1507 réponses à ce sujet

[Nerevar-as]

Comparing both games in gameplay is completely pointless. They are not intended to be similar. Doesn´t help that we still don´t know DA2 gameplay, and even it might be different for PC and consoles

[MintyCool]

RageGT wrote...

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

I'm not saying the witcher series doesn't have a kickass story. However, DA2 will probably have one as well (Bioware only failed once), and DA2 also has party based tactical gameplay, which the witcher lacks.

Failed Once? And yet that is their best ever game delivered ever? Have you tried any of the amazing worlds created or adapted from literature to such "one time fail"? The OC was just like a demo of what could be done..

http://nwn.wikia.com...gory:Gameworlds

From
what I can remember, (besides maybe the Mass Effect series) Bioware has just
been rehashing the same story outline for many years now. Gaiders writing is
looked upon on these forums like he's some hero when in reality, Dragon Age is
pretty vanilla when it comes to a narrative based on Mages, Dwarves, and Elves.
Everything is just kind of bland, and not very unique. Even the novel Gaider
wrote was complete trash. Actually, Reviewer Crowshaw explains the tiredness of
the story better than I can. Copy/paste Link below...

http://www.escapistm...gon-Age-Origins




That being said, I do hope DA2 does turn out well. (Even
though, judging by the previews, graphics, and gameplay its looking less likely) Good RPG's are few and far between,
I guess we'll just wait and see.

Modifié par MintyCool, 22 août 2010 - 10:00 .

[AndrahilAdrian]

RageGT wrote...

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

I'm not saying the witcher series doesn't have a kickass story. However, DA2 will probably have one as well (Bioware only failed once), and DA2 also has party based tactical gameplay, which the witcher lacks.

Failed Once? And yet that is their best ever game delivered ever? Have you tried any of the amazing worlds created or adapted from literature to such "one time fail"? The OC was just like a demo of what could be done..

http://nwn.wikia.com...gory:Gameworlds

But do any of those user created stories match the epicness of mass effect or Dragon Age? I get that NWN was great value for money, and it had fun multiplayer for people into D&D, but in terms of quality I found it severely lacking. In short, Neverwinter Nights blew. :innocent:

Thanks for the link though, I appreciate the thought.

Modifié par AndrahilAdrian, 22 août 2010 - 10:09 .

[fchopin]

In my opinion if you people want to talk about the witcher you should go to the witcher forums.



This is the DA2 forum so i think enough has been said about the witcher.

[DragonRageGT]

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

RageGT wrote...

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

I'm not saying the witcher series doesn't have a kickass story. However, DA2 will probably have one as well (Bioware only failed once), and DA2 also has party based tactical gameplay, which the witcher lacks.

Failed Once? And yet that is their best ever game delivered ever? Have you tried any of the amazing worlds created or adapted from literature to such "one time fail"? The OC was just like a demo of what could be done..

http://nwn.wikia.com...gory:Gameworlds

But do any of those user created stories match the epicness of mass effect or Dragon Age? I get that NWN was great value for money, and it had fun multiplayer for people into D&D, but in terms of quality I found it severely lacking. In short, Neverwinter Nights blew. :innocent:

Thanks for the link though, I appreciate the thought.

Well, there are always the well established epic stories that some PW used as background. LotR, Zelda, Ultima, etc.

And a DM'ed event in a LotR hardcore roleplay PW could really make many of us go very emotional. Like doing a courier mission for the Captain of Gondor or being summoned by the Lady of the Galadhrim (particularly when you're an Elf born in Caras Galadhon, like my RageBow) to be assigned a misson deep inside Mordor.

But nothing will ever beat the fight against Sauron inside the forge of Orodruin when a slaying evil arrow of mine hit the damn thing and he rolled a 1 in his save roll and poof! I would pay anything to see the face of the DM controlling him! Of course he was mad. Next day those arrows were banned from the server! =)

"Nei Ragebow Elvenwyn, taruro lestad ar Elrondur! Auta enna i leo, Saurondur!"

Modifié par RageGT, 22 août 2010 - 10:22 .

[DragonRageGT]

fchopin wrote...

In my opinion if you people want to talk about the witcher you should go to the witcher forums.

This is the DA2 forum so i think enough has been said about the witcher.

You're loco! Have you any idea how much DA:O I've discussed in Risen or Gothic forums? Usually defending it against lame fanatism.

And this thread is to discuss good stuff of TW that might suit a game like DA2. So if you have nothing to add... and believe me, we do talk about the Witcher in the Witcher forums.

[Tirigon]

MintyCool wrote...

