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[-Semper-]

damn, missed the tail. oh, and gargoyles already have horns

[nightcobra]

basically the similarities between the two are the upper torso and the face

[Jimmy Fury]

Anarya wrote...
Origins and races? No probably not in need of fixing but they never said (and probably never intended) that you'd always have a bunch of different origins to choose from.

Art and combat style? Debatable, and ultimately subjective. I personally think they DID need changing, especially the art style. Maybe it's because I pay particular attention to the way things look but Origins looked terrible on the consoles. At max settings on the PC it looked decent but nothing to write home about. There was not enough visual differentiation between races and the overall style was kind of generic looking. These were complaints of many of the reviews as well, so I know I'm not alone in this.

The glitches and patches are absolutely something that needs more attention but I disagree that they were the only things that needed to change.

For the last month (has it been a month yet?) i've been wondering why people have stopped seeing the colon between Dragon Age and Origins.
For me, and obviously this is purely my opinion, the presence of the colon suggested that the origins were going to be unique to Dragon Age: Origins. Mind you I don't consider species+class to be an origin. The origin missions are the origins.

But yeah, art and combat are entirely subjective. There were things I hated about the combat. Like when you go to attack an enemy and you circle them for 5 seconds before striking.... so I'm pretty pleased about that being one of the few confirmed changes.

BrotherWarth wrote...
This is not the only forum discusiing
DAII.  And quite honestly these boards do play home to a lot of Bioware
sycophants. Probably because this is the only forum that Bioware devs
post on and people don't want to seem like jerks right to them. Go to
any other forum discussing DAII and the majority of posters are against
the changes being made.

Nice ad hominen but I've seen some other boards discussing DA2 and there's a couple of problems with your analysis.
1: Haven't seen this "majority" you speak of on other boards either. Still a lot of support for changes.
2: Other boards have angrier people on them yes. But I've noticed they also have more people spouting outright lies to drum up that rage.
Things like, claiming the devs have confirmed something but only in 1 unnamed foreign magazines printed in another language that the people on the english speaking board wouldn't understand anyway so they won't bother to cite the source. Stuff that has not been confirmed here by the devs themselves, hasn't been linked to in the "what we know" thread, or is the exact opposite of what has been said here.

So I wouldn't rely too heavily on those boards to be unbiased sources either.

[TSamee]

My stance on DA2 is prettymuch "wait and see", though the (much) shorter dev cycle does worry me. I'd like to see the decision to make Hawke voiced as an attempt to really characterise your protagonist and make the story genuinely revolve around them; a way of making your character a real member of the cast, but with a dev cycle of max 2 years (assuming it actually releases in March 2010) it seems like a way to cut corners.

Keep in mind that I'm trying not to spout the PR BioWare used to sell Shepard, even if it sounds like it. Shepard had no backstory short of a paragraph, no past; he/she's actual character can only be defined by the player, and yet he's voiced, so he's a strange mix of first and third-person protagonists. I personally like the approach (at least the way it was implemented in ME1; didn't like the sequel), but it still means Shepard doesn't really feel like a character, just a PC with a voice. It seems (from posts by writers, at least), that they're actually trying to flesh Hawke out as a character this time, which is good.

Getting back on topic, I quite like the Qunari's new look. I don't think it applies to the average Qunari; having horns is obviously something special. Possible hereditary, but maybe it actually signals a child whose abilities mean they're destined for greatness. So, those born with exceptional strength and willpower, who seem destined to become the greatest of warriors, might also be born with horns. However, I'm really apprehensive about the white pigment. I really hope the white and red are tattoos; their culture seems a bit eastern, with elements of Middle Eastern culture and some Islamic values (as well as a hefty dose of mental strength and plenty of awesomeness); it seemed appropriate for them to have bronzed, Arabesque skin. Perhaps the Qunari in the shots is some sort of outcast who joins Hawke on his travels, or maybe some kind of High Priest?


EDIT: Scratch the Arabesque statement; Qunari would be like Buddhists if Buddhists decided to believe in the necessity of violence.

Modifié par TSamee, 09 août 2010 - 04:34 .

[Nohvarr]

BrotherWarth wrote...

Nohvarr wrote...

Let's take another look at all the 'new' racial designs.

http://bioware.files...8/da2_races.jpg

I don't see the problem. Enlighten me.

The Qunari stepped out of the 90's cartoon Gargoyles to invade Dragon Age.

Soooo Bioware is taking pointers from one of the best cartoon series Disney ever produced?

Even if that were true, (and I think other people have shown that it's not) I'd really not mind.

DA:O did not really stand out in the visuals department. It was generic at best, and these days you need to do more than just slightly modify the "Sword & Sorcery" visuals if you want to stand our from the crowd.

[Bryy_Miller]

BrotherWarth wrote...

Anarya wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...

