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[darknoon5]

dreman9999 wrote...

darknoon5 wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

Mars Nova wrote...

Anyone else expecting/hoping for Kai Leng to show up as a squadmate in ME3?

No...
I'd rather turn him over to Aria, disturbing character.

That's what makes him interesting.
Are you really so two-dimensional as to tell me you don't think he's interesting?
Plus he's former n7 and is extremely resilient, he's already good squad mate content-more qualified then Kaidan and Ash considering they're not n7, infact.

Yes, he's a good fighter and interesting but I can take his mindless disgust and hate.

That's why it's a good decision-HK-47 and Canderous were big time killers, but nobody seemed to care.

[Kreidian]

First off, as far as I'm concerned this whole book takes place in a parallel universe where apparently Udina is councilor and Anderson was his advisor right up to the point where he quit. In my cannon universe Anderson is councilor and will remain there fighting the good fight. Though he probably took time off to help Kahlee. He might be a councilor but he's still a soldier a man of action, and this was like a vacation to him.



As for Cerberus, yes they messed up again. Big surprise. Still they make a great antagonist. Fortunately this book gives me one more reason to hate their collective guts. The Illusive Man may talk pretty about how he wants to save all those human colonies, but he was responsible, no matter how indirectly, for destruction of more then one human colony as well. Between all those crimes Cerberus has done in the first game, not to mention what they did to Jack in the second.

Hell what they did to Grayson daughter, as well as Grayson himself, was pretty freaking horrific. No matter how TIM wants to spin things as some point there's just no excuse for any of it. He made it possible. At some point the buck has to stop on him.



I suspect, and hope, that in the third game you will have the option to work with TIM again or work against him. My guess, and again hope, is that you will be able to choose between him and Aria. Because I would love nothing more then to side with Aria to take out Cerberus, the Illusive Man, and to gift wrap her daughter's killer and lay him at Aria's feet.



People might argue that Aria is nothing more then a crime boss, but at least she's honest about it. And the only reason she's killed more people then TIM is because she's had over a millennial to wrack up a body count. Even then most of the people she's killed have been her own competitors, meaning other criminals. The severity of her crimes pale in comparison to what TIM has done. All things being equal the Illusive Man is by far the wost of the two of them.



Just because he thinks he's doing it all "for the good of humanity" is no excuse.

[WOLF_00]

I am really enjoying reading posts about the new book. I am waiting for my copy, which won't reach before 14 working days. As I understand ; the novel states Cerberus as evil organization; so do you expect Shepard to make them and their Illusive man as his first target in ME3? For sure Shepard won't be silent for what have they done; I expect TIM action is turning point event that will have direct impact in ME3; especially the relationship between species, cerberus and alliances.

[WOLF_00]

Kreidian wrote...

First off, as far as I'm concerned this whole book takes place in a parallel universe where apparently Udina is councilor and Anderson was his advisor right up to the point where he quit. In my cannon universe Anderson is councilor and will remain there fighting the good fight. Though he probably took time off to help Kahlee. He might be a councilor but he's still a soldier a man of action, and this was like a vacation to him.

As for Cerberus, yes they messed up again. Big surprise. Still they make a great antagonist. Fortunately this book gives me one more reason to hate their collective guts. The Illusive Man may talk pretty about how he wants to save all those human colonies, but he was responsible, no matter how indirectly, for destruction of more then one human colony as well. Between all those crimes Cerberus has done in the first game, not to mention what they did to Jack in the second.
Hell what they did to Grayson daughter, as well as Grayson himself, was pretty freaking horrific. No matter how TIM wants to spin things as some point there's just no excuse for any of it. He made it possible. At some point the buck has to stop on him.

I suspect, and hope, that in the third game you will have the option to work with TIM again or work against him. My guess, and again hope, is that you will be able to choose between him and Aria. Because I would love nothing more then to side with Aria to take out Cerberus, the Illusive Man, and to gift wrap her daughter's killer and lay him at Aria's feet.

People might argue that Aria is nothing more then a crime boss, but at least she's honest about it. And the only reason she's killed more people then TIM is because she's had over a millennial to wrack up a body count. Even then most of the people she's killed have been her own competitors, meaning other criminals. The severity of her crimes pale in comparison to what TIM has done. All things being equal the Illusive Man is by far the wost of the two of them.

