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[wildannie]

 Okay, here's my entry - Zevran's Ranger Lesson.



Hopefully a clearer version can be seen here wildannie.deviantart.com/art/Ranger-181642784

@payroo, I love your take on Zevran the Ranger, he looks very pleased with himself.

I've not read any of the entries yet... will do that tomorrow!

[dbfandillyjam]

ejoslin wrote...

dbfandillyjam wrote...

He also doesn't trust anyone (wisely) so I don't see him becoming a devoted family man, or doing anything mundane really.

I think Zev would be a good father.  Just because he has a family doesn't nessesarrally mean his life would become mundane. 

I think he would be a good father as well -- and he does say he wouldn't mind having a child with the (fem) warden.  HOWEVER, that's with the warden.  I don't see anyone else getting close to him like that.  I know, I know, but still, I just don't see it. 

Yes I see your point, and I agree.  I could see him act as a father figure to the young crows if he were to take over however.  I can see him changing the way they worked.  This is if the warden didn't do the US though.

[Sarah1281]

@wildannie: Yeah, it's probably for the best he started with the wolf, huh?

[maradeux]

jenovan wrote...
@mara, nicely done!  I imagine it sounds nicer in German, but I have no idea how it'd all be pronounced...

With this I can help.

[wildannie]

Sarah1281 wrote...

@wildannie: Yeah, it's probably for the best he started with the wolf, huh?

hmm... sticking to the creatures available in game I definitely think the wolf is the best place to start... but I like dogs and had a very wolf-like dog myself once upon a time...so i'm certainly biased.

[Creature 1]

dbfandillyjam wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

dbfandillyjam wrote...

He also doesn't trust anyone (wisely) so I don't see him becoming a devoted family man, or doing anything mundane really.

I think Zev would be a good father.  Just because he has a family doesn't nessesarrally mean his life would become mundane. 

I think he would be a good father as well -- and he does say he wouldn't mind having a child with the (fem) warden.  HOWEVER, that's with the warden.  I don't see anyone else getting close to him like that.  I know, I know, but still, I just don't see it. 

Yes I see your point, and I agree.  I could see him act as a father figure to the young crows if he were to take over however.  I can see him changing the way they worked.  This is if the warden didn't do the US though.

If he took over the Crows??  The Crows can't be run like that, the recruits have to be disposable.  Which is why it sucks if he goes back. 

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Corker wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

I think if you let Zevran go early (either when you first meet, or after you kill Taliesen), he gets away from the Crows forever.

This here is my area of interest.  What does not-Crow, not-Warden trainer Zevran do with the rest of his life?  Freelance assassin and roguish lover?  Captain of the Kirkwall Guard and devoted father of three?  First mate on the Siren's Call?  Killed in a freak accident involving three blond(e)s, two bottles of legacy White Shear, and a falling harpsichord?

Zevran does say early on that he can't see himself doing anything else but assassination, and that he has thought about going into business himself far away from the Crows. He also says he enjoys what he does, he knows he's really good at it, and he'd be pleased to continue doing so if he can.

That suggests freelance assassin, initially at least, and maybe something more/better will come of that.

If you choose to stay in Denerim after the coronation and he leaves, he expresses an interest in travelling, meeting new people and 'robbing a few of them blind'. On that sense, I think he just wants to experience life without a cage, being able to go where he wants and do as he pleases.

[Corker]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

That suggests freelance assassin, initially at least, and maybe something more/better will come of that.

That might work.  I thought about 'freelance assassin' and wondered how well that would work, long-term.  You don't mess with the Crows (or the Mob, or the Yakuza, or any other organized crime ring) because you can't get them all, and the survivors will make you pay.  One guy, goin' round killing people, no backup?  Long-term career prospects do not look good to me.

[ejoslin]

Corker wrote...

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

That suggests freelance assassin, initially at least, and maybe something more/better will come of that.

That might work.  I thought about 'freelance assassin' and wondered how well that would work, long-term.  You don't mess with the Crows (or the Mob, or the Yakuza, or any other organized crime ring) because you can't get them all, and the survivors will make you pay.  One guy, goin' round killing people, no backup?  Long-term career prospects do not look good to me.

There's lots of mercenary groups in Ferelden alone.  Then you have the Orlesian bards, which are probably far worse than the Antivan crows (Crows murder, Bards murder, torture, whatever it takes). Freelance assassin is probably ok, unless the crows hear about him.

Modifié par ejoslin, 06 octobre 2010 - 12:07 .

