1227 réponses à ce sujet

[Tooneyman]

PC rules! I'm so glad I got one and of course the Consoles aren't going to get mods. Why you ask, because of 1 reason. Security. Microsoft and Sony are sick and tired of people cheating on the live games and treating other gamers like crap. I like their atittude. If you don't play fair, you ain't playing at all. I'm not saying that this is the case for a single player game, but security is still the main issues with consoles so I could see why Bioware did this.

[the_one_54321]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

- making textures just for the PC Baldur's gate aerial view (as opposed to 3rd person console view) would have been too expensive compared to the targeted audience.

This part bugs me in particular. I just got finished playing a console game that has a fully isometric rotatable camera and textures that blow DA:O out of the water. FFXIII has, thus far, the best visual quality out of almost any of the next generation games. And it does it with a player controlled camera and on the PS3.

If your team can't manage to even render in a separate camera without spending too much money, then they aren't a team that is on par with other big developers. I'm not trying to be deliberately insulting about this, but the cards are on the table and you call a spade a spade.

[DragonRageGT]

andar91 wrote...

I never said that mods weren't nice to have, I just said that I never use them much personally.  What makes DA a better game is completely subjective.

I meant compared to vanilla DA.

[Sauronych]

Now that was unexpected. No aerial view = no buy for me.

[fchopin]

If the points from Purple Lady are correct then i am very disappointed.

[Narreneth]

Purple Lady wrote...

I know it's kinda stupid concerning the camera, but I feel were're losing the feeling we had when playing NWN or BG. The game will be more action oriented, but if I wanted action, I'd turn to the Mass Effect franchise, not to the game that is supposed to be "the spiritual successor of Baldur"s gate". Just remember how they sold us DAO I as being old school, and now, they're completely changing policy.
And no mods simply means reducing the time people will actually be interested in the game, and letting the community go to another games, certainly the witcher II.

I'm sorry but there are so many flaws in what you just said, it makes my head spin.  First and foremost, when you say that if you wanted action you'd play Mass Effect instead of Dragon Age; because, you are moving from NWN and BG to this franchise.  Both NWN and BG had tons of action.  Combat is always action-y unless you're dealing with completely turn-based style fighting.   Hell, even in Real Time Strategies, there's lots of action when you're micro-managing units.  The only added action is coming in the form of making combat more reactive.  They aren't taking storyline, decision making, or character sculpting out of the game.  Further on in your post you contradict your action point by pointing out that if Dragon Age doesn't do it for this "anti-action" crowd they're likely to buy Witcher 2.  Have you ever even played Witcher?  The combat in that game is 100% action.  So essentially what you're saying is "if you're going to put faster-paced combat into Dragon Age, I'm going to go play a game that has even faster combat than your game even though I have clearly stated that action is not what I am looking for."

The "spiritual successor" to Baldur's Gate argument is getting very old and tired.  While BioWare said that Dragon Age: Origins was meant to be this, they never said anything about the series in general.  No one knew when they were putting the game together how successful or unsuccessful a game DA:O was going to be.  If a franchise is going to stand on its own and not stagnate, it cannot measure its development cycles in how close in likeness it is to another series.  (Also, it's laughable that you think BG is "old school")   Furthermore, DA:O is nothing like BG even with the top-down viewpoint so your argument really doesn't fit to begin with unless your goal is to slam the series as a whole based on this particular criticism. 

Finally, the modding thing.  Look, I understand people like to mod.  I understand other people like to play mods.  I do not.  I've worked with people on making mods before, but I do not find the mod community to be interesting in the slightest.  I still play DA:O.  Quite frequently.  For you to say that the lack of a toolset means the game is less-enjoyable over a long period of time so absolutely is completely false.  It may be less enjoyable to you; but, that doesn't mean it's less enjoyable to everyone.  Would I be disappointed if I was really into mods?  Probably.  I wouldn't, however, be on here talking about how it ruins the game.  The fact of the matter is, the ability to mod the game does nothing to the quality of the game itself.  The modding community is using the engine to make their own stuff.  While this is obviously something that is enjoyable to people who do it, it has nothing to do with the main game and shouldn't be used to judge the quality of said game.  If you wanted a mod for every game release ever you'd constantly be disappointed.  Again, I realize you enjoy it, but it's irrational to pan the entire game on one thing alone.

As far as the top-down thing: yeah, it's kinda strange, but honestly, I didn't like it on the PC version anyway; so, in this case it doesn't really disappoint me.

