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The Witcher -> Dragon Age II

Débuté par Quercus , juil. 30 2010 04:30

1507 réponses à ce sujet

#1451
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Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 03:36

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Cyberfrog81 wrote...

Well, I'm a bit worried the story won't measure up to the story in the first one, despite Tom Gop's claims. And while there is time to improve on it, the animations (facial expressions etc.) are really dull in the material they've shown; making the voice acting seem worse than it is, too. Maybe I've posted that before, but it's damn important... I really don't care how (not) "indie" they are or whether it's the "best-looking RPG" on screenshot comparisons - I care about story and the overall gameplay experience.

By contrast (sort of), with BioWare I'm almost 95% sure we will get a well-written story with excellently voiced characters. Some concern about the very short development time seems warranted though.


The writing in TW1 is in my opinion top notch, right up there with Bioware's. Story, along with the RPG mechanics were the best part of the game for me.

I'm more concerned about technical issues like crashing and compatibility; also character animations and designs ( although the art design looks good so far) I also wonder about melee combat, which is very hard to do. If anyone here has experienced good melee combat in an RPG I'd like to know cause I sure haven't.

Modifié par slimgrin, 19 septembre 2010 - 03:36 .

#1452
Bryy_Miller
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 04:12

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cosgamer wrote...
Anyone wonder why so much of Dragon Age's forum (both DA:O and DA2) features so much content about the Witcher and CD ProjeKt?  Perhaps BiowEAr will take heed but I doubt it.


I see what you did there. BioWare is owned by EA, right?

#1453
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Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 04:30

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Bryy_Miller wrote...

cosgamer wrote...
Anyone wonder why so much of Dragon Age's forum (both DA:O and DA2) features so much content about the Witcher and CD ProjeKt?  Perhaps BiowEAr will take heed but I doubt it.


I see what you did there. BioWare is owned by EA, right?


Sadly, unfortunately, in 2007 my worst fear came true: the greedy slugs at EA bought up the parent company of what was at the time the most respected game-maker in the business: Bioware.  Needless to say due to the fact EA cares less about their customers than the gum that gets stuck to EA exec's shoes Bioware is no longer regarded as highly.  Fact is, since then they've lost the loyalty to a large part of their customer base.  Given EA's track record that standing will only continue to go lower.  EA cares not one whit about customer satisfaction, and will continue to do what it has in the past: publish sub-standard and/or buggy games, create a media blitz, make a profit and keep on churning drivel.  I am very afraid what will become of DA2 and other Bioware titles.

#1454
Cyberfrog81
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 04:32

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TW1 story IS top notch. But it takes a while to realize it. Too many people seem to give up in, or even before, Chapter II. Many, many hours later when you finish the epilogue... "Holy crap that story was awesome"! But, characters... They worked fine, but BioWare writes them better. It's possibly their greatest strength, writing interesting and memorable characters (and some you might dislike, while other become huge fans of them). In ME2 I'm not even indifferent to Zaeed. Like Bon Jovi, he rocks, on occasion.



It's BECAUSE TW1 set such a high standard for the story that I'm somewhat concerned TW2's won't live up to it. Didn't someone imply it looks like they're trying too hard? 16 endings, what for? 1 excellent one might have sufficed, I'm not obsessed with nonlinearity in games. I like choices, but I prefer few and interesting choices to a convoluted mess of a story branching senlessly left and right, backwards and forwards in time, or whatever. Maybe it will be awesome. I'm hopeful. But as said also somewhat concerned.

#1455
Bryy_Miller
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 04:37

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cosgamer wrote...
Fact is, since then they've lost the loyalty to a large part of their customer base.  


I don't really think you can make a claim like that as fact. As for a lot of people on this board liking The Witcher, that's not indicative of anything, really. A lot just like The Witcher. Sometimes I wonder why this thread isn't locked, because if people want to talk about how The Witcher is so much better than Dragon Age (or 2, which they have not even played)... there's an entire forum dedicated to The Witcher to do it in. It's called the official Witcher forums.

#1456
Catsith
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 04:39

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cosgamer wrote...



Kalfear wrote...



Im loving The Witcher because its a true Action RPG, ublike ME2.

Combat builds up the STORY in the Witcher.

Styory builds up the Combat in ME2.



Thats the huge difference between the two.

At the end of the day, after playing tha Witcher, you know that story comes first and formost. At end of day with ME2, you know the story only there to give combat some meaning.

VASTLY different approachs to gameing.



