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[exorzist]

Why past choices can't make major future storylines



As fans are chatting up the forums about Dragon Age 2 and new DLCs, you can hardly avoid mentions and wishes of “god baby.” BioWare didn’t help stem the speculation either, by mentioning that “We are certainly not done with Morrigan’s story.” But the whole idea of expanding on the god baby storyline in the future presents with one major problem – what if you rejected Morrigan? The thought made me realize that past choices logically can’t shape future major storylines and remain fair to all players.

Continue here ...

[Saibh]

I'm amazed that a modded face was used as the article cover instead of her actual face. Personally, I can't play with the modded version since it doesn't feel like "her", but I just hate how unreal she looks.



In any case, it's nothing we didn't know already, but maybe some shrieking fans who rush into the forums after hearing the rumor that the DR isn't canon can be railroaded here.

[Kusy]

You can't reject Morigan and I think it was proven by Awakening... it's a "lore"thing... just like Star Wars games and even Mass Effect games assume certain things happened. I don't mind it realy, it's a small part of player's freedom going dead but it holds the history together.



As for the baby's apearence, I'd bet my money on Dragon Age 3.

[GodWood]

The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

[Behindyounow]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

You can't reject Morigan and I think it was proven by Awakening... it's a "lore"thing... just like Star Wars games and even Mass Effect games assume certain things happened. I don't mind it realy, it's a small part of player's freedom going dead but it holds the history together.

As for the baby's apearence, I'd bet my money on Dragon Age 3.

How was it? You can take your warden into Awakening without a hitch if you killed Alistair or Loghain too y'know.

[Astranagant]

Since when were the Old Gods "ancient Imperium mages"?

Mr.Kusy wrote...

You can't reject Morigan and I think it was proven by Awakening... it's a "lore"thing... just like Star Wars games and even Mass Effect games assume certain things happened. I don't mind it realy, it's a small part of player's freedom going dead but it holds the history together.

Uh, yeah you can. I reject her all the time.

GodWood wrote...

The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

Nothing is canon, deal with it.

Modifié par Astranagant, 04 août 2010 - 02:11 .

[DPB]

Saibh wrote...

I'm amazed that a modded face was used as the article cover instead of her actual face. Personally, I can't play with the modded version since it doesn't feel like "her", but I just hate how unreal she looks.

I'm not keen on mods that change the appearance of NPCs either. Sure, they might look better to some but it's just not the same person anymore.

[BallaZs]

Saibh wrote...

I'm amazed that a modded face was used as the article cover instead of her actual face. Personally, I can't play with the modded version since it doesn't feel like "her", but I just hate how unreal she looks.

Agreed. I dislike any face/hair/etc. mods for the companions. They are just looks 'unrealistic'.

[Kohaku]

I was thinking the same thing Saibh . I looked at her face and said, "Wow. Why does that Morrigan look so much different than my own?" I thought I was losing it. Granted I play with a modified Leiliana.



On topic. I can't see the issue. They said Morrigan's story isn't done but why does that have to revolve around the child? Maybe Morrigan will play some other kind of role in future games. Maybe she'll hit up some other smuck down the line with baby drama. Hell. Even though some may have knocked her up, maybe she'll lose the child. That's totally a possibility in this kind of setting.

[GodWood]

Astranagant wrote...

GodWood wrote...
The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

Nothing is canon, deal with it.

You are wrong, deal with it.

[Saibh]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

You can't reject Morigan and I think it was proven by Awakening... it's a "lore"thing... just like Star Wars games and even Mass Effect games assume certain things happened. I don't mind it realy, it's a small part of player's freedom going dead but it holds the history together.

As for the baby's apearence, I'd bet my money on Dragon Age 3.

You...can reject Morrigan. Awakening doesn't make the DR canon if you import a dead Warden, it just sacrifices the other Warden instead.

...Er, right? That's what I recall, at least. Regardless, you don't need to import a dead Warden. All it does it goes back and changes a decision to keep your Warden alive. Not the same thing.

