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[OfficerDonNZ]

You know there's one thing about talking with Goldanna that's missing. For the PC to make some remark about the Demon Goldanna from the fade Either in front of Goldanna or to Alistair afterwords. Yes I'm evil Or even Alistair to make some comment. This assums you had Ailstair with you when you do the tower.

[Lady Jess]

OfficerDonNZ wrote...

You know there's one thing about talking with Goldanna that's missing. For the PC to make some remark about the Demon Goldanna from the fade Either in front of Goldanna or to Alistair afterwords. Yes I'm evil Or even Alistair to make some comment. This assums you had Ailstair with you when you do the tower.

Another thing is missing. The oppurtunity to slap her good and hard when you threaten to cut her tongue out.

[CalJones]

You're pretty harsh, aren't you?

She's had a hard life and whilst she isn't the most pleasant person, she has the right to feel a little bitter. If she's been told that her mother died giving birth to a stillborn child, and then Alistair walks in declaring that he's her brother, she's going to be angry that she's been lied to. Certainly, it's not Alistair's fault, but it must be a shock for her.

Regarding the Fade, I did find it odd that Alistair never met Goldanna before yet she appears in the Fade as she does in the game. I suppose it's a bit of artistic license.

An option to talk about it would have been good, though.

[Wulfram]

"15 sovereigns!  15!  She could buy Redcliffe village with that!  "

Is what my characters would like to say about Goldanna

[Lady Jess]

CalJones wrote...

You're pretty harsh, aren't you?
She's had a hard life and whilst she isn't the most pleasant person, she has the right to feel a little bitter. If she's been told that her mother died giving birth to a stillborn child, and then Alistair walks in declaring that he's her brother, she's going to be angry that she's been lied to. Certainly, it's not Alistair's fault, but it must be a shock for her.
Regarding the Fade, I did find it odd that Alistair never met Goldanna before yet she appears in the Fade as she does in the game. I suppose it's a bit of artistic license.
An option to talk about it would have been good, though.

"Who's this? Some elf to carry your riches?" As a Dalish, being called that which she hates most, a slave? Yeah...I'd be harsh. 

edit: And it comes with no provocation, a simple line i believe saying that Alistair is telling the truth. Aside from the fact that she's running down an already devastated Alistair, who has lost just as much as her and has no more money than she does, she is lashing out at the person who DOES have the money needed to help her. And in any origin (she called my mage, and HNF a tart by the way), my wardens being referred to as basically a SERVANT or a ****, when she's one of the asses saved by their effort...yep, needs a good slap.

Edit 2: the tart/elf/servant line comes after "that's hardly Alistair's fault is it?"

Modifié par Lady Jess, 11 septembre 2010 - 10:02 .

[Herr Uhl]

CalJones wrote...

Regarding the Fade, I did find it odd that Alistair never met Goldanna before yet she appears in the Fade as she does in the game. I suppose it's a bit of artistic license.

You can meet Goldanna before going to the fade (or am I wrong in this?) and making two models of her would be kind of weird.

[Aeowyn]

Yeah but still. If you decide to go to the Circle before going to Denerim, it's quite weird that Alistair knows what his sister looks like before even having met her.

I did miss some kind of dialogue after that as well (if you do the Fade before Denerim). It felt strange when you did the Fade and then the next thing you know Alistair is talking about having a sister in Denerim and you can't even remark on the fact that "Hey is that the one we met in the Fade?!"



As for Goldanna being a ****. Yes she is bitter about life, but that gives her no excuse to still be rude if the PC decides to give her 15 sovereigns. What does she expect? I felt sorry for her but after that I just wanted to slap her and teach her some manners. Having a hard life is no excuse for being rude when someone helps you out.

[CalJones]

Ah well she never gets money from me. Heh.

[Aeowyn]

I mean, I don't hate her or blame her for being so bitter. I would be quite bitter as well. But it was quite obvious that she was one of those people who likes to feel sorry for themselves and not do anything about it. On one playthrough I gave 5 sovereigns to Kaitlin and she managed to start a successful foundry with that. Goldanna could probably get out of the miserable life she's in with the 15 sovereigns. Meh, it just seems that she's the kind of character that you're supposed to dislike or something.

[CalJones]

I do tend to think she's nastier to female characters. I usually play males, and humans at that, so I admit I'd forgotten some of her more barbed comments. She is certainly not meant to be likeable but I wouldn't go as far as to slap her around.

[Yankee23]

It looked to me that Goldanna was doing quite well, tbh. She's got her own house in the capital city right smack in the middlle of the market square. It seems like a pretty prime location to me...heck, Marjalaine is only staying a few houses away and she not the type to slum it.  No gold from me.