As I said, im playing The Witcher for the first time and its already tied with DA:O for 2nd best game Ive ever played.

But one of my major complaints with the Witcher is the voice preset on Geralt. In chapters 1 and 2 it was totally immersion breaking for me. In chapter 3 ive grown to accept it, not like it, but accept it!



You cant really compare DA:O and TW combat as one is squad based and other is single player based. Developers have to approach combat in vastly different mindsets for these types of combat! I think both games did exceptionally well in this regard.



As for TW2, my spring of 2011 games buy stands as:

Deus Ex3

The Witcher 2

The Old Republic



Dragon Age 2 (whats been reported) doesnt hold a candle to what beed reported for Deus Ex3 or The witcher 2. Its not even close at this point in time!



But mostly (for me) it comes down to who I beleive now. I just have no faith in this new Bioware. I dont trust them, I dont like how they acting on boards and in interveiws, I (like many many others)dont like direction of DA2, and After ME2, there simply is no good will left over for them to play on.



Some folks might buy anything that has Biowares name with out question or thought, im far more thinking and picky then that! Game companies EARN (and lose) my respect by their actions and how good to their words they are. Right now, Bioware is as close to rock bottom as you can get for me (game wise).



Ill still check in, in hopes Bioware putting out a real RPG product but so far DA2 sounds like the Mass Effect approach where the stories only there to prop up the action.



For me, STORY, IMMERSION, INTERACTION of characters, and CHARACTER DETAIL, these things all come BEFORE combat in level of importance for real RPGs and CD Projekt seems to understand that in their designing of ROLE PLAYING GAMES ( RPGs)!! Doesnt mean you have to have bad combat, Mass Effect 2 could of had same combat system and still been a RPG if they only cared half as much about story and immersion and character detail as they did about combat in the game. But they didnt.



PS: I strongly suggest anyone that hasnt played The Witcher to try it! I got it for $20.00 off Steam and I would have gladly payed full price for this game, even now. Well worth the money.



CD Projekt being a independant developer doesnt get the attention it should (like Bioware and Blizzard gets) but their first game is as good as anything Bioware put out and better then anything Blizzard put out IMO.




AMEN!!!



Anyone wonder why so much of Dragon Age's forum (both DA:O and DA2) features so much content about the Witcher and CD ProjeKt? Perhaps BiowEAr will take heed but I doubt it.




What do you mean "so much content"? There's only this one thread, which they've been extremely generous about keeping up since it has absolutely nothing to do with DA2 anymore. There have been plenty of DA threads on their forums as well.



I don't think "BiowEAr" have to take heed of anything, really. It's a handful of people posting on a forum and rooting for the underdog.

TW fans said Dragon Age would be crap, sell horribly and TW would remain king, and DA sold more than 2x. People said the same thing about Alpha Protocol, how it would blow ME2 out of the water, and look what happened there. Obsidian, CD Projekt... it makes no difference. The underdogs always have the loudest forum supporters.

#1457
Guest_cosgamer_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 04:43

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I am far less concerned what will occur with TW2 despite CD ProjeKt's lofty goals and the high standards set by TW1 than I am with DA2. Why? Because they have something in common with the folks who produced the BG series. Black Isle and what was then Bioware listened intently to what their fans wanted, and they responded in kind as does CD ProjeKt today. Will they succeed at everything they're trying? Probably not but I bet you they come very close to obtaining every goal and even falling short will produce an epic game the likes of which hasn't been seen since BGII...you know back in the day when Bioware paid attention to what their customers wanted. Now no more. A user posted this way back in 2007 and I've never forgotten it: "Bioware... rest in piece, friend. EA, burn in hell." My reaction wasn't quite so quick. I waited for DA:O to decide. The crap they pulled with the blatant advertising for the DLCs in the game told me all I needed to know. Still I thought there might be enough quality in those DLCs from Bioware's ghost to justify purchasing them. I was wrong.

#1458
Guest_slimgrin_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 04:45

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Bryy_Miller wrote...

cosgamer wrote...
Fact is, since then they've lost the loyalty to a large part of their customer base.  


I don't really think you can make a claim like that as fact. As for a lot of people on this board liking The Witcher, that's not indicative of anything, really. A lot just like The Witcher. Sometimes I wonder why this thread isn't locked, because if people want to talk about how The Witcher is so much better than Dragon Age (or 2, which they have not even played)... there's an entire forum dedicated to The Witcher to do it in. It's called the official Witcher forums.