[Corker]

Right, but those are all groups. Somebody's got your back. Even the bards have a noble as a patron.



...I guess when I hear "freelance," I think "solo." But I suppose it could also mean that he hires on with various groups until he gets bored or double-crossed.

[Aroihkin]

In my personal head-canon, non-Crow Master and non-LI Zevran becomes a pirate. Arrr!

In all seriousness I could see it. He's already buddies with Isabella. It's a life of travel, shiny metal objects, loot, and being hard to track down!



Although he'd be a very clean pirate. Or, like some folks said, he goes on to assassinate people as not-a-Crow...

Or both.

Modifié par Aroihkin, 06 octobre 2010 - 12:44 .

[Tellervo]

Aroihkin wrote...

In my personal head-canon, non-Crow Master and non-LI Zevran becomes a pirate. Arrr!

In all seriousness I could see it. He's already buddies with Isabella. It's a life of travel, shiny metal objects, loot, and being hard to track down!

This.  Despite what I will end up writing in my fanfic (and it's already planned), Cadryn *actually* dies by slipping in the bathtub and cracking his skull a couple of years after Zevran comes back from Antiva.  Zev shacks up with Isabella.  The end.  So, a lone Zev going pirate?  Absolutely.

Modifié par Tellervo, 06 octobre 2010 - 01:08 .

[tankgirly]

No this is not a contest entry. Just a post on some Zev goodness I did a while back

Modifié par tankgirly, 06 octobre 2010 - 01:04 .

[dbfandillyjam]

Creature 1 wrote...

dbfandillyjam wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

dbfandillyjam wrote...

He also doesn't trust anyone (wisely) so I don't see him becoming a devoted family man, or doing anything mundane really.

I think Zev would be a good father.  Just because he has a family doesn't nessesarrally mean his life would become mundane. 

I think he would be a good father as well -- and he does say he wouldn't mind having a child with the (fem) warden.  HOWEVER, that's with the warden.  I don't see anyone else getting close to him like that.  I know, I know, but still, I just don't see it. 

Yes I see your point, and I agree.  I could see him act as a father figure to the young crows if he were to take over however.  I can see him changing the way they worked.  This is if the warden didn't do the US though.

If he took over the Crows??  The Crows can't be run like that, the recruits have to be disposable.  Which is why it sucks if he goes back. 

I was refering to the physical, mental , emotional and possible sexual abuses that the young ones went through.  I doubt he would allow it to happen if he became head of The Crows.

[ejoslin]

dbfandillyjam wrote...

Creature 1 wrote...

If he took over the Crows??  The Crows can't be run like that, the recruits have to be disposable.  Which is why it sucks if he goes back. 

I was refering to the physical, mental , emotional and possible sexual abuses that the young ones went through.  I doubt he would allow it to happen if he became head of The Crows.

I think he would have no choice.  The system works and it's the system he knows.  The recruits who survive are very proud of that.  He does describe horrific stuff very nonchalantly.  

That's why it bothers me so much that that ending became most likely canon.  Because how the crows recruit and train is so horrible.  I can see it if he cracks.  Everything good about him dies.  But with a living warden he's in love with?  I just don't see it.  

Edit: Deleted much of the quoted stuff.

Modifié par ejoslin, 06 octobre 2010 - 01:25 .

[Creature 1]

dbfandillyjam wrote...
I was refering to the physical,  mental , emotional and possible sexual abuses that the young ones went through.  I doubt he would allow it to happen if he became head of The Crows.

I agree with ejoslin.  The Crows work because they take in so many recruits and then abuse them so horribly that few survive.  The ones that do make it become some of the most skilled, ruthless assassins in Thedas.  And even then they are treated as commodities.

How would you train a child recruit as an assassin otherwise?  "Stab that person now . . . you won't?  Go to your room!" 

Edit:  I am quote challenged.  

Modifié par Creature 1, 06 octobre 2010 - 01:45 .

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

ejoslin wrote...

dbfandillyjam wrote...

Creature 1 wrote...

If he took over the Crows??  The Crows can't be run like that, the recruits have to be disposable.  Which is why it sucks if he goes back. 

I was refering to the physical, mental , emotional and possible sexual abuses that the young ones went through.  I doubt he would allow it to happen if he became head of The Crows.

I think he would have no choice.  The system works and it's the system he knows.  The recruits who survive are very proud of that.  He does describe horrific stuff very nonchalantly.  

That's why it bothers me so much that that ending became most likely canon.  Because how the crows recruit and train is so horrible.  I can see it if he cracks.  Everything good about him dies.  But with a living warden he's in love with?  I just don't see it. 