Also, I always wondered how so many people know that Alistair is Maric son, including Alistair, especially if it was supposed to be a big secret. Why even tell Alistair? If the whole point was that no one was supposed to know, maybe they shouldn't have told anyone.

EDIT: Because there is no Alistair on this page.

Modifié par Yankee23, 11 septembre 2010 - 01:12 .

[Lanfaer01]

Aeowyn wrote...

I did miss some kind of dialogue after that as well (if you do the Fade before Denerim). It felt strange when you did the Fade and then the next thing you know Alistair is talking about having a sister in Denerim and you can't even remark on the fact that "Hey is that the one we met in the Fade?!"

Exactly. That's what I'm missing too. Though it should be a conversation he initialises. I would find it curios to confront him with his dream.

Not enough Ailstair on this page

 

[tuppence95]

On the subject of Fiona's baby ...

This is something I posted at another forum last April.  This is what made me believe that Goldanna is not Alistair's sister.



*** BIG SPOILERS FOR THE CALLING ***


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I finished The Calling last night. I'm much more of a DA geek than you and HF are because this stuff fascinates me. During the epilogue, Duncan and Fiona come to visit Maric after being away for a long time, having been called to Weisshaupt, and they bring the baby with them. Maric has to arrange for their visit very late at night while Loghain is away, because Loghain is practically keeping him prisoner in the palace. Maric was very much like Alistair. It seems like his only relationships with women were very serious. He didn't seem the type for casual flings. After reading about the way he reacted to discovering he had a child and then having to give him up, I can't believe that this is the second time he had done it. Also, it's unlikely that Duncan was watching over two sons of Maric's.

[edited to add: Maric on the throne seems a little like an unhardened Alistair as king.]

"He stared down at this tiny baby, shock more than anything else running through his mind. The child had a wisp of blond hair and rosy pink cheeks, and was sleeping soundly. It was definitely his, however. The boy even looked a bit like Cailan. Maric also noticed that the boy's ears were quite round."

Maric tries to talk Fiona into leaving the Grey Wardens and staying with him, but she refuses. "No, what I want is for him to be human. I want him to be fully human and not in the line for your throne, not competing with your other son and tied to this royal blood that has brought you nothing but grief. I want him to have a fresh start." "You can do that, can't you?"

There's some angst about giving up the baby. Fiona had grown up as a slave, and she's determined that this child will not know he has elf blood. Then Duncan makes an offer.

"I'll watch him," Duncan vowed. "I can do that without arousing suspicion, make sure he's doing well. Keep him safe. I can even bring you news, from time to time."

"It was almost too much to take in. First Fiona had returned and wasn't dying. And now he had a son, and he was losing them both. Yet he understood what she was saying. If he recognized the boy and raised him in the palace, he would be subject to the constant politics and struggles. He would be seen as competition for Cailan. Better to have him raised somewhere quietly, out of sight and allowed to have his own destiny. But to have the boy believe he was never wanted, to have him never know his true mother? The ache in his heart threatened to make it explode."

Maric has a sweet, sad goodbye with Fiona and she and Duncan leave. 

"Even though the parting had the air of finality, somehow Maric still couldn't bring himself to feel sad. This didn't feel like an ending.

....... It felt like a beginning."

[Yankee23]

tuppence95 wrote...

On the subject of Fiona's baby ...

This is something I posted at another forum last April.  This is what made me believe that Goldanna is not Alistair's sister.



*** BIG SPOILERS FOR THE CALLING ***


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I finished The Calling last night. I'm much more of a DA geek than you and HF are because this stuff fascinates me. During the epilogue, Duncan and Fiona come to visit Maric after being away for a long time, having been called to Weisshaupt, and they bring the baby with them. Maric has to arrange for their visit very late at night while Loghain is away, because Loghain is practically keeping him prisoner in the palace. Maric was very much like Alistair. It seems like his only relationships with women were very serious. He didn't seem the type for casual flings. After reading about the way he reacted to discovering he had a child and then having to give him up, I can't believe that this is the second time he had done it. Also, it's unlikely that Duncan was watching over two sons of Maric's.

[edited to add: Maric on the throne seems a little like an unhardened Alistair as king.]

"He stared down at this tiny baby, shock more than anything else running through his mind. The child had a wisp of blond hair and rosy pink cheeks, and was sleeping soundly. It was definitely his, however. The boy even looked a bit like Cailan. Maric also noticed that the boy's ears were quite round."

Maric tries to talk Fiona into leaving the Grey Wardens and staying with him, but she refuses. "No, what I want is for him to be human. I want him to be fully human and not in the line for your throne, not competing with your other son and tied to this royal blood that has brought you nothing but grief. I want him to have a fresh start." "You can do that, can't you?"

