The only praise I can give to AP is that the way it controls the flow of the story is great, and really knows how to handle consequences. Can't really make up for bad characters, poor voice acting and boring story, and that's just the cherry on top of the giant **** sundae that is the broken gameplay mechanics.
On the other hand, giving yourself a fisheman's beard, big sunglasses and a beanie, and intentionally picking the silly dialogue lines make this game hilarious. I wouldn't play it again, though.
Mass Effect 3 should have choices like Alpha Protocol( AP Spoilers)
Débuté par
CroGamer002
, juil. 30 2010 12:04
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#77
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 04:35
DarthCaine
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AP had lots of consequences at the expense of being a 20 hour long RPG. You also couldn't play as a female and couldn't customize your character much. AP had so many features, that in the end it was very unpolished and buggy and the all the features ended up being half implemented and broken. They had stupid designers and blew the budget on wrong things (it was in development for like 5 years)
Would you prefer that kind of ME3?
Choices and consequences can cost a lot of money 'cos of the many variations. ME3 could have lots of big consequences, but they'd have to remove FemShep, the whole character creator (only Sheploo would be available) and make it 20 hours long (not to mention the fact that the game would probably be buggy as hell). Would you prefer that?
Would you prefer that kind of ME3?
Choices and consequences can cost a lot of money 'cos of the many variations. ME3 could have lots of big consequences, but they'd have to remove FemShep, the whole character creator (only Sheploo would be available) and make it 20 hours long (not to mention the fact that the game would probably be buggy as hell). Would you prefer that?
Modifié par DarthCaine, 08 octobre 2010 - 05:34 .
#78
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 04:45
DarthCaine
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You mean how to be a complete financial failure disliked by both critics and fans alike?smudboy wrote...
ME can learn quite a lot from AP.
I liked AP, but I have low standards in some areas.
It's what the majority likes that's important for devs (guess what, people LIKE making lots of money), and the majority says ME2>ME1>>>>>>AP.
Modifié par DarthCaine, 08 octobre 2010 - 04:54 .
#79
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 05:16
SnakeStrike8
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The best part of Alpha Protocol, I think, was how natural the dialogue felt. Thorton would walk around as he spoke to others, glance around, draw guns, wave his arms around- andothers would do the same, too! Anyone recall the Thorton-Albatross face to face talk? What I enjoyed about that short section was that it felt real. You weren't just standing in the snow glaring at each other. You mvoed around.
Mass Effect can stand to copy that feature, if nothing else. I don't want Shepard-Commander to be constantly asking bland and innane who/what/where/why/when/how questions while standing stiff as a board. Alpha Protcol's dialogue felt real. Sentences were phrased in unique ways. A Suave Thorton would crack sarcastic jokes every time he opened his mouth. Aggresive Thortons really did sound aggressive.
Mass Effect doesn't do this, and it should in my opinion because it would make the game feel more real. 'Nuff said.
Mass Effect can stand to copy that feature, if nothing else. I don't want Shepard-Commander to be constantly asking bland and innane who/what/where/why/when/how questions while standing stiff as a board. Alpha Protcol's dialogue felt real. Sentences were phrased in unique ways. A Suave Thorton would crack sarcastic jokes every time he opened his mouth. Aggresive Thortons really did sound aggressive.
Mass Effect doesn't do this, and it should in my opinion because it would make the game feel more real. 'Nuff said.
#80
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 05:20
Xilizhra
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If Sheploo was removed instead, I might take it.DarthCaine wrote...
AP had lots of consequences at the expense of being a 20 hour long RPG. You also couldn't play as a female and couldn't customize your character much. AP had so many features, that in the end it was very unpolished and buggy and the all the features ended up being half implemented and broken. They had stupid designers and blew the budget on wrong things (it was in development for like 5 years)
Would you prefer that kind of ME3?
Choices and consequences can cost a lot of money 'cos of the many variations. ME3 could have lots of big consequences, but they'd have to remove FemShep, the whole character creator and make it 20 hours long. Would you prefer that?
#81
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 05:55
Raizo
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I haven't actually played Alpha Protocal myself although I have seen various clips of the game on youtube.
I'm not fond of having a time limit to make my dialogue choices but I will admit that I am intrigued by the idea of knowing what tone AP's main character will use in his dialogue choices. The thing is that I don't feel that AP's dialogue system is superior to ME's. I feel that AP's dialogue system is a bit vague, at least in the ME games we have a brief preview of how Shepard is going to phrase his/her responses.
The only thing wrong with the ME games dialogue system is the morality system, it forces you to be either Paragon or Renegade, it doesn't really encourage palying araound with the dialogue system since you have to be one or the other. I would much rather see a collective "Charisma" meter as opposed to the current Paragon and Renegade bars that fill up independant of one another.