Just because he thinks he's doing it all "for the good of humanity" is no excuse.

"Preservation of Humanity" That what TIM said to Shepard as it is main objective for Cerberus to convince Shepard to work for him and take decision in align of his command. Everyone must saw the ending; if Shepard decided to save the Collector Base; and see how the Illusive man look the scheme of that Station. It is evil ending that fit purpose of evil person whose method do not satisfy his his objectives. He will put a colony as test subject with cold blood if he has knew that it will save the humanity. 


But my question here is; What will the Illusive man gain from preservation and protection of the humans? What is his interest and benefits? The alliances won’t accept him as human leader and other species won’t let him to be a councilor? 

[dreman9999]

Shandepared wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Your saying that TIM did know people on both sides would die dure Gillian's failed extraction?
And No, the Flotilla was innocent. They were helping an innocent girl hide from a moraly corrupt organization.
Also, Aria is below your consern, She only goes after people who crossed her, like Shepard. Also, Omega is better for her being there.

The quarians are plotting to use a REAPER to take control of the geth. TIM was right to be suspicious of them and right to seek to find a way to infiltrate or at least monitor their fleet. Lemm should have known when to quit.

1.Everyone's plotting to control the Geth.
2. Like they would find or understand want a reaper is at that time.
3.After ME2 they understand that they can't and don't want to after talking with Shepard.

The flotila is innocent. Get over it.

[Cypher0020]

Ok read the book's summary on the wiki.. hopefully will get a chance to read it all the way through.... things I noticed



- being Grayson sucks

- I hope Leng dies painfully

- TIM has had combat training



I"d hoping for Shep Vs. TIM......a no holds barred, biotic slinging, bullet flying, knockdown drag out slugfest....

[dreman9999]

Cypher0020 wrote...

Ok read the book's summary on the wiki.. hopefully will get a chance to read it all the way through.... things I noticed

- being Grayson sucks
- I hope Leng dies painfully
- TIM has had combat training

I"d hoping for Shep Vs. TIM......a no holds barred, biotic slinging, bullet flying, knockdown drag out slugfest....

Offical Kai Leng must die a slow horrible death in ME3 thread(Post RETRIBUTION chracter discusion)
Join us!!!!!

Modifié par dreman9999, 01 août 2010 - 07:48 .

[Asheer_Khan]

Shandepared wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Your saying that TIM did know people on both sides would die dure Gillian's failed extraction?
And No, the Flotilla was innocent. They were helping an innocent girl hide from a moraly corrupt organization.
Also, Aria is below your consern, She only goes after people who crossed her, like Shepard. Also, Omega is better for her being there.

The quarians are plotting to use a REAPER to take control of the geth. TIM was right to be suspicious of them and right to seek to find a way to infiltrate or at least monitor their fleet. Lemm should have known when to quit.

"Use a Reaper..."

I wonder what Flotilla can offer reapers in return for helping them to again subdue Geth to thier will?

It's like asking hungry Orca to guard fish swarm against possible sharks attack.

If they will ever find a Reaper then this will be nothing more as death warrant at flotilla... and with all due respect... TiM have no right to interferee in others business because he is just slimy insignificant NOBODY  who can only drag humanity in intergalactic war with other species because he act with care of Godzilla  moving through Tokio....

Lucky Quarians didn't poses significant military and political power to actually proper respond at this attack but trust me... if he will pull same kind of stunt when comes to Turians... things could  go lot different.

That's why i seriously hope that for the sake of humanity i will be able to end cerberus existence once for all before will be too late to prevent another war... because my Shepard have more important things to do than cleaning galaxy from more and more cerberus failures caused by timmy's overgrown ego and dream of grandure when Reapers ante portas...

Modifié par Asheer_Khan, 01 août 2010 - 10:19 .

[dreman9999]

Asheer_Khan wrote...

Shandepared wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Your saying that TIM did know people on both sides would die dure Gillian's failed extraction?
And No, the Flotilla was innocent. They were helping an innocent girl hide from a moraly corrupt organization.
Also, Aria is below your consern, She only goes after people who crossed her, like Shepard. Also, Omega is better for her being there.

The quarians are plotting to use a REAPER to take control of the geth. TIM was right to be suspicious of them and right to seek to find a way to infiltrate or at least monitor their fleet. Lemm should have known when to quit.

"Use a Reaper..."

