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[sylvanaerie]

Zjarcal wrote...

Going through the toolset and Alistair's dialogue, I found a line I had never seen that cracked me up way too much. After he tells you how he was raised by flying dogs you can say:

"Do you write at least? I bet your mother's a b!tch."

The things you miss for not having enough points in cunning early in the game.

LOL and he laughs too!  I have used that a couple times cause I use the stat books mod and yea its cheating but I don't like missing stuff.  So my PC's usually have 30 cunning before I go into Korcari Wilds.  Flemeth has a couple good lines if you have a cunning of 30 when you first meet her also.
Damn ToP...Okay Alistair's response to Morrigan's take on Kaitlyn's plight...Frankly since I hate that whiney boring as dirty dishwater girl I have to agree...and wish that was an option...

Modifié par sylvanaerie, 06 novembre 2010 - 08:13 .

[Bruddajakka]

You know I think Origins is the only game where I've liked the default names enough not to change them. Well the male names in any event.

[Lady Jess]

sylvanaerie wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

Going through the toolset and Alistair's dialogue, I found a line I had never seen that cracked me up way too much. After he tells you how he was raised by flying dogs you can say:

"Do you write at least? I bet your mother's a b!tch."

The things you miss for not having enough points in cunning early in the game.

LOL and he laughs too!  I have used that a couple times cause I use the stat books mod and yea its cheating but I don't like missing stuff.  So my PC's usually have 30 cunning before I go into Korcari Wilds.  Flemeth has a couple good lines if you have a cunning of 30 when you first meet her also.

I think my city elf is going to use that one. She's a snarky bookworm type, and I think she'll get Alistair...I planned Zev but I don't know.

[Lady Jess]

Oh where did THAT line of epic snark come from up there?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Caladhiel wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...Good you specified computer game, cause I was going to mention God of War
I am pretty sure "Athena" was a specialization for the Greeks in Age of Mythology (RTS) though.

Figures. Mythology without the Gods is a no-go, I guess. I hope it was a *good* specialisation, at least

I can't remember, I msotly played the Egyptians lol

@ Rak
Haha, nice. Though I dislike that Ayman's variant is Dexter....I prefer Ayman.

[Addai]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
Unfortunately for you, KoP, David Gaider and the game writers disagree and have written both Maric and Alistair as successful kings whereas according to your philosophy, both should have crashed and burned.  Sorry buddy. 

Don't put words in my mouth, I never said both should have crashed and burned and I said before, both are decent rulers. But just that, decent. I don't think either of them qualifies as a great leader and ruler. 
Furthermore, this depends heavily on what country they are in. Put Alistair in Orlais or Orzammar for instance, and he would amount to nothing at all.

And do they really disagree with me? They made Harrowmont a complete pile of fail, while Bhelen was the great king.

Well but it's completely your assumption that Alistair = Harrowmont and Anora = Bhelen.  I see it as the other way around.  Anora is the status quo and Alistair represents a new day, with a greater interest in the common people.  It's true that Alistair gives an approval bump for choosing Harrowmont, but that's because Bhelen is so obviously a snake.  But I almost always choose Bhelen and almost always make Alistair king, and I think they will work together just fine.  Edit:  Also, I think the dissolution of the Assembly is a pretty big pile of fail in Bhelen's corner, especially given that that is what he was planning all along.

Modifié par Addai67, 06 novembre 2010 - 08:39 .

[Addai]

yo broooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo wrote...

If he really is a virgin then its proof heros always get the girls.

Just because you're a virgin doesn't make you an antisocial idiot?  Alistair is hot and he acts like a gentleman.  Mystery solved.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Addai67 wrote...
Well but it's completely your assumption that Alistair = Harrowmont and Anora = Bhelen.  I see it as the other way around. 

And where did I say that Alistair = Harrowmont?
I said what I said, to show that Bioware writers do not disagree with my philosophy.

Anora is closer to Bhelen for being ambitious and cunning, traits Alistair lacks.

Addai67 wrote...
Anora is the status quo and Alistair represents a new day, with a greater interest in the common people. 

Or Alistair is the status quo with the Therein precedent and Anora, of commoner origin, is bringing change by focusing on trade, the middle class and building a university, which is also beneficial to the common people.

