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[Secretlyapotato]

sylvanaerie wrote...


But tell me, doesn't it sonund ridiculous that taint damages fertility? And instead of causing some irreversible damage to other systems it primarly attacks gonads? One would think it would cause mental disorders, maybe disfunctions of other organs too. But no, bodily functions deteriorate over time, and fertility is affected almost instantly.

Well, I don't think it causes certain organs to "fail" first. I do know that irl, someone's diet can directly affect a person's fertility without killing them. And the taint does cause a grey warden to have horrible dreams all the time.

[BevH]

Mr Cloud wrote...

Could you link a site you got info from? I'd like to read it myself.

But tell me, doesn't it sonund ridiculous that taint damages fertility? And instead of causing some irreversible damage to other systems it primarly attacks gonads? One would think it would cause mental disorders, maybe disfunctions of other organs too. But no, bodily functions deteriorate over time, and fertility is affected almost instantly.

As I said, brilliant.

And yes, Alistair would be a friggin awesome dad, I'd take it for granted.

I think most of the information is quotes from David Gaider here on the forums. I seem to remembering him posting somewhere here that under no circumstances would Alistair ever have a child and the line of Calenhad would end with him.

As for the taint affecting fertility, it's a very real possibility, yes. Sperm are rather stupid to begin with; it's why it takes so many of them to fertilize one egg. The taint is a poison that, in my opinion, would tend to make them even more stupid and, over time, would render them useless. But I think the big question here is: was Alistair fertile in the first place? The comments from David Gaider, himself, would seem to indicate that, no, he was not. Which then raises a question in my mind: was Anora truly the one who was infertile?

I, too, think Alistair would have been an awesome father.

[Mr Cloud]

BevH wrote...

I think most of the information is quotes from David Gaider here on the forums. I seem to remembering him posting somewhere here that under no circumstances would Alistair ever have a child and the line of Calenhad would end with him.

As for the taint affecting fertility, it's a very real possibility, yes. Sperm are rather stupid to begin with; it's why it takes so many of them to fertilize one egg. The taint is a poison that, in my opinion, would tend to make them even more stupid and, over time, would render them useless. But I think the big question here is: was Alistair fertile in the first place? The comments from David Gaider, himself, would seem to indicate that, no, he was not. Which then raises a question in my mind: was Anora truly the one who was infertile?

I, too, think Alistair would have been an awesome father.

I can't and won't even try to find David Gaider's exact quote, way too much effort. I've seen few BS member speaking of it though, so it would semi-confirm it.

And as for the taint: I know that it may have had an effect on fertility, but why wouldn't it affect other systems? We know that wardens have nightmares, yes. We know that wardens lives 10-30  years after drinking darkspawns' blood. But it seems that fertility disfunction is somehow instant.

Edit: It appears taint causes revanous hunger, so it does effect something other than fertility. But still, no other symptoms of taint's effects.

Modifié par Mr Cloud, 20 juillet 2013 - 11:39 .

[Secretlyapotato]

Don't forget the whole point of drinking it in the first place! Being able to sense darkspawn, and being immune to further taint corruption. (until their Calling)

Also, infertility may not be instant, from what I recall it only comes up in conversation with a HNF and Alistair who are going to be king and queen, which takes place about a year after her joining. Morrigan also says that she's unable to do the OGB ritual with Riordin since he's been a grey warden too long.

Modifié par Secretlyapotato, 21 juillet 2013 - 12:28 .

[Mr Cloud]

I think there's no point in continuing this discussion, everything has been said and there's nothing we can do about it. I know everything I wanted to. Thanks

I'm wondering though, did any developer specified timeline for DA:I? Because I've read someone's post (I think on tumblr, she/he believes she saw David posting it somewhere), that Warden and Alistair will live up to 15 years after the Blight (there might be point to it, because wardens' lifespan shortens should they be in close proximity to darkspawns and Archdemon). If so, to see Alistair (and perhaps Warden), it should be placed during five years after events of DA2.

Let's hope it will.

Modifié par Mr Cloud, 21 juillet 2013 - 06:06 .

[BevH]

Mr Cloud wrote...

I think there's no point in continuing this discussion, everything has been said and there's nothing we can do about it. I know everything I wanted to. Thanks

I'm wondering though, did any developer specified timeline for DA:I? Because I've read someone's post (I think on tumblr, she/he believes she saw David posting it somewhere), that Warden and Alistair will live up to 15 years after the Blight (there might be point to it, because wardens' lifespan shortens should they be in close proximity to darkspawns and Archdemon). If so, to see Alistair (and perhaps Warden), it should be placed during five years after events of DA2.