From
what I can remember, (besides maybe the Mass Effect series) Bioware has just
been rehashing the same story outline for many years now. Gaiders writing is
looked upon on these forums like he's some hero when in reality, Dragon Age is
pretty vanilla when it comes to a narrative based on Mages, Dwarves, and Elves.
Everything is just kind of bland, and not very unique. Even the novel Gaider
wrote was complete trash. Actually, Reviewer Crowshaw explains the tiredness of
the story better than I can. Copy/paste Link below...

http://www.escapistm...gon-Age-Origins

Well, that Zero Punctuation guy does not only talk way too much but also really says NOTHING. Let me summarize his "review":

DAO is a fantasy game. If you´re a nerd without friends you´ll like it. Otherwise you should have sex instead.

It´s just the plain old prejudice against gamers... He probably didn´t even PLAY DAO before spewing that bullsh!t.

And yes, the story of DAO IS rather bland... But the dialogue is great, and so are Gaider´s novels, which were actually better than some of the "great Fantasy Bestsellers" that are thrown on the market about monthly.

[AndrahilAdrian]

Tirigon wrote...

MintyCool wrote...

From
what I can remember, (besides maybe the Mass Effect series) Bioware has just
been rehashing the same story outline for many years now. Gaiders writing is
looked upon on these forums like he's some hero when in reality, Dragon Age is
pretty vanilla when it comes to a narrative based on Mages, Dwarves, and Elves.
Everything is just kind of bland, and not very unique. Even the novel Gaider
wrote was complete trash. Actually, Reviewer Crowshaw explains the tiredness of
the story better than I can. Copy/paste Link below...

http://www.escapistm...gon-Age-Origins

Well, that Zero Punctuation guy does not only talk way too much but also really says NOTHING. Let me summarize his "review":

DAO is a fantasy game. If you´re a nerd without friends you´ll like it. Otherwise you should have sex instead.

It´s just the plain old prejudice against gamers... He probably didn´t even PLAY DAO before spewing that bullsh!t.

And yes, the story of DAO IS rather bland... But the dialogue is great, and so are Gaider´s novels, which were actually better than some of the "great Fantasy Bestsellers" that are thrown on the market about monthly.

OK so the darkspawn were generic orcs. And the Morrigan ending sucked. But that doesn't mean the whole story was bland. I found the relationship between the chantry and the circle interesting, and the "elves as second class citizens" concept was a nice skewer of the holier-than-thou elves normally found in Tolkien derivatives. But what really made the story for me was Loghain and his motivations, the romantic subplots (there, I said it), and the bittersweet ending. Dragon Age had more going for it than just good writing.

[Zanderat]

RageGT wrote...

Exactly!  But TW2 I'm getting as soon as I can. DA2 I'll have to try first.

Ditto.  Sadly, DA2 was the must buy for me.  But as I hve learned about both games TW2 is a definite pre-order and DA2 is meh, wait and see.

[Zanderat]

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

OK so the darkspawn were generic orcs. And the Morrigan ending sucked. But that doesn't mean the whole story was bland. I found the relationship between the chantry and the circle interesting, and the "elves as second class citizens" concept was a nice skewer of the holier-than-thou elves normally found in Tolkien derivatives. But what really made the story for me was Loghain and his motivations, the romantic subplots (there, I said it), and the bittersweet ending. Dragon Age had more going for it than just good writing.

You obviously have not had much exposure to other fanasy writings. TW had literally everything that you just mentioned years before DAO.  Now, I liked both games, but originality was not DAO's strong suit (and that was OK with me.  I enjoyed the familiarity of the game).  

Modifié par Zanderat, 23 août 2010 - 12:18 .

[fchopin]

slimgrin wrote...

Bioware has nothing to fear from CD Projekt red. They are the senior developer, and have been gracious enough thus far because I think they are confident in their abilities. CD Projekt and Bioware are among the few RPG devs left making story-based games. Let this thread be.

As you wish.

[AndrahilAdrian]

Zanderat wrote...

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

OK so the darkspawn were generic orcs. And the Morrigan ending sucked. But that doesn't mean the whole story was bland. I found the relationship between the chantry and the circle interesting, and the "elves as second class citizens" concept was a nice skewer of the holier-than-thou elves normally found in Tolkien derivatives. But what really made the story for me was Loghain and his motivations, the romantic subplots (there, I said it), and the bittersweet ending. Dragon Age had more going for it than just good writing.

You obviously have not had much exposure to other fanasy writings. TW had literally everything that you just mentioned years before DAO.  Now, I liked both games, but originality was not DAO's strong suit (and that was OK with me.  I enjoyed the familiarity of the game).  