Addai67 wrote...
Edit:  Also, I think the dissolution of the Assembly is a pretty big pile of fail in Bhelen's corner, especially given that that is what he was planning all along.

And that's not "fail" at all. You may not like it, but it's efficient thus is not a fail. In fact, Bhelen so easily removing a centuries old institution, after they tried to assassinate him, without so much hurting his position, shows how good he was and how useless the Assembly is.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 06 novembre 2010 - 08:56 .

[sylvanaerie]

Unfortunately any inroads he makes as a sole ruler/dictator are going to end when he dies. Or throw the dwarves into further chaos, without him to force those old fogeys into doing what he wants. Where I feel Bioware failed was in expecting that much change to be accomplished in (however many years) he is king. And once he's dead, where is the leadership? A son? who may or may not be raised as ruthless as he is? Making things worse? They won't even have the Assembly (who are mostly fools anyway).

The whole Orzammar situation is just...lose lose to me. Do you elect a weak (mostly moral guy-and Harrowmont has his flaws in that department too) or do you elect a strong ruthless ****** only out for his own gain?

[KnightofPhoenix]

sylvanaerie wrote...
And once he's dead, where is the leadership? A son? who may or may not be raised as ruthless as he is? Making things worse?

If Endrin, Bhelen's son, is raised to be like his father, it will be perfect for Orzammar.

It is not necessary for Orzammar and its system to crumble after Bhelen. He has all the time he needs to focus on a smooth succession. He might fail to do that, or he might succeed (and many have in the past). We can't tell. However his much needed reforms are likely going to be irreversible after his death (or very hard to reverse) regardless.

Harrowmont on the otherhand is guaranteed failure. So it's not lose-lose for me. It's lose - great win with a slight chance of lose at the end that can be avoided

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 06 novembre 2010 - 09:02 .

[nos_astra]

The funny thing is, I thought the Assembly and the Landsmeet are predecessors of democracy, yet you seem to favour dictatorship. Why is something many would consider praiseworthy today (albeit an incomplete and flawed version) the totally wrong way in DAO?

Modifié par klarabella, 06 novembre 2010 - 09:24 .

[sylvanaerie]

I don't believe change is that easy to accomplish. Especially since Bhelen's sole purpose is holding on to his own power. A smooth transition? No I dont' see Endrin getting it. Bhelen is going to grasp it and not going to relinquish it to anyone, even his son. I wouldnt' be surprised if he strangles his own son before the boy gets old enough to oust/kill him. And if Endrin ISN'T raised to be like that, then he's a guppy swimming in a shark tank. Unlike Anora who actually seems to have Ferelden's best interests in mind (even if she is ambitious enough to give Bhelen a run for his money) everything Bhelen does is for Bhelen, not Orzammar.

Orzammar is going to go down in flames just like all the other dwarven cities I fear, with either a weak ruler unable to do diddly squat or a ruthless dictator out for his own whims. I guess though only time will tell.

[KnightofPhoenix]

klarabella wrote...

The funny thing is, I thought the Assembly and the Landsmeet are predecessors of democracy, yet you seem to favour dictatorship. Why is something many would consider praiseworthy today (albeit an incomplete and flawed version) the totally wrong way in DAO?

The Assembly is purely oligarchic and has nothing to do with democracy. The Landmseet is different, because the banns are, in theory, chosen from the bottom and not the top, and I am not in favour of disolving the Landsmeet. It is not however democratic. It still leans towards oligarchy.

I favour the system and regime that works at a specific time and place.
Modern political beliefs and systems have little bearing on a medieval setting with completely different political concerns and environment.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 06 novembre 2010 - 09:47 .

[Gilsa]

Heeeeey, this thread passed page 666 without any Alicorn or Alistair/Loghain sex scenes. People are asleep at the wheel! =p

[sylvanaerie]

Gilsa wrote...

Heeeeey, this thread passed page 666 without any Alicorn or Alistair/Loghain sex scenes. People are asleep at the wheel! =p

Hi Gilsa.  Long time no see.  I've missed you.

[KnightofPhoenix]

sylvanaerie wrote...
 Especially since Bhelen's sole purpose is holding on to his own power.

How do you know that? You speak as if it's fact.
It isn't.