This is not the only forum discusiing DAII.  And quite honestly these boards do play home to a lot of Bioware sycophants. Probably because this is the only forum that Bioware devs post on and people don't want to seem like jerks right to them. Go to any other forum discussing DAII and the majority of posters are against the changes being made.
I remember in the run-up to ME2 dropping a few people like me who didn't like the inventory change were told by a big group of people to leave the forum because we didn't deserve to play Bioware's games. I had dozens of messages talling me I suck and am too stupid to understand Bioware. So this forum is an especially bad barometer.
But that's not to say every poster here is a sycophant. I will say that this forum is much more civilized and even tempered than the ME2 board was before that game came out.

I still don't see how any of that warrants an "I OWN you, Gaider! P.S. You are a jerk" response. Because that's how your post came off.

I mean really. I don't personally care what you think of DA2 either way, but it irks me to see rudeness like that. You are obviously capable of expressing yourself civilly, but I guess if all you wanted was attention from David Gaider I suppose it worked, though I don't really know what you got out of it. Besides attention.

That was not my intention at all. I wasn't aware that my post came off like that.

Then you really need to think about how you want to present yourself before you post. 

[TSamee]

Seeing the concepts for all the races I'm a bit apprehensive about the Qunari's horns. I really hope they're special, so babies with higher muscle-building potential, or willpower potential or whatever have them, either that or it's just hit-or-miss and some Qunari just have them. In showing us Sten's squadmates in the Fade illusion, both of whom have the same skin and build as him, BioWare have shot their story's continuity... only way out I see if all Qunari have them is for Sten to be of mixed parentage (not hard, considering how many races and nations have been amalgamated into the Qunari nation), and for all such soldiers to be put into separate squads ("pure", horned Qunari may be stronger, etc., or perhaps it's just segregation as between black and white soldiers in the 1800 and 1900s)

[Ghurshog]

The simple fact is people fear change and they are terrified with things they actually like. Alot of folks liked Dragon Age Origins.



But the fact of the matter is you only honestly get to vote with your pocket books.



If you like it buy it, if you think you wont, dont. its as simple as that.



You are entitled to no more and no less.

[Jimbe2693]

They look better.

[TSamee]

eh, it's not so much the change for me. I just don't like the idea of BioWare completely changing the aesthetic of an entire race... it's like seeing an Asari in Mass Effect that looks like a Krogan. It doesn't fit in the framework of previous games. Still, we've only seen Sten and his two squadmates in DA:O, so coming up with a lore reason for most Qunari to have horns should be easy.

And yes, they do look better. More unique, at least, though I wouldn't expect the Qun coming from something that looks as though it'll tear my face off.

Modifié par TSamee, 09 août 2010 - 11:27 .

[Riona45]

BrotherWarth wrote...


This is not the only forum discusiing DAII.  And quite honestly these boards do play home to a lot of Bioware sycophants. Probably because this is the only forum that Bioware devs post on and people don't want to seem like jerks right to them. Go to any other forum discussing DAII and the majority of posters are against the changes being made.

People who post on messageboards in general (even aside from BW's boards) still don't represent the majority of game buyers.

[Riona45]

Anarya wrote...

Art and combat style? Debatable, and ultimately subjective. I personally think they DID need changing, especially the art style. Maybe it's because I pay particular attention to the way things look but Origins looked terrible on the consoles. At max settings on the PC it looked decent but nothing to write home about. There was not enough visual differentiation between races and the overall style was kind of generic looking. These were complaints of many of the reviews as well, so I know I'm not alone in this.

Indeed, I'd rather see them take a risk and try out a new art style rather than stick with the old one.  If it pays off, it might take my breath away rather than be mostly "meh, been there, seen that."

[filetemo]

[quote]Anarya wrote...

[quote]Dave of Canada wrote...

Boss: Remember son, the customer is always right!
Newbie: Sure thing, boss!
Boss: I'll be leaving you in charge of the store while I'm gone.
Newbie: OK-ie-DO-kie!
[Boss leaves, guy enters]
Guy: I'd like a burger.
Newbie: Anything else you'd like?
Guy: A milkshake with that, please.
Newbie: The customer is always right!
Guy: Oh really? Did you know that the burger and milkshake are free today?
Newbie: Omg rly?
Guy: Yep, and you'll give me all the money in the cash register too because it's opposite day where you give ME money!

[one hour later, the deed to the store was given to the guy along with everything inside it]

Boss: We're ruined, we're ruined! *cries*


[/quote]

Boss: Remember son, the customer is always right!
Newbie: Sure thing, boss!
Boss: I'll be leaving you in charge of the store while I'm gone.
Newbie: OK-ie-DO-kie!
[Boss leaves, guy enters]
Guy: I'd like a burger, no pickles.
Newbie: Anything else you'd like?
Guy: A milkshake with that, please.
Newbie: The customer is always right!
Guy: I SAID NO PICKLES YOU INCOMPETENT MORON I DEMAND FREE FOOD FOR LIFE OR I SUE YOU FOR EVERYTHING YOU'VE GOT!!!!! I DEMAND TO SEE THE MANAGER!!
Newbie: Omg!!
Guy: THE CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT!!! 