There's some angst about giving up the baby. Fiona had grown up as a slave, and she's determined that this child will not know he has elf blood. Then Duncan makes an offer.

"I'll watch him," Duncan vowed. "I can do that without arousing suspicion, make sure he's doing well. Keep him safe. I can even bring you news, from time to time."

"It was almost too much to take in. First Fiona had returned and wasn't dying. And now he had a son, and he was losing them both. Yet he understood what she was saying. If he recognized the boy and raised him in the palace, he would be subject to the constant politics and struggles. He would be seen as competition for Cailan. Better to have him raised somewhere quietly, out of sight and allowed to have his own destiny. But to have the boy believe he was never wanted, to have him never know his true mother? The ache in his heart threatened to make it explode."

Maric has a sweet, sad goodbye with Fiona and she and Duncan leave. 

"Even though the parting had the air of finality, somehow Maric still couldn't bring himself to feel sad. This didn't feel like an ending.

....... It felt like a beginning."

I never read the books and am not sure about the whole Alistair/Fiona thing but from what I've heard it could be true. But man if it is, did everybody drop the ball with this poor boy? Send him to Eamon to be a serving maid's bastard and get sent to the chantry when Isolde has a tantrum? They couldn't have found a couple with no children to give him to? Somewhere they could quietly watch him? Excuse me while I go load up IRS and leave the boy in a stupor.

[tuppence95]

 Yeah, I wish we knew more about what happened to Maric after Fiona left.  What could he have been thinking of to give a baby to Eamon?  I don't think he was married to Isolde yet, but still ... He could have given the child to the Couslands.  That would've screwed things up for our HNF, if Alistair had grown up thinking of her as a sister.  But he definitely would've been a happier child.

[Giggles_Manically]

Well having Fergus as an older brother would have been awsome.

[inclemency]

Yah, and I could just see him running tame in Highever Castle...and sleeping in a real room rather than in the stables.

[Merilsell]

Lady Jess wrote...

inclemency wrote...

For Merilsell and Grumpy (and me)...my current PC put her foot down.

haha! My Lyra had a moment last night and I missed it. All this time She's been stonefaced, only speaking when she must, and not being very nice about it at that. And she meets Leliana. Made HER mad by calling her nosy. And got to the point where I could call her crazy, and Alistair's line pops "More crazy? I thought we were full up". I swear Lyra kicked him in the shin.

Ediyed: those are some shweet daggers...which mod?

Hah, this pic is WIN. And so what my Dalish feels at the moment. Seriously in my fic I'm afraid she will murder-knife Harrowmont for suggesting to find Branka in the Deep Roads AFTER she had been already unwilling to go after that Carta-cow Jarvia. Yet she killed the whole thug gang in the end, but when now Harrowmont tells her that it is still NOT enough to get him the throne and her the needed troops? Uh-oh.I fear for his safety. I guess another case of headache for Alistair, as he already imagine how to get out there alive when that should happen.

Lady Jess: Oh the Dalish women. Always the epitome of unrestrained conversation and good mood, heh They are really made for being Kuudere- characters. Lenya is pretty much very good in all of these points ...Though she is slowly opening up to certain people now (she likes Morrigan, Shale, ...and somehow even Alistair.) And by opening up I mean that they mostly get an actual answer now, and not just a stare/glare, a blunt "Whatever" or "I don't care" like she loves it to do otherwise. 

Oh and again I'm rambling about her....don't mind me...just go on.

[inclemency]

Merilsell wrote...
*snip*

Hah, this pic is WIN. And so what my Dalish feels at the moment. Seriously in my fic I'm afraid she will murder-knife Harrowmont for suggesting to find Branka in the Deep Roads AFTER; she had been already unwilling to go after that Carta-cow Jarvia. Yet she killed the whole thug gang in the end, but when now Harrowmont tells her that it is still NOT; enough to get him the throne and her the needed troops? Uh-oh. I fear for his safety. I guess another case of headache for Alistair, as he already imagine how to get out there alive when that should happen.

*snip*

Oh and again I'm rambling about her....don't mind me...just go on.

Lol, thanks, had fun doing the pic. (Please don't stop 'rambling' about her, it's fun to 'hear'.)

I think I mentioned it already, but I still was surprised at the Dalish character in Witch Hunt. She accepted the party members immediately, and was so light-hearted and full of jokes that it kind of threw me. I'd always played the slow-to-warm-up-to-other-than-Dalish party members and others. Wonder if that was all from bad character development or no budget in the DLC, or if that's the view the writers have of the Dalish character.

[Maria13]

Merilsell wrote...

