39010 réponses à ce sujet

[Reika]

@LadyD - That was very sweet.

@KoP - I thought the lyrium thing wasn't wellknown, but you're right, the templar in Denerim does say it's the lyrium to explain why the other templar isn't right in the head. Yet, I thought Alistair had said the lryium thing was secret, but I'm too lazy to go digging through all the lines in the toolset.

Edit: ToP, crud, could someone else post a picture for me? I don't have anything to post atm.

Modifié par Reika, 30 janvier 2011 - 04:32 .

[LadyDamodred]

You know, don't forget that Alistair is still Maric's son, and Maric may have wanted him far enough away where he wouldn't be tempted to change his mind. The other side of the country is a great way to lessen that temptation.



Thank you, guys!

[errant_knight]

Somebody wrote...

I didnt understand why arl Howe was still alive in Darkspawn Chronicles. Wouldnt Alistair have had to kill him to free Riordan? 

There was an astonishing amount of total bull**** in DSC. It really doesn't hold up under examination, and I don't think that was even part of the consideration.

[Zjarcal]

errant_knight wrote...

Somebody wrote...

I didnt understand why arl Howe was still alive in Darkspawn Chronicles. Wouldnt Alistair have had to kill him to free Riordan? 

There was an astonishing amount of total bull**** in DSC. It really doesn't hold up under examination, and I don't think that was even part of the consideration.

Yeah, trying to make logic out of the things depicted in that DLC is futile. It's a stupid DLC where the main selling point is "Kill your companions!!".

If only I hadn't created a thread to talk about how great it was after only playing it for five minutes... 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Reika wrote...
@KoP - I thought the lyrium thing wasn't wellknown, but you're right, the templar in Denerim does say it's the lyrium to explain why the other templar isn't right in the head. Yet, I thought Alistair had said the lryium thing was secret, but I'm too lazy to go digging through all the lines in the toolset.

Codex: "The templars' power derives from the substance lyrium, a mineral
believed to be the raw element of creation. While mages use lyrium in
their arcane spells and rituals, templars ingest the primordial mineral
to enhance their abilities to resist and dispel magic. Lyrium use is
regulated by the Chantry, but some templars suffer from lyrium
addiction, the effects of which include paranoia, obsession, and
dementia. Templars knowingly submit themselves to this "treatment" in
the service of the Order and the Maker.
"

It's known.

[Commander of the Grey]

Just worked a 12 hour shift so I'm beat but I had to check in and see what had gone on in my absence.



Amazing prompt responses everyone!

[KnightofPhoenix]

LadyDamodred wrote...

You know, don't forget that Alistair is still Maric's son, and Maric may have wanted him far enough away where he wouldn't be tempted to change his mind. The other side of the country is a great way to lessen that temptation.

Fair enough. Still doesn't justify giving him to Eamon. Giving him up to a freeholder family would have been adequate.

If Maric, who supposedely wanted to keep an eye out for Alistair, could do so when he was in the Chantry (and I wonder how seeing how Eamon stopped going there), I fail to see why he couldn't do the same with Alsitair in a small freeholder family somewhere in Ferelden.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 janvier 2011 - 04:43 .

[_Somebody]

Yeah, its known. The mage collective for one knows about it. Do you guys give the lyrium to the dirty templar btw or to the good one in Denerim? 

Modifié par Somebody, 30 janvier 2011 - 04:43 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Somebody wrote...

Yeah, its known. The mage collective for one knows about it. Do you guys give the lyrium to the dirty templar btw or to the good one in Denerim? 

Since the "good" Templar happens to be an enemy of the collective that I deem vital to my interests, I go for the dirty one.

[LadyDamodred]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...

You know, don't forget that Alistair is still Maric's son, and Maric may have wanted him far enough away where he wouldn't be tempted to change his mind. The other side of the country is a great way to lessen that temptation.

Fair enough. Still doesn't justify giving him to Eamon. Giving him up to a freeholder family would have been adequate.

If Maric, who supposexely wanted to keep an eye out for Alistair, could do so when he was in the Chantry (and I wonder how seeing how Eamon stopped going there), I fail to see why he couldnt' do the same with Alsitair in a small freeholder family.

Well, my general take on it is that Maric trusted Eamon to do the right thing.  We don't know the details involved, but I think Eamon proably promised Maric that the boy would be raised a normal commoner.  Obviously, that's not what happened.  I also think Maric chose not to know too many details beyond the infrequent reports Duncan brought or what Eamon might have said.