[Celticon]

If there's no aerial view, I'd at least like a free-look mode even if it's constrained to the ground. Aerial view really helped me target spells and enemies from far away without charging in and getting personal too quickly.

[Ladybright]

Speaking completely out of my posterior here, but would it be possible to rig/alter/demonize the DAO toolset into working with DA2? Assuming DAO and DA2 are set up in the same way.

[Brockololly]

Sadly though these 2 items were hinted at a while back in other posts.
But the lack of a BG style tactical view is trash. The reasoning they used for not including it in the console versions of Origins was that the consoles couldn't handle it. Now they're saying they don't want to put the extra work in to make it work on the PC? And I'm now supposed to expect that if they don't want to do that amount of work, that the PC version will be as robust as Origins? Please.
As for the no toolset- again, its a matter of putting in work that they can't easily monetize. The toolset for DA has added so much to the game for myself- half of the reason I'm still playing Origins and subsequently still interested in DLC ($$ for you BioWare!) is that mods extend the life of the game and let you not only mod, but fix bugs that the devs don't fix or add dialogue thats missing (see: Terra_ex's Morrigan dialogue mod).

I can't say I'm at all surprised by this news if true, but at least I wish BioWare would hav ethe honesty to quit saying DA2 PC isn't going to be held back by the consoles, as "their market" isn't the PC, its the consoles...

Modifié par Brockololly, 07 août 2010 - 06:51 .

[JasonPogo]

Ladybright wrote...

Speaking completely out of my posterior here, but would it be possible to rig/alter/demonize the DAO toolset into working with DA2? Assuming DAO and DA2 are set up in the same way.

I know nothing about moding but I would guess no.

[Amyntas]

Combat was rather trivial in DA:O even on the PC. If the new combat mechanics are interesting then I don't have a problem with KOTOR style combat. The lack of a tool set is disappointing though. I've played Fallout 3 for almost a year because of all the awesome mods (weapons, companions, quests), I don't think I would have touched FO3 after the first playthrough if it wasn't for mods. It gives a game so much more longevity.

[LadyKarrakaz]

tmp7704 wrote...

Purple Lady wrote...

- making textures just for the PC Baldur's gate aerial view (as opposed to 3rd person console view) would have been too expensive compared to the targeted audience. So, M Laidlaw confirmed there will be no tactical Baldur's gate like camera view (isometric view).

Ehh, that's odd. There's no extra textures for "aerial view" as far as i can tell, the game simply have items split into two chunks, the base part and "fade" part which becomes hidden when camera is pulled up. Both parts have the same textures.

I'm sorry but it seems rather dubious, as does that bit about Toolset provided there's no explanation for it whatsoever.

I edited my fist post with the quote of M Laidlaw about this.

[MrLee95]

No aerial view is a huge disappointment! Stop rushing and do it right!!

[Solid N7]

It doesn´t matter to bioware, the pc makert is broken so is not a big loss to lose a few pc whiners

[DragonRageGT]

Narreneth wrote...
...

Finally, the modding thing.  Look, I understand people like to mod.  I understand other people like to play mods.  I do not.  I've worked with people on making mods before, but I do not find the mod community to be interesting in the slightest.  I still play DA:O.  Quite frequently.  For you to say that the lack of a toolset means the game is less-enjoyable over a long period of time so absolutely is completely false.  It may be less enjoyable to you; but, that doesn't mean it's less enjoyable to everyone.  Would I be disappointed if I was really into mods?  Probably.  I wouldn't, however, be on here talking about how it ruins the game.  The fact of the matter is, the ability to mod the game does nothing to the quality of the game itself.  The modding community is using the engine to make their own stuff.  While this is obviously something that is enjoyable to people who do it, it has nothing to do with the main game and shouldn't be used to judge the quality of said game.  If you wanted a mod for every game release ever you'd constantly be disappointed.  Again, I realize you enjoy it, but it's irrational to pan the entire game on one thing alone.

As far as the top-down thing: yeah, it's kinda strange, but honestly, I didn't like it on the PC version anyway; so, in this case it doesn't really disappoint me.

You really should watch this before saying  "the ability to mode the game does nothing to qualify the game itself":

Dragon Age: Origins - Trailer mod

This is not my video. It is the Modder's video. Just watch it and drool!

(forgot to say that a Bioware guy was so impressed by it that he sent the video to all his BW colleagues. He said so in the Project discussion page)

Modifié par RageGT, 07 août 2010 - 06:54 .

