39010 réponses à ce sujet

[phaonica]

Axekix wrote...

If anything Flemeth is apparently the one to be concerned with, meaning Morrigan's plans may or may not be the only way to deal with her. 

If you believe Morrigan. What has Flemeth ever done to make anyone think that her plan might be worse than Morrigan's? Except for whatever Morrigan herself has told you?

By that philosophy, any  action could be justified based on personal perspective, which is clearly ridiculous.  Most laws are based around ethical arguments at their core and for good reason.  You can choose to disagree but if you go and kill someone in cold blood that doesn't make you any less of a murderer.

So a murderer is someone who kills another outside the bounds of an ethical argument? And also, the only way to have an ethical argument to kill someone is with rock-solid proof (ie a crime has *already* been committed)? Is there absolutely no ethical argument that has room for preventative measures?

Well I'm certain there are laws in Fereldan as well.

Which the Warden has already chosen not to obey, not based on 'because they are the law' but because they are contrary to their mission.

Damn, I have to go to class. BBL.

[tuppence95]

Wow, you guys are still debating!  Very interesting stuff.  

For me personally, I guess I lean more toward Axe's side.  I cannot believe I'm arguing against KoP on this particular subject.  But I feel that way because I tend to put a lot of myself into my characters.  I'm not that creative a roleplayer.  I find it very difficult to play characters like my current blood mage and to make moral choices that I wouldn't make for myself.  But when I attacked Morrigan the other night, it was the player, not the character, that did it, and I was attacking the DLC, not Morrigan.  I was letting my frustrations at the bugs affect what my character did.  I expected a fight that would end with either Morrigan fleeing through the mirror before I could overpower her, or more likely my warden getting knocked unconscious and finding Morrigan gone when she came to.  But of course sneaky Bioware would put in that horrifying cutscene for anyone making that choice, so it could result in these debates about "Is she dead?" "Was it wrong to do that?"

I do believe there's no right or  wrong way to play.  Well, no, I'll qualilfy that.  I just don't like the players who will kill Morrigan, execute Alistair or even Loghain in a gleeful way, just because they can!

But back on topic ...

Thursday!  Sparkly love scene.

[Addai]

Siduri wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Warden Commander ending?  Oh man, pass the tissues.  And like you, I wanted to fireball every last damn one of them in the post-coronation hall.

All through Awakenings and the rest of the DLC, whenever anyone called me "The Hero of Ferelden" I snarled at the screen, "That's Alistair." It really kind of sucks that the boon I asked for was that the sacrifice of the Wardens not be forgotten, and yet everybody's all like, "Ali-who now?"

Yeah, I believe the WC ending was designed for male players who didn't want Alistair stealing their PC-is-god thunder.  Pfeh.

What a lovely image!

I like that one.  It's called Dragon Age Nouveau.

Now you said that when you ran the ending where you had Alistair marry the Ice Queen, that at least it led to a golden age etc.  So you got the golden age slide with Alistair + Anora, too?  There's been some debate around these parts about that phrase only appearing for mCousland + Anora, but several us swore we got it when we had Alistair marry Anora, too.  I wonder if you get that only if the Warden leaves Denerim?

Not that it matters much to me since I'll never do that to him again.  I think they had to give some incentive to marry the &$)*+.

Modifié par Addai67, 09 septembre 2010 - 02:45 .

[Addai]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

yukidama wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I'd like to add that arguing for killing Morrigan is much harder than I thought...

Lol, now you know how we feel

Except none of you actually tried arguing for executing Alistair  

Not true.  I said I could understand doing that if you wanted to give Anora a little wedding present, some extra security for her throne.  I just didn't see the logic of executing him for "desertion."

[Yankee23]

Addai67 wrote...

Siduri wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Warden Commander ending?  Oh man, pass the tissues.  And like you, I wanted to fireball every last damn one of them in the post-coronation hall.

All through Awakenings and the rest of the DLC, whenever anyone called me "The Hero of Ferelden" I snarled at the screen, "That's Alistair." It really kind of sucks that the boon I asked for was that the sacrifice of the Wardens not be forgotten, and yet everybody's all like, "Ali-who now?"