Let's hope it will.

I don't think a timeline has been announced yet. However, I would assume that it would be taking place no sooner than 10 years after the events of DA:O. Cassandra's questioning of Varric takes place 10 years after the start of DA2, which that timeline starts concurrently with DA:O. It would be nice to see Alistair again, or at least some mention of him, but I think that may be unlikely. A Twitter post from Steve Valentine stated that he hadn't been tapped for any voice work for DA:I.

[tklivory]

 FWIW, here are some thoughts on Grey Warden infertility as explored by me and another Tumblr user a few months ago:

Musings and ramblings

Modifié par tklivory, 22 juillet 2013 - 09:28 .

[BevH]

tklivory wrote...

 FWIW, here are some thoughts on Grey Warden infertility as explored by me and another Tumblr user a few months ago:

Musings and ramblings

Basically, a more in-depth explanation of my "sperm are stupid" one.

[angelic_wounds]

 Oh, sorry to join in late, my exam schedule was mind numbing... I finished a week ago. 

Regarding the taint of fertility through darkspawn blood, I partially still believe that it is a rumour spread out from people and got to stay as a fact. I just don't think how it would concern a Warden, who has already passed through the deathly consequences of drinking the blood. I mean, you will live for 30 years, but no kids. I might not saying life is fair, but really?

Here's an image of Alistair checking out my plain Warden. (sorry, do not know how to upload images )

Modifié par angelic_wounds, 23 juillet 2013 - 12:21 .

[Mr Cloud]

angelic_wounds wrote...

 Oh, sorry to join in late, my exam schedule was mind numbing... I finished a week ago. 

Regarding the taint of fertility through darkspawn blood, I partially still believe that it is a rumour spread out from people and got to stay as a fact. I just don't think how it would concern a Warden, who has already passed through the deathly consequences of drinking the blood. I mean, you will live for 30 years, but no kids. I might not saying life is fair, but really?

Here's an image of Alistair checking out my plain Warden. (sorry, do not know how to upload images )

Actually, it's a bit different. Warden whom stayed in close proximity to darkspawn  and/or archdemon (presumably, the Blight) will live even shorter. I've seen someone's post that (not sure if leigit) David Gainer had stated somewhere that Warden/Alistair would live up to 15 years after killing the AD.

Modifié par Mr Cloud, 23 juillet 2013 - 10:20 .

[ladyiolanthe]

Calenhad's line doesn't, technically, end with Alistair if you have Alistair do the Dark Ritual. Calenhad's bloodline continues in the Old God Baby, in that instance. However, it would be true that the line of Theirin kings ends with Alistair, since OGB will never be sitting on the throne (he almost certainly has a greater destiny).

[ladyiolanthe]

BevH wrote... 
A Twitter post from Steve Valentine stated that he hadn't been tapped for any voice work for DA:I.

This is the tweet:

Steve Valentine ‏@Stevevalentine 11 Jun
For those asking about #Dragonage3 as far as I know, I'm not part of it, now Alistair on the other hand….

It's pretty coy.

Modifié par ladyiolanthe, 24 juillet 2013 - 03:20 .

[Mr Cloud]

ladyiolanthe wrote...

BevH wrote... 
A Twitter post from Steve Valentine stated that he hadn't been tapped for any voice work for DA:I.

This is the tweet:

Steve Valentine ‏@Stevevalentine 11 Jun
For those asking about #Dragonage3 as far as I know, I'm not part of it, now Alistair on the other hand….

It's pretty coy.

Truth be told,  he would only have a cameo, so he may not has been asked for VO just yet.

Modifié par Mr Cloud, 24 juillet 2013 - 01:08 .

[ladyiolanthe]

Well, one interpretation of his tweet that others have come up with is that he's being a bit evasive/playful and means that he, Steve Valentine, won't be in DA:I, but Alistair with a voice by Mr. Valentine will be. But yeah, if Alistair shows up it will probably only be a cameo.

I wonder if they'd even bother with drunk Alistair? If he's in DA:I at all, I expect it would be a waste of time and money to do drunk Alistair. To me, it seems likely that he'd only appear as Grey Warden or King Alistair.

