1227 réponses à ce sujet

[Sauronych]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...
First off, let's talk about the toolset issue. Obviously in this community there's going to be some concern that we wouldn't release a toolset, so let me clear the air a little: The tools we're using to make Dragon Age 2 are very, very close to the tools you guys have used to make your mods for DA:O. They're not identical, as we've made a few in-house improvements, but they're almost identical. As such, there isn't a new toolset to release, per se.

While we won't be releasing a toolset update in tandem with Dragon Age 2, we ARE investigating what it would take to update the community toolset to match ours, along with providing DA2 content in the future.

1)You have already released updates for the toolset in the past. Why does it require "investigating what it would take" now to do the same thing?

2)If for some mysterious reason it is so hard to release an update, why don't you give us the whole DA2 toolset?

 
While we likely won't pull as far up as we did in DA:O, I have always felt that the key to tactical play was actually freeing your camera from the character you're controlling to issue precise orders, which is what we're tuning now. So, this means you can still maneuver the camera around the battlefield and issue orders from a remote location, just as you could in Origins.

Again, why is it so hard to let us pull as far up as in DAO? In Starcraft 2 a modder can make the game third-person or first-person in a matter of hours if not minutes. You have a whole team and yet you can't create a different camera angle? Wait, not different... exactly the same as in the previous game.  

[A. Sayalero]

Dileos wrote...

A. Sayalero wrote...

Enjoy your Dragon Effect 2 in PS3.
I 'll enjoy The Witcher 2 on my PC , rather than swallow a port.


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window.jstiming.load.tick("dl");

And I'll enjoy knowing that you just ran out of ammunition in your misguided little rant.

And I plan on purchasing DAII for my PC, just as I did for DA:O and DA:A.

There is a difference between having no ammunition and no patience to convince a fan of Bioware .

For what you 'll find on PC , better play it on PS3. Experiential remain casual , but at least be authentic.

[Dileos]

A. Sayalero wrote...

There is a difference between having no ammunition and no patience to convince a fan of Bioware .

For what you 'll find on PC , better play it on PS3. Experiential remain casual , but at least be authentic.

You failed to provide any proof to support your flimsy arguments, you failed to make a single valid and well thought out point, and you abruptly ended an argument you were on the losing end of. That sounds like running out of ammo to me.

And why would I play the console version if the PC version seems so much better? Again, you're just grasping at straws bro.

And you don't know what Experiential means...do you?

Modifié par Dileos, 08 août 2010 - 09:19 .

[Lux]

Mike's a new dad? Congrats!



Some positive info derived from this after all.



As an ancient sea scorpion once told me, let's wait and see about the game. Modding tools would be nice to have. It gets the community more involved.

[Burdokva]

Well, there I go saving a 100$ in my wallet. Seeing where even the hardcore old-school RPG Dragon Age team is heading, I'm pretty sure Mass Effect 3 (and Origins, once the price drops) will be the last BioWare game I buy in the foreseeable future. Good job hacking away decent features...

Developers made money before DLC; before free content with patches became paid packs, before mods become the plague for the greedy developers .Yeah, I'm a PC elitist, and I won't insult myself with buying overpriced DLCs when there are free mods that frequently top the standard DLC quality.

Modifié par Burdokva, 08 août 2010 - 09:22 .

[FlamenDialis]

Sarkus wrote...

FlamenDialis wrote...
You are also making some assumptions. I don't believe that the camera will be locked onto characters, but I recognize that with a camera stuck at arse-to-shoulder level I will be stuck staring at character arse much as I do in bioware's other console exploits, such as mass effect, je, and kotor. I do not know how far the camera can be pulled back from my character. It appears that Mike believes that "freeing" the camera, without being able to pull it back, is meeting what is essential to achieve a tatical experience. Sorry, but being stuck at keister or shoulder level is NOT my notion of maintaining a tactical experience. Yes, according to Mike I will be able to peer at shrubbery as well as character fundaments, but I will be stuck at a height that makes tactical gameplay far less satisfying.

"you just probably won't be able to pull the camera back..."

Perhaps you are getting sucked in by Mike's view of what is and is not essential. This is not a "just probably" bit of tactical minutiae. The original DA developers didn't see the camera being locked in tight as "just probably" fare and neither do I.

