1227 réponses à ce sujet

[FedericoV]

Morroian wrote...

FedericoV wrote...

Kotor combat wasn't that great, but imho even DA:O's combat system is pretty awful. If I start to make a list of al the feature I do not like about DA:O's combat I would fill a page or two, but that's not the place. Briefly, I would say that the pause&play/isometric combat system that worked so well for the IE games based on AD&D (wich is a turn game), do not worked very well with the cooldown system of DA:O (since it forced the player to use the stupid tactics or to pause the game every second).

The fact that you were forced to use tactics was the point, and no they weren't stupid if you used them properly. However if they are getting rid of the top down viewpoint on the PC they will have to implement queuing.

I know that tactics could be useful if you spend a lot of time to tweak them. My point is that a party pased tactical game is all about control. Forcing tactics wich remove situational control from the player or hectic pausing is an example of bad game design and at the end it's stupid. Imho, a party based/tactical/pause&play combat with isometric view and lot of power to use is not suited for fast gameplay and need a slower tempo, just like BG/AD&D. If you want an action/rush feel, there are better options.

Modifié par FedericoV, 08 août 2010 - 01:00 .

[Lord_Saulot]

Maybe once the work week starts again, we will get a clarification.

[Onyx Jaguar]

I was beaten multiple times, disregard

Modifié par Onyx Jaguar, 08 août 2010 - 01:01 .

[TheMufflon]

AmstradHero wrote...

Given I'm a modder, I know exactly what I'm talking about. Or perhaps you didn't look at my sig or haven't played my mod.

Do me a favour. Check out the most popular mods here and on DANexus. And lay off the insults

So what you're saying is that since people didn't want to play your mod, they shouldn't get any mods at all?

[Nerevar-as]

AmstradHero wrote...

adneate wrote...

AmstradHero wrote...

So the mods that garner the most interest are those that make cosmetic changes to the game? Sounds like all people care about is pretty graphics and having attractive characters...

And people wonder why there won't be a DA2 toolset.

To complain that BioWare are supporting style over substance, but all the while only focussing on cosmetic mods... well, sounds like people are just getting exactly what they asked for.

You have no idea what you're talking about why don't you get a clue and then come back, okay?

Given I'm a modder, I know exactly what I'm talking about. Or perhaps you didn't look at my sig or haven't played my mod.

Do me a favour. Check out the most popular mods here and on DANexus. And lay off the insults

And because of that the people who make and enjoy other kinds of mods pay? Gooooood.

[ladydesire]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I was beated multiple times, disregard

As fast as this thread is moving, it's understandable that you might have been ninja'd. :happy:

[PanosSmirnakos]

adneate wrote...

AmstradHero wrote...

So the mods that garner the most interest are those that make cosmetic changes to the game? Sounds like all people care about is pretty graphics and having attractive characters...

And people wonder why there won't be a DA2 toolset.

To complain that BioWare are supporting style over substance, but all the while only focussing on cosmetic mods... well, sounds like people are just getting exactly what they asked for.

You have no idea what you're talking about why don't you get a clue and then come back, okay?
 

Sorry but you're making a mistake here...  I think that Amstrad Hero created the first fully voiced user made module for DA:O which was Alley of Murders and it was quite good. Now, if you go to DA Nexus or here in BSN and see which mods are to the top 20 or nominated as files of the month, you'll mainly see mods related to nudity, sex and cosmetics. So, I can clearly understand what he means. I don't agree  that this has anything to do with the no toolset decision of DA2 though.

Modifié par PanosSmirnakos, 08 août 2010 - 01:06 .

[Estel78]

RageGT wrote...

Estel78 wrote...

You have any data that backs you up?

From another thread in the off-topic... if you still don't see this as a fact... they i'd say you're as blind as you want to be.

RageGT wrote...



Over 2 million Movies and Softwares CD/DVDs, PC and Console, lots of Console games CDs and DVDs aprehended and destroyed!

And people think that file sharing causes any loss... lol. This is what causes loss because someone is actually making lots of money from it. Money that should be going to the devs, publishers and well, to the tax collectors as well so it might revert in benefits for the society. (As though they did that with the taxes we pay...)

Do they do that? In someplaces all they can think of is passing some crazy laws against internet users!

Dan Bull - Dear Mandy [an open letter to Lord Mandelson]

Edit: Abt making more money with consoles, but of course. They sell a PC game here for 99,00. A console? for 250, 300! The pirated console? 10 bucks! =P

You didn't provide any data that says console games are more pirated than PC games, sorry.

