39010 réponses à ce sujet

[KnightofPhoenix]

For what it's worth, I do not think Alistair is whiny. Oghren is whiny and he is awesome.

He often fails to express his opinion properly and logically,  and makes it personal when it shouldn't. But that's not whining imo.

Anyways gtg, cheers!

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 04 février 2011 - 06:00 .

[Elysis]

 Actually you're right KoP (don't say "I'm always right!" or I'll have to MorrigAlistair you!) - Alistair isn't whiny, or duty minded, he's just extremely subjective about everything and will only fight for what he believes in. And yet, disappears if not made King and Loghain spared.

As for the LM, he should have stayed. To not let Anora the shrew be queen ; To accomplish what a Grey Warden is suppose to accomplish : end the Blight ; To stay by his fellow Grey Warden & Lover.
I adore Alistair, but when it comes to the LM, I say he is being excruciatingly childish. It's like seeing a child stomping his feet to get what he wants.
But, I can understand where he's coming from. What Loghain did, deserves punishment, and seeing him becoming a Grey Warden (which is a great honor) and ending the Blight, is probably too unbareable.

Annnd I'm turning into circles and not saying anything interesting.
le sigh.

Modifié par Elysis, 04 février 2011 - 06:08 .

[Giggles_Manically]

I dont consider joining the wardens to be a great honor.



Hell Duncan recruits the DN, DC, Mage, and DE simply to save their life.

[Gilsa]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I dont consider joining the wardens to be a great honor.

Hell Duncan recruits the DN, DC, Mage, and DE simply to save their life.

What the hell, no! DC IS AWESOME AND BAD ASS AND BEAT ALL THE WARRIORS IN FRONT OF THE ENTIRE PROVINGS. There is no pity party for DC. It is a "you are teh awesome and I want you in my army."

But yeah, I'll concede on the DN. He's doing a favor for an old friend by saving the life of his kid.

Don't pick on the DC!

[Thor Rand Al]

I know this has nothing to do with Alistair but this pic I had to post.  Dog wins all




He's definitely giving his 2-bits of how he feels about Arl Howe .  You go dog.

[Yankee23]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

I know this has nothing to do with Alistair but this pic I had to post.  Dog wins all
[snip]
He's definitely giving his 2-bits of how he feels about Arl Howe .  You go dog.

That is AWESOME!!!!!!!

Modifié par Yankee23, 04 février 2011 - 06:38 .

[Briiel]

ROFL!! That's awesome !!

[Giggles_Manically]

Gilsa wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I dont consider joining the wardens to be a great honor.

Hell Duncan recruits the DN, DC, Mage, and DE simply to save their life.

What the hell, no! DC IS AWESOME AND BAD ASS AND BEAT ALL THE WARRIORS IN FRONT OF THE ENTIRE PROVINGS. There is no pity party for DC. It is a "you are teh awesome and I want you in my army."

But yeah, I'll concede on the DN. He's doing a favor for an old friend by saving the life of his kid.

Don't pick on the DC!

You still would have been killed by all those guards.

[inclemency]

Lol, what a great shot!

[Tigress M]

Great pic, Thor! You should frame that sucker!

[RagingCyclone]

Thor--That.Is.Epic!!!

[Catspaw]

Thor, that's priceless! Head much better now. Hurray for modern pharmacology! ...and Rage's picture.

[Zjarcal]

@Thor



That is the best screenshot EVER!!

[Zjarcal]

Tigress M wrote...

I'm probably going to get beaten up over this, but I have to say it. I don't get why people think Alistair is whiny. Yes, he complains -- thank the Maker! He has opinions and isn't afraid to express them. I learned this more than ever when I played Randi, my diced Warden. She was terrible at picking lines that pissed Alistair off, but his reaction to what she'd said wasn't unreasonable. She was being a B!tch!

I would say it's the inconsistency of his opinions and reactions (at times, not always) that probably annoys people.

I've said it before, but his rant after killing Connor is what annoys me the most about him. His rant after killing Isolde doesn't bother me at all because he was against that option from the very beginning. His decision to leave after sparing Loghain (that is, leave for good, not just the party) is another example of inconsistency in my view.

I don't view him as whiny though, but he does annoy me more than the other companions in this regard.

And no need to don the flamesuit!

[Maria13]

@Thor, how's it go "Mabari dominance has been asserted..."

[ColaQueen]

@errant_knight I was only kidding

As to Alistair:
Well I guess people aren't perfect, or 100% logical in their reactions all the time. >insert reason why him going off in a huff when Loghain is chosen does not really bother me, some people are just unacceptable to you no matter what anyone else says whether it's reasonable, logical, practical or not. We're all complex beings so characters shouldn't always be predicatable in their reactions either if we want to consider them to have any depth and replayability. Which is why sometimes I roll my eyes at things Alistair does or says when I'm trying to be free of micromanaging the dialogue to get the happiest response and instead just go with the roleplay. However, I do think he gets off lightly in certain situations. If that break-up happened in real life, depending on your own personality, you may or may not wish to throw a bit of tantrum yourself and tell him off instead of taking one on the chin for Fereldon. I think the Warden has done a lot of taking one for the team as it is.

In other news: Circenne took him to Denerim today. He's so cute when he's all puppystair outside her house. I always feel like a complete beoch when I tell him that people are messed up get used to it (of course not those exact words) and his little fluffy heart shrank two sizes that day. On the other hand, there is now room for one more in the bed when we go to the Pearl

It does get to me when his eyes go all sadistair talking about dead Grey Wardens

[Tigress M]

Zjarcal wrote...

