221 réponses à ce sujet

[guru7892]

OK, so in Dragon Age Origins they did the Origin story brilliantly and it colors the rest of the game; and it made me feel like my character was unique. To actually have an origin and a base line in a story is very important and DAO did that in a way that told multiple stories in the same setting. In a way DAO was something that hasn't been done before.



In DA2 it seems like they are removing the elements that made that game unique. A new art direction is 'nice' but it almost makes the game seem like a non-sequitur or an anatopism (something that is out of place).



DA2 to me just seems less unique than DAO; so maybe I will try to buy it on the cheap unless i hear stuff thats more interesting.

[Aradace]

Slidell505 wrote...

I personally think this is the best thread in the DA2 forum.

Seeing as how its the ONLY one not filled with some sort of whining *****ing, moaning, or complaining? Yea, it is lol.

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

I still don't have enough information for a real opinion though I was kinda pissed at the limitations of character creation, being trapped in an Origin and race and voice over.



It passed quickly, now I just don't give a damn and am amused by the trickle of information about the game, especially the art direction.

[trying_touch]

can't wait for it to come out... always look forward to fantasy rpgs that shed their tolkein-esque facades a bit...



i think the race limitation will really only decrease my play-throughs from twenty to 8...

[bjdbwea]

If it goes into the direction of ME 1, I wouldn't mind that, even though I would like for the DA series to retain the classic RPG feeling. If it goes into the direction of ME 2, I will not buy it.

[Bobad]

My emotional state was not given, I feel tranquil.

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

Bobad wrote...

My emotional state was not given, I feel tranquil.

That's a Wynne/Wynne perspective!

[StreetlightEagle]

bjdbwea wrote...

If it goes into the direction of ME 1, I wouldn't mind that, even though I would like for the DA series to retain the classic RPG feeling. If it goes into the direction of ME 2, I will not buy it.

Perfectly sums up my feelings on the matter.

[lizzbee]

Emotional state: tired

Oh, about the game...  I have mixed feelings about it.  On the one hand, I know the story and the writing will be good, and it's set in the Dragon Age universe, so that's also a good thing.  I'd prefer more of a choice in defining Hawke, but I don't really care that much that I'm confined to a human character.  I'm not a huge fan of the new art direction, but it's not a dealbreaker at all for me, either, and I have a feeling things will look far better come release time. 

What bothers me more than I thought it would are the screenshots of the dialog system.  I've been playing Mass Effect for the last few days, and while I've been having fun with the game, it's not an RPG at all.  I feel like I'm issuing Shepard stage directions for a personalized movie, with some self-controlled shooting and off-roading thrown in.  I'd hate to see that happen to Hawke, but I'm sure it'll be worse in some ways.  The whole new "symbol" thing really gets me.  Is it really that hard to figure out the tone of the text without having a huge red fist or olive branch show up in the middle of the dialog wheel?  It seems like the dialog system is dumbed down even more from Mass Effect, which isn't exactly challenging in the first place.  For character-driven games like Dragon Age, that's just depressing.

I'm sure the DA2 will be fun when it comes out, and I'm sure I'll buy it, but I don't get the feeling it'll work its way into my heart the way DA:O or KOTORs I & II did.

[StreetlightEagle]

lizzbee wrote...

Emotional state: tired

Oh, about the game...  I have mixed feelings about it.  On the one hand, I know the story and the writing will be good, and it's set in the Dragon Age universe, so that's also a good thing.  I'd prefer more of a choice in defining Hawke, but I don't really care that much that I'm confined to a human character.  I'm not a huge fan of the new art direction, but it's not a dealbreaker at all for me, either, and I have a feeling things will look far better come release time. 

What bothers me more than I thought it would are the screenshots of the dialog system.  I've been playing Mass Effect for the last few days, and while I've been having fun with the game, it's not an RPG at all.  I feel like I'm issuing Shepard stage directions for a personalized movie, with some self-controlled shooting and off-roading thrown in.  I'd hate to see that happen to Hawke, but I'm sure it'll be worse in some ways.  The whole new "symbol" thing really gets me.  Is it really that hard to figure out the tone of the text without having a huge red fist or olive branch show up in the middle of the dialog wheel?  It seems like the dialog system is dumbed down even more from Mass Effect, which isn't exactly challenging in the first place.  For character-driven games like Dragon Age, that's just depressing.

I'm sure the DA2 will be fun when it comes out, and I'm sure I'll buy it, but I don't get the feeling it'll work its way into my heart the way DA:O or KOTORs I & II did.

