477 réponses à ce sujet

[aaniadyen]

Riona45 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Teddie Sage wrote...

Yeah... Being atheist and playing on a good path would also be interesting. Though it seems more fun to destroy the whole "religion", if you're playing evil or politically.

How exactly do you destroy a religion?
People in RL have been trying for hunderds of years to destroy christianity, and failed. It's practicly mission impossible.


With that said...interesting how for all the talk of evil of organized religion, the hate is oozing from the other side.

Take this elsewhere please. 

Huh? What'd he do?

[Riona45]

aaniadyen wrote...
A. Link it to Christianity in real life and transfer their negative feelings toward it to the Chantry for some reason.

As I said...can we leave discussion of people's real life beliefs out of here?

[aaniadyen]

Riona45 wrote...

aaniadyen wrote...
A. Link it to Christianity in real life and transfer their negative feelings toward it to the Chantry for some reason.

As I said...can we leave discussion of people's real life beliefs out of here?

Oh, that's what that was about. Sorry about that...won't mention it again.

Like I said though, don't get why people feel the Chantry is somehow evil because it's members don't have comical personalities.

Modifié par aaniadyen, 16 septembre 2010 - 06:52 .

[Riona45]

Thank you.

[LobselVith8]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

jln.francisco wrote...
I'm positive the vials used to track mages are some kind of blood magic.

Nah. Blood magic is something different. Blood magic is powering your spells with life force. The vials are something completely different.


But really....Chantry evil? Destroying it would be good?
Don't know what kind of backwards logic that is based upon, but is clearly not the case.

The devs build a grey-ish world, which means you cannot clearly label the Chantry as evil. They don't consider it evil. Of course, that won't stop some people from trying. But canon isn't on their side

It's a matter of perspective. The homeland of the Chantry, Orlais, permit the chevaliers to rape women of the lower class without incident. The Dales are occupied and worship of a foreign religion is forbidden. The Chantry keeps mages under their heel, forbidding them from having rights to own a title or keep their children (as Wynne's son was stolen away from her). Plenty of people would view this as evil.

aaniadyen wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

jln.francisco wrote...
I'm positive the vials used to track mages are some kind of blood magic.

Nah. Blood magic is something different. Blood magic is powering your spells with life force. The vials are something completely different.


But really....Chantry evil? Destroying it would be good?
Don't know what kind of backwards logic that is based upon, but is clearly not the case.

The devs build a grey-ish world, which means you cannot clearly label the Chantry as evil. They don't consider it evil. Of course, that won't stop some people from trying. But canon isn't on their side

Actually, according to David Gaider, the creation and use of the phylacteries are technically blood magic.  The phylacteries are powered by the mage's blood inside of them. It is a more innocuous spell, but technically, it is BM.

As for destroying the chantry being good...I don't understand where anyone can come to that conclusion. They do a lot to help Thedas. It seems the only three types of people who think this Either A. Link it to Christianity in real life and transfer their negative feelings toward it to the Chantry for some reason. B. Mainly play a mage and are just pissed that they had such a horrible origin story (or something like that); and C. Somehow believe the Chantry consists of a bunch of mindless drones who do more harm than good. (again, no idea where they came up with that). Possibly a mix of all three.

 
They do a lot to help themselves. The Chantry supported Orlais when it occupied Ferelden (it's the reason why the current age is called the Dragon Age), and did nothing when people were murdered and raped by the Orlesians. The Dales were defeated by Orlais and worship of the elven gods was prevented. Mages are taken from their families and imprisoned, their children are taken away from them, they have no rights, and they are watched over constantly by the templars (drug addicts and some who, as Cullen points out, talk about killing mages with glee).

[OmbradelCerberos]

The Chantry supported Orlais when it occupied Ferelden (it's the reason why the current age is called the Dragon Age)

No, actually it is called Dragon Age, because the dragons began reappearing at the beginning of the age.

Modifié par OmbradelCerberos, 16 septembre 2010 - 04:10 .

[Dave of Canada]

As a Mage player, the chantry is going down. Sorry. If it has to come back, I'll make the damn rules about it.

[nightcobra]

Dave of Canada wrote...