The 'rumour' and 'some say' wording of the epilogue slides give us some leeway, I think. I'm still fond of the idea that Zev and LI Warden *do* take on the Crows, but rather than take over they strike a deal: Zev gets to walk free, and the guild lets it be known he is a Crow again so their reputation won't be damaged and he won't be hunted. Considering it's a bit hard to hide the fact Zev + Warden handed their asses to them, they also allow a rumour that he's the new leader (which, as an added bonus to the Crows, can protect the identity of the actual guildmaster).

With or without an LI by his side, I can't see taking over the Crows to be a good thing. I can't even see Zev wanting to be in charge, unless the Warden encourages it. :/

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Creature 1 wrote...

How would you train a child recruit as an assassin otherwise?  "Stab that person now . . . you won't?  Go to your room!"  [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/wondering.png[/smilie]

I 'm not convinced that there's actual *severe* physical abuse involved with child recruits. Zevran says that if you do poorly in your training you die, he says young recruits are packed into tiny communal apartments, but he never speaks of abuse or pain conditioning. Don't we only see torture in his Circle dream (presumably when he's older)?

Removal of necessities could work. Hunger and thirst can be a powerful motivator, and treating food/drink as a reward (Pavlov's Response, anyone?) is good training for the contract system they will face as Crows, where the fully qualified assassinsonly get paid once the contracts they bid for are completed. They don't
have an income, and it's possible they have to buy their own food rather
than live off a Master's largesse as motivation to work.

*mulls*

[ejoslin]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

Creature 1 wrote...

How would you train a child recruit as an assassin otherwise?  "Stab that person now . . . you won't?  Go to your room!"  [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/wondering.png[/smilie]

I 'm not convinced that there's actual *severe* physical abuse involved with child recruits. Zevran says that if you do poorly in your training you die, he says young recruits are packed into tiny communal apartments, but he never speaks of abuse or pain conditioning. Don't we only see torture in his Circle dream (presumably when he's older)?

Removal of necessities could work. Hunger and thirst can be a powerful motivator, and treating food/drink as a reward (Pavlov's Response, anyone?) is good training for the contract system they will face as Crows, where the fully qualified assassinsonly get paid once the contracts they bid for are completed. They don't
have an income, and it's possible they have to buy their own food rather
than live off a Master's largesse as motivation to work.

*mulls*

He mentions torture as well -- it's at the beginning of his first story if you tell him you want to hear about his life as the crows.  Here's the conversation with VO notes:

Warden: I meant your time as a Crow.
Zevran: You mean you want to hear about the grueling training? Being locked in an oubliette for weeks at a time? The slavery? The festering injuries? Or are we seeking something more glamorous? (wry wit)
Warden: Was it really so terrible?
Zevran: Oh those things never happened to me. (he's joking -- and lying, as they certainly did)

He was taught, at the very least, ****house massage techniques before he was 7.  He also talks about getting the occasional beating in the ****house. 

Edit: It does not say how old he was when his training begun, but I would imagine if they buy recruits at 7, they have some sort of training right from the start.  And that it is very, very harsh.  It makes no sense to NOT cull out the weaker recruits immediately.

Modifié par ejoslin, 06 octobre 2010 - 02:13 .

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

ejoslin wrote...

He mentions torture as well -- it's at the beginning of his first story if you tell him you want to hear about his life as the crows.  Here's the conversation with VO notes:

Warden: I meant your time as a Crow.
Zevran: You mean you want to hear about the grueling training? Being locked in an oubliette for weeks at a time? The slavery? The festering injuries? Or are we seeking something more glamorous? (wry wit)
Warden: Was it really so terrible?
Zevran: Oh those things never happened to me. (he's joking -- and lying, as they certainly did)

Ahhh...thanks. I need to look more closely at the toolset dialogue--especially the writer notes.

Maybe I'm just arguing semantics, but besides the psychological torture of the oubliette, his comments on gruelling training and festering injuries may not be a result of torture. It sounds *torturous*, but it's not said there's whippings, beatings, sessions on the rack etc (or rather while he was a child)...though perhaps that can all come under the heading of slavery. And 'discipline'.

Edit: It does not say how old he was when his training begun, but I would imagine if they buy recruits at 7, they have some sort of training right from the start.  And that it is very, very harsh.  It makes no sense to NOT cull out the weaker recruits immediately.