No I think the symbol thing is a good idea because with the text in DAO you're never sure how your companion is gonna take what you say to them. For instance, my warden and Zevran usually have good banter and he takes teasing quite well, but when I said "I didn't ask about your leather fetish" he gets all pissy with me because obviously the tone my warden used wasn't the tone I was expecting that line to be delivered in and the humour wasn't there. So yeah, I think knowing the tone of conversation will help greatly. 

[Woodstock-TC]

im ok with it although i would have loved to continue playing the current character.

however i hope that with the tighter selection we will get also voice-over for the main char.
It feels so anachronistic especially when playing ME with that fantastic female Shepard voice acting, and than switching to DAO that your character remains silent. i always get reminiscense of the 80ties (ye sorry, same thing happens in ME when i played with the space truck or especially the ME1 circle-frogger minigames)

the game is restricting itself a little but will offer in this restriction a wider experience and more option as less node states need to be considered. makes also addons easier to develop

br,
wood

Modifié par Woodstock-TC, 27 juillet 2010 - 01:30 .

[Azdeus]

thatguy212 wrote...
if this doesn't get you to beat your chest i don't know what will
www.youtube.com/watch

I think mine trumphs yours.

On the subject at hand, "I am not liking any of the announcements and am pretty sure I won't be buying the game.".

Decisions will be made when more information is revealed, but the things that have been mentioned so far has definetly stopped me from preordering the game.

StreetlightEagle wrote...
No I think the symbol thing is a
good idea because with the text in DAO you're never sure how your
companion is gonna take what you say to them. For instance, my warden
and Zevran usually have good banter and he takes teasing quite well, but
when I said "I didn't ask about your leather fetish" he gets all pissy
with me because obviously the tone my warden used wasn't the tone I was
expecting that line to be delivered in and the humour wasn't there. So
yeah, I think knowing the tone of conversation will help greatly. 

Do you know how real people are going to take what you say before you say it aswell? Everyone has their point of breaking, subjects that don't really sit well with them.
I think that not knowing their exact reaction to what you say creates some believability in the character. (Though not knowing exactly what you are about to say, and THEN pissing of someone is a situation full of butthurt.)

Modifié par Azdeus, 27 juillet 2010 - 01:36 .

[StreetlightEagle]

There's no way you can compare this to a real life situation at all. Keeping with my example for instance, there is seriously a multitude of different ways a person could deliver "I didn't ask about your leather fetish" and all would get different results from the person you directed it at. In DA, the writers have chosen how that line is going to be delivered and in what tone you are speaking yet they neglect to give you this information. With the DA2 system in place you may not know how the companion is going to react it but at least you know that you are joking rather than purposely being harsh or vice versa.

[AllThatJazz]

Azdeus wrote...

thatguy212 wrote...
if this doesn't get you to beat your chest i don't know what will
www.youtube.com/watch

I think mine trumphs yours.

On the subject at hand, "I am not liking any of the announcements and am pretty sure I won't be buying the game.".

Decisions will be made when more information is revealed, but the things that have been mentioned so far has definetly stopped me from preordering the game.

StreetlightEagle wrote...
No I think the symbol thing is a
good idea because with the text in DAO you're never sure how your
companion is gonna take what you say to them. For instance, my warden
and Zevran usually have good banter and he takes teasing quite well, but
when I said "I didn't ask about your leather fetish" he gets all pissy
with me because obviously the tone my warden used wasn't the tone I was
expecting that line to be delivered in and the humour wasn't there. So
yeah, I think knowing the tone of conversation will help greatly. 

Do you know how real people are going to take what you say before you say it aswell? Everyone has their point of breaking, subjects that don't really sit well with them.
I think that not knowing their exact reaction to what you say creates some believability in the character. (Though not knowing exactly what you are about to say, and THEN pissing of someone is a situation full of butthurt.)

In a real conversation, you might not know what someone's reaction will be, and you might not even know beforehand, the EXACT words about to come out of your mouth (I know I sometimes speak before thinking things through thoroughly ); but you generally know the tone in which you intend a remark. A case in point is forums like these. People (including myself) can take remarks in completely the wrong way, which is partly why the use of emoticons etc has become so popular - it makes the tone of what we're saying much clearer, and makes it far less likely that someone will take offence where none is meant.  

In game, if I pick a dialogue option that I think is humorous or whatever, but it offends the character I'm speaking to, then is it me or the character to whom I am speaking that is misinterpreting?  This way, at least I can be sure that the tone of my conversation is as I wish it. Then, if the writers want that particular character to get snarky anyway, then it's definitely not my fault 

[Saibh]

AllThatJazz wrote...

