886 réponses à ce sujet

[Corker]

Addai67 wrote...

Bruddajakka wrote...

Iona seemed to be a lot more open in regards to her sexuality. On top of which she seemed to lack the submissive quality a lot of other CE's have.

I dunno, she seems pretty deferential/ submissive to me.

On my male HN I felt like a real cad going for Iona.  Felt like sexual harrassment, whether it is or not.

I couldn't even ask her about her backstory as a HNF.  Felt too much like "Display your personal pain for my curiosity!  Now!" rather than genuine concern for her well-being.

[Bruddajakka]

I never felt that way. She's really very open about most of it. And seriously it's not like your pulling her into the bedroom with a couple of your buddies Vaughn style.

[Xilizhra]

I didn't have any problems with it either; I quite liked the whole Iona thing, as a female at least. It's quite a shame that she automatically dies...

[Sarah1281]

The Iona fling (though I always go for it) reminds me uncomfortably of the story Alistair tells about Maric and the serving girl he may or may not have ever actually gone with. The power dynamics are just too different there. You're an heir to a teynir and she's forced to still live in the Alienage with her young daughter. While she seems willing to sleep with you, if she turned you down and you complained about her (though not for that, obviously) then her position could be at risk.

[Bruddajakka]

Yeah I always go for it as well, and if she had shown any hesitation, or signs of being uncomfortable about the whole affair I wouldn't have pressured her into it.

[Addai]

Bruddajakka wrote...

I never felt that way. She's really very open about most of it. And seriously it's not like your pulling her into the bedroom with a couple of your buddies Vaughn style.

I didn't say you force her.  It just felt icky.  There is a bit of power dynamic with Dairren, too, but he's not a female of an oppressed minority so it didn't have the same feeling.  Though I did get that same feeling with Zevran and my HNF, since he's beholden to you, it felt wrong to jump in bed with him though she was mightily tempted. 

[Zjarcal]

Can't say that I share the "icky" or "sexual harassment" vibe on Iona. She wasn't uncomfortable at all, that was clear to me. Sure, her attitude might have been submissive (the VO notes describe it as a servant talking to a superior), but that's to be expected.



She eventually grows curious about you (she asks why you don't have any ladies in waiting, if you're female). There's a line where the VO notes explain that she'd be open to the idea of a relationship (not just sex) with the PC. Another VO note says "deliberately inviting - she's open to take the flirtation further". It's definitely not harassment.



I understand why some people don't want to seduce her (or Dairren) though. It's a matter of personal preference really, just like with any other choice in the game.

[soignee]

 I drew some elves recently that weren't Zevran. I know, I was shocked too.

Jolene Surana:


Alim Surana:

[Giggles_Manically]

I like them soignee.

Very nice fire effect on the Alim one.

[Sarah1281]

Zjarcal wrote...

Can't say that I share the "icky" or "sexual harassment" vibe on Iona. She wasn't uncomfortable at all, that was clear to me. Sure, her attitude might have been submissive (the VO notes describe it as a servant talking to a superior), but that's to be expected.

She eventually grows curious about you (she asks why you don't have any ladies in waiting, if you're female). There's a line where the VO notes explain that she'd be open to the idea of a relationship (not just sex) with the PC. Another VO note says "deliberately inviting - she's open to take the flirtation further". It's definitely not harassment.

I understand why some people don't want to seduce her (or Dairren) though. It's a matter of personal preference really, just like with any other choice in the game.

Yeah, to me it's not so much Iona in particular that gives me those vibes so much as the general someone in a high position of power and someone who, if the first person does not get what they want, can have their life ruined. I like equal (or as close as you can get) power dynamics in relationships, even such brief ones.

[Giggles_Manically]

I see it more in the way that a very charismatic boss (Tony Stark) outright flirts with a secretary (Iona).

The Warden is very Charismatic person who has a natural draw.

[Addai]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I see it more in the way that a very charismatic boss (Tony Stark) outright flirts with a secretary (Iona).
The Warden is very Charismatic person who has a natural draw.

They weep, they acclaim, they lust... behold THE WARDEN.

It's different than a secretary, however.  The Vaughn situation is an extreme but illustrates the power dynamics at work.

Just saying how it felt to me.  My HN still did her, of course.  I just didn't like him much at that point.

[Giggles_Manically]

My human noble did, but it really didnt seem like anyone was forcing people.

I mean some charming noble lord, walks in talks to you nicely, there is compliments and some flirting happens, and then nookies ensue.



Really she almost seems to come on to the HN pretty quickly as well.

Or that was how it went for me at least.

[Zjarcal]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Really she almost seems to come on to the HN pretty quickly as well.
Or that was how it went for me at least.

It's how it went for my HNF as well. There's no forcing at all.

Comparing it to the Vaughn situation is too much of an extreme. Vaughn forces himself on the elves in the Alienage and won't hesitate to kill them if they refuse to be raped. The HN doesn't have an option to "force herself/himself" on Iona (or Dairren). If such option had been available then I'd agree it's harassment (possibly even rape).

I understand why people would want any sort of relationship (no matter how short) to be on an equal power level, but the Vaughn comparison is too much.

[Giggles_Manically]

To true Z.