[Bugzehat]

Saibh wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

You can't reject Morigan and I think it was proven by Awakening... it's a "lore"thing... just like Star Wars games and even Mass Effect games assume certain things happened. I don't mind it realy, it's a small part of player's freedom going dead but it holds the history together.

As for the baby's apearence, I'd bet my money on Dragon Age 3.

You...can reject Morrigan. Awakening doesn't make the DR canon if you import a dead Warden, it just sacrifices the other Warden instead.

...Er, right? That's what I recall, at least. Regardless, you don't need to import a dead Warden. All it does it goes back and changes a decision to keep your Warden alive. Not the same thing.

Importing a dead Warden does make it so the DR happened -- Alistair can show up, after all, so it doesn't have him die instead. That said, it's perfectly possible to import a Warden who had Alistair or Loghain sacrifice themselves instead, so it's not like every Awakenings playthrough takes place in a world where the DR happened.

[MaxQuartiroli]

GodWood wrote...

The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

And I'd also add to this sentence "...thank god !!"

[Behindyounow]

MaxQuartiroli wrote...

GodWood wrote...

The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

And I'd also add to this sentence "...thank god !!"

Second.

[Nerdage]

It could have a massive effect on the story without necessarily having a large impact on the game. A large mission, the context of which changes depending on how you handled the DR, could give people who did the ritual a sense of continuity but not con the others out of a big chunk of content, there just has to be a reason for those who didn't do the ritual to be doing something similar.
So the dialogue throughout the quest is different depending on your decision regarding the DR, but the areas and most of the enemies remain the same either way. I have no idea what the quest would be like since, as the article says, we have no idea what the consequences of the ritual actually are, but it could be made to work. It's not an idea solution, or even a very good one, and I doubt it's what's planned, but it seems to tick all the boxes.

[Astranagant]

GodWood wrote...

Astranagant wrote...

GodWood wrote...
The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

Nothing is canon, deal with it.

You are wrong, deal with it.

That doesn't link to any posts by David Gaider. In fact, not a single Bioware employee posted in that thread. And it doesn't link anywhere to any official posts or documentation.

I am right. Deal with it.

Modifié par Astranagant, 04 août 2010 - 02:26 .

[Herr Uhl]

Astranagant wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Astranagant wrote...

GodWood wrote...
The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

Nothing is canon, deal with it.

You are wrong, deal with it.

That doesn't link to any posts by David Gaider. In fact, not a single Bioware employee posted in that thread. And it doesn't link anywhere to any official posts or documentation.

I am right. Deal with it.

Why should they need to? If all games endings are the same, it is the canon. Unless they'll just disregard DAO completely.

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

GodWood wrote...

The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

Where did this comment come from? Who said it was? The article in the OP agrees with you.

[Pedrak]

Am I saying the god baby scenario is never going to pop up for players who did [/i]do it? No, of course not. But I am saying that it’s not going to be a major[/i] portion of a future game. Maybe you run into the god baby somewhere down the line and have a conservation, aid it in a quest, gain it as a temporary companion or fight it and kill it. The god baby, however, is logically not going to be the focal point of a game’s plot.

That's what I've been saying since quite a while, and I'd be happy with a solution of this kind: make the god baby, now an adult, a possible party member in DA3; players who didn't perform the ritual get another character instead. This way, if you did the ritual you get some closure without devoting a whole game to it, and if you didn't you also get something unique.

[Saibh]

Bugzehat wrote...

Saibh wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

You can't reject Morigan and I think it was proven by Awakening... it's a "lore"thing... just like Star Wars games and even Mass Effect games assume certain things happened. I don't mind it realy, it's a small part of player's freedom going dead but it holds the history together.

As for the baby's apearence, I'd bet my money on Dragon Age 3.

You...can reject Morrigan. Awakening doesn't make the DR canon if you import a dead Warden, it just sacrifices the other Warden instead.

...Er, right? That's what I recall, at least. Regardless, you don't need to import a dead Warden. All it does it goes back and changes a decision to keep your Warden alive. Not the same thing.

Importing a dead Warden does make it so the DR happened -- Alistair can show up, after all, so it doesn't have him die instead. That said, it's perfectly possible to import a Warden who had Alistair or Loghain sacrifice themselves instead, so it's not like every Awakenings playthrough takes place in a world where the DR happened.