As for selling pirated copies, that's not exclusive to console games and there are also people who download console games, so i dunno why you keep bringing that up.

[AbounI]

Estel78 wrote...

AbounI wrote...

For those who pretend they don't care about the toolset for any reason, please  come and watchhere

I have already played Baldurs Gate 2 and prolly won't do so YET AGAIN, there are a lot of new great games coming out and not enough time, thank you.

For those that love doing stuff like a BG2 mod, guess what, YOU STILL CAN, with the DAO toolset.

I've linked this project only to illustrate one the multiple possibilities of what can be done with a toolset.it does not necessary mean new skins, new weapons and hairstyles.Some projects can be huge, in time, in investment, in various talents it demands (some need writings capabilities, others need programming capabilities, etc etc).
So not giving anymore support for the toolset is a wrong behaviour.

I know a toolset is a gift, but one can see it as reward too, a reward for saying "thanks to the fanbase.I hope you'll enjoy to work with".It's just a manner to give thanks to the fanbase for supporting a so long project, for beeing faithfull.
It is said Bioware is listening to his fanbase.let's see how much they want to listen to it again.But at least, it seems Bioware does not want his fanbase to be able to express herself in a creative way.
edit: So, my question is:
don't we worth no more such a reward?What was wrong with us?Didn't we buy enough PC version of origins?

Modifié par AbounI, 08 août 2010 - 01:22 .

[Vandrayke]

I was excited about the DAO toolset at first because I spent so much time playing NWN mods... sadly, what I've seen so far makes me think that high production values are harder and harder to mimic as games get technically more diverse and complicated. Honestly, I liked many NWN mods far more than the actual NWN game, but I haven't experienced the same thing when it comes to DAO mods, or even NWN2 mods. What I have seen is more and more mods with different looking female characters. While some of these are nice, they don't make me want to play the game again

[JamieCOTC]

slimgrin wrote...

Sarkus wrote...

JamieCOTC wrote...

Combat on the consoles is being streamlined to better utilize the
controller interface. Combat on the PC should be largely the same.
[GameInformer article]

- from the What do we know thread.

So, BW told one gaming magazine one thing and then changed their minds?  wtf?  Every time I get a little bit enthusiastic about this game, something comes along and destroys it.  BW said "we don't won't the same old, same old." I say, great, so why are they giving us Masds Effect2? My enthusiasm for this thing has hit rock bottom.  Oh, and uh, I hate the name Hawke.

That's what I don't get and what makes me think the OP's source is confused or something.  Here is what the GI article says:

The PC version implements the same strategic approach afforded by a mouse-and-keyboard control scheme. You can examine the battlefield closely, make decisions from a top-down view, and direct your party like a general.

Somebody is wrong or Bioware changed their minds between GI and this new article. 

I think somebody is wrong. That statement in bold text is not vague in the least.

EXACTLY!  The only way to "think like a general" is to see the d*mned battlefield.  I'm really hoping this is wrong, otherwise they have pretty much lost a customer. 

[kraidy1117]

Tell me this is just a cruel joke from Bioware?

[Nerevar-as]

FedericoV wrote...

Morroian wrote...

FedericoV wrote...

Kotor combat wasn't that great, but imho even DA:O's combat system is pretty awful. If I start to make a list of al the feature I do not like about DA:O's combat I would fill a page or two, but that's not the place. Briefly, I would say that the pause&play/isometric combat system that worked so well for the IE games based on AD&D (wich is a turn game), do not worked very well with the cooldown system of DA:O (since it forced the player to use the stupid tactics or to pause the game every second).

The fact that you were forced to use tactics was the point, and no they weren't stupid if you used them properly. However if they are getting rid of the top down viewpoint on the PC they will have to implement queuing.

I know that tactics could be useful if you spend a lot of time to tweak them. My point is that a party pased tactical game is all about control. Forcing tactics wich remove situational control from the player or hectic pausing is an example of bad game design and at the end it's stupid. Imho, a party based/tactical/pause&play combat with isometric view and lot of power to use is not suited for fast gameplay and need a slower tempo, just like BG/AD&D. If you want an action/rush feel, there are better options.

It WAS BG heir, so to speak. Not an action/rush feel. Now who knows.

[Onyx Jaguar]

kraidy1117 wrote...

Tell me this is just a cruel joke from Bioware?

one in french

[Estel78]

Senzen Sumnor wrote...