Hah, this pic is WIN. And so what my Dalish feels at the moment. Seriously in my fic I'm afraid she will murder-knife Harrowmont for suggesting to find Branka in the Deep Roads AFTER she had been already unwilling to go after that Carta-cow Jarvia. Yet she killed the whole thug gang in the end, but when now Harrowmont tells her that it is still NOT enough to get him the throne and her the needed troops? Uh-oh.I fear for his safety. I guess another case of headache for Alistair, as he already imagine how to get out there alive when that should happen.

Lady Jess: Oh the Dalish women. Always the epitome of unrestrained conversation and good mood, heh They are really made for being Kuudere- characters. Lenya is pretty much very good in all of these points ...Though she is slowly opening up to certain people now (she likes Morrigan, Shale, ...and somehow even Alistair.) And by opening up I mean that they mostly get an actual answer now, and not just a stare/glare, a blunt "Whatever" or "I don't care" like she loves it to do otherwise. 

Oh and again I'm rambling about her....don't mind me...just go on.

Wow! Merilsell thanks for publishing this link and educating me...  Little did I know that one of the Dalish characters in my fic, Bregeth, is an almost pure Kuudere... How interesting...

[tuppence95]

My new Dalish mage isn't really a Shem-hater.  But she's really not happy with the turn her life has taken.  It all started with those 3 Shems she and Tamlen ran into.  She urged Tamlen to let them all go, and they repaid her kindness by getting the local community stirred up against her clan.  And their story lead her to find the mirror.  That was no fault of theirs, but still that's when all her troubles started.  She lost her best friend and lover, found out that her father was killed by humans and his death pretty much killed her mother. And then another Shem took her away from her clan.  Ok, he's saving her life.  But she's not thinking too rationally after losing everything she cares about.  And now there's Shems all over the place!  And she finds herself traveling around with a man who seems to have a problem with mages and keeps babbling incomprehensible things swinging cats and wearing dresses.

[Sandtigress]

Is Kara the only Dalish who decided to make the best of the situation and try to be civil to anyone who didn't deserve getting murder-knifed? :-P

She and Alistair got along decently well from the start...

[Yankee23]

Ok, I am going to attempt to make some progress with in my HNF game with the Ser Gilmore mod this weekend. They were childhood friends but he has really been getting on her nerves since she found him in Lothering. Maybe his new look will help? And why the h*** am  able to make a male without a problem but my female humans suck...I hate the toolset!

[Merilsell]

I think so, Sandti, lol.

tuppence95:Yep, that's understandable and how Len feels too. The world outside her clan is just sooo confusing and she has nothing to orient on, others than her believes and who she is. So she desperately tries to venerate all the things she had learned, while the memories on her clan hurt her so very much. She never wanted to be a Warden and she misses each of them so much, plus she is deeply hurt from Tamlen's loss and suffers from irrational but heavy survivor guilt. It's a quite miserable situation, really. The only other Warden is a confusing shem who is trying to be nice to her, but that only confuses and aggravate her more. She trust no one but herself right now, yet has to deal with leadership and all the things people expecting from her because of that. That she has been told to hate humans all her life and knows since a longer time who caused the death of her parents isn't helpful either. Anyone still surprised why she is giving Alistair such a hard time? Lol.

Maria13: No prob. I found that by accident, read it and thought wow they are describing my character here, lol.
Oh, and I'm totally on the Fiona is Alistair's mom bandwagon *weeeheee*

Remember:

Q: Do we ever meet Fiona's son?
Gaider: Maybe you already have.... *eyebrow waggle*

Modifié par Merilsell, 11 septembre 2010 - 03:39 .

[inclemency]

Yankee23 wrote...

Ok, I am going to attempt to make some progress with in my HNF game with the Ser Gilmore mod this weekend. They were childhood friends but he has really been getting on her nerves since she found him in Lothering. Maybe his new look will help? And why the h*** am able to make a male without a problem but my female humans suck...I hate the toolset!

*snip*

He looks good, Yankee. I never minded the old one EXCEPT for his teeth, which were somehow not quite right in his mouth, on a funny angle or something. Let us know how you fare in the Ser Gilmore adventure. I tried the old version when it first came out, but he annoyed me, and I couldn't get over those teeth, and as I had just gotten Extra Dog Slot, EDS won

Bleh, I'm still trying to get through Orzammar with one of three characters that need to still get through it.  Between yesterday and today (so far); I've only progressed from the Proving to Dust Town.  Lol, I could have been through everyone in Orzammar/Deep Roads with all three characters by now if I hadn't been procrasinating so much.

Modifié par inclemency, 11 septembre 2010 - 03:48 .