[one hour later, the deed to the store was given to the guy along with everything inside it]

Boss: We're ruined, we're ruined! *cries*

Fixed that up a bit for you. That's how it goes down in America. Is it that bad for you guys?

[/quote][/quote]

EA exec: Remember David, the console customer is always right!
David Gaider: Sure thing boss!
EA exec: I'll be leaving you in charge of the store while I'm gone.
[PC gamer enters the forum]
PC gamer: Hello, I would like a Dragon Age sequel
David Gaider: Anything else you would like?
PC gamer: Yes, I want it to have better graphics, to play as my warden, to finish morrigan story and to expand for the better all the features the original had
David Gaider: look, what you want is irrelevant to us, because ultimately we're making the game and making the choices, so we know what is a good game, and you don't. The dominant market is the console market, where you need A button mashing, low-res textures, dumbed down inventory and action rpg combat speed to appeal the FPS crowd. Since you are a dirty pirate and your demands for quality are not rewarded with the money we get from the console crowd, I have to tell you that probably this game is not for you and you should leave the store right now before I call security.
[PC gamer goes to purchase the Witcher 2]
EA exec: We're ruined!... wait, let's sell Bioware to Activision.

[Riona45]

TSamee wrote...
Getting back on topic, I quite like the Qunari's new look. I don't think it applies to the average Qunari; having horns is obviously something special.

No, it's been stated to be the exact opposite.  Most qunari have horns.  The ones that don't are uncommon (but not rare) and are the ones seen as "special."

[Odin2040]

I think they look better and more unique this way.

[Lil-Vinny29]

Only getting awful feelings about DA2 ..now Sten was just a nice little qunari? When the others are more demonic looking?



I still dont get it...First Title ORIGINS and then you want to change everything and its not a sequel or barely.



Will focus on ME now

[TSamee]

oh, thanks for clearing that up... still, it seems weird. Perhaps not having horns could be the result of mixed parentage? Sten's squad all looked like him if the Fade illusion is to be believed, so maybe Qunari warriors are segregated? Or perhaps hornless Qunari are put into squads like Sten's, who have more covert missions in other countries. Seeing an almost-seven-foot brown guy running around with a broadsword (in a land where everyone is five-something and white) must be more acceptable than a GIANT FRIGGING DEMON.



Still, they've only really showed us three Qunari, so a lore reason (like the one I mentioned) should be easy to come up with. Also, does anybody feel weird that a philosophy like the Qun is adopted by people who look like they'll tear your face off? I don't know a thing about Buddhism, but a Buddhist who believes in violence is the closest parallel I can draw to Sten... the "new" Qunari seem like they'll scream at me before snapping my spine in two and beating my squad to death with my corpse, all in about three seconds. Just getting a bit of a "crazed killing machine" vibe from them... sort of as if BioWare just cooked this up and though "this is badass" (which it is).

[mllrthyme]

TSamee wrote...

Still, they've only really showed us three Qunari, so a lore reason (like the one I mentioned) should be easy to come up with. Also, does anybody feel weird that a philosophy like the Qun is adopted by people who look like they'll tear your face off? I don't know a thing about Buddhism, but a Buddhist who believes in violence is the closest parallel I can draw to Sten... the "new" Qunari seem like they'll scream at me before snapping my spine in two and beating my squad to death with my corpse, all in about three seconds. Just getting a bit of a "crazed killing machine" vibe from them... sort of as if BioWare just cooked this up and though "this is badass" (which it is).

If that's the case, I so want the new Qunari for a squad mate!

[Bryy_Miller]

Lil-Vinny29 wrote...

I still dont get it...First Title ORIGINS and then you want to change everything and its not a sequel or barely.

Well, it's not an origin story anymore.

[Riona45]

Lil-Vinny29 wrote...

Only getting awful feelings about DA2 ..now Sten was just a nice little qunari? When the others are more demonic looking?

What does that even mean?

[Anarya]

TSamee wrote...

oh, thanks for clearing that up... still, it seems weird. Perhaps not having horns could be the result of mixed parentage? Sten's squad all looked like him if the Fade illusion is to be believed, so maybe Qunari warriors are segregated? Or perhaps hornless Qunari are put into squads like Sten's, who have more covert missions in other countries. Seeing an almost-seven-foot brown guy running around with a broadsword (in a land where everyone is five-something and white) must be more acceptable than a GIANT FRIGGING DEMON.

Still, they've only really showed us three Qunari, so a lore reason (like the one I mentioned) should be easy to come up with. Also, does anybody feel weird that a philosophy like the Qun is adopted by people who look like they'll tear your face off? I don't know a thing about Buddhism, but a Buddhist who believes in violence is the closest parallel I can draw to Sten... the "new" Qunari seem like they'll scream at me before snapping my spine in two and beating my squad to death with my corpse, all in about three seconds. Just getting a bit of a "crazed killing machine" vibe from them... sort of as if BioWare just cooked this up and though "this is badass" (which it is).

Really? Because to me they look like huge hulking dudes but with intelligent-looking faces. Like Beast from X-Men.