One being personally ambitious does not exclude the possibilty that he also has Orzammar's interests at heart.
This whole: either one has his own interests at heart OR the interests of his community but not both, is nonsense. One can have both.
Octavian / Augustus is a prime example.

sylvanaerie wrote...
Bhelen is going to grasp it and not going to relinquish it to anyone, even his son. I wouldnt' be surprised if he strangles his own son before the boy gets old enough to oust/kill him.

Even he knows he is going to die and wil prepare for a succession for after his death.

This is all speculation. It could happen. It doesn't have to happen. It's all based on the assumption that Bhelen only cares about himself, which I see no evidence for.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 06 novembre 2010 - 09:41 .

[Gilsa]

Hi hi. This thread is making me miss Alistair -- more specifically, the whole epic ride that comes with a great romance! I've just loaded up my Netflix queue with romance movies. Glad to see most of the folks are still around -- didn't know if Witch Hunt being the last DLC along with the book closing on Alistair/Warden would put a damper on this thread.

[mellifera]

GILSAAAAAAAAAA

[sylvanaerie]

Its a case of perceiving things/people differently in game then. I see plenty of evidence that suggests Bhelen is out for his own needs but that's my perception of his actions. That his needs coincide with something actually good for Orzammar is IMO just a coincidence.



I do not believe Harrowmont is the better man for the job. And I have put Bhelen on the throne more often than not. I just don't think in the long run his 'changes' are going to amount to everything everyone expects them to because 1) I am a pessimist where dictators are concerned and 2) I know that change isn't going to be accomplished overnight or even over one generation.

Yes I do see him killing his own son if that son threatens his power/rule/life. And if he doesn't I can see Bhelen killing him for being too weak to 'play the game' and not being a threat.

And, of course, like anything that happens off screen, this is all speculation on my part. Others are certainly welcome to debate this.

[sylvanaerie]

Gilsa wrote...

Hi hi. This thread is making me miss Alistair -- more specifically, the whole epic ride that comes with a great romance! I've just loaded up my Netflix queue with romance movies. Glad to see most of the folks are still around -- didn't know if Witch Hunt being the last DLC along with the book closing on Alistair/Warden would put a damper on this thread.

I took a long break to do some writing.  But I still play DAO somewhat.  Dahlia has released a new mod for the ending and there are a lot of new faces on the board so new Alistairians have arrived.  The templar soldiers on

[KnightofPhoenix]

sylvanaerie wrote...
in the long run his 'changes' are going to amount to everything everyone expects them to because 1) I am a pessimist where dictators are concerned and 2) I know that change isn't going to be accomplished overnight or even over one generation.

I personally do not believe that Bhelen's rule alone is going to make a 180 degree turn with Orzammar, no. But every long term change needs a strong foundational basis, which is what Bhelen is providing and that will be hard to reverse.

It will be extremily hard for someone after Bhelen to put the casteless back where they were. They submitted before, but once they had a taste of rights they never had, I don't see them submitting that easily again.
Orzammar opening up to the surface and acquiring wealth as a result, and that will make the populace weary about being isolated again. Also, his weakening of caste restrictions and surface trading are hard to reverse when they go into full effect.

If long term change is going to come to Orzammar, Bhelen's reforms are a strong foundational basis for that. Eventually, Bhelen's regime might collapse or reform itself, but the system as a whole and the social impact of his reforms can be maintained and would be very hard to overthrow.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 06 novembre 2010 - 10:00 .

[Lady Jess]

How bout a quick doodle since I have no screenshots.

[sylvanaerie]

Perhaps it can reform.  Perhaps (Whomever) takes over once Bhelen is gone might be able to maintain the reforms and build on them.  Make them for the good of Orzammar.  In that I CAN see hope for the city.  I see it taking several generations though if it does.  The dwarves revere their ancestors and 'the stone' for good reason, as many of their traditions (and personalities) seem to be as if they were carved in stone.
It is said "an ill wind blows no good" and not even Bhelen (unlike Harrowmont) is that. 
At the time my PC is there though it seems very much a lose/lose situation  I just want my friggin' troops not to swim in the shark tank of dwarven politics.

awwwthats cute LJ!

Modifié par sylvanaerie, 06 novembre 2010 - 10:08 .

[CalJones]

I'm sure you've seen this one before but enjoy if you haven't.