This isn't about assumptions, its about who is taking an optimistic approach to what Mr. Laidlaw said and who is taking a negative approach.  While I enjoyed the potential of the tactical camera in DAO, I'd be lying if I said I used it all that much.  Maybe it's because every other Bioware RPG since KOTOR hasn't had it or maybe it's because almost no other RPG being made anymore uses that kind of camera, but I just don't require being able to pull back that far to feel it's tactical.  So I'm willing to give the developers the benefit of the doubt about the issue and assume that what they come up with will still provide a resonable amount of tactical control.  Beyond that, I can't be any more precise about what we are going to see because Mr. Laidlaw wasn't any more precise. 

And I don't know what you are talking about when you say "the original DA developers."  Mr. Laidlaw was the lead designer on DAO, just like he is on DA2.  Almost all the other developers seem to be returning in the same roles.  This is not a scenario where a different team of individuals is involved.  Either you trust the people who gave you the first game to give you something this time that maintains the core important aspects of the title you claim to have enjoyed or you don't.

Hey, I agree that you are taking an "optimistic" approach and I am seeing the potential pitfalls.However, I believe that you are being far too optimistic given the actual language being utilized by Mike and in light of the other announced changes to DA.  Given the short development cycle for this game, it seems far more reasonable to express discontent now as opposed to after the release of the game. Also, the fact that Mike was involved with the original da does not preclude that the factors described as essential over a half decade ago are differing than what is being described as essential today. I posted on the old interplay bg boards. I followed bg 2 development from day 1. I remember the names of shadowspawn, draconis, lanfear, silvermoon, di, spectre, gromnir, beerfish and dozens of other boardies who were regulars long before any of the current mods had first posted. I recall when a poster named diesel was insulted for his githyanki wild mage submission to a bg2 contest. I suffered with those horrible nwn messgae boards that were originally monitored by Josh Sawyer, who is now a developer at obsidian. I was arguing with David Gaider about aspects of bioware games long before Mike began working on HotU. Revisionist history will not work with me, and I am far too experienced with the game development process to be willing to take every developer statement on Faith.

[joriandrake]

people, stop insulting eachother

[babchenko]

So who here wouldn't buy DA2 if it didn't have a tactical view? I know I'd be hesitant to buy it with what I've read about it so far. The entire thing reeks of lazy.

[BrutalBeast]

Rurik948 wrote...

We still don't know what Bioware is planning. If it is just a loss of the highest angle of the camera, it will have nearly no impact on the game-play.

In my opinion DA:Os highest camera angle was already too cramped. I'd hate to see it being limited to even lower.

[Sauronych]

babchenko wrote...

So who here wouldn't buy DA2 if it didn't have a tactical view?

I wouldn't. Not releasing a toolset and removing the classic BG view is an insult to PC gamers. It is an obvious attempt to make console versions feel less inferior and to remove the developers' competition with modders so that Bioware can release more crappy DLC's like RtO and Darkspawn Chronicles. 
I was fine with introducing the dialogue wheel but this is just too much. And I'm sure this isn't the last bad news.

[Validus]

I just wanted to add my voice to the folk who want a toolset and aerial view. If anything the aerial view in DA:O was too limiting. You couldn't scroll past selected NPCs, so sometimes you couldn't pan to other party members or close enough to the mobs, and I lost count of how many times the camera zoomed back in on its own due to some terrain obstruction. Hearing that the aerial camera view in DA2 will be even more restrictive is disappointing to say the least. Dragon Age Origins was always a day one purchase for me, but I think I will have to try the gameplay of DA2 myself before making a decision this time.



I've always loved BioWare games for the spit shine you guys put on the story, characters and dialogue, but I wish you would put as much if not more effort into the technical and gameplay elements because that's usually where the games fumble a little for me and become... irksome.



As for a toolset, I've always wanted to create some adventures myself, and I've started in both NWN and DAO, but I just don't have that kind of time to dedicate to it. However, for the many many people out there who do, I really hope you do release one.

[Behindyounow]

babchenko wrote...

So who here wouldn't buy DA2 if it didn't have a tactical view? I know I'd be hesitant to buy it with what I've read about it so far. The entire thing reeks of lazy.