[_Somebody]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Somebody wrote...

Yeah, its known. The mage collective for one knows about it. Do you guys give the lyrium to the dirty templar btw or to the good one in Denerim? 

Since the "good" Templar happens to be an enemy of the collective that I deem vital to my interests, I go for the dirty one.

Well by good I meant the by the books guy. I dont agree with the chantry and their phobia of mages, but there was something about that other templar in Redcliff... I didnt trust him.

[Briiel]

Lady D , I loved that , that's how I always see Alistair acting around my warden .It was very cute !

[errant_knight]

Zjarcal wrote...

errant_knight wrote...

Somebody wrote...

I didnt understand why arl Howe was still alive in Darkspawn Chronicles. Wouldnt Alistair have had to kill him to free Riordan? 

There was an astonishing amount of total bull**** in DSC. It really doesn't hold up under examination, and I don't think that was even part of the consideration.

Yeah, trying to make logic out of the things depicted in that DLC is futile. It's a stupid DLC where the main selling point is "Kill your companions!!".

If only I hadn't created a thread to talk about how great it was after only playing it for five minutes... 

Oooo, ouch! I'm feeling sympathy chagrin right now....

[KnightofPhoenix]

LadyDamodred wrote...
Well, my general take on it is that Maric trusted Eamon to do the right thing.  We don't know the details involved, but I think Eamon proably promised Maric that the boy would be raised a normal commoner.  Obviously, that's not what happened.  I also think Maric chose not to know too many details beyond the infrequent reports Duncan brought or what Eamon might have said.

That goes contrary to what Addai is saying, that Maric kept an eye on him. If he did, then what he did was a bit stupid and very avoidable.

Your potrayal of Maric also doesn't make him sound intelligent (and it's not unlikely). Even Maric was like "wtf" when Eamon married an Orlesian. Is he positevely sure that Eamon is the noble he can trust the most? Did he not think ahead and see that the Gueirrins might feel alienated by the sudden rise of the Mac Tirs, who could be seen as upstarts? Not only do the Mac Tirs control one of two Ternirs, but they also have a Queen. What did the Gueirrins get after years of service and sacrifice?
That just sounds like a recipee for disaster.

I personally think that Maric, not quite sure how to deal with this, was being played around by Eamon and Loghain.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 janvier 2011 - 04:54 .

[Giggles_Manically]

I think that some people just dont want to admit that Maric was a terrible father.



Cailan is a moron, and Alistair was well left out in the cold.

Really Fereldan Children's Services should have knocked at his door.

[LadyDamodred]

So what if it's contrary to what Addai said? We don't know what was really going on or why. Until DG says, everything we say here is pure speculation. I was agrreing with her for saying Eamon isn't the worst choice and there were reasons why Maric would have chosen him.



And we have beaten the fact that people do not always think logically to death and into the ground. This is especially true when it concerns their children. I have no idea how painful it is to find out you have a child, only be able to have it for a few days, and then have to give it up knowing that you can never be a family.



What would have been worse for Maric? Knowing a lot of details about the son he can never be with, or just trying to make sure the boy can have a good life and then trying to move on with his own. I don't think he was unintelligent, but he was an emotional person, and that response seems perfectly reasonable to me.



And maybe he was being played by Eamon and Loghain. We don't know. Personally, I don't think Loghain had anything to do with what Eamon did. As for Maric looking ahead, why would he think the Guerrins would feel alienated? He married one, made her his queen, and her son inherits the throne. He knows Loghain doesn't give a damn about titles except as a means to an end, and Eamon appeared to have a position of influence. Why would he be looking for trouble there?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I think that some people just dont want to admit that Maric was a terrible father.

Cailan is a moron, and Alistair was well left out in the cold.
Really Fereldan Children's Services should have knocked at his door.

If we take the past 3-4 generations and Calenhad, then moments of stupidity, immaturity and childishness are pretty common in the Therein line.

[LadyDamodred]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I think that some people just dont want to admit that Maric was a terrible father.

Cailan is a moron, and Alistair was well left out in the cold.
Really Fereldan Children's Services should have knocked at his door.

He was.  In Mistakes, I have him flat out admit that he screwed up big time and failed his children.  I do think he tried more after he got back from the Deep Roads, but there were still issues.  One being that a lot of the damage to Cailan was already done, and another that I don't think he knew how to be a good parent.  He didn't really have any examples.  Had Rowan lived, I think things would have been very different.

[_Somebody]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I think that some people just dont want to admit that Maric was a terrible father.

