163 réponses à ce sujet

[Valdan777]

Which one is a better choice and why? At first I was thinking viper but then I realized that even at close range it kills things like scions faster to hip fire a viper then it does a shotgun and sniper rifles don't get range multipliers. But the mattock does get the range multiplier and I'm wondering if it would turn out to be a overall more effective choice?

[Kronner]

If I had to pick (lesser evil), I'd take Mattock for sure - does more damage and has almost no recoil.

Modifié par Kronner, 09 août 2010 - 07:21 .

[Thatguy38]

I'd have to agree. The mattock overall is the superior rifle. It is basically a sniper rifle without the zoom function, plus it holds more ammo, 64 rounds as opposed to the viper's 48.

[MadCat221]

Assault rifles are better general-purpose guns, and are better impromptu short-range weapons than sniper rifles.  A good gun to soften targets up at range, and then switch to the shotgun and charge in for the kill.  If someone wanders too close, it works a lot better in a pinch at short range than a sniper rifle.

You're a Vanguard, not an Infiltrator.

Modifié par MadCat221, 09 août 2010 - 08:50 .

[OniGanon]

Viper has more effective ammo than Mattock (less ammo, but more damage per shot).



Viper is the better choice IMO. The times where you cannot or would not Charge are usually also the times that would best benefit from a scope.

[MadCat221]

Does the Viper have "fires as fast as you can pull the trigger" semi-auto fire rate?

According to the Wiki, the Mattock has the edge on RPM, which gives it a definite edge in DPS.  327.6 DPS for the Viper, versus 630 DPS for the Mattock.

And, as stated earlier, it works better in a pinch up close.

Mattock is still a better choice for Vanguard.

Modifié par MadCat221, 10 août 2010 - 03:22 .

[termokanden]

No, the Viper has a much more limited rate of fire. However, the Mattock pretty much requires Adrenaline Rush to reach its max RoF and thereby the max theoretical DPS.

I haven't seen any calculations so far that use realistic numbers and factor in the 50% extra headshot damage from the Viper.

In the end it doesn't make a big difference. For a vanguard, I would personally choose the Viper. I am a big fan of the Mattock, but I find that it runs out of ammo too fast if I don't use Adrenaline Rush. The Viper may have slightly less ROUNDS, but it deals much more damage per shot.

By the way, I am skeptical of those numbers. Aren't all other DPS figures on the wiki with reload times considered as well? You have to reload the Mattock every 2 seconds or so with the max RoF so you'd need to factor that in as well.

Modifié par termokanden, 10 août 2010 - 03:30 .

[Relix28]

One word: Claymore.



End of discussion.

[MadCat221]

I did those DPS calculations on my own. Damage per shot times RPM divided by 60 seconds per minute. The Mattock fires as fast as you can tap the trigger.

[termokanden]

Yeah that's my point. How fast CAN you tap the trigger. I seem to remember reading on these boards that you can't tap the trigger fast enough to reach Mattock's RPM without Adrenaline Rush.



And then there's still my point about reload times. I seem to remember them being factored into the other DPS figures, so you can't compare if you don't do that.



I am skeptical because I simply can't accept that the Mattock should be doing twice the DPS of the Viper. Just doesn't look right, and neither does 630 DPS. That's insane

[JaegerBane]

Valdan777 wrote...

Which one is a better choice and why? At first I was thinking viper but then I realized that even at close range it kills things like scions faster to hip fire a viper then it does a shotgun and sniper rifles don't get range multipliers. But the mattock does get the range multiplier and I'm wondering if it would turn out to be a overall more effective choice?

I think I would argue in favour of the Mattock. Like the Viper, it offers a potent long range attack that can deal unholy punishment out a rapid rate.

Unlike the Viper, it's also quite effective up close thanks to it's potential rate of fire and damage per shot.

An arsenal of Phalanx, Locust, Scimitar and Mattock should see you through most admirably.

[jwalker]

I agree. Before Firepower pack, always took the SR training with my vanguard for a more versatile Shepard. Next time, it'll be AR.



The Mattock is very accurate and works great at close range (unlike the viper), eg, when you're in a bad situation and switching weapons it's not an option or your shotty ran out ammo.

[AntiChri5]

Mattock, for sure.