I'm not fond of having a time limit to make my dialogue choices but I will admit that I am intrigued by the idea of knowing what tone AP's main character will use in his dialogue choices. The thing is that I don't feel that AP's dialogue system is superior to ME's. I feel that AP's dialogue system is a bit vague, at least in the ME games we have a brief preview of how Shepard is going to phrase his/her responses.
The only thing wrong with the ME games dialogue system is the morality system, it forces you to be either Paragon or Renegade, it doesn't really encourage palying araound with the dialogue system since you have to be one or the other. I would much rather see a collective "Charisma" meter as opposed to the current Paragon and Renegade bars that fill up independant of one another.
#82
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 06:34
Phaedon
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If you overlook some of the issues AP had (cheesy lines, not so good gameplay), it's a very good game. But I think that the consequences for your choices were too severe, really. I dunno if I prefer the fact that in AP you can choose the style of your response, instead of the actual response.
#83
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 06:56
RiouHotaru
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Also, I loved the perks system, which is basically a more advanced version of what ME1 did. The game kept track of lots of variables: enemies dropped lethally/non-lethally, gadgets used, headshots gotten, etc, etc. At a pre-determined milestone, you could get a 'Perk' which rewarded for reaching that milestone with immediate in-game benefits, like discounts on intel or items, increased durations/reduced cooldowns on powers, and so on.
I felt this was an incredible system for rewarding players, like how ME1's achievements worked by rewarding players for consistent behavior, although with ME1 the bonuses were permanent across all playthroughs, and the bonuses weren't quite as varied as AP's. But the system itself, the concept of giving the player an intrinsic, in-game bonus for their playstyle is a great idea.
I felt this was an incredible system for rewarding players, like how ME1's achievements worked by rewarding players for consistent behavior, although with ME1 the bonuses were permanent across all playthroughs, and the bonuses weren't quite as varied as AP's. But the system itself, the concept of giving the player an intrinsic, in-game bonus for their playstyle is a great idea.
#84
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 07:28
nelly21
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Not this again.
The only redeemable aspect of Alpha Protocol was when Obsidian announced they weren't making a sequel.
Also: "If you overlook some of the issues AP had (cheesy lines, not so good gameplay), it's a very good game."
If all the ME2 haters lived by this standard, you would all realize what an awesome game ME2 is.
AP was crap. Bioware has nothing to learn from it.
The only redeemable aspect of Alpha Protocol was when Obsidian announced they weren't making a sequel.
Also: "If you overlook some of the issues AP had (cheesy lines, not so good gameplay), it's a very good game."
If all the ME2 haters lived by this standard, you would all realize what an awesome game ME2 is.
AP was crap. Bioware has nothing to learn from it.
Modifié par nelly21, 08 octobre 2010 - 08:21 .
#85
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 09:42
Valikdu
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Yeah, ME can learn quite a lot.
<serious> Well, actually there is a couple of things. There are more well-directed cutscenes in AP (at least from my pov), though I'm sure that's being taken care of regardless. And the influence... though I'm sure that too will be present in ME3 in some shape or form, since it was stated that ME3 will be more "RPG" than ME2.
Modifié par Valikdu, 08 octobre 2010 - 09:48 .
#86
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 09:47
Valikdu
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<double post>
Modifié par Valikdu, 08 octobre 2010 - 09:47 .
#87
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 10:25
Iakus
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Choice and consequences
Inventory management and mods
Skill system
ME could indeed learn a lot from Alpha Protocol. Yes AP had it's share of flaws, but it lived up to its claim "Your weapon is Choice"
Inventory management and mods
Skill system
ME could indeed learn a lot from Alpha Protocol. Yes AP had it's share of flaws, but it lived up to its claim "Your weapon is Choice"
#88
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 11:05
CroGamer002
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Well I agree ME2 is far superior in terms of gameplay, plot and characters but dialogue system and dialogue choices are better in AP.
#89
Posté 08 octobre 2010 - 11:14
Iakus
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Mesina2 wrote...
Well I agree ME2 is far superior in terms of gameplay, plot and characters but dialogue system and dialogue choices are better in AP.
I'll agree with gameplay. Maybe plot, but I think AP executed its plot better than ME2 did its own. Characters is debatable. Some of AP's characters were kinda dull (Leland). But others were truly intrigiung, and colorful. "Turn Up the Radio" has been changed for me forever
#90
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 01:01
Felene
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ME can tell a epic story but can't write a good story, just kidnap AP's writing team and use them on ME3 or any other ME titles. Problem solve.
#91
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 02:01
InvaderErl
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DarthCaine wrote...
You mean how to be a complete financial failure disliked by both critics and fans alike?smudboy wrote...
ME can learn quite a lot from AP.
So much so the publisher actually made a statement that there WOULDN'T be a sequel. I've never seen that happen before.