I wonder what Flotilla can offer reapers in return for helping them to again subdue Geth to thier will?

It's like asking hungry Orca to guard fish swarm against possible sharks attack.

If they will ever find a Reaper then this will be nothing more as death warrant at flotilla... and with all due respect... TiM have no right to interferee in others business because he is just slimy insignificant NOBODY  who can only drag humanity in intergalactic war with other species because he act with care of Godzilla  moving through Tokio....

Lucky Quarians didn't poses significant military and political power to actually proper respond at this attack but trust me... if he will pull same kind of stunt when comes to Turians... things could  go lot different.

That's why i seriously hope that for the sake of humanity i will be able to end cerberus existence once for all before will be too late to prevent another war... because my Shepard have more important things to do than cleaning galaxy from more and more cerberus failures caused by timmy's overgrown ego and dream of grandure when Reapers ante portas...

He did mess witht the Turians....... And the Turians in Retribution nerarly took him down.

[Marta Rio]

Just finished Retribution, and overall, I thought it was not as good as Ascension.  Mainly because, other than the character of Kai Leng, there wasn't much new to digest.  We didn't really find out much more about the Illusive Man (I guess that's going to be presented in the new comic series?), or the Reapers (although that quantum entanglement communication was a bit nifty I suppose).  And even though we got to read about the indoctrination process from an indoctrinee's perspective, it just didn't seem to me like there were many new things revealed that couldn't already be surmised from the games.  Whereas in Ascension there was a whole boatload of new info about the Quarians, and also the introduction of Omega, two things which featured prominently in ME2.  Hopefully this means that they're leaving the big surprises from ME3 itself, but it meant that overall, I was a little bored with the novel.

There were a couple of things that drove me nuts about Retribution, primarily Karpyshyn's technique of describing certain scenes from multiple character perspectives.  This is not necessarily a bad technique, but at the end he's totally out of control - there are 5 characters running around Grissom Academy, and we get descriptions of the final action sequence from each one.  (Maybe it's just me, but I couldn't care less about what minor character Nick the biotic teen was thinking at that point in the narrative.)  Also, I couldn't believe how Mary Sue-ish Sanders was in this novel.  Maybe she was in Ascension as well, I just don't recall it being quite as bad.  But in this she's so wonderful that all her male students, as well as Anderson and Grayson, are in love with her, and she's so smart that she can decipher any encrypted files or solve any problem requiring complicated analysis techniques.  I think there was maybe one line about a possible negative character trait (something about her keeping feelings bottled up maybe?).  

Despite these rants (which I needed to get off my chest, I guess), I didn't think Retribution was all that terrible, at least for a video game tie-in novel, and hopefully there will be some mention of Kai Leng in the next game (assassin showdown vs. Thane maybe?).  The one thing the novel did seem to confirm, as was hinted at in ME2 as well, as that humanity seems to be selected for some form of "immortality" by the Reapers.  I'd like to think that this means that the Reapers aren't just totally one dimensional villains, and that humans just don't really "get" what they're trying to do for us.

[AresXX7]

Marta Rio wrote...

 I'd like to think that this means that the Reapers aren't just totally one dimensional villains, and that humans just don't really "get" what they're trying to do for us.

I don't really think they're trying to do anything for our benefit, but for their own, I say this because of their need to control others
i.e. husks & collectors - neither had any independent motives or real freedom of will


oh and....

Shandepared wrote...

AriesXX7 wrote...

I want to see them both crushed under my boot

Then I guess you should have crushed them when you had the chance.

I prefer not having to intentionally go through innocents to get my target, if I can help it
which is why I'd like to cross paths with them again in the game(s)

Modifié par AriesXX7, 02 août 2010 - 01:02 .

[MarchWaltz]

I hope the new DLC has some info regarding the book, like you hear Anderson resigned or something.

[Hunter Boris.0]

Wait so if Anderson quit what does that mean?

[didymos1120]

Hunter Boris.0 wrote...

Wait so if Anderson quit what does that mean?

Um, that he...quit?  I'm not really sure what you mean by that question.

[Marta Rio]

Hunter Boris.0 wrote...

Wait so if Anderson quit what does that mean?

That he's not going to be an utter bore in ME3?  That he'll have something to do other than mope around his office and complain about his misspent "twilight years" (even though he's only 49, apparently)? 

