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[Melca36]

inclemency wrote...

Melca36 wrote...

Screen shot  from one of the cutscenes in that new Dark Times mod.


*snip*

Oh, I was going to wait for a new revision with fixes, but think I'll try this out now!

I think they just uploaded a new released. I was trapped at the end. 

Other than that, its exceptionally well done and the voice acting is actually good!  The modders did a fabulous job.

[inclemency]

Nice! Downloading now, can't wait to try it

[Collider]

About a post made in the last page...



"whiny" is often just the person saying "I don't like this character." That's what I've learned through reading comments on BSN. If someone doesn't like a character, then that character whines all the time.

[Merilsell]

Yeah that is quite a valid observation for BSN, noticed that too. Before DA I was quite active in the ME-fandom...and there gets Kaidan called 'whiny' quite a lot, most by the same audience, so to speak, that also dislike Alistair and call him that. It's funny how predictable people can be. *cough*

[Aeowyn]

Emotional men I guess. Not to generalise everyone, but the same people who called Kaidan and Alistair whiny also think that Carth Onasi is whiny. Because he's suspicious.... which I would be as well if your mentor turn on you and launch an attack on your home that kill your wife and (before he knew anything) your son. Hmmmm

[sylvanaerie]

Collider wrote...

About a post made in the last page...

"whiny" is often just the person saying "I don't like this character." That's what I've learned through reading comments on BSN. If someone doesn't like a character, then that character whines all the time.

Indeed, I find Loghain extremely whiny throughout most of the game.  "Orlesians this, Orlesians that" (and wtf is this with the Joining instantly making you an Orlesian?) and then his behavior at the Landsmeet makes me want to shove his ugly mule kicked zombie face through the stone floor.  Real men stand up for what they've done and accept responsibility for it, not whine that 'it's not my fault' oh boohooo.  Have a tissue man...
Admittedly no one is on their best behavior at the Landsmeet.  I take sadistic glee pulling enough votes to overrule Anora (even when she sides with Daddy Dearest) and making Loghain attack everyone at the Landsmeet, then insulting his honor and then when I off the bastard, calling his daughter a b*tch. Ahhh good times

The only thing I don't like is the way he dies in front of his kid. Not even Anora deserves to have to watch that.  I'd prefer an option to take him to the tower instead but since the game doesn't give me a choice I kill him there.  Not even that spares him.  Usually I have Alistair kill him to take some of the sting from it (and it matters little to me if he is going to be king anyway) but if i want Anora to rule or if Loghain just really pissed me off especially that playthrough i do it myself.

[Aeowyn]

Well, if you've read The Calling you can kind of get a hint on why Loghain is suspicious of the Grey Wardens.

[inclemency]

Melca36 wrote...

inclemency wrote...

Melca36 wrote...
Screen shot  from one of the cutscenes in that new Dark Times mod.

*snip*

Oh, I was going to wait for a new revision with fixes, but think I'll try this out now!

I think they just uploaded a new released. I was trapped at the end. 

Other than that, its exceptionally well done and the voice acting is actually good!  The modders did a fabulous job.

So glad you brought this up as I'm now having a blast playing it.  Thanks!


A magic hat changes Jules from a blazing redhead to white pigtails, Alistair looks a bit shellshocked so he....


...grabbed the hat away and put it on, and voilà, instant crewcut!

Modifié par inclemency, 06 novembre 2010 - 02:00 .

[tuppence95]

Good morning, Alistairians!  After spending way too much time last night picking on a dumb kid, I need to concentrate on playing today!

sylvanaerie wrote...
Indeed, I find Loghain extremely whiny throughout most of the game.  "Orlesians this, Orlesians that" (and wtf is this with the Joining instantly making you an Orlesian?) and then his behavior at the Landsmeet makes me want to shove his ugly mule kicked zombie face through the stone floor.  Real men stand up for what they've done and accept responsibility for it, not whine that 'it's not my fault' oh boohooo.

Good post!  Yes, this is what bothers me the most about Loghain.  He may have felt he had good reasons for doing all the horrible things he did, but he never accepted responsibility and instead tried to pin the blame on others.  Even Jowan ended up being more of a man, in that respect, than Loghain.

Storm, how are they handling companion dialogue in the new mod?  Does Alistair speak silently or do they have someone else doing his voice?

[inclemency]

They have recycled lines that fit rather nicely so far. It's been really fun.  Almost spit out my tea when I saw that hat!  Lol, I decided not to show Alistair's face, let you see what he looks like in it yourselves rather than me spoiling it. 

Modifié par inclemency, 06 novembre 2010 - 02:21 .

[tuppence95]

Looking forward to it!  Now if I can just get my Cousland mage out of Lothering!  

[rak72]

inclemency wrote...

Aww, you poor thing...here's a Morrie for you

Her makeup looks nice!

[inclemency]

Lol, I had that problem, too. This current game is going on forever. Was just hitting the Denerim Gate on the way to the Archdemon when this mod came out. This game has taken me a long long time.