I'm not saying those ideas haven't been used before, just that they're not as overused as some other fantasy concepts. Dragon Age wasn't trying to reimagine the fantasy genre, but that doesn't make it bland. But your'e right, the witcher had a more interesting setting. However, Dragon Age's vastly superior writing, gameplay, characters, voice acting, and all-round production value make it the better game in my book.

[Zanderat]

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

Zanderat wrote...

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

OK so the darkspawn were generic orcs. And the Morrigan ending sucked. But that doesn't mean the whole story was bland. I found the relationship between the chantry and the circle interesting, and the "elves as second class citizens" concept was a nice skewer of the holier-than-thou elves normally found in Tolkien derivatives. But what really made the story for me was Loghain and his motivations, the romantic subplots (there, I said it), and the bittersweet ending. Dragon Age had more going for it than just good writing.

You obviously have not had much exposure to other fanasy writings. TW had literally everything that you just mentioned years before DAO.  Now, I liked both games, but originality was not DAO's strong suit (and that was OK with me.  I enjoyed the familiarity of the game).  

I'm not saying those ideas haven't been used before, just that they're not as overused as some other fantasy concepts. Dragon Age wasn't trying to reimagine the fantasy genre, but that doesn't make it bland. But your'e right, the witcher had a more interesting setting. However, Dragon Age's vastly superior writing, gameplay, characters, voice acting, and all-round production value make it the better game in my book.

Hmm.  "Vastly superior writing, gameplay, characters, voice acting, and all-round production value"?  I think not. 

TW had some bugs on intitial launch.  The devs, to their credit, kept at it and The Enhanced Edition of TW is easily as polished as DAO.

[AndrahilAdrian]

The Witcher was a great game, and I'm going to get the sequel but the voice acting could be cheesy and Geralt's dialogue, perticularly the pick up lines, was soporific. The combat wasn't in the same league as DA's tactical battles and there were still some bugs in the EE, although it fixed most of them. I like both games, but DA was in a league of it's own.

[ErichHartmann]

The Witcher was great but it really offered nothing story wise I haven't read or seen before (and Dragon Age too!).  That being said, I'm looking forward to the sequel and Dragon Age II.  On top of that, pre-release hype has become a joke.  I won't be burned by anticipating what could be and reserve judgement for final products.  Who really knows what could happen between now and release?

/shrugs        

[Kalfear]

Zanderat wrote...

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

Zanderat wrote...

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

OK so the darkspawn were generic orcs. And the Morrigan ending sucked. But that doesn't mean the whole story was bland. I found the relationship between the chantry and the circle interesting, and the "elves as second class citizens" concept was a nice skewer of the holier-than-thou elves normally found in Tolkien derivatives. But what really made the story for me was Loghain and his motivations, the romantic subplots (there, I said it), and the bittersweet ending. Dragon Age had more going for it than just good writing.

You obviously have not had much exposure to other fanasy writings. TW had literally everything that you just mentioned years before DAO.  Now, I liked both games, but originality was not DAO's strong suit (and that was OK with me.  I enjoyed the familiarity of the game).  

I'm not saying those ideas haven't been used before, just that they're not as overused as some other fantasy concepts. Dragon Age wasn't trying to reimagine the fantasy genre, but that doesn't make it bland. But your'e right, the witcher had a more interesting setting. However, Dragon Age's vastly superior writing, gameplay, characters, voice acting, and all-round production value make it the better game in my book.

Hmm.  "Vastly superior writing, gameplay, characters, voice acting, and all-round production value"?  I think not. 

TW had some bugs on intitial launch.  The devs, to their credit, kept at it and The Enhanced Edition of TW is easily as polished as DAO.

vastly superior writing : Gotta go with The Witcher having played both games completely and read books available for both products.
gameplay : Again, The Witcher wins. DA:O was good and the tactics made the group game much better but still wasnt what it could or should be
characters: The Witcher had more interesting characters other then Morrigan. Problem with DA:O characters is they were watered down for Teens rather then living up to their Mature rating for complexidy 
voice acting : DA:O wins this (at least refering to english versions). Leliannas song still is a amazing part of DA:O and sounded so good compared to Dandelions horrid singing 
all-round production value: The Witcher wins hands down. Day night, weather, better graphics (even though Witcher using a much outdated engine), stronger story (as mentioned), really not a issue!

I loved DA:O btw and was hoping DA2 would be the logical and physical updated version of DA:O rather then what it sounds like we getting. DA:O just doesnt realistically compare to The Witcher (if you played both games completely through). Both had areas that got tedious but The Witcher had by far less moments like that and the streonger story with greater surprises.