[Lieutenant Flashlight]

Hunter Boris.0 wrote...

Wait so if Anderson quit what does that mean?

Possible ME3 Squadmate perhaps?

Ignore me.  I'm letting my hopes get up. 

[snfonseka]

For me this book has a weak storyline (seriously the story as a whole is boring but there are some interesting points here and there!). Also the writer tried to represented the story in black and white format where there are no (or less) gray areas.

[mosor]

Asheer_Khan wrote...

That's why i seriously hope that for the sake of humanity i will be able to end cerberus existence once for all before will be too late to prevent another war... because my Shepard have more important things to do than cleaning galaxy from more and more cerberus failures caused by timmy's overgrown ego and dream of grandure when Reapers ante portas...

The biggest failures here is Drew and the writing of other bioware writers. We know Cerberus must have had plenty of sucessess or they wouldn't be an organization worth mentioning. However they write about their failures so much that it's really hard to take them seriously as an antagonist. I guess thats why my Sheppard helps them. I'll make em winners dispite Drews attempts to turn them into losers.

At least Drew has good taste in human councillors. I chose Udina all the time   It's good that he at least shows what his version of the ME universe is.

Modifié par mosor, 02 août 2010 - 06:43 .

[SandTrout]

Andersen's resignation actually allows for a kind of pro-active retcon(Yes, I know that is an oxymoron) that allows BW to consolidate some of the possibilities for the start of ME3. Regardless of weather you pick Andersen or Udina for Counselor, Andersen eventually resigns his post, leaving him free to help you as a free agent and contact on the Citadel.

If he hated being the military advisor to the Counselor, there is no doubt he would have hated being Counselor more, so it still makes sense when he tells Shepard that he resigned in ME3.

I also figure that the writers are setting up so that the Counsel dies (again), but they don't want David Andersen's character to be killed of.

As for Cerberus: The writers do need to cut the crap with them failing comically every time Shepard is not directly involved. Yes, from a practical standpoint, I know that they must have some successes under their belt, that we never hear about, but this is really getting to the point of silliness on the writer's behalf. We do know they have more than Just Miranda as competent field operatives, though. Kai Leng does get the job done, even if there is an excessive body count.

[snfonseka]

SandTrout wrote...

Andersen's resignation actually allows for a kind of pro-active retcon(Yes, I know that is an oxymoron) that allows BW to consolidate some of the possibilities for the start of ME3. Regardless of weather you pick Andersen or Udina for Counselor, Andersen eventually resigns his post, leaving him free to help you as a free agent and contact on the Citadel.
If he hated being the military advisor to the Counselor, there is no doubt he would have hated being Counselor more, so it still makes sense when he tells Shepard that he resigned in ME3.
I also figure that the writers are setting up so that the Counsel dies (again), but they don't want David Andersen's character to be killed of.
As for Cerberus: The writers do need to cut the crap with them failing comically every time Shepard is not directly involved. Yes, from a practical standpoint, I know that they must have some successes under their belt, that we never hear about, but this is really getting to the point of silliness on the writer's behalf. We do know they have more than Just Miranda as competent field operatives, though. Kai Leng does get the job done, even if there is an excessive body count.

^This.

[Mummolus]

Y'know the most interesting thing in the book for me was when Reaperson was wandering around the streets of Omega thinking that everything was still based on Reaper tech. It was a bit of a throwaway line but it looked to me like they might have been hinting that Omega has a larger role to play, especially given that the last major prothean relic turned out to be Reaper in origin, and Omega is widely seen as a prothean relic.

[Costin_Razvan]

Also, I couldn't believe how Mary Sue-ish Sanders was in this novel.

She was to a degree in Ascension as well as far as I can remember...



Let's see how well that helps her when my Shepard plants his gun in her face in ME3 and pulls the trigger at point black range. Anderson might also get a bullet for being a blind stubborn moron.



Leng: Let's work together to take down his Reaper!



Anderson and Sanders: **** no, never with Cerberus....we would sooner see the Galaxy burn then do that.

[snfonseka]

Actually according to my opinion ME related novels are getting dumber at each release. The first novel is a good one, second one also somewhat good (but not better than the first) and this novel is the dumbest of all. Its looks like the writers cannot survive without Cerberus. Why they can't come-up with a new creative idea, rather than writing about another failed experiment. ME universe has enough failed experiments ... now it's time for thinking something new !