@rak, thanks, it's mostly the lighting as she's in front of the fireplace while talking to the Warden about the ritual.  All I did was add lipgloss and earrings to her.  The lighting in there is fantastic.

Modifié par inclemency, 06 novembre 2010 - 02:33 .

[Schratty]

phaonica wrote...
Schratty's Loghain is a good looking guy, but he's just not the Loghain I fell in  with. Though Loghain is lookin' pretty good in the pic Lady Jess posted earlier and I think she said that was tmp's morph. 

Lore takes a backseat to aesthetics in many of my NPC morphs. That's just how a I roll

[inclemency]

Schratty wrote...

phaonica wrote...
Schratty's Loghain is a good looking guy, but he's just not the Loghain I fell in  with. Though Loghain is lookin' pretty good in the pic Lady Jess posted earlier and I think she said that was tmp's morph. 

Lore takes a backseat to aesthetics in many of my NPC morphs. That's just how a I roll

And, I, for one, thank you for that!  *laughs* 

[tuppence95]

LOL!  I give up!  I can't keep up with cme's mod tester's group discussions.  Every time I peek, there's over 100 new posts to sort through.  I hope when she comes back and gets back to testing, I'll be able to keep up!  


Recycled Alistair

[KnightofPhoenix]

Shanara Windwalker wrote...

Okay, so seriously, that "other" thread aside....is he really whiny?

I don't think he is whiny. The real whiner is Oghren and he was still awesome in Origins.

He is rather way too affected, imo, by the loss of the Wardens he knew for 6 months. They are warriors, they could die in any battle, Duncan told him this. And Alistair admits he should have handled it better, but he didn't. So while I didn't think this was whining, I also felt this is not an attitude I'd like to have from a companion in the middle of a war when more people are going to die. 
So imo, he handles it poorily. And I am not talking about immediately after Ostagar. He brings this up several times later on.

And, imo, he could end up insulting Duncan's memory by deserting the Wardens, which is bordering hypocritical. Which for me shows that Alistair didn't really love Duncan for who he was (a calculating and very pragmatic man) but he rather loved the image he projected onto Duncan, aka him being a father.  Which again, I consider to be part of his self-centered nature.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 06 novembre 2010 - 03:48 .

[tuppence95]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Shanara Windwalker wrote...

Okay, so seriously, that "other" thread aside....is he really whiny?

I don't think he is whiny. The real whiner is Oghren and he was still awesome in Origins.

He is rather way too affected, imo, by the loss of the Wardens he knew for 6 months. They are warriors, they could die in any battle, Duncan told him this. And Alistair admits he should have handled it better, but he didn't. So while I didn't think this was whining, I also felt this is not an attitude I'd like to have from a companion in the middle of a war when more people are going to die. 
So imo, he handles it poorily. And I am not talking about immediately after Ostagar. He brings this up several times later on.

And, imo, he could end up insulting Duncan's memory by deserting the Wardens, which is bordering hypocritical. Which for me shows that Alistair didn't really love Duncan for who he was (a calculating and very pragmatic man) but he rather loved the image he projected onto Duncan, aka him being a father.  Which again, I consider to be part of his self-centered nature.

Yes, I completely agree with this bolded statement.  I think, if Duncan had lived, Alistair might have been dismayed by some of his decisions.  I think Gaider said Duncan might have just decided to completely abandon Ferelden.

But I don't think Alistair is self-centered in a selfish, "I'm more important than you are" way.  Often extremely insecure people come across as being selfish.  But their insecurities and fears do hold such a strong place in their minds that they become self-centered ... if that makes any sense.

*edited to add - also the only knowing them 6 months issue never was important in my mind.  It didn't matter if he only knew them for one week.  They were the first glimmer of hope that he had in his life, and when that was suddenly taken away from him, I think it crushed his spirit.

Modifié par tuppence95, 06 novembre 2010 - 03:56 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

tuppence95 wrote...
Yes, I completely agree with this bolded statement.  I think, if Duncan had lived, Alistair might have been dismayed by some of his decisions.  I think Gaider said Duncan might have just decided to completely abandon Ferelden.

To join the Wardens at the borders, yes. Not completely abandon the fight against the blight like Alistair did.
Just saying, because I know someone will say "Aha!" on the Landsmeet issue.

tuppence95 wrote...
But I don't think Alistair is self-centered in a selfish, "I'm more important than you are" way.  Often extremely insecure people come across as being selfish.  But their insecurities and fears do hold such a strong place in their minds that they become self-centered ... if that makes any sense.

Yes, and I've always stressed that by self-centered, I do not mean selfish. Just that he thinks that things revolve around him, when they don't and even if they do, more important things are at stake.

tuppence95 wrote...
*edited to add - also the only knowing them 6 months issue never was important in my mind.  It didn't matter if he only knew them for one week.  They were the first glimmer of hope that he had in his life, and when that was suddenly taken away from him, I think it crushed his spirit.

I think it was rather the image he gave them that was shattered and not the reality of it.
See, I personally do not think that 6 months is enough to develop a real bond with complete strangers as to consider them family and grieve for them this much unless they were fighting side by side in battles, which I don't think happened yet.