Yeah, I believe the WC ending was designed for male players who didn't want Alistair stealing their PC-is-god thunder.  Pfeh.

What a lovely image!

I like that one.  It's called Dragon Age Nouveau.

Now you said that when you ran the ending where you had Alistair marry the Ice Queen, that at least it led to a golden age etc.  So you got the golden age slide with Alistair + Anora, too?  There's been some debate around these parts about that phrase only appearing for mCousland + Anora, but several us swore we got it when we had Alistair marry Anora, too.  I wonder if you get that only if the Warden leaves Denerim?

Not that it matters much to me since I'll never do that to him again.  I think they had to give some incentive to marry the &$)*+.

Why can't FCousland get the golden age with Alistair?  Pffft!

[cmessaz]

Wow, still going? Well my 2 cents: I can understand all sides with regards to how to handle Morrigan. As well as I can understand the arguments to allow Alistair to be executed. Does that mean I'm going to do it? Probably not. I had actually intended to hunt her down and kill her with one of my pcs, until I saw that she doesn't fight back. That just doesn't feel right for me, but again I can totally understand people who do it.

[Yankee23]

cmessaz wrote...

Wow, still going? Well my 2 cents: I can understand all sides with regards to how to handle Morrigan. As well as I can understand the arguments to allow Alistair to be executed. Does that mean I'm going to do it? Probably not. I had actually intended to hunt her down and kill her with one of my pcs, until I saw that she doesn't fight back. That just doesn't feel right for me, but again I can totally understand people who do it.

When I saw it was an option, I considered it for one of my wardens as well. But it is portrayed very much like a betrayal. For any of my wardens who have a hostile relationship with Morrigan the cutscene doesn't fit. An epic boss battle with an injured morrigan disappearing through the mirror would have been much better.

Thursday!

[Addai]

Yankee23 wrote...

Why can't FCousland get the golden age with Alistair?  Pffft!

She gets the "adored bride" epilogue.  Ferelden can go to hell.  LOL

Just kidding.  Anora appears to be the key to a golden age.  Pfeh, like I said, I think they had to even out the fact that she's a major b*tch by saying "at least a b*tch gets things done".

Modifié par Addai67, 09 septembre 2010 - 03:22 .

[Giggles_Manically]

Warden: "You're sort of a ruthless b#tch."

Queen Anora: "I prefer to think of it as having staunch determination. Was there a point you wanted to make?"

Warden: "No, I just wanted to say it."

[Addai]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Warden: "You're sort of a ruthless b#tch."
Queen Anora: "I prefer to think of it as having staunch determination. Was there a point you wanted to make?"
Warden: "No, I just wanted to say it."

Is that an actual dialogue?  Heh.  You do get several opportunities to tell her off.  Not enough of them, I say.

Do people think Anora would swear fealty to Alistair after the Blight?  I don't think she would.  With her father dead and her throne gone, I bet she'd commit suicide by hangman.

[Giggles_Manically]

Addai67 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Warden: "You're sort of a ruthless b#tch."
Queen Anora: "I prefer to think of it as having staunch determination. Was there a point you wanted to make?"
Warden: "No, I just wanted to say it."

Is that an actual dialogue?  Heh.  You do get several opportunities to tell her off.  Not enough of them, I say.

Do people think Anora would swear fealty to Alistair after the Blight?  I don't think she would.  With her father dead and her throne gone, I bet she'd commit suicide by hangman.

I dont know.
I thought she was just some power hungry noble. But I actually respect her for NOT marrying the person who kills her father. If she wasent made Queen, then I would advocate her execution after the blight since she would try a coup.

Also one of the guys on my dorms does video editing and is making a tribute to his PC who did the US.
He wants to know if this song works for it (Male City Elf, Kinged Alistair, Romanced Leliana,):
Message to the Queen: 300 OST.

[cmessaz]

I'm right there with you on the Anora thing. Some people see her swearing fealty, but not me personally, she doesn't seem like the type to give in. And yes I make sure to get that dlg a lot

[Addai]

Giggles_Manically wrote...
I thought she was just some power hungry noble. But I actually respect her for NOT marrying the person who kills her father.