[the_one_54321]

Narreneth wrote...
...

You're completely out in left field here. None of those arguments have anything to do with technical qualities or concrete definition. They are about the tone of presentation of the game. While what you've said is technically correct with regard to the technical construction of DA:O, it actually has nothing to do with her statements as she was talking about the promises made regarding tone of presentation.

[Tooneyman]

Brockololly wrote...

Sadly though these 2 items were hinted at a while back in other posts.
But the lack of a BG style tactical view is trash. The reasoning they used for not including it in the console versions of Origins was that the consoles couldn't handle it. Now they're saying they don't want to put the extra work in to make it work on the PC? And I'm now supposed to expect that if they don't want to do that amount of work, that the PC version will be as robust as Origins? Please.
As for the no toolset- again, its a matter of putting in work that they can't easily monetize. The toolset for DA has added so much to the game for myself- half of the reason I'm still playing Origins and subsequently still interested in DLC ($$ for you BioWare!) is that mods extend the life of the game and let not only mod, but fix bugs that the devs don't fix or add dialogue thats missing (see: Terra_ex's Morrigan dialogue mod).

I can't say I'm at all surprised by this news if true, but at least I wish BioWare would hav ethe honesty to quit saying DA2 PC isn't going to be held back by the consoles, as "their market" isn't the PC, its the consoles...

Ok, first off have you even been reading these forums?
Yeah, they will have a tactical system like they did in the old game of DA:O and the top view camera for DA2 for the PC. Its just not for consoles. No big deal. They want to make it easier for console gamers who have a control in hand to be able to have an easier time with the controls. I had both versions of the game and I will tell you. The PC was far superior. The console controls were ok, but I couldn't move fast enough to get a lot of my kills done. I can see why they want to make it more fun. AS for a toolset. You don't need a toolset for the console version. Besides they might still make a toolset after the game comes out. It might be a little while after so don't start assuming right away. Until I have a bioware worker in this thread telling us we aren't going to have a toolset for PC I'll believe it.

Modifié par Tooneyman, 07 août 2010 - 06:57 .

[Anacronian Stryx]

So when will there come any positive news about DA2??

[jones0901]

man i was really hoping that all the changes in DA2 were methodical and well thought out; that the early release date and quick development were just because bioware had some spontaneous outpouring of creativity; i am wrong, all these changes are just EA or bioware or whoever rolling out quick games to cash in on the DA name and ME model...im sure the game will be good and i think i will like it (maybe thats the problem, since everyone is accepting these hybrid rpgs the devs can make simpflied games), but damn--DA is the last game franchise out there that touches on the fallout/BG old school rpg set up, and if it moves away from the classic build and is sells well (as it will) devs will realize there is no reason to build another arcanum or fallout 2... its a shame

[the_one_54321]

Tooneyman wrote...
Ok, first off have you even been reading these forums?
Yeah, they will have a tactical system like they did in the old game of DA:O and the top view camera for DA2 for the PC. Its just not for consoles. No big deal. They want to make it easier for console gamers who have a control in hand to be able to have an easier time with the controls. I had both versions of the game and I will tell you. The PC was far superior. The console controls were ok, but I couldn't move fast enough to get a lot of my kills done. I can see why they want to make it more fun. AS for a toolset. You don't need a toolset for the console version. Besides they might still make a toolset after the game comes out. It might be a little while after so don't start assuming right away. Until I have a bioware worker in this thread telling us we aren't going to have a toolset for PC I'll believe it.

Purple Lady quoted the lead designer. And his words seemed to imply that there be no top-down view at all and that they were focusing on the system that sold the most copies, that being the console.

[Brockololly]

Tooneyman wrote...

Ok, first off have you even been reading these forums?

Umm.. did you not read the OP's post?
- No aerial view for PC version as BioWare has deemed it a bad investment since apparently Origins sold more on the console side and thats their market.
- No toolset for the PC

[DragonRageGT]

Well, honestly I can only hope the OP is a hoax and based on some poor translation. And for those suck-ups that take it up their rear end and even apologize for showing their backs to those screwing them... that does not make you any more fan than those who can still show some critical sense.

[Gwydion19]

This saddens me greatly. The Baldur's Gate feel is one of the main things I love about DA. Let us hope this changes in the future.

[AlanC9]

Could we have a translation of the quote concerning the toolset, please?



And no top-down means no friendly fire on spells, right?