Cailan is a moron, and Alistair was well left out in the cold.
Really Fereldan Children's Services should have knocked at his door.

Cailan wasnt that bad, he just wanted to match up to his father. I liked the guy.

[LadyDamodred]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I think that some people just dont want to admit that Maric was a terrible father.

Cailan is a moron, and Alistair was well left out in the cold.
Really Fereldan Children's Services should have knocked at his door.

If we take the past 3-4 generations and Calenhad, then moments of stupidity, immaturity and childishness are pretty common in the Therein line.

Shockingly, this is true of nearly every human being on the planet.

[_Somebody]

LadyDamodred wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I think that some people just dont want to admit that Maric was a terrible father.

Cailan is a moron, and Alistair was well left out in the cold.
Really Fereldan Children's Services should have knocked at his door.

If we take the past 3-4 generations and Calenhad, then moments of stupidity, immaturity and childishness are pretty common in the Therein line.

Shockingly, this is true of nearly every human being on the planet.

Queen Moira wasnt like that though, was she? 

[Briiel]

hey !! Im not immature and childish !!! *pouts* I kid I kid !



I really need to read the books, I feel like I'm always missing something

[KnightofPhoenix]

LadyDamodred wrote...
And we have beaten the fact that people do not always think logically to death and into the ground. This is especially true when it concerns their children. I have no idea how painful it is to find out you have a child, only be able to have it for a few days, and then have to give it up knowing that you can never be a family.

I wouldn't have been careless enough to father an illegitimate child when I am king.
Unless I lvie in a society where such things don't matter, for instance if it's very patriarchal and the mother of the child doesnt' really matter.

LadyDamodred wrote...
What would have been worse for Maric? Knowing a lot of details about the son he can never be with, or just trying to make sure the boy can have a good life and then trying to move on with his own. I don't think he was unintelligent, but he was an emotional person, and that response seems perfectly reasonable to me.

I really fail to see how emotional has to mean not stupid for you. Sometimes it isn't stupid. Sometimes it is.

LadyDamodred wrote...
And maybe he was being played by Eamon and Loghain. We don't know. Personally, I don't think Loghain had anything to do with what Eamon did. As for Maric looking ahead, why would he think the Guerrins would feel alienated? He married one, made her his queen, and her son inherits the throne. He knows Loghain doesn't give a damn about titles except as a means to an end, and Eamon appeared to have a position of influence. Why would he be looking for trouble there?

Rowan was dead at the time. What did the Gueirrins get besides that? Cailan is on the throne solely because he is a Therein, Rowan being his mother is inconsequential seeing how she is dead. If she was still alive, then that would have been a different scenario. 

So the ones to carry the most influence on Cailan was naturally going to be Anora and her father. Heck, Eamon apparently always knew that Anora was always two steps ahead of the boy. And Loghain may decide that keeping Eamon away and centralizing power is also a means to an end, that's pretty irrlevent. The titles gave Loghain tremendous power, even if it's not something he lusts over.

So all things considered, yes Maric was very careless. You don't give a weapon like that to a family that has a strong chance of feeling alienated, especially when you die. He made a gross miscalculation and him being emotional does not absolve him from being unintelligent. Understandable sure, but unintelligent.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 janvier 2011 - 05:23 .

[LadyDamodred]

Somebody wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...
I think that some people just dont want to admit that Maric was a terrible father.

Cailan is a moron, and Alistair was well left out in the cold.
Really Fereldan Children's Services should have knocked at his door.

If we take the past 3-4 generations and Calenhad, then moments of stupidity, immaturity and childishness are pretty common in the Therein line.

Shockingly, this is true of nearly every human being on the planet.

Queen Moira wasnt like that though, was she? 

It depends how you look at it.  From Maric's memories of Moira, she was a very forceful personality, perhaps even manic and reckless to a degree.  You could say the way she coddled Maric was stupid, or not very forward thinking.

But...everyone does that.  Everyone does things that in hindsight they recognize were completely idiotic or immature or childish.

[KnightofPhoenix]

LadyDamodred wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I think that some people just dont want to admit that Maric was a terrible father.

Cailan is a moron, and Alistair was well left out in the cold.
Really Fereldan Children's Services should have knocked at his door.

If we take the past 3-4 generations and Calenhad, then moments of stupidity, immaturity and childishness are pretty common in the Therein line.

Shockingly, this is true of nearly every human being on the planet.

Different scales.
Some are more childish and immature than others.