I would say it's the inconsistency of his opinions and reactions (at times, not always) that probably annoys people.

I've said it before, but his rant after killing Connor is what annoys me the most about him. His rant after killing Isolde doesn't bother me at all because he was against that option from the very beginning. His decision to leave after sparing Loghain (that is, leave for good, not just the party) is another example of inconsistency in my view.

I don't view him as whiny though, but he does annoy me more than the other companions in this regard.

And no need to don the flamesuit!

I agree with you.  His inconsistency annoys me and I love him to death.  Yes it ticks me off when he jumps down your throat for killing Connor since he's the one who suggested it in the first place.  Yes, it pisses me to high hell when he forsakes everything at the LM just because he can't get past Loghain.  Yes, it makes me want to set his clothes on fire when he tries to dump you after the LM.  

But, all of those things make him more "human".  They're things I can see a real person doing.  Real people aren't always consistent or logical or tactful.  Real people b!tch when things don't go their way or they're under a great deal of stress.  Real couples, even real friends, fight; sometimes for completely irrational reasons.  

This may sound really corny, but Alistair is the first PC character that has ever made me cry.  I think that's why I love him so much... not that I'm into pain, but that I got so attached to a character I could be emotionally affected by their actions.  

And Alistair doesn't hold a monopoly on the realism or the emotional purse strings, either.  I just resonate more strongly with him than I do the other characters (although Zevran is coming up a close second in that regard, these days).  

Edit:  semi-'d by Silver.  LOL

Modifié par Tigress M, 04 février 2011 - 09:20 .

[Giggles_Manically]

Gaider writes good characters.



What I found most telling was that Gaider said at one point:

Alistair's hatred of Loghain corrupted him, Like Loghain's hatred of Orlais corrupted him.

[ColaQueen]

Tigress M wrote...

Edit:  semi-'d by Silver.  LOL

That's 'cause awesome minds think alike.

@Giggles that is a very good way of looking at it.

[Zjarcal]

Tigress M wrote...
But, all of those things make him more "human".  They're things I can see a real person doing.  Real people aren't always consistent or logical or tactful.  Real people b!tch when things don't go their way or they're under a great deal of stress.  Real couples, even real friends, fight; sometimes for completely irrational reasons.  

This may sound really corny, but Alistair is the first PC character that has ever made me cry.  I think that's why I love him so much... not that I'm into pain, but that I got so attached to a character I could be emotionally affected by their actions.  

And Alistair doesn't hold a monopoly on the realism or the emotional purse strings, either.  I just resonate more strongly with him than I do the other characters (although Zevran is coming up a close second in that regard, these days).  

Edit:  semi-'d by Silver.  LOL

I never implied that he wasn't human nor that I want perfect flawless characters in the game. Those particular occasions annoy me in the same way they would annoy me in RL. The other characters also have their moments where I want to smack them over the head.

Just last night in the Leliana thread we were discussing the traits or moments of her that annoyed us the most. I listed a couple of moments. And I could do the same for all the other companions.

But as you said, the more you like and identify with a character, the more likely you are to forgive or ignore those flaws, and learn to live with them, just as one would in real life. On the other hand, we may not feel as inclined to forgive or ignore those annoying traits if we don't like the character that much in the first place.

My point was more than anything to respond to your initial post where you mentioned how him not always agreeing with your PC was a good thing, something which I agree with, but that doesn't mean I have to like the character just because he/she stood up to me. It depends.

And there's nothing corny about crying over a character. I have cried to and I can also become extremely attached to them.

Modifié par Zjarcal, 04 février 2011 - 09:46 .

[Giggles_Manically]

I think the moments were a squadmate stand up to the PC are cool ones.



Zaeed and Wrex both became a hell of a lot more awesome for standing up to Shepard but then listening to him.

[ColaQueen]

That's what I like about Sten, because there is no easy way with him. He is always challenging you so just picking the answer that sounds best is usually incorrect.

[Sarah1281]

I never implied that he wasn't human nor that I want perfect flawless characters in the game. Those particular occasions annoy me in the same way they would annoy me in RL. The other characters also have their moments where I want to smack them over the head.

I agree. I don't see why disliking it when someone in a game does something means it must be unrealistic or why realistic reactions always have to mean that they get a pass on whatever they did anymore than everyone IRL would get a pass over whatever THEY do because of how realistic and human their reactions are.

[Giggles_Manically]

SilverSentinel wrote...

That's what I like about Sten, because there is no easy way with him. He is always challenging you so just picking the answer that sounds best is usually incorrect.

I just laughed and laughed when I saw my little fem City Elf beat him up.
She is like half his size and kicked his ass.

[Zjarcal]

SilverSentinel wrote...

That's what I like about Sten, because there is no easy way with him. He is always challenging you so just picking the answer that sounds best is usually incorrect.

I love Sten because he always questions the things he doesn't understand or views as unnecessary. In his case however, I don't find any inconsistencies in what he says or what he complains about, so none of his complaints really annoy me. His episode at Haven is one of my favorite moments in the game because I feel he's entirely right to be questioning the decision to embark on such a stupid quest.

More so, the fact that you don't always have to agree with him for his approval to go up is another plus. I love how sometimes a conversation feels like its headed towards a -50 approval decrease and instead you get a +30 approval increase. Gotta love the Sten.

At any rate, I like it when characters challenge you, so long as they have a strong basis for that challenge.

And before I get accused of ruining the Gush, have some Alistair fanart:



My Bed is Chilly Tonight by nielspeterdejong

Modifié par Zjarcal, 04 février 2011 - 10:17 .