[AndrahilAdrian]

Kalfear wrote...

characters: The Witcher had more interesting characters other then Morrigan. Problem with DA:O characters is they were watered down for Teens rather then living up to their Mature rating for complexidy 

I don't know why Morrigan gets so much praise. She is basically a human version of the Drow Viconia from the Baldur's Gate Series, except you can't influence her in any way. And her dark ritual was a stupid, tacked on twist added right after a perfectly good twist. However, although DA's characters were hardly Tolstoy-worthy, they are the best seen in a video game to date.

Modifié par AndrahilAdrian, 23 août 2010 - 01:20 .

[Zanderat]

AndrahilAdrian wrote...

Kalfear wrote...

characters: The Witcher had more interesting characters other then Morrigan. Problem with DA:O characters is they were watered down for Teens rather then living up to their Mature rating for complexidy 

I don't know why Morrigan gets so much praise. She is basically a human version of the Drow Viconia from the Baldur's Gate Series.

For me, it was the way she was voiced.   <3

Modifié par Zanderat, 23 août 2010 - 01:17 .

[AndrahilAdrian]

Zanderat wrote...

AndrahilAdrian wrote...


I don't know why Morrigan gets so much praise. She is basically a human version of the Drow Viconia from the Baldur's Gate Series.

For me, it was the way she was voiced.   <3

I'll give you that one. Although "tis" quickly bugged me

Modifié par AndrahilAdrian, 23 août 2010 - 01:23 .

[NovenseiWarden]

I have to say this thread has gotten me interested in TW2, but it's looking a bit like a button masher (for the combat at least). Usually, this would make me support Bioware more, but when DA2 looks like it's going down the same path... I'll just wait for a gameplay video I guess...

[Kalfear]

NovenseiWarden wrote...

I have to say this thread has gotten me interested in TW2, but it's looking a bit like a button masher (for the combat at least). Usually, this would make me support Bioware more, but when DA2 looks like it's going down the same path... I'll just wait for a gameplay video I guess...

check out the 2 interveiws linked in my signature

TW2 not a button masher unless you want it to be.

CDRed has stated clearly for all to hear, this is a RPG first and formost and options to vary the combat to the players own desire. So yes it can be a button masher at high difficulty or you can play exactly like you did in TW1 on the lower difficulties, your choice completely.

[saruman31]

I think that what bioware is doing is fail. I know lots of people who wouldn't be intrested in the game even if it had devil may cry gameplay.

[hangmans tree]

Cyberfrog81 wrote...

If one sees DA2 as an unavoidable epic fail and Witcher 2 as the second coming... Yeah, that seems odd to me. I still think there is a great chance that both will be awesome. BioWare knows what they are doing - they will probably again deliver a great story with awesome characters. CD Projekt RED have a lot less experience, but on the other hand they have a huge amount of talent, ambition and enthusiasm, and have developed an RPG engine to be perfect for creating the worlds they want to create and telling the stories they want to tell.

It is an interesting duel. I'm certainly not going to announce the winner just yet. And obviously we want both games to be awesome, so that there's more RPG goodness for us. Right?

Right!
I cant say its a duel, both games are being made to cater to the same public (with DA2 slightly wider) but I dont think that marketspace/audience isn't big enought for both of them. Personally I want to check out both, and wish them well. Although I'm more intersted in TW2 but that is basically subjective, and tend to change and shift depending on gamers tastes.

I like Geralt, an exceptional character if you ask me, but there are those that simply hate the concept. On the other hand I just can spend hours creating characters! So you can bet all your money MY Hawke wont look like the default one

Witchers amulet could originally detect traces of magic, unnatural phenomena, warn from danger, shield from minor magic effects and so on. I didnt play Batman AA (alcoholic anonymous?), so I dont see the similarities but I can tell you that I dont find it off when I see the medallion effect

Boxing: I like it. Hope its non-obligatory to enter the "ring" and can be done quickly with normal view (like the first guard in the video).
Everything else I see is just great and like an addiction thats craving too soothe its hunger.

Speaking of writing and such..you do know that that putting elves (all high and mighty enigmatic creatures) in the gutter was first done in TW? The world painted all gray, cynical and egoistic with cruelty on top.So far from heroic and high fantasy standards. That is refreshing.

2011 cant come quick enough.

Modifié par hangmans tree, 23 août 2010 - 07:43 .

[hangmans tree]

Another thing that excites me is that there are 130,000 lines of dialog in TW2...IIRC DA:O had around 68,000 is that correct?