Like I've mentioned 3 times already, lets have the mods move it to off topic. I'm not here to say how much better The Witcher is than DA, and this thread clearly annoys many DA fans ( for whatever reason).

But they still keep it on the DA2 discussion thread so here we are.

Modifié par slimgrin, 19 septembre 2010 - 04:46 .

#1459
Bryy_Miller
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 04:54

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cosgamer wrote...
The crap they pulled with the blatant advertising for the DLCs in the game told me all I needed to know. Still I thought there might be enough quality in those DLCs from Bioware's ghost to justify purchasing them. I was wrong.


*facepalm*
You do know that whoever EA bought had to agree to it, right?

#1460
Guest_cosgamer_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 05:16

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Bryy_Miller wrote...

cosgamer wrote...
The crap they pulled with the blatant advertising for the DLCs in the game told me all I needed to know. Still I thought there might be enough quality in those DLCs from Bioware's ghost to justify purchasing them. I was wrong.


*facepalm*
You do know that whoever EA bought had to agree to it, right?


Yes, they did.  Who's going to turn down 800 and some odd million?  No one.  I'm not complaining about Bioware selling...I'm complaining about how EA treats its customers and its approach to making games.  I state that from my own experience but you can read about it as a whole from:

http://en.wikipedia...._Arts#Criticism

#1461
Guest_cosgamer_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 05:20

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Bryy_Miller wrote...

cosgamer wrote...
Fact is, since then they've lost the loyalty to a large part of their customer base.  


I don't really think you can make a claim like that as fact. As for a lot of people on this board liking The Witcher, that's not indicative of anything, really. A lot just like The Witcher. Sometimes I wonder why this thread isn't locked, because if people want to talk about how The Witcher is so much better than Dragon Age (or 2, which they have not even played)... there's an entire forum dedicated to The Witcher to do it in. It's called the official Witcher forums.


I belong to the Witcher forum of course.  I did a search on The Witcher to see what was said about it on here, what the thoughts were on TW2 and was surprised by what I found.  As for stating BiowEAr has lost a lot of its customers' respect, well that has nothing to do with TW it is just a statement based on what I've read and seen not only in this forum but across the web and from what EA has done with the DA:O's DLCs.  You trying to tell me Leliana's Song is worth the $7?  How about Witch Hunt which is oddly reminescent of EA's practice: push the release date, cut down on the story, forget about the bugs and get it out the door?

Modifié par cosgamer, 19 septembre 2010 - 05:22 .

#1462
Guest_slimgrin_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 05:23

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EA did have a bad reputation. I think they have changed if ME2 and DA are any indication. Time will tell.

#1463
Guest_cosgamer_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 05:25

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I was hoping EA had changed, which is why I waited for DA:O and how they would handle the DLCs to decide. Hope so far is unfulfilled, the Witch Hunt being a prime example of EA's past.

#1464
Guest_slimgrin_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 05:33

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cosgamer wrote...

I was hoping EA had changed, which is why I waited for DA:O and how they would handle the DLCs to decide. Hope so far is unfulfilled, the Witch Hunt being a prime example of EA's past.


I've long been critical of dlc. I wouldn't judge any company by the quality of their dlc.

DA does seem to be coming out prematurely, but theres no telling the size of the team and when exactly they started work on it.

#1465
Guest_cosgamer_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 05:48

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I have no problem with DLCs if they provide the proper bang for their buck. The ones for DA:O were either clearly meant to be part of the original release (Warden's Keep, The Stone Prisoner) or rushed, buggy or limited in quality (every other DLC). The former were plainly along the lines of EA's business model in getting early pre-orders. The latter, well not to be beat a dead horse, but EA's product model...



I can't yet state how Awakenings will compare as an expansion pack to say TOB because I haven't played it yet. I do have it installed just haven't had the time to give it a whirl.



I must admit at this point I've been so badly burned by EA that DA:O is the first product in several years I've purchased that's been even remotely associated with EA. I will give them one more chance with DA2 depending on the feedback I see regarding it because I loved Bioware so much, and their developmental staff is on EA's payroll. Maybe things have changed but what I have seen so far has not been a good example of such.

#1466
Bryy_Miller
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 07:17

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cosgamer wrote...

I have no problem with DLCs if they provide the proper bang for their buck. The ones for DA:O were either clearly meant to be part of the original release (Warden's Keep, The Stone Prisoner)


The Stoner Prisoner was cut content they managed to put back in due to the delay. 

cosgamer wrote...
 You trying to tell me Leliana's Song is worth the $7?