Never made sense to me since she'll still marry Alistair even though he advocates Loghain's death.  Seems a quibble that you'll go through with it if he calls for his execution and has a buddy do the actual deed, versus calling for it and doing it himself.  My theory on that is that when Alistair executes high justice, she sees he's not going to be a pushover and suddenly isn't so keen on sharing a throne with him.
 

Also one of the guys on my dorms does video editing and is making a tribute to his PC who did the US.
He wants to know if this song works for it (Male City Elf, Kinged Alistair, Romanced Leliana,):
Message to the Queen: 300 OST.

I'll have a listen later on, don't have sound at work.

[Yankee23]

DA gives us all a base of information about our wardens and companions to do with what we will. I really enjoy hearing about how we all interpret them in different ways, especially post game where we have no specific info (approval loss, etc...). So I am going to attempt to throw a Alistair related topic out there.



What would your Alistair's choices/opinion of your choices be for Awakenings and why? What would he choose to do about the architect, would he defend the village or the keep, anything from Awakenings.

[Giggles_Manically]

Alistair would I think be tempted by the Architect if hardened.

Unhardened he would not side with a Darkspawn.



Also I think that Alistair would want to save Amaranthine.

[cmessaz]

Wow, I have thought of this in regards to the Architect. I thought he would immediately say kill him, but the more I think about it the more I'm not sure.

[cmessaz]

Addai67 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...
I thought she was just some power hungry noble. But I actually respect her for NOT marrying the person who kills her father.

Never made sense to me since she'll still marry Alistair even though he advocates Loghain's death.  Seems a quibble that you'll go through with it if he calls for his execution and has a buddy do the actual deed, versus calling for it and doing it himself.  My theory on that is that when Alistair executes high justice, she sees he's not going to be a pushover and suddenly isn't so keen on sharing a throne with him.
 

Also one of the guys on my dorms does video editing and is making a tribute to his PC who did the US.
He wants to know if this song works for it (Male City Elf, Kinged Alistair, Romanced Leliana,):
Message to the Queen: 300 OST.

I'll have a listen later on, don't have sound at work.

Whoa...never thought of it like that.

[Addai]

Yankee23 wrote...

What would your Alistair's choices/opinion of your choices be for Awakenings and why? What would he choose to do about the architect, would he defend the village or the keep, anything from Awakenings.

I always think of a bit of dialogue SurelyForth wrote for him on the subject of the Architect.  "Just go kill the talking... darkspawn... thing."  I can't see Alistair siding with a shady darkspawn blood mage kind of guy.

Likewise, I think he would try to save Amaranthine.  I base that on what he says about Lothering.  He didn't like abandoning a town even for a good reason.

[Giggles_Manically]

cmessaz wrote...

Wow, I have thought of this in regards to the Architect. I thought he would immediately say kill him, but the more I think about it the more I'm not sure.

I agree with Sigrun on this "Time to take out the trash"
It will be a chilly day in hell before I side with some deluded piece of talking mutated disease.

[cmessaz]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

cmessaz wrote...

Wow, I have thought of this in regards to the Architect. I thought he would immediately say kill him, but the more I think about it the more I'm not sure.

I agree with Sigrun on this "Time to take out the trash"
It will be a chilly day in hell before I side with some deluded piece of talking mutated disease.

I almost sided with him, my first time. I guess if you haven't read the books, you don't have the whole story. Oops.

[Yankee23]

Addai67 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Warden: "You're sort of a ruthless b#tch."
Queen Anora: "I prefer to think of it as having staunch determination. Was there a point you wanted to make?"
Warden: "No, I just wanted to say it."

Is that an actual dialogue?  Heh.  You do get several opportunities to tell her off.  Not enough of them, I say.

Do people think Anora would swear fealty to Alistair after the Blight?  I don't think she would.  With her father dead and her throne gone, I bet she'd commit suicide by hangman.