In a real conversation, you might not know what someone's reaction will be, and you might not even know beforehand, the EXACT words about to come out of your mouth (I know I sometimes speak before thinking things through thoroughly ); but you generally know the tone in which you intend a remark. A case in point is forums like these. People (including myself) can take remarks in completely the wrong way, which is partly why the use of emoticons etc has become so popular - it makes the tone of what we're saying much clearer, and makes it far less likely that someone will take offence where none is meant.  

In game, if I pick a dialogue option that I think is humorous or whatever, but it offends the character I'm speaking to, then is it me or the character to whom I am speaking that is misinterpreting?  This way, at least I can be sure that the tone of my conversation is as I wish it. Then, if the writers want that particular character to get snarky anyway, then it's definitely not my fault 

Precisely. I couldn't find the words for it eariler, and this is what I was thinking.

I'd like to also point out that if your intent was taken in a different way in real life, it'd be pretty easy to see that they misinterpreted you. You could clarify, or get angry, or just not care. In the game if they misinterpret you, you're sort of stuck with that negative approval you may not have wanted and didn't derserve. In real life, I am in control of my tone and expression. In the game, I'm just hoping they get it right.

In DA2, it'd be interesting to have characters misunderstand you sometimes, but most of the time, if Hawke's voice actor is being clear, I think I'd feel like they were idiots. If it were used, I think it should be with a light hand.

Modifié par Saibh, 27 juillet 2010 - 02:09 .

[Chuvvy]

AllThatJazz wrote...


In a real conversation, you might not know what someone's reaction will be, and you might not even know beforehand, the EXACT words about to come out of your mouth (I know I sometimes speak before thinking things through thoroughly ); but you generally know the tone in which you intend a remark. A case in point is forums like these. People (including myself) can take remarks in completely the wrong way, which is partly why the use of emoticons etc has become so popular - it makes the tone of what we're saying much clearer, and makes it far less likely that someone will take offence where none is meant.  

In game, if I pick a dialogue option that I think is humorous or whatever, but it offends the character I'm speaking to, then is it me or the character to whom I am speaking that is misinterpreting?  This way, at least I can be sure that the tone of my conversation is as I wish it. Then, if the writers want that particular character to get snarky anyway, then it's definitely not my fault 

And it shows way to much emotion.

Modifié par Slidell505, 27 juillet 2010 - 02:15 .

[AllThatJazz]

Slidell505 wrote...

AllThatJazz wrote...


In a real conversation, you might not know what someone's reaction will be, and you might not even know beforehand, the EXACT words about to come out of your mouth (I know I sometimes speak before thinking things through thoroughly ); but you generally know the tone in which you intend a remark. A case in point is forums like these. People (including myself) can take remarks in completely the wrong way, which is partly why the use of emoticons etc has become so popular - it makes the tone of what we're saying much clearer, and makes it far less likely that someone will take offence where none is meant.  

In game, if I pick a dialogue option that I think is humorous or whatever, but it offends the character I'm speaking to, then is it me or the character to whom I am speaking that is misinterpreting?  This way, at least I can be sure that the tone of my conversation is as I wish it. Then, if the writers want that particular character to get snarky anyway, then it's definitely not my fault 

And it shows way to much emotion.

If only there were male equivalents of smilies, like 'grunties'.

[Azdeus]

StreetlightEagle wrote...

There's no way you can compare this to a real life situation at all. Keeping with my example for instance, there is seriously a multitude of different ways a person could deliver "I didn't ask about your leather fetish" and all would get different results from the person you directed it at. In DA, the writers have chosen how that line is going to be delivered and in what tone you are speaking yet they neglect to give you this information. With the DA2 system in place you may not know how the companion is going to react it but at least you know that you are joking rather than purposely being harsh or vice versa.

I disagree, in DA:O they have'nt really defined how you deliver the line, but they have defined how the recipient reacts.
DA2 they determine how you deliver the line and how the recipient reacts, wich kind of removes an element of roleplay. Atleast with a silent protagonist and without those clear indications of how you deliver it, you can determine that for yourself, nevermind it being meaningless.
As an example, I don't particularly react fondly to "Your mother/face" jokes, does'nt matter how they are delivered or intended.

AllThatJazz wrote...
In a real conversation, you might not
know what someone's reaction will be, and you might not even know
beforehand, the EXACT words about to come out of your mouth (I know I
sometimes speak before thinking things through thoroughly [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/unsure.png[/smilie]); but you generally know the tone in which you intend
a remark. A case in point is forums like these. People (including
myself) can take remarks in completely the wrong way, which is partly
why the use of emoticons etc has become so popular - it makes the tone
of what we're saying much clearer, and makes it far less likely that
someone will take offence where none is meant.  