No, because I'm not the ones making the decisions as to why what is priced what it is. Do I agree that all the DLC is reasonable? No. In fact, with the exception of Witch Hunt, Warden's, Ostagar (which I finally got and is pretty good for a dungeon crawl) and Prisoner, I think the DLC looks rather horrible. But I wouldn't assume to know what is a reasonable cost from a business perspective.

#1467
hangmans tree
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 09:36

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About the 16 endings in TW2.

I do not know if you are aware of the mechanics for the endings.

There are 3 major endings (for storylines) and the rest are subplot events (I assume they are political/social outcomes based on your decisions during the game), which altogether give 16 combinations for endings.

This is not some elaborate 16 complete different endings, so there is no need to worry with "shooting at the stars"



I wonder how many fixed endings do we have in DA2? Or are they still in the making? I just hope they will not be some text on a background image...

#1468
nhsk
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 11:29

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Cyberfrog81 wrote...

TW1 story IS top notch. But it takes a while to realize it. Too many people seem to give up in, or even before, Chapter II. Many, many hours later when you finish the epilogue... "Holy crap that story was awesome"! But, characters... They worked fine, but BioWare writes them better. It's possibly their greatest strength, writing interesting and memorable characters (and some you might dislike, while other become huge fans of them). In ME2 I'm not even indifferent to Zaeed. Like Bon Jovi, he rocks, on occasion.

It's BECAUSE TW1 set such a high standard for the story that I'm somewhat concerned TW2's won't live up to it. Didn't someone imply it looks like they're trying too hard? 16 endings, what for? 1 excellent one might have sufficed, I'm not obsessed with nonlinearity in games. I like choices, but I prefer few and interesting choices to a convoluted mess of a story branching senlessly left and right, backwards and forwards in time, or whatever. Maybe it will be awesome. I'm hopeful. But as said also somewhat concerned.


How  many hours should one spent on a game before it get good?!? No seriously, I sat through chapter 1 and an unknown part of chapter 2, used at least 5 hours on that and the story, characters and all that still sucked..

#1469
Pedrak
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 11:38

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nhsk wrote...
How  many hours should one spent on a game before it get good?!? No seriously, I sat through chapter 1 and an unknown part of chapter 2, used at least 5 hours on that and the story, characters and all that still sucked..


It is legitimate to complain if a game takes too long to capture the player's interest. But it is at least worth knowing when a game with an average beginning gets very good later - like TW, KOTOR2, Arcanum, etc.

CRPGs, in general, have a slow start, and the first hours are easily the least interesting - DAO was something of an exception, as the origins were intriguing.

#1470
nhsk
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 11:43

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Problem was that the average beginning you say wasn't average but outright crappy. The origins never got my attention (probably because my first warden was a mage) in DA:O, Ostagar did - It set up with a grand battle, politics, betrayal and the promise of a great story to unfold.



TW on the other hand, somebody stole your mutagen stuff that enhances witchers DNA... And thats about all I know



Now... DNA?!? Medieval?!?



I'm baffled

#1471
Nerevar-as
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 12:21

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nhsk wrote...

Problem was that the average beginning you say wasn't average but outright crappy. The origins never got my attention (probably because my first warden was a mage) in DA:O, Ostagar did - It set up with a grand battle, politics, betrayal and the promise of a great story to unfold.

TW on the other hand, somebody stole your mutagen stuff that enhances witchers DNA... And thats about all I know

Now... DNA?!? Medieval?!?

I'm baffled


And what? Is not medieval earth, and magic is studied as a science. I´m surprised in fact the game was recieved this good outside countries where the books aren´t published, the game takes a lot from them even if it is a sequel.

#1472
nhsk
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 12:34

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And what? Well, it just removed every credibility for a believable story for me, magic or no magic.

#1473
Guest_vilnii_*
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 01:24

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CD Projekt Red is truly putting up a challenge to Bioware in the RPG world.



With The Witcher 2 and DA-2 set to be released around the same time next year...it will be interesting to see who emerges king of the hill

#1474
hangmans tree
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 02:16

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Must there be a king of the hill? :)

Both games will have supporters, fanbois, admireres, critics, haters and trolls. There will be also gamers who like both (if they are good of course), and support BW as well as CDP :)

#1475
ErichHartmann
Posté 19 septembre 2010 - 02:21

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Diablo III will crush both games combined in sales.
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