39010 réponses à ce sujet

[KnightofPhoenix]

LadyDamodred wrote...
As for common courtesy.... What do you want him to apologize for? For him calling her a b!tch in the first place or for the fact that he said it to your face? He and Morrigan hate each other. If he did apologize, would you honestly think he meant it? Wouldn't apologizing for calling her a b!tch just be a lie you would totally see through? Or does the PC just want the lip service, as false as it is?

I couldn't care less about what he thinks of Morrigan to be quite honest. So yes, the fact that he said it to my face, despite knowing what I feel for her. I don't care if he means it or not. The apology is still common courtesy and I would have liked to make it perfectly clear for him that I will not tolerate him insulting her in this fashion to my face again.

Because this is not disrespecting Morrigan only, this is insulting to me. 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 01 octobre 2010 - 06:00 .

[Sarah1281]

yukidama wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...

If you're not friends, he probably doesn't care about your feelings too much. *shrugs* I know I'm usually more upset if I accidently offend one of my friends than someone I don't like very much. Different ways of looking at it, I suppose. If you were friends, then a "Sorry, I just don't want to see you get hurt" would fit, but...meh.

As for common courtesy.... What do you want him to apologize for? For him calling her a b!tch in the first place or for the fact that he said it to your face? He and Morrigan hate each other. If he did apologize, would you honestly think he meant it? Wouldn't apologizing for calling her a b!tch just be a lie you would totally see through? Or does the PC just want the lip service, as false as it is?

Gotta agree with this, even though I said I wouldn't comment. I don't really like guys using that word, heh, but I wouldn't apologize for it if we weren't friends. I just wouldn't give a damn, I'm not going to lie to make a person I'm not friends with (and probably don't like too much either at this point) feel better...

Just because the person calling your loved one names doesn't care doesn't mean that you are automatically fine with it or shouldn't want an apology. It's perfectly natural to not want to listen to someone start insulting the people you care for. Maybe some people can just brush it off and go 'well, I don't give a damn about Alistair so him calling Morrigan a **** is no big deal' but I really don't get why Alistair feeling perfectly justified in his tactlessness and his dislike for you means that you're not supposed to get upset by it and that it's fine for him to do so. He should apologize here because what he said was rude and clearly offensive to anyone calling him on it. The fact that you feel that he wouldn't doesn't reflect well on him.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Sarah1281 wrote...
Just because the person calling your loved one names doesn't care doesn't mean that you are automatically fine with it or shouldn't want an apology.

Not to mention the fact that this was an attempt of bonding together. If he doesn't care, then why does he want to play little school girl gossiping with me in the first place?

[Addai]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...
As for common courtesy.... What do you want him to apologize for? For him calling her a b!tch in the first place or for the fact that he said it to your face? He and Morrigan hate each other. If he did apologize, would you honestly think he meant it? Wouldn't apologizing for calling her a b!tch just be a lie you would totally see through? Or does the PC just want the lip service, as false as it is?

I couldn't care less about what he thinks of Morrigan to be quite honest. So yes, the fact that he said it to my face, despite knowing what I feel for her. I don't care if he means it or not. The apology is still common courtesy and I would have liked to make it perfectly clear for him that I will not tolerate him insulting her in this fashion to my face again.

Because this is not disrespecting Morrigan only, this is insulting to me. 

I agree, KoP.  My male PC and Alistair were bros, but I would have liked the option to punch his lights out when he calls her a ****.  It's also pretty crass of him to say "good riddance" at post-coronation in the case of a Warden who a) is his friend, romanced Morrigan and c) had just lost her.  Alistair is clueless sometimes.

[mellifera]

Lol, I am not saying that Alistair should have said it and I cringe every time he does. I don't know where you got that from, because what I said is that I would not apologize for saying something I meant about a person I dislike. Especially if someone I disliked or didn't care for demanded said apology. If it colors their perception of me as rude and crass, so be it. I don't like that he used that word but saying he should apologize or that you wish you could take it out on him is just not something I am going to agree on because it's just a false apology to make the Warden feel better, not because he genuinely feels he crossed the line and regrets hurting your feelings. The case is different if you are friends, but for a person who isn't friendly with him? Yeah, no.

Modifié par yukidama, 01 octobre 2010 - 06:04 .

[LadyDamodred]

Alrighty, so by that same token, Morrigan should also apologize when she insults Alistair, right?



I happen to hold honesty in higher esteem than politeness for the sake of being polite. I will not apologize if I don't mean it and I don't expect others to do it either. Apologizing to me when you don't mean it is downright insulting. *shrugs* I suspect we shall never see eye-to-eye on that.



Sarah: And so it reflects poorly on me as well and not just Alistair, since it's my position in the first place. Which is fine.

[Viva la France]

Sarah1281 wrote...

yukidama wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...

If you're not friends, he probably doesn't care about your feelings too much. *shrugs* I know I'm usually more upset if I accidently offend one of my friends than someone I don't like very much. Different ways of looking at it, I suppose. If you were friends, then a "Sorry, I just don't want to see you get hurt" would fit, but...meh.