#92
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 02:55
Arijharn
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They said they wouldn't make a sequel to AP, but not that they wouldn't use what they learnt from that game. That's two different things.
The perks, how the consequences of your decisions actually felt like consequences (even if in the end they were relatively minor) even I thought the time limit to conversations, I thought these were good ideas and would like to see further incarnations of them.
Most of all, I'd like to see perks somehow return...
The perks, how the consequences of your decisions actually felt like consequences (even if in the end they were relatively minor) even I thought the time limit to conversations, I thought these were good ideas and would like to see further incarnations of them.
Most of all, I'd like to see perks somehow return...
#93
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 04:49
DarthCaine
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Like I said, they need to balance their budget, if ME2 had lots of consequences, it would've had crap gameplay and stuffMesina2 wrote...
Well I agree ME2 is far superior in terms of gameplay, plot and characters but dialogue system and dialogue choices are better in AP.
#94
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 05:12
Therion942
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DarthCaine wrote...
Like I said, they need to balance their budget, if ME2 had lots of consequences, it would've had crap gameplay and stuffMesina2 wrote...
Well I agree ME2 is far superior in terms of gameplay, plot and characters but dialogue system and dialogue choices are better in AP.
I find it a little funny you're in here defending ME2's abominable C&C system with a Witcher 2 signature, considering the Witcher did C&C much better than ME2 did with probably half the budget and even more paths and characters to deal with.<_<
#95
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 06:14
Valikdu
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iakus wrote...
"Turn Up the Radio" has been changed for me forever
Oh yes.
#96
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 07:38
CroGamer002
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DarthCaine wrote...
Like I said, they need to balance their budget, if ME2 had lots of consequences, it would've had crap gameplay and stuffMesina2 wrote...
Well I agree ME2 is far superior in terms of gameplay, plot and characters but dialogue system and dialogue choices are better in AP.
They can just do few twiks with ME2 gameplay and add few more features for ME3 and done.
#97
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 07:59
Phaedon
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Well, they couldn't go crazy with consequences in ME1 or ME2, it was in the middle of the trilogy.Mesina2 wrote...
DarthCaine wrote...
Like I said, they need to balance their budget, if ME2 had lots of consequences, it would've had crap gameplay and stuffMesina2 wrote...
Well I agree ME2 is far superior in terms of gameplay, plot and characters but dialogue system and dialogue choices are better in AP.
They can just do few twiks with ME2 gameplay and add few more features for ME3 and done.
#98
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 02:15
Arijharn
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They probably could have made some meaningful consequences though. Ahhh the benefits of hindsight and armchair game designers! XD
#99
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 03:01
smudboy
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Phaedon wrote...
Well, they couldn't go crazy with consequences in ME1 or ME2, it was in the middle of the trilogy.Mesina2 wrote...
DarthCaine wrote...
Like I said, they need to balance their budget, if ME2 had lots of consequences, it would've had crap gameplay and stuffMesina2 wrote...
Well I agree ME2 is far superior in terms of gameplay, plot and characters but dialogue system and dialogue choices are better in AP.
They can just do few twiks with ME2 gameplay and add few more features for ME3 and done.
How does that make any sense? AP had amazing consequences to the main plot and it didn't need sequels. If anything, sequels should've increased the complexity and consequences of choices. Being 2 of 3 makes no difference whatsoever.
Modifié par smudboy, 09 octobre 2010 - 03:01 .
#100
Posté 09 octobre 2010 - 03:14
MassEffect762
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It would an interesting system to adapt.
I see TOO many things already on Biowares plate though.
1) Story (I doubt it was fleshed out already)
2) Choice impact (people are tired of emails, an impact that has real "weight" is going to co$t)
3) Shooter elements still need fine tuning. (kneeling, lessen cover)
4) Para/Renegade options. (what happens to them?) I guess you could leave them for interrupts.
5) AP feature helps the RPG department but it's only the start imo. (RPG needs to find it's way back to the weapons/armor/biotics/upgrades/crew armor/more skills/etc)
I'm not saying it isn't possible just that I don't see Bioware putting even more TLC to make it work.
To put it bluntly, they're a buisness. (buy low, sell high)
I see TOO many things already on Biowares plate though.
1) Story (I doubt it was fleshed out already)
2) Choice impact (people are tired of emails, an impact that has real "weight" is going to co$t)
3) Shooter elements still need fine tuning. (kneeling, lessen cover)
4) Para/Renegade options. (what happens to them?) I guess you could leave them for interrupts.
5) AP feature helps the RPG department but it's only the start imo. (RPG needs to find it's way back to the weapons/armor/biotics/upgrades/crew armor/more skills/etc)
I'm not saying it isn't possible just that I don't see Bioware putting even more TLC to make it work.
To put it bluntly, they're a buisness. (buy low, sell high)
Modifié par MassEffect762, 09 octobre 2010 - 03:20 .