I think, again, that he didn't love the Wardens for who they are, but for the image he projected on them. An understandable image, for the reasons you've posted, but it's somewhat naive.

In fact, I think he was so in love with this image that he completely ignored the ruthlessness expected from Wardens. He says it himself, Wardens do whatever is necessary. He saw Duncan kill Jory without hesitation. He presumabely knows what Wardens did in the past. And he wasn't bothered, because he belived they were his family. That also contributed to my interpretation that Alistair is not really concerned about morality as much as people would think.

EDIT: actually, Alistair might have fought in the 3 battles before Ostagar.
I guess a better way to explain this is that Alistair saw the Wardens as family, which could be true, but they were a military order first and foremost, potential family second.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 06 novembre 2010 - 04:21 .

[philiposophy]

I think that Alistair's behaviour at the Landsmeet is very emotional and thus not totally reflective of his true character.

He has a slightly idealized view of the Grey Wardens and Duncan, but it's not naive in the same way as someone like Wynne does. He knows they have to get their hands dirty (he knows about the Joining and saw Duncan shank Jory).

I think that if he walks out on the Wardens, he would regret it later and feel he acted wrongly. If the Blight had not been defeated when it did, I like to think that he would have realized he was being a fool and gone to join the Wardens on the border with Orlais.

[tuppence95]

Actually, KoP, your thinking on this subject isn't that far off from mine.  We just come to different conclusions about it.  

I agree that Alistair probably didn't even know these Grey Wardens well enough to even consider them close friends.  I think his mind held on to a fantasy about them.  All he ever wanted in life was to have a family.  And the companionship that he was getting from them made him feel like there was hope for him after all.  It was kinda like the fantasy he had built up in his mind about Goldanna.

I'm not sure either that he cared that as much about morality as people often think.  I'm sure he did want to make the moral choices.  But he is such a conflicted person.  Sometimes those choices fight his dream of finally having someone to care about who might also care about him, even when it's not a romance.

I know that problem well.  I was involved with someone once, and I had this whole silly fantasy built up in my head about him.  It turned out to have very little to do with reality, and I ended up messing things up because of my unrealistic expectations.  But you couldn't have convinced me of my mistake until I was able to see it myself, which took an embarrassingly long time.

Anyway, I see Alistair's faults and self-deceptions as part of the reasons I like his character so much.  You see them as weaknesses that are hard to forgive.  It's like I was saying last night.  I think it's so interesting that we can all look at characters and events in this game and see something completely different.

[KnightofPhoenix]

tuppence95 wrote...
 You see them as weaknesses that are hard to forgive. 

I do see it as a weakness, but I don't think they are hard to forgive. Mostly because it doesn't affect me personally, for me to forgive him for it or not.
Except maybe at the Landsmeet, but I didn't base my decision on me not forgiving his weaknesses. It was more practical than that.
I do see them as hard to ignore however. And I see them as traits that are not fit for great leadership.  

But yea indeed, that's the beauty of the game.

[rak72]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

tuppence95 wrote...
 You see them as weaknesses that are hard to forgive. 

I do see it as a weakness, but I don't think they are hard to forgive. Mostly because it doesn't affect me personally, for me to forgive him for it or not.
Except maybe at the Landsmeet, but I didn't base my decision on me not forgiving his weaknesses. It was more practical than that.
I do see them as hard to ignore however. And I see them as traits that are not fit for great leadership.  

But yea indeed, that's the beauty of the game.

As a girl, it makes me want to hug him closely, kiss him on the forhead, and teach him what true love means.  Once he learns, he will be an unstoppable bastion of manly kickass machoness, while preserving his soft, tender side. 

Yes, yes I know - don't flame me about the whole girly girl princess cous cous crap.  It's MY fantasy.

[sylvanaerie]

rak72 wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

tuppence95 wrote...
 You see them as weaknesses that are hard to forgive. 

I do see it as a weakness, but I don't think they are hard to forgive. Mostly because it doesn't affect me personally, for me to forgive him for it or not.
Except maybe at the Landsmeet, but I didn't base my decision on me not forgiving his weaknesses. It was more practical than that.
I do see them as hard to ignore however. And I see them as traits that are not fit for great leadership.  

But yea indeed, that's the beauty of the game.

As a girl, it makes me want to hug him closely, kiss him on the forhead, and teach him what true love means.  Once he learns, he will be an unstoppable bastion of manly kickass machoness, while preserving his soft, tender side. 

Yes, yes I know - don't flame me about the whole girly girl princess cous cous crap.  It's MY fantasy.

Nothing wrong with that at all.  I enjoy being a girl and Alistair pushes all the right buttons to get my heart going.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Eh, I love Morrigan precisely because she is independent and would scoff at the idea of me teaching her actively. She of course has flaws of her own and yes, I do believe that her experience with the Warden does teach her something. But it's certainly not with the Warden hugging her and kissing her forehead and then teach her how a woman is supposed to be

It's rather something she learns on her own, I think.