I have thought about this and still don't know if I have a good  answer. Anora wants the throne and doesn't want to give it up even after she loses it , but I think eventually she may swear. I think she is too smart and ambitious to allow herself to be executed. I think you may have to offer her something to get her to swear fealty. I have toyed with the thought that my HNF and Alistair offer her a stewardship of a sort in Ameranthine. My HNF returns to court so she can't oversee both the wardens and the city. And putting a senior Orlesian GW in charge doesn't seem like it would go over well with the people. Sort of like a joint rulership with the GW's until an appropriate Fereldan can be found. It gives Anora a purpose and there are trustworthy wardens there to keep an eye on her.

[Giggles_Manically]

cmessaz wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

cmessaz wrote...

Wow, I have thought of this in regards to the Architect. I thought he would immediately say kill him, but the more I think about it the more I'm not sure.

I agree with Sigrun on this "Time to take out the trash"
It will be a chilly day in hell before I side with some deluded piece of talking mutated disease.

I almost sided with him, my first time. I guess if you haven't read the books, you don't have the whole story. Oops.

I just killed him for:
Attacking me
Experimenting on me
Sicking Dragons On me
Killing people left and right with his minions.
His plan being FUBARed from the getgo "Some will be nice, but some go crazy!"
Him making the mother, brilliant work there senior!

You dont just need the books to find reasons to kill him.
Also he didnt deny the need for broodmothers so I dont feel any regret turning him into a stain in Drake's Fall.

[Addai]

cmessaz wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...
I thought she was just some power hungry noble. But I actually respect her for NOT marrying the person who kills her father.

Never made sense to me since she'll still marry Alistair even though he advocates Loghain's death.  Seems a quibble that you'll go through with it if he calls for his execution and has a buddy do the actual deed, versus calling for it and doing it himself.  My theory on that is that when Alistair executes high justice, she sees he's not going to be a pushover and suddenly isn't so keen on sharing a throne with him.
 

Also one of the guys on my dorms does video editing and is making a tribute to his PC who did the US.
He wants to know if this song works for it (Male City Elf, Kinged Alistair, Romanced Leliana,):
Message to the Queen: 300 OST.

I'll have a listen later on, don't have sound at work.

Whoa...never thought of it like that.

There's this moment where, after Alistair says "put her in the tower", he turns away and she stands looking at him for a bit.  I like to think she's seeing what a big miscalculation she made in underestimating him.  Of course, it's probably more like "how did an idiot like you steal my precious throne."

[cmessaz]

Addai67 wrote...

cmessaz wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...
I thought she was just some power hungry noble. But I actually respect her for NOT marrying the person who kills her father.

Never made sense to me since she'll still marry Alistair even though he advocates Loghain's death.  Seems a quibble that you'll go through with it if he calls for his execution and has a buddy do the actual deed, versus calling for it and doing it himself.  My theory on that is that when Alistair executes high justice, she sees he's not going to be a pushover and suddenly isn't so keen on sharing a throne with him.
 

Also one of the guys on my dorms does video editing and is making a tribute to his PC who did the US.
He wants to know if this song works for it (Male City Elf, Kinged Alistair, Romanced Leliana,):
Message to the Queen: 300 OST.

I'll have a listen later on, don't have sound at work.

Whoa...never thought of it like that.

There's this moment where, after Alistair says "put her in the tower", he turns away and she stands looking at him for a bit.  I like to think she's seeing what a big miscalculation she made in underestimating him.  Of course, it's probably more like "how did an idiot like you steal my precious throne."

Guess I'm evil, but I really enjoy that part

[Yankee23]

cmessaz wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

cmessaz wrote...

Wow, I have thought of this in regards to the Architect. I thought he would immediately say kill him, but the more I think about it the more I'm not sure.

I agree with Sigrun on this "Time to take out the trash"
It will be a chilly day in hell before I side with some deluded piece of talking mutated disease.

I almost sided with him, my first time. I guess if you haven't read the books, you don't have the whole story. Oops.

That's kinda why I asked. I didn't read the books and don't know too much other than bits and pieces picked up on the forums, but I believe Duncan was involved in this? How much, if anything may Duncan have told Alistair and would that influence him?