What would have been powerful though is if Iona survived the Origin you meet her later in the Alienage, and she is going to have your child, or has already had it. Like the DN and the Noble Hunter.



That would have been a interesting moment to add.

[Giggles_Manically]

Someone should put the tool set notes up so we can see what the VO notes are.

[Zjarcal]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

To true Z.

What would have been powerful though is if Iona survived the Origin you meet her later in the Alienage, and she is going to have your child, or has already had it. Like the DN and the Noble Hunter.

That would have been a interesting moment to add.

Hehe, unless there was magic involved, I could've never gotten her pregnant! 

But that would've been a very nice scenario. Perhaps even have the chance to start a meaningful relationship with her. Well, that would've required for the game to allow romances outside your party members, but it still would've been nice.

Seriously, at the very least we should've had the option to take care of her child!

[Xilizhra]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

To true Z.

What would have been powerful though is if Iona survived the Origin you meet her later in the Alienage, and she is going to have your child, or has already had it. Like the DN and the Noble Hunter.

That would have been a interesting moment to add.

What would have happened if you were female?

[Zjarcal]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Someone should put the tool set notes up so we can see what the VO notes are.

Which ones specifically? I posted a few in my earlier post.

[Sarah1281]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

To true Z.

What would have been powerful though is if Iona survived the Origin you meet her later in the Alienage, and she is going to have your child, or has already had it. Like the DN and the Noble Hunter.

That would have been a interesting moment to add.

If that had been the case, I'd never have a HNM sleep with her ever. With the NH, she wants to have a son. You might be doing it mostly for fun (or maybe you just really want a son now) but her whole point is to have a child. Iona already has one child to support, she might lose her position over it, it would have been a huge scandal had Howe not given you bigger problems, and bringing a child into the wolrd when it's just going to face all sorts of **** from both the elves and the humans when you don't even have a real relationship with the mother...It wouldn't surprise me if Iona used some sort of protection to prevent this.

[Addai]

Zjarcal wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Really she almost seems to come on to the HN pretty quickly as well.
Or that was how it went for me at least.

It's how it went for my HNF as well. There's no forcing at all.

Comparing it to the Vaughn situation is too much of an extreme. Vaughn forces himself on the elves in the Alienage and won't hesitate to kill them if they refuse to be raped. The HN doesn't have an option to "force herself/himself" on Iona (or Dairren). If such option had been available then I'd agree it's harassment (possibly even rape).

I understand why people would want any sort of relationship (no matter how short) to be on an equal power level, but the Vaughn comparison is too much.

I said that the Vaughn situation shows the power dynamic, not that the two situations are identical.  Not just the fact that Vaughn does what he does, but that no one cares, no one lifts a finger.  Even the Chantry sister who protests basically can't do anything.  So that shows you the power balance inherent in a noble male approaching a female elf for sex.  I'm not saying you're forcing her.  I did type that, right?   I think I said so numerous times.

It would also be different, maybe, if it were in the context of a long-term relationship where you're expressing more than "can I get into your smallclothes."

Modifié par Addai67, 03 novembre 2010 - 08:37 .

[Giggles_Manically]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

To true Z.

What would have been powerful though is if Iona survived the Origin you meet her later in the Alienage, and she is going to have your child, or has already had it. Like the DN and the Noble Hunter.

That would have been a interesting moment to add.

If that had been the case, I'd never have a HNM sleep with her ever. With the NH, she wants to have a son. You might be doing it mostly for fun (or maybe you just really want a son now) but her whole point is to have a child. Iona already has one child to support, she might lose her position over it, it would have been a huge scandal had Howe not given you bigger problems, and bringing a child into the wolrd when it's just going to face all sorts of **** from both the elves and the humans when you don't even have a real relationship with the mother...It wouldn't surprise me if Iona used some sort of protection to prevent this.

It could have served to make you feel really bad.
The writers talk about dark and powerful choices.

Running into the woman you had sex with one night who has your kid, and is now living in poverty would really serve as a kick to the gut to many players.

[Giggles_Manically]

Xilizhra wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

To true Z.

What would have been powerful though is if Iona survived the Origin you meet her later in the Alienage, and she is going to have your child, or has already had it. Like the DN and the Noble Hunter.

That would have been a interesting moment to add.

What would have happened if you were female?

The same thing that happens for a DNF, nothing.

[Zjarcal]

Addai67 wrote...
So that shows you the power balance inherent in a noble male approaching a female elf for sex.

I feel left out when people don't acknowledge that a female can also approach her! Would you also consider it an equally unbalance situation by the way?

Yes, there is a power imbalance. I understand that it bothers you and that you feel "icky" about it. I don't feel that way but to each their own.

[Addai]

Zjarcal wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
So that shows you the power balance inherent in a noble male approaching a female elf for sex.

I feel left out when people don't acknowledge that a female can also approach her! Would you also consider it an equally unbalance situation by the way?

Yes, there is a power imbalance. I understand that it bothers you and that you feel "icky" about it. I don't feel that way but to each their own.

I'm talking about my HNM.  Why should you feel left out of my male PC's game?  I gave another example where I felt the same way with my HNF, i.e. with Zevran who is the PC's subordinate in your little Warden mercenary band.

Modifié par Addai67, 03 novembre 2010 - 08:45 .