That makes sense. Zevran says he was 'all skin and bones' (IIRC?) and didn't know anything about daggers when he was recruited, so he'd have had to toughen up and learn pretty fast if young recruits are pushed to excel right from the beginning. :/

[Hilde]

This is a non entry for the weekly prompt: Rogue Specializations: Bard, Ranger, Duelist, Shadow, Legionnaire Scout

As it took nearly 70 minutes to complete and edit. The intro is a bit...descriptive, I was not certain what is forum safe so I posted it here to read.

Time Together

Modifié par Hilde, 06 octobre 2010 - 02:45 .

[Creature 1]

ejoslin wrote...
Edit: It does not say how old he was when his training begun, but I would imagine if they buy recruits at 7, they have some sort of training right from the start.  And that it is very, very harsh.  It makes no sense to NOT cull out the weaker recruits immediately.

In my horribly depressing and probably destined to remain incomplete prequel fic the Crows handle failed recruits in the most efficient way possible, chaining them to the wall and having another recruit stab them to death for practice.  Zevran gets beaten when he freezes up, at least the first two times. 

So yeah, not liking the idea of him running the organization. 

[Hilde]

@ Sarah ~ I like the banter between Leliana and Zevran. You caught her voice well.

@ICevol ~ The protectiveness of Kai is so very sweet! I love the knowing eyecontact Zevran gives the spider at the fireside, I did not see it coming but loved the idea at the end! Nice touch!

@ Korina ~ I cannot tell you how much I love the first song being a flirty action by Zevran. I had the biggest smile on my face at the end!

@Payroo ~ I love this. Zevran looks so carefree with a lute in his arms!

@Halae Dral ~ I really enjoyed the take on the interaction of learning the duelist specialization.

@Soignee ~  I love the interaction and strength of Vardel. He obviously sets the tone of the entire camps actions.

@ Wildannie ~ That is fantastic. He is that charming though...

@ Corker ~ Anything you can sing along to with the Gilligans Island tune is great, but the song itself, the wording and spirit are superb!

Edit...eek! You would think I could spell....

Modifié par Hilde, 06 octobre 2010 - 03:38 .

[Remmirath]

@jenovan - Thanks! And yeah, you interpreted that right. I really like your non-entry, and I think you did a very good job of describing the various skills.

@soignee - That was great. I really like that interpretation of the ranger. Very different from the 'being nice to all the forest creatures' type, and very dangerous.

@Sarah1281 - Awkward, indeed. 

@Korina1982 - Yep, although at that point he would steadfastly deny anything of the sort.

@ICevoL - Thanks! I think that only happens if you don't have high enough stats to do it on your own, but keep trying anyway. I'm not really sure on that, though.

@Corker - Awesome! You're really good at those songs.

@wildannie - He does seem to have gone a bit over-board on the charm there. XD

@Hilde - Thanks! I like the non-entry. The bard specialisation is not for everyone, it would seem.

[maradeux]

This seems to be the week of silly poems for me. So - here is my entry: Zevran's thoughts about the specializations he would like to learn (or not). I needed about 50 minutes and it is a premier: the first poem I wrote directly in English (alright, there is one French/Italian/Spanish - its in all these languages the same -  adjective included, but I hope it is common enough to understand ) - so it's not a translation this time.
__________________________

An Assassin's Domain

The Bard, when it comes to a fight
starts singing one bright song
It takes him strength, and in that light
I'd prefer staying strong

The Ranger needs a lot of time
to summon wolf or bear
They attack on a certain chime
the opponents to tear

As an Assassin I don't know
why I should learn such crap
Want my abilities to show
to kill my prey or to entrap

A Bard by enemies surrounded
stands still and screams, so everyone
gets numb and wickedly confounded
But how long can he carry on?

Once he is breathless, breaks the spell
all enemies are still alive
If they do know their weapons well
he will get jabbed like in a hive

The Ranger has some bleak prospects
in each interior and floor
For distant fights much too complex
The bear gets stuck in every door

Why should I learn such needless things?
I am the best of all the Crows
Our enemies, beware my wings
and better not come close

The only useful skill to earn
might be the Duelist
I'm glad I had the chance to learn
how to fasten my wrist

The sharpest blade of Llomerryn
has taught me hold and stand
This science appears quite elfin
goes nicely with my hand

So I decide for Duelist.
Just one thing does not let me sleep
Why can't I follow (that's so triste)
My Warden on to Vigil's Keep?

In Amaranthine I could gain
my very favourite spec
The Shadow would be my domain
I'd never give it back.

(edit just for the explanation text above - I swear. )

Modifié par maradeux, 06 octobre 2010 - 09:40 .