[Njorls]

Just went back to my last Vanguard playthrough where I took the Viper and took the Mattock instead. Both are effective but the no zoom in when using powers while using the Viper makes the Mattock a more fun choice IMHO.

[Alamar2078]

I like the Viper on my Vanguard just because I'm more apt to want to use them at extreme range so the Viper works well for me.



Note: The Mattock is a beast so I wouldn't underrate it.

[Gumbeaux Jr]

Relix28 wrote...

One word: Claymore.

End of discussion.

Ha ha.  However, the Eviscerator and Mattock make one helluva no-scope combo.  Two of the best firing from the hip guns in the game!

[OniGanon]

While it's certainly a terrible way of using it, the Viper does tear things apart at close rage as well. It's not like you're suddenly helpless if a Husk sneaked up on you or something.

[yuckygeo]

Can I ask why someone would take something other than the Claymore as a Vanguard? I'm on my first Vanguard playthrough and I can't wait to get that thing, even if I suck with it.

[JGDD]

yuckygeo wrote...

Can I ask why someone would take something other than the Claymore as a Vanguard? I'm on my first Vanguard playthrough and I can't wait to get that thing, even if I suck with it.

Rate of fire is terrible. On harder difficulty levels you can get owned in a hurry if not careful.

[Relix28]

justgimmedudedammit wrote...

yuckygeo wrote...

Can I ask why someone would take something other than the Claymore as a Vanguard? I'm on my first Vanguard playthrough and I can't wait to get that thing, even if I suck with it.

Rate of fire is terrible. On harder difficulty levels you can get owned in a hurry if not careful.

I always take the Claymore. It bring's some challenge and it's incredibly satisfying when you one shot a collector with a full barrier on hardcore/insanity. Plus it's practically built for Vanguards, since most of your kills after a charge are @ point blank, and that's where the Claymore shines the most.
Offcourse the Eviscerator is also very effective, has better range and it's much easier to use overall, but as I said, nothing is as safisfying as a point blank one shot kill from the Claymore.


As a sidenote for anyone who wants to/is using a Claymore. Learn the reload trick, it's not that hard really.
Here's a vid showcasing the increased fire rate you get for using the reload trick.
Enjoy

Modifié par Relix28, 12 août 2010 - 12:36 .

[PseudoEthnic]

The Claymore makes things more challenging, and I love it!

[yuckygeo]

Relix28 wrote...

justgimmedudedammit wrote...

yuckygeo wrote...

Can I ask why someone would take something other than the Claymore as a Vanguard? I'm on my first Vanguard playthrough and I can't wait to get that thing, even if I suck with it.

Rate of fire is terrible. On harder difficulty levels you can get owned in a hurry if not careful.

I always take the Claymore. It bring's some challenge and it's incredibly satisfying when you one shot a collector with a full barrier on hardcore/insanity. Plus it's practically built for Vanguards, since most of your kills after a charge are @ point blank, and that's where the Claymore shines the most.
Offcourse the Eviscerator is also very effective, has better range and it's much easier to use overall, but as I said, nothing is as safisfying as a point blank one shot kill from the Claymore.


As a sidenote for anyone who wants to/is using a Claymore. Learn the reload trick, it's not that hard really.
Here's a vid showcasing the increased fire rate you get for using the reload trick.
Enjoy

Thanks for the info.  I get owned pretty often anyway since I'm pretty bad using Charge. 

[sinosleep]

Viper IMO, if you're going to be using a shotty as your primary then ammo is a non-issue. Not only that but again, if the shotty is your primary then what ever other weapons you use will be used from range as well, where a scope comes in handy.

[Skyblade012]

The Mattock overpowers pretty much every other weapon in the game. Stat-wise, it shares the closest similarity to the Viper Sniper rifle. It just has improved damage, ammo, rate of fire, stability, and accuracy. The trade off is a scope. The scope isn't worth that much, grab the Mattock.

[OniGanon]

Mattock has less effective ammo than the Viper. It has less damage than the Viper. It has higher DPS but only if you're rapid firing it, and a Vanguard doesn't have Adrenaline Rush to make that 12 mouse clicks a second so easily achievable (you have to exceed 6 clicks per second to beat the Viper).

Modifié par OniGanon, 12 août 2010 - 02:28 .