Ahh okay, Estel seemed a bit of any old school name, I was picturing an old lady with bee-hive hair-do that enjoys knitting.

[cmessaz]

kraidy1117 wrote...

Tell me this is just a cruel joke from Bioware?

I want to get my hopes up, I really do. But I don't think the lack of toolset is a joke, I would place money on it.

[Drizzt ORierdan]

Purple Lady wrote...

AbounI wrote...

Purple Lady wrote...

andar91 wrote...

@OP: would you mind providing the quotes you translated in french? I'm not doubting your translating skills, I just think it would be nice to have them for completeness' sake, and if people want to check, then they can.

The original (French) quotes are in the French forum thread I created here. Check the end of first post. They are mostly the same, though French tends to be a bit longer than English. And don't forget that it's already the translation made by the journalist of Mr Laidlaw's answers.

I'll add the link to first post of this thread, in case other are interested.

Wrong link?Perhaps did you want to link the french one?here it is so

The thread is too quick. i have already changed the links to give the right thread. My apologizes.

Thanks for all your troubles; specially tying to keep this thread civilized...    

[adneate]

AmstradHero wrote...

Given I'm a modder, I know exactly what I'm talking about. Or perhaps you didn't look at my sig or haven't played my mod.

Do me a favour. Check out the most popular mods here and on DANexus. And lay off the insults

Really your logic is that because cosmetic mods (which are the easiest to make) are popular BioWare should stop supporting the mod community all together. It took over a year before the really good mods came out for Oblivion but since the Dragon Age modders haven't done it already we should never have a toolset again since apparently we abused it. I love reading all these ignorant posts by people that don't bother to think outside of their own little world and then when people call them on said BS they act surprised.

[Estel78]

Vandrayke wrote...

shedevil3001 wrote...

its not really so hard to understand that many would be upset by no toolset alot of hard work goes into mods and alot of time and effort to

I get that.  I don't get the, "there's no point in even playing this game," mentality, though.  Like a game cannot possibly be good unless it meets X prerequisites.  

exactly

[Vandrayke]

PanosSmirnakos wrote...

adneate wrote...

AmstradHero wrote...

So the mods that garner the most interest are those that make cosmetic changes to the game? Sounds like all people care about is pretty graphics and having attractive characters...

And people wonder why there won't be a DA2 toolset.

To complain that BioWare are supporting style over substance, but all the while only focussing on cosmetic mods... well, sounds like people are just getting exactly what they asked for.

You have no idea what you're talking about why don't you get a clue and then come back, okay?
 

Sorry but you're making a mistake here...  I think that Amstrad Hero created the first fully voiced user made module for DA:O which was Alley of Murders and it was quite good. Now, if you go to DA Nexus or here in BSN and see which mods are to the top 20 or nominated as files of the month, you'll mainly see mods related to nudity, sex and cosmetics. So, I can clearly understand what he means. I don't agree  that this is the reason for the no toolset decision of DA2 though.

Indeed.  I used to visit DA Nexus almost daily, and the top files seemed to always be nude people or a better brothel or whatever.  

[Spoonuser12]

Very Disappointing, hopefully Bioware will be able to provide some justification for these decisions, not that anything could justify this.



What's next on the "slippery slope"?

[Lord_Saulot]

cmessaz wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

Tell me this is just a cruel joke from Bioware?

I want to get my hopes up, I really do. But I don't think the lack of toolset is a joke, I would place money on it.

Lack of toolset is quite plausible, especially since launching and supporting a tool set requires extra work on Bioware's behalf.  On the other hand, "no overhead view" is what some have doubts about, since it seemingly contradicts the previous claim that PC combat would be about the same.  I really hope the latter is not changed from the first game.

[fchopin]

Vandrayke wrote...

fchopin wrote...

Vandrayke wrote...

shedevil3001 wrote...

its not really so hard to understand that many would be upset by no toolset alot of hard work goes into mods and alot of time and effort to

I get that.  I don't get the, "there's no point in even playing this game," mentality, though.  Like a game cannot possibly be good unless it meets X prerequisites.  

I don't think you want to understand, this is supposed to be a sequel to dao not an everything changed in the game.

meh I expect significant changes from sequel to sequel.  Sometimes sequels are disappointing, sure, but I never expect more of the same.  If I really wanted more of the same, I'd just load up the original again

And also, sometimes sequels knock it out of the park.  

I understand your point of view but don't agree with it, i will not say anything else as i would not like this thread closed.