As for common courtesy.... What do you want him to apologize for? For him calling her a b!tch in the first place or for the fact that he said it to your face? He and Morrigan hate each other. If he did apologize, would you honestly think he meant it? Wouldn't apologizing for calling her a b!tch just be a lie you would totally see through? Or does the PC just want the lip service, as false as it is?

Gotta agree with this, even though I said I wouldn't comment. I don't really like guys using that word, heh, but I wouldn't apologize for it if we weren't friends. I just wouldn't give a damn, I'm not going to lie to make a person I'm not friends with (and probably don't like too much either at this point) feel better...

Just because the person calling your loved one names doesn't care doesn't mean that you are automatically fine with it or shouldn't want an apology. It's perfectly natural to not want to listen to someone start insulting the people you care for. Maybe some people can just brush it off and go 'well, I don't give a damn about Alistair so him calling Morrigan a **** is no big deal' but I really don't get why Alistair feeling perfectly justified in his tactlessness and his dislike for you means that you're not supposed to get upset by it and that it's fine for him to do so. He should apologize here because what he said was rude and clearly offensive to anyone calling him on it. The fact that you feel that he wouldn't doesn't reflect well on him.

I don't mean to start an argument, but I mean Morrigan starts stuff herself.  She said to Leliana, while in a romance with the warden, that there will be moments he's thinking of her.  Morrigan knew Lel was jealous of her.

So Alistair calling Morri a **** is not a big deal to me, I look at as if the group is one big traveling family that doesnt get along all the time.

[Monica21]

I think this whole thing hearkens back to "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all." There are degrees of course, but I think Alistair steps much farther over the line than Morrigan does.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Addai67 wrote...
I agree, KoP.  My male PC and Alistair were bros, but I would have liked the option to punch his lights out when he calls her a ****.  It's also pretty crass of him to say "good riddance" at post-coronation in the case of a Warden who a) is his friend, romanced Morrigan and c) had just lost her.  Alistair is clueless sometimes.

Thank you. Yes, I did actually want to punch him when he said that.

[LadyDamodred]

yukidama wrote...

Lol, I am not saying that Alistair should have said it and I cringe every time he does. I don't know where you got that from, because what I said is that I would not apologize for saying something I meant about a person I dislike. Especially if someone I disliked or didn't care for demanded said apology. If it colors their perception of me as rude and crass, so be it. I don't like that he used that word but saying he should apologize or that you wish you could take it out on him is just not something I am going to agree on because it's just a false apology to make the Warden feel better, not because he genuinely feels he crossed the line and regrets hurting your feelings. The case is different if you are friends, but for a person who isn't friendly with him? Yeah, no.

This is exactly my point.  We could get into the bigger issue of whether or not he should bring up the conversation at all if he doesn't like you, since it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.  Ah well.

Addai:  Yeah, the "Good riddance." thing is a facepalm if you've romanced Morrigan, I'll grant you that.  Like, oi, Alistair, really?  He should have just said nothing or asked if you're okay.  And before y'all call me a hypocrite, there is a huge difference between calling someone a b!tch and dismissing the loss of what could be your best friend's true love.  Poor editing there.

Modifié par LadyDamodred, 01 octobre 2010 - 06:10 .

[Zjarcal]

LadyDamodred wrote...

I happen to hold honesty in higher esteem than politeness for the sake of being polite.

I actually agree with this. Still, that doesn't mean he should insult a friend's lover in a conversation he started. Keeping his mouth shut would be both honest (as he isn't lying) and polite.

[LadyDamodred]

Monica21 wrote...

I think this whole thing hearkens back to "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all." There are degrees of course, but I think Alistair steps much farther over the line than Morrigan does.

Really?  Looking at all their conversations, Alistair crosses the line more than Morrigan?

*shrugs*  Different strokes....

[Zjarcal]

LadyDamodred wrote...

This is exactly my point.  We could get into the bigger issue of whether or not he should bring up the conversation at all if he doesn't like you, since it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.  Ah well.

He doesn't. The conversation is only available if you're at "friendly" status.

[KnightofPhoenix]

LadyDamodred wrote...

Alrighty, so by that same token, Morrigan should also apologize when she insults Alistair, right?

She insults him in his face most of the time.
And fool is not nearly the same as "complete and utter b*tch".
Unless you feel so strongly about the word "fool".

Had Alistair said "she's stupid", I would not have cared. ITs the word he uses that pisses me off.

LadyDamodred wrote...
I happen to hold honesty in higher esteem than politeness for the sake of being polite. I will not apologize if I don't mean it and I don't expect others to do it either. Apologizing to me when you don't mean it is downright insulting. *shrugs* I suspect we shall never see eye-to-eye on that.

No, we won't.
I call it common courtesy. When I don't care about the person's honest opinion and find it unnecessarily insulting, I'll make it clear to that person to be quiet and not say anything next time.