[Mr Cloud]

Hmm, he may be somehow involved into Morrigan's OGB if he slept with Morrigan (a bit far-fetched theory though)

Btw, I haven't played DA2 yet (but I don't mind spoilers) but one thing got me irking: if Warden dies killing the AD, in epilogue Alistair is said to leave the Grey Wardens, but then he appears as one. Mistake on BW's side?

[BevH]

Mr Cloud wrote...

Hmm, he may be somehow involved into Morrigan's OGB if he slept with Morrigan (a bit far-fetched theory though)

Btw, I haven't played DA2 yet (but I don't mind spoilers) but one thing got me irking: if Warden dies killing the AD, in epilogue Alistair is said to leave the Grey Wardens, but then he appears as one. Mistake on BW's side?

Many things are wonky about the DAO import into DA2.

"Alistair felt the loss of his love keenly. Although he returned to the Grey Wardens for a time, he was heard to say that it simply was not the same anymore. Much to Queen Anora's relief, he resigned from the order and left Ferelden for good."

I assume this is what you're referring to. My take on this is that this happened several years later. Alistair's appearance in DA2 as a warden occurs about 3 years after the end of the blight. So his departure from the wardens could have happened after that.

[Mr Cloud]

BevH wrote...

Mr Cloud wrote...

Hmm, he may be somehow involved into Morrigan's OGB if he slept with Morrigan (a bit far-fetched theory though)

Btw, I haven't played DA2 yet (but I don't mind spoilers) but one thing got me irking: if Warden dies killing the AD, in epilogue Alistair is said to leave the Grey Wardens, but then he appears as one. Mistake on BW's side?

Many things are wonky about the DAO import into DA2.

"Alistair felt the loss of his love keenly. Although he returned to the Grey Wardens for a time, he was heard to say that it simply was not the same anymore. Much to Queen Anora's relief, he resigned from the order and left Ferelden for good."

I assume this is what you're referring to. My take on this is that this happened several years later. Alistair's appearance in DA2 as a warden occurs about 3 years after the end of the blight. So his departure from the wardens could have happened after that.

I heard about imports, I know that no matter what, Alistair (as the Grey Warden) reffers to the Warden as friend (even when romanced). For one I'm happy - I picked PC version of DA:O (and so will DA2 follow), as modders fix SO many things that I feel sorry for console boyos. There's a mod that fixes imports.

I think of getting DA2 asap to be brought up to speed. Is it as disappointing as they say?

[BevH]

Mr Cloud wrote...
I heard about imports, I know that no matter what, Alistair (as the Grey Warden) reffers to the Warden as friend (even when romanced). For one I'm happy - I picked PC version of DA:O (and so will DA2 follow), as modders fix SO many things that I feel sorry for console boyos. There's a mod that fixes imports.

I think of getting DA2 asap to be brought up to speed. Is it as disappointing as they say?

I believe there was once when I got  Alistair to refer to the warden as his love. It seems to be kind of a random thing though.

As far as DA2 being disappointing, mine came more from aesthetics than anything else. Although, the lack of interaction with your companions was highly disappointing. I do like the faster pace of combat and while the dialogue wheel was surprising/frustrating, I liked that you were able to pick a personality for your Hawke from it. I was majorly disappointed in the quality of the graphics... seemed like a step backwards to me. But others, I'm sure, will have different opinions.

[ladyiolanthe]

angelic_wounds wrote...
Regarding the taint of fertility through darkspawn blood, I partially still believe that it is a rumour spread out from people and got to stay as a fact. I just don't think how it would concern a Warden, who has already passed through the deathly consequences of drinking the blood. I mean, you will live for 30 years, but no kids. I might not saying life is fair, but really? 

As an added footnote, the Warden is reported to have disappeared, in both Awakening and DAII.

Awakening epilogues from the wiki:

Warden married to Alistair - "If the Warden-Commander is married to Alistair, she returns to life at court, resuming her duties as queen of Ferelden and receives a hero's welcome when she rides back into the capital. King Alistair awaits her at the palace gates, grinning from ear-to-ear. A few years later, the Warden vanishes. Nobody knows why, but "neither does anyone think her tale is complete ..."

Warden not married to Alistair; Alistair is King or a Grey Warden - "Some claimed she returned to Alistair, her true love, and a life far away from both Ferelden and the royal court. Some say that she served the Grey Wardens elsewhere, Alistair at her side, or that the two of them were seen often at the palace in Denerim. After a number of years, however, neither she nor Alistair were seen again. Perhaps they undertook some mission on behalf of the Grey Wardens, or departed for their own adventures, or ... simply disappeared. Most assume their tale is far from complete ... " - At least Alistair doesn't get abandoned in this one.