In game, if I
pick a dialogue option that I think is humorous or whatever, but it
offends the character I'm speaking to, then is it me or the character to
whom I am speaking that is misinterpreting?  This way, at least I can
be sure that the tone of my conversation is as I wish it. Then, if the
writers want that particular character to get snarky anyway, then it's
definitely not my fault [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/grin.png[/smilie]

I've never had any the problem of not knowing the exact words that come out of my mouth - well, except for the English language barrier - And emoticons can help, sure, but taking offence from words are just silly; Sticks and stones! The "PC"-board be damned. I'll just try hard to keep the tone of the text either ambigous or free of ad hominem/strawmen or similar, in the lack of a "gruntie" or "neutral nod" emoticon.

If you pick "I don't want to hear about your leather fetish!" line, intending/thinking it as humor you kind of mean it as that. In this case the recipient just did'nt like the subject in this case. Like I wrote in the previous message.

Saibh wrote...
Precisely. I couldn't find the words for it eariler, and this is what I was thinking.

I'd
like to also point out that if your intent was taken in a different way
in real life, it'd be pretty easy to see that they misinterpreted you.
You could clarify, or get angry, or just not care. In the game if they
misinterpret you, you're sort of stuck with that negative approval you
may not have wanted and didn't derserve. In real life, I am in control
of my tone and expression. In the game, I'm just hoping they get it
right.

In DA2, it'd be interesting to have characters
misunderstand you sometimes, but most of the time, if Hawke's voice
actor is being clear, I think I'd feel like they were idiots. If it were
used, I think it should be with a light hand.

The game does let you clarify in some situations, Wynne being one I can remember from the top of my head, if the writers does'nt let you clarify it in DA: O then that's an area we could complain and/or ask them to improve in, instead of simplifying everything with the Wheel of Tourettes.

PS, am I a complete idiot or is there no preview button?

Modifié par Azdeus, 27 juillet 2010 - 02:43 .

[ROD525]

Im fine with the way things are shaping up for DA2. I love DAO but I always thought the game should have had an even darker edge ala Robert E. Howard.When I think dark fantasy I think of Conan not LOTR. From an artistic standpoint it seems thats where the game is headed and I couldn't be more pleased.

[lizzbee]

StreetlightEagle wrote...
No I think the symbol thing is a good idea because with the text in DAO you're never sure how your companion is gonna take what you say to them. For instance, my warden and Zevran usually have good banter and he takes teasing quite well, but when I said "I didn't ask about your leather fetish" he gets all pissy with me because obviously the tone my warden used wasn't the tone I was expecting that line to be delivered in and the humour wasn't there. So yeah, I think knowing the tone of conversation will help greatly. 

I remember that line (just played that convo last night)-- "I asked you about Antiva, not about your leather fetish."  It's pretty clearly dismissive, especially after Zevran lets you actually see how he's really feeling for the first time.  The line I had trouble with there was, "No boots for you," but in the context of the conversation, it's pretty clear he's not actually in a joking mood at all.  The symbol's going to take away all thought and nuance from the game, I think, and add that layer of disconnection to Hawke, unfortunately.

[lizzbee]

Azdeus wrote...
Wheel of Tourettes.

Beautiful 

[Sable Rhapsody]

lizzbee wrote...

StreetlightEagle wrote...
No I think the symbol thing is a good idea because with the text in DAO you're never sure how your companion is gonna take what you say to them. For instance, my warden and Zevran usually have good banter and he takes teasing quite well, but when I said "I didn't ask about your leather fetish" he gets all pissy with me because obviously the tone my warden used wasn't the tone I was expecting that line to be delivered in and the humour wasn't there. So yeah, I think knowing the tone of conversation will help greatly. 

I remember that line (just played that convo last night)-- "I asked you about Antiva, not about your leather fetish."  It's pretty clearly dismissive, especially after Zevran lets you actually see how he's really feeling for the first time.  The line I had trouble with there was, "No boots for you," but in the context of the conversation, it's pretty clear he's not actually in a joking mood at all.  The symbol's going to take away all thought and nuance from the game, I think, and add that layer of disconnection to Hawke, unfortunately.

Not necessarily.  I actually think the symbols are a good hybrid of the ME2 system--where you got paraphrase but not inflection--and the Alpha Protocol system, where you got inflection but no idea WTF was going to come out of that jerkass's mouth.  My thing is that sometimes in games like DA2, word choice is hugely important.  A line like the one about the leather fetish can be taken as joking, dismissive, aggressive, etc.  That allows for more RP room, but it also can cause the player to genuinely mistake the intent behind certain lines regardless of thought or nuance.  See also: the number of times I said something in ME I didn't mean to, because my interpretation of the paraphrase had a different inflection from the actual line delivered.

Connection to a PC is nice, but so too is precision of what you say.  I think short of a Holodeck, this is the most precise we're gonna get.