I would still buy it. I only really used the zoomed out view once or twice for the novelty of everything looking like Baldur's gate.

[SDNcN]

babchenko wrote...

So who here wouldn't buy DA2 if it didn't have a tactical view? I know I'd be hesitant to buy it with what I've read about it so far. The entire thing reeks of lazy.

I would.
I don't care about nostalgia and prefer to be able to watch combat animations as I move around my party. The fact that they are improving how things look in real time, and removing the foot shuffle,  is a huge plus for me.

[Sago_mulch]

At least there won't be an endless list of nudity mods, shagging opitions, crappy quests and other stuff that nobody cares about because DA2 doesn't have toolset. lol



Just get back to making pointless mods, ****** at them or whatever you crazy basement dwellers do in that dungeon of urs, it's teim to preapre for Dragonraeg2:Mass orgies.

[Dileos]

Sago_mulch wrote...

At least there won't be an endless list of nudity mods, shagging opitions, crappy quests and other stuff that nobody cares about because DA2 doesn't have toolset. lol

Just get back to making pointless mods, ****** at them or whatever you crazy basement dwellers do in that dungeon of urs, it's teim to preapre for Dragonraeg2:Mass orgies.

Ah crap...somebody let it out of its cage...

[Sago_mulch]

Dileos wrote...

Sago_mulch wrote...

At least there won't be an endless list of nudity mods, shagging opitions, crappy quests and other stuff that nobody cares about because DA2 doesn't have toolset. lol

Just get back to making pointless mods, ****** at them or whatever you crazy basement dwellers do in that dungeon of urs, it's teim to preapre for Dragonraeg2:Mass orgies.

Ah crap...somebody let it out of its cage...

Mod Edit: Post removed. Temporary ban meted out.

Modifié par Seagloom, 08 août 2010 - 12:14 .

[Pedrak]

I would still buy it. I only really used the zoomed out view once or twice

As for a toolset, I've always wanted to create some adventures myself, and I've started in both NWN and DAO, but I just don't have that kind of time to dedicate to it. However, for the many many people out there who do, I really hope you do release one.

What they said. These news don't bother me much - never installed or made a mod so far, seldom used the tactical camera (almost only for area spells), but I understand that for someone who liked these features this could be a disappointment.

Modifié par Pedrak, 08 août 2010 - 10:01 .

[Dileos]

Sago_mulch wrote...
Mod Edit: Post removed. Temporary ban meted out.

You do realize that you're the most obvious troll on the forums tonight right? And thats saying something.

...and with that, I'm done with you.

Modifié par Seagloom, 08 août 2010 - 12:14 .

[Sago_mulch]

Dileos wrote...

Sago_mulch wrote...
Mod Edit: Post removed. Temporary ban meted out.

You do realize that you're the most obvious troll on the forums tonight right? And thats saying something.

...and with that, I'm done with you.

You cannot even use quotes rite, fail.

Modifié par Seagloom, 08 août 2010 - 12:15 .

[Daurf815]

Thank god, I played DA:O on console and I loved the up close experience it gave

[Kandid001]

Mod Edit: Inflammatory comment removed.

Modifié par Seagloom, 08 août 2010 - 12:16 .

[Rixxencaxx]

Obviously this is not a pg game but a poor console port.
Bioware was very clear saying that they developed dao 2 with console gamers in mind.
In the end if this game is not for us pc gamers they will not get our money.
No dao 2 form me and hope that every pc gamer will boycott this game to send a clear message to sh.
Just one last thing.
PC only games can't sell well cause of piracy?? you desperately neeed to grab console audience to remain on the market?
Well...i'll say.....Starcraft 2 is a pc only game and you can only dream to match their sales.
Good luck for your future Bioware...

Modifié par Rixxencaxx, 08 août 2010 - 10:26 .

[Kandid001]

Turns out, being EA's lapdog is more profitable for them than remaining loyal to their fanbase.



But don't leave it at this BioWare, make DA2 an RPG flavored action game, and hire a bunch of talentless clowns to port it to the PC with 30 FPS cap and terrible optimization. Butcher 40% of the game and release it as paid DLC starting from day one.



Only then will you truly become EA's favorite pet.

[mr_nameless]

Any really good Role Playing Games to be looking forward to now??

I'm saving my money now for independent game studios.