At the end of DAII, Cassandra reports that the Champion has disappeared without a trace, just like the Warden. So... your Warden is out of the picture by 9:40 Dragon, though in the princess-consort case, Alistair remains behind.

Modifié par ladyiolanthe, 29 juillet 2013 - 07:48 .

[ladyiolanthe]

tklivory wrote...

 FWIW, here are some thoughts on Grey Warden infertility as explored by me and another Tumblr user a few months ago:

Musings and ramblings

Interesting, but some baby bits do actually cross the placenta and get into the mother's body, and vice-versa. See http://www.scientifi...n-mothers-brain

This is why I wonder if Fiona's cure from the darkspawn taint had something to do with her pregnancy, although the book The Calling was written several years before this research came to light. However, migration of cells and stuff across the placenta was known before this research - for example, the whole Rh negative/positive interaction issue for mothers and their developing fetuses has been known for a long time. See http://americanpregn...rhfactor-2.html

Modifié par ladyiolanthe, 29 juillet 2013 - 07:26 .

[M-Taylor]

I always thought the infertilty was more down to the taint actually warping your species.

I mean, ghouls and ghasts seem like they have different DNA structures, right down to the core. Check Broodmothers, and Tamlen from the Dalish origin. It doesn't just seem like a poison or an infection, it seems to completely alter your body over time.

From that, I assumed that the Grey Wardens were half human/elf/dwarf and half Darkspawn (continual references in game to you being 'something more' too, such as the Chasined outside the Chantry in Lothering). So to make a full baby, they require a healthy person to balance out the taint. And even then, it's said to be very hard to conceive with 1 Warde/1 normal person. So two Wardens would be completely redundant.

It's hard to explain because there's nothing like it in real life, and I can't think of another example in any other fantasy settings. But yeah, this is just what I inferred from the game. I wasn't surprised when Gaider said Alistair and a Female Warden are unable to conceive children.

Edit:

In conjunction, they're being turned into a hybird race, and the other half is a race that does not procreate through sexual interaction. They're being injected with race goo goo, and the race is almost like a cloning race/hive. The reproduction of humans/elves/dwarves are not compatible with Darkspawn, futher suggesting that infertility would be a direct consequence.

Edit edit:

I just had a nasty ass image of a female Warden broodmother with Alistair cooing gleefully over the thousands of children.

Modifié par M-Taylor, 04 août 2013 - 07:53 .

[sylvanaerie]

 So, my PC has a nervous breakdown and I lose all my saves in a reinstallation of Windows 7.  This was the only thing I had left to do since restore/repair wasn't functioning.  Very little seemed to be functioning.  The fun part though is i get to rediscover how much fun Dragon Age is.  I did some minor modding on my Alistair but aside from using Dracomie's textures to give him more realistic eyes, and adding a bit of scruff to his cheeks (I figured who has time to shave when fighting darkspawn most days?), my Alistair looks pretty close to vanilla.

Ahh, Neria will be falling in love all over again with her former templar!

Modifié par sylvanaerie, 16 août 2013 - 01:26 .

[BevH]

sylvanaerie wrote...

 So, my PC has a nervous breakdown and I lose all my saves in a reinstallation of Windows 7.  This was the only thing I had left to do since restore/repair wasn't functioning.  Very little seemed to be functioning.  The fun part though is i get to rediscover how much fun Dragon Age is.  I did some minor modding on my Alistair but aside from using Dracomie's textures to give him more realistic eyes, and adding a bit of scruff to his cheeks (I figured who has time to shave when fighting darkspawn most days?), my Alistair looks pretty close to vanilla.

Ahh, Neria will be falling in love all over again with her former templar!

This is one of my favorite exchanges in the game. Of course, most of what comes out of Alistair's mouth is a favorite!

[sylvanaerie]

I  agree. Most of what Alistair says is pure gold.  It's mine too. And Duncan's response of the 'long suffering sigh' to be hearing the snark in stereo is one of his funnier moments. A pity he doesn't get more of those in the game.

Modifié par sylvanaerie, 16 août 2013 - 03:02 .

[Browneye_Vamp84]

Has anyone else finished "Until We Sleep"? I'm wanting to talk to some folks about the comics and the upcoming novels and game. I don't want to spoil anything by talking about the comic if others haven't read it, (it's pretty freaking awesome) That is all.