Yeah, I have yet to actually get the game, so I was just summoning up what I barely recall other people saying. Still, point stands.

[phaonica]

And in Awakening, while you may question how your dead Warden could “come back to life” for the expansion, it’s not a continuity lapse so much as its a mechanical anomaly. Gaider explains: “Your Warden was not resurrected in-game. If you imported a DS Warden into Awakening, then you chose to un-do your earlier decision. As to whether you can un-un-do it again when importing into DA2, I really don’t have an answer for that yet, sorry.” If your Warden died and you chose to resurrect him/her, that’s you changing the story from what you previously chose

If they can say you could "undo" your choice not to do the US by importing your US Warden into Awakening, they could do the exact same thing with another expansion.

The difference, I guess, is that the story in Awakening would still occur, no matter if you did the US or not, and the OBG story won't occur at all if you made that choice. Whatever the case, though, if in one DLC the Warden never existed at all, and in other we played as Leliana, and in DA2 we don't play as the Warden at all, then I don't see why we couldn't play an expansion or DLC where we were meant to play a Warden who did the DR.

Modifié par phaonica, 04 août 2010 - 02:44 .

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

Pedrak wrote...

Am I saying the god baby scenario is never going to pop up for players who did [/i]do it? No, of course not. But I am saying that it’s not going to be a major[/i] portion of a future game. Maybe you run into the god baby somewhere down the line and have a conservation, aid it in a quest, gain it as a temporary companion or fight it and kill it. The god baby, however, is logically not going to be the focal point of a game’s plot.

That's what I've been saying since quite a while, and I'd be happy with a solution of this kind: make the god baby, now an adult, a possible party member in DA3; players who didn't perform the ritual get another character instead. This way, if you did the ritual you get some closure without devoting a whole game to it, and if you didn't you also get something unique.

I agree with this. There are actually 3 possible endings depending on whether you romanced Morrigan at all.

God baby
Regular baby
No baby

[phaonica]

Astranagant wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Astranagant wrote...

GodWood wrote...
The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

Nothing is canon, deal with it.

You are wrong, deal with it.

That doesn't link to any posts by David Gaider. In fact, not a single Bioware employee posted in that thread. And it doesn't link anywhere to any official posts or documentation.

I am right. Deal with it.

OK, so where are your DG posts that prove nothing is canon?

[Saibh]

phaonica wrote...

And in Awakening, while you may question how your dead Warden could “come back to life” for the expansion, it’s not a continuity lapse so much as its a mechanical anomaly. Gaider explains: “Your Warden was not resurrected in-game. If you imported a DS Warden into Awakening, then you chose to un-do your earlier decision. As to whether you can un-un-do it again when importing into DA2, I really don’t have an answer for that yet, sorry.” If your Warden died and you chose to resurrect him/her, that’s you changing the story from what you previously chose

If they can say you could "undo" your choice not to do the US by importing your US Warden into Awakening, they could do the exact same thing with another expansion.

The difference, I guess, is that the story in Awakening would still occur, no matter if you did the US or not, and the OBG story won't occur at all if you made that choice. Whatever the case, though, if in one DLC the Warden never existed at all, and in other we played as Leliana, and in DA2 we don't play as the Warden at all, then I don't see why we couldn't play an expansion or DLC where we were meant to play a Warden who did the DR.

Because those are alternate universes or past experiences that don't exclude the already existing Grey Warden from the fold. Why should people who made the Ultimate Sacrifice get punished by not having a DLC or expansion to themselves? Why should their choices be invalidated? The US should be a selfless thing you get rewarded for, not get told you made the wrong decision.

[GodWood]

Astranagant wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Astranagant wrote...

GodWood wrote...
The DR isn't canon, deal with it.

Nothing is canon, deal with it.

You are wrong, deal with it.

That doesn't link to any posts by David Gaider. In fact, not a single Bioware employee posted in that thread. And it doesn't link anywhere to any official posts or documentation.
I am right. Deal with it.

It seems you don't understand what canon means.
Deal with it.