As a Mage player, the chantry is going down. Sorry. If it has to come back, I'll make the damn rules about it.

i love playing the political puppetmaster, i'll change them from within:devil:

[EmperorSahlertz]

What I would truely love is a quest about Hawke having to kill a group of people who tries to overthrow the Chantry.

[LobselVith8]

OmbradelCerberos wrote...

The Chantry supported Orlais when it occupied Ferelden (it's the reason why the current age is called the Dragon Age)

No, actually it is called Dragon Age, because the dragons began reappearing at the beginning of the age.

Actually, according to the timeline of Thedas (that pertains to BioWare's timeline):

Even though scholars claimed it a terrible omen, the Chantry declared it to be a sign of the Orlesian Empire’s glory and named the next century the Dragon Age.

[Lotion Soronarr]

LobselVith8 wrote...


It's a matter of perspective. The homeland of the Chantry, Orlais, permit the chevaliers to rape women of the lower class without incident. The Dales are occupied and worship of a foreign religion is forbidden. The Chantry keeps mages under their heel, forbidding them from having rights to own a title or keep their children (as Wynne's son was stolen away from her). Plenty of people would view this as evil.

A) That's not a law, but rather simply the pwoer of nobles at work. Without any evidence, no one is going to belive a lowly commoner over a noble.
Or do you think that in the middel ages, a noble couldn't rape a low-class women and get away with it?
How is that any evidence of the evil fo the Chantry?

Also, mages CAN marry, but it looks like Wynne did everything without informing the Chantry..and they didn't like that. Apparently, Wynne was very young then, so maybe they didn't think her suitable for raising a child? Dunno exactly.

Also, the Dales were at war with Orlais. They weren't occupied because the Chantry said so.

Actually, according to David Gaider, the creation and use of the phylacteries are technically blood magic.  The phylacteries are powered by the mage's blood inside of them. It is a more innocuous spell, but technically, it is BM.

I don't recall him saying that. Link to that statement?

They do a lot to help themselves. The Chantry supported Orlais when it occupied Ferelden (it's the reason why the current age is called the Dragon Age), and did nothing when people were murdered and raped by the Orlesians. The Dales were defeated by Orlais and worship of the elven gods was prevented. Mages are taken from their families and imprisoned, their children are taken away from them, they have no rights, and they are watched over constantly by the templars (drug addicts and some who, as Cullen points out, talk about killing mages with glee).

War is hell. How eaxctly do you propose any religion can stop murder and rape altogether? It happens in EVERY War, during ANY occupation, by ANY side.
Aslo, as said before, containing mages is a necessary evil.

[LobselVith8]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

A) That's not a law, but rather simply the pwoer of nobles at work. Without any evidence, no one is going to belive a lowly commoner over a noble.
Or do you think that in the middel ages, a noble couldn't rape a low-class women and get away with it?
How is that any evidence of the evil fo the Chantry?

I agree about the nobility getting out of line, and David Gaider did clarify the comment about Orlais not legally permitting rape in another thread when the issue of what the Orlesian vendor said was brought up.

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Also, mages CAN marry, but it looks like Wynne did everything without informing the Chantry..and they didn't like that. Apparently, Wynne was very young then, so maybe they didn't think her suitable for raising a child? Dunno exactly.

Mages can marry in some Circles, but other Circles don't permit relationships or marriage. Regardless of the marriage, mages can't raise their own children.

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Also, the Dales were at war with Orlais. They weren't occupied because the Chantry said so.

That really depends on what perpsective you take. Orlais claims the war happened because of the attack on Red Crossing, and the Dales claimed that templars were sent into the Dales when the elves kicked out the Chantry missionaries.

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

I don't recall him saying that. Link to that statement?

Gaider mentioned at PAX about the templars using a form of blood magic involving the phylactery. You can see the interview on ustream.tv.

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Aslo, as said before, containing mages is a necessary evil.

In your opinion, it's necessary, but there are no facts in the novels, codex entries, or the storyline of Dragon Age supporting it's necessity.

Modifié par LobselVith8, 27 janvier 2011 - 05:34 .

[Catalyst38]

Bethany is a apostate and thus I must defend her well being from the Templar. The the chantry must fall to ensure her safety then so be it.