[LadyDamodred]

Zjarcal wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...

I happen to hold honesty in higher esteem than politeness for the sake of being polite.

I actually agree with this. Still, that doesn't mean he should insult a friend's lover in a conversation he started. Keeping his mouth shut would be both honest (as he isn't lying) and polite.

Out of curiousity because I can't remember, does he give the b!tch line if you don't choose the "You don't like her very much, do you?" option?

[mellifera]

Yeah, that's a bit of a "Duuuuuuuuude...." moment. Like you say your dog died and the person responds "Well, the dog smelled anyway. Whatever." xD There are a bunch of things Alistair (and all the characters) say that just makes me hang my head and sigh. But that's the point. They're not supposed to always be perfect and calculate every word and turn of phrase to your liking.

[LadyDamodred]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...
Alrighty, so by that same token, Morrigan should also apologize when she insults Alistair, right?

She insults him in his face most of the time.
And fool is not nearly the same as "complete and utter b*tch".
Unless you feel so strongly about the word "fool".

Had Alistair said "she's stupid", I would not have cared. ITs the word he uses that pisses me off.

But she does insult him when talking to me.  So she should apologize, right?  Or are apologies only necessary if you use a vulgarity?

Edit:  I guess maybe for you it is the use of the vulgarity, which seems not very important to me.  For me, it's more the fact that she constantly belittles the man I love even knowing how I feel about him, not the names.

Note, I do not expect Morrigan to apologize.

Modifié par LadyDamodred, 01 octobre 2010 - 06:14 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

yukidama wrote...
he should apologize or that you wish you could take it out on him is just not something I am going to agree on because it's just a false apology to make the Warden feel better, not because he genuinely feels he crossed the line and regrets hurting your feelings. The case is different if you are friends, but for a person who isn't friendly with him? Yeah, no.

It;'s called common etiquette.
When I insult someone's loved one at his face, I at least will say I won't do that again, even if I do feel strongly about that person (I would never do that anyways, but example).

It's not making the Warden feel better. It's being polite and not crossing the line.
Because for me, when someone insults a loved one to my face in this fashion, I consider it a personal attack on my honor.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 01 octobre 2010 - 06:16 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

LadyDamodred wrote...
But she does insult him when talking to me.  So she should apologize, right?  Or are apologies only necessary if you use a vulgarity?

More called for when it's vulgar.
It becomes personal, when you insult a loved one like that.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 01 octobre 2010 - 06:16 .

[mellifera]

The Warden can also call her a **** (multiple times, like 4 or 5 different times in different convos), and I'd imagine if Alistair called her one to her face she would be no more hurt and respond the same way



Warden: I should have known you'd be a selfish ****.

Morrigan: I trust I am supposed to be shocked and dismayed by your language? Do not make me laugh.

[Zjarcal]

LadyDamodred wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...

I happen to hold honesty in higher esteem than politeness for the sake of being polite.

I actually agree with this. Still, that doesn't mean he should insult a friend's lover in a conversation he started. Keeping his mouth shut would be both honest (as he isn't lying) and polite.

Out of curiousity because I can't remember, does he give the b!tch line if you don't choose the "You don't like her very much, do you?" option?

Alright, just saw it in the toolset. He won't say it if the PC doesn't ask that question.

Point for Alistair... well, not really, but at least there's a way to avoid the line in the convo.

[Viva la France]

Actually you can call morri a **** and break up with her when she has her "no more sex right now" convo

[LadyDamodred]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

LadyDamodred wrote...
But she does insult him when talking to me.  So she should apologize, right?  Or are apologies only necessary if you use a vulgarity?

More called for when it's vulgar.
It becomes personal, when you insult a loved one like that.

So...yes, she should apologize?  That's what you're saying?  It's just less called for because she doesn't use a bad word?

That sort of boggles my mind, actually.  I consider mocking someone for grieving over the loss of the only family they've ever known to be a way more egregious insult than calling someone a b!tch when they act like it.

[KnightofPhoenix]

yukidama wrote...

The Warden can also call her a **** (multiple times, like 4 or 5 different times in different convos), and I'd imagine if Alistair called her one to her face she would be no more hurt and respond the same way

Warden: I should have known you'd be a selfish ****.
Morrigan: I trust I am supposed to be shocked and dismayed by your language? Do not make me laugh.

And? How is that relevent?
My Warden never says that anyways.

And I never suggested Morrigan would care. Who is Alistair anyway for her to care? 
But like I said, it's not about him insulting Morrigan. It's him doing it to my face while he knows I like her.

And BTW, he was not at low approval when he said that, it was in fact somewhat high.

[Lady Jess]

So after my Loghain WTF earlier, I checked it out on my Dalish and my mage...compliments abound! Darn the man, I haven't checked it on a dwarf but



Dalish: Maric knew a dalish once, better with a bow than anyone i've seen since

Mage: something about earning Irving's resp4ect and having alot of talent for one so young.



Curse the man for having a nice side to him.