 cents.

[Lumikki]

LPPrince wrote...

We need a revamped inventory. Elements of ME1's, some elements of what we got in ME2(I refuse to call that an inventory system), and some elements not introduced before(like the previously mentioned idea of every class having every ammo available at any time, independent of inventory and powers).

You do understand the difference between ME2 and ME1 system?

I mean, ME2 system is same as ME1 without induvidual items. Induvidual items are what's problem in ME1 and most of RPG inventory systems. ALOT of JUNK items.

So, saying to take some ME1 elements and some ME2, what you mean by that as actual example?

I ask this, because even how I look situaton, only way to improve it, is to add more customation to ME2 system. There isn't much what you can take from ME1 system, except weapon, ammo and armor customation. In ME2 Shepards armor customation allready showed how it can be done in ME2. Now they just need to make that also to squad members armors and everyones weapons too.

[Pocketgb]

Only thing I want to see for ME3 would be weapon customization. That was the only thing that was truly lost.

Modifié par Pocketgb, 27 juillet 2010 - 08:00 .

[winlord]

The original inventory system is a pain in the axx, and I am OK with the ME2 system. Its simple and clean.

[LPPrince]

Lumikki wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

We need a revamped inventory. Elements of ME1's, some elements of what we got in ME2(I refuse to call that an inventory system), and some elements not introduced before(like the previously mentioned idea of every class having every ammo available at any time, independent of inventory and powers).

You do understand the difference between ME2 and ME1 system?

I mean, ME2 system is same as ME1 without induvidual items. Induvidual items are what's problem in ME1 and most of RPG inventory systems. ALOT of JUNK items.

So, saying to take some ME1 elements and some ME2, what you mean by that as actual example?

I ask this, because even how I look situaton, only way to improve it, is to add more customation to ME2 system. There isn't much what you can take from ME1 system, except weapon, ammo and armor customation. In ME2 Shepards armor customation allready showed how it can be done in ME2. Now they just need to make that also to squad members armors and everyones weapons too.

I already made a post like this. I'm not doing it again. Its a few pages back.

[LPPrince]

LPPrince wrote...

lazuli wrote...

Would you care to describe a happy medium for me?

I'll try to describe a way to make it good for both sides(those that like the simplicity of ME2 and those that like the complexity of ME1).

WEAPONS- Give weapons their own inventory system. You can have more than one of said weapon, say a limit of 5 each(5 Avengers, 5 Vindicators, etc etc). Each weapon can have its own upgrades, which leads me to-

UPGRADES- Upgrades are accessed in the weapon's inventory system(like ME1). Weapons are set to have specific upgrades, 1-3 depending on the weapon itself(Avenger gets 1 upgrade, Vindicator gets 2, Revenant gets 3). Not gonna list the various amounts of upgrades, but they'd follow the same vein as the ME1 upgrades, or maybe new ones. Can't think of what kind of upgrades.

AMMO- Give ammo types their own separate category on the wheel(not in inventory). Every character no matter Soldier or Engineer or whatever, gets access to all of them.

Have say, 8-10 different ammos. For example-

1. Inferno(AOE damage, panic)
2. Polonium(Damage over time, Stops regen)
3. High-Explosive(Very high damage, push back, very high overheat)
4. Armor-Piercing(Extra damage to armor)
5. Warp(Extra damage to barriers)
6. Disruptor(Extra damage to shields)
7. Shredder(Extra damage to organics sans defense)
8. Radioactive(Delay biotics and tech abilities)
9. Micro(Higher rate of fire, less damage)
10. Cryo(Chance to freeze, lower overheat)

Thus, in combat, they could easily be switched on the fly.

When you head to a shop, you can buy new weapons, sell the ones you have, get rid of your upgrades and buy new ones(PC version did a better job with inventory than consoles, but it could still be better placed on a menu). Ammo types stay with you since they're not part of inventory.

With this, you could switch weapons and ammo rather quickly while having a much less cluttered inventory AND have more room for abilities for you class, since ammo has been removed as a power and has its own section.

Thus, if you want to keep things simple, you can just switch ammo on the fly to whatever you need, and if you want things complicated, well, its your bag. Have fun with it.

EDIT- Whoops. Forgot about armor.

Keep that as it was in ME2, but with a few alterations.

Give us more than just N7 armor to pick apart piece by piece. Give us more options to mix and match. Return helmets to what they were in ME1- Toggle button to take them off and put them on, with a little note that you do not have the helmet's bonus if it is toggled off.

That way, armor isn't an inventory problem(although I'm trying to find a way it could be switched on the fly. I don't think there's a way to solve that while making a ton of people happy), and people with the toggle helmet issue can be satiated while facing a penalty.

Here you go.

[Lumikki]

LPPrince wrote...


WEAPONS- Give weapons their own inventory system. You can have more than one of said weapon, say a limit of 5 each(5 Avengers, 5 Vindicators, etc etc). Each weapon can have its own upgrades, which leads me to-

UPGRADES- Upgrades are accessed in the weapon's inventory system(like ME1). Weapons are set to have specific upgrades, 1-3 depending on the weapon itself(Avenger gets 1 upgrade, Vindicator gets 2, Revenant gets 3). Not gonna list the various amounts of upgrades, but they'd follow the same vein as the ME1 upgrades, or maybe new ones. Can't think of what kind of upgrades.

AMMO- Give ammo types their own separate category on the wheel(not in inventory). Every character no matter Soldier or Engineer or whatever, gets access to all of them.

Are these induvidual items in inventory list? Meaning, do You see induvidual items, when You put some items to some character use, it lowers amount of items in inventory list?

Example you say 5 Avenger weapon? What that means? Is there 5 different version of same weapon?

Modifié par Lumikki, 27 juillet 2010 - 08:15 .