[Augoeides]

Teddie Sage wrote...

Hmm... Siding with the demons creatures reminds me of Radiata Story's fairy path. That would be interesting.

/looks at the developers with big puppy dog eyes

I can has demonic fairies to annihilate the Chantry with?

On a serious note, I would like to have the option to remind the Chantry that they too are mortal and fallible through some means, violent or not.

[TJPags]

The thread needed to be necro-ed to say "i have a sister and will ignore all consequences and possible gameplay to protect her"?

[s0meguy6666]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...


It's a matter of perspective. The homeland of the Chantry, Orlais, permit the chevaliers to rape women of the lower class without incident. The Dales are occupied and worship of a foreign religion is forbidden. The Chantry keeps mages under their heel, forbidding them from having rights to own a title or keep their children (as Wynne's son was stolen away from her). Plenty of people would view this as evil.

A) That's not a law, but rather simply the pwoer of nobles at work. Without any evidence, no one is going to belive a lowly commoner over a noble.
Or do you think that in the middel ages, a noble couldn't rape a low-class women and get away with it?
How is that any evidence of the evil fo the Chantry?

Also, mages CAN marry, but it looks like Wynne did everything without informing the Chantry..and they didn't like that. Apparently, Wynne was very young then, so maybe they didn't think her suitable for raising a child? Dunno exactly.

Also, the Dales were at war with Orlais. They weren't occupied because the Chantry said so.

Wow, that's a great argument. The Chantry isn't evil, because everyone else did it too.

[Mad-Max90]

Arghhh...stop saying ser issac newton was antireligous sorry to disappoint but the man was as Christian as they come...sorry but that gets annoying

[s0meguy6666]

Mad-Max90 wrote...

Arghhh...stop saying ser issac newton was antireligous sorry to disappoint but the man was as Christian as they come...sorry but that gets annoying

Nobody said that, I think. Isaac Newton was a theist because almost everyone else in his time was. If he lived today, with what we know today, I seriously doubt he wouldn't recognize christianity for the idiotic fairy tale that it is.

[Zevais]

I am drunk and posted in the wrong topic. Disreguard post.

Modifié par Zevais, 07 février 2011 - 04:01 .

[Heimdall]

s0meguy6666 wrote...

Mad-Max90 wrote...

Arghhh...stop saying ser issac newton was antireligous sorry to disappoint but the man was as Christian as they come...sorry but that gets annoying

Nobody said that, I think. Isaac Newton was a theist because almost everyone else in his time was. If he lived today, with what we know today, I seriously doubt he wouldn't recognize christianity for the idiotic fairy tale that it is.

  Please do not insult other people's religious beliefs.

[Elite Midget]

Indeed... If someone wants to believe in the unseen than let them. It doesn't effect you unless they gather a mob, call you sinners/non-believers, or simply try to force 'their' views and ideals upon you. Like oppressing another group of people.



In Dragon Age it's mages.



In real life it's Gays/Lesbians. Though it used to be Minorities untill we wised up...

[Heimdall]

Elite Midget wrote...

Indeed... If someone wants to believe in the unseen than let them. It doesn't effect you unless they gather a mob, call you sinners/non-believers, or simply try to force 'their' views and ideals upon you. Like oppressing another group of people.

In Dragon Age it's mages.

In real life it's Gays/Lesbians. Though it used to be Minorities untill we wised up...

  Most groups, religious or not, try to force their veiws on others or put down other's beliefs at some point to some extent.

[Nonoru]

Never good to mix up reality and videogames.Please keep your opinion about religions for you,people.

Whatever,i would like to have the possibility to become a Qunari(not Sten race,a follower of the Qun)and fight some chantrists.And vice versa.It could be a choice to make.(Not necessarily in DA2,but in one of the future games)

Modifié par Nonoru, 07 février 2011 - 05:26 .

[Elite Midget]

That may be true but you find it far harder to call out Religions due to Fanatics that twist the original ideals to their liking. Especialy those that have a hand in a station of power. Pretty sure the ones those that wrote the Bible weren't expecting hatred between it and other groups to this day.

Modifié par Elite Midget, 07 février 2011 - 05:31 .