39010 réponses à ce sujet

[Axekix]

Gilsa wrote...

SurelyForth wrote...

I'm a little annoyed that David Gaider considers that all non-Morrigan romances got closure in DAO. Yes, she leaves. But, if you play Awakening, Leliana and Zevran leave AND you're separated from Alistair. And then everyone just disappears without explanation. I really don't see how that's closure.

New post from DG:

David Gaider wrote...

Saibh wrote...
It just feels like this is the conclusion the story of men who romanced Morrigan. 

Consider this:

If you're looking on this only from the romance perspective, out of all the romances in Dragon Age Morrigan's is the only one you never get any personal closure on. Not even a little bit. I understand wanting more from Alistair, Zevran and Leliana but you do at least get something from them... whereas from Morrigan you get nothing (albeit for very good reasons).

So for those men who romanced Morrigan, you might want to cut them some slack.

That said, that's not the only reason to do this DLC-- I would think many people would be curious as to what the future holds regarding Morrigan. And, yes, it takes all the various ending states of Origins into account. And, yes, in case anyone's wondering I wrote the Morrigan part.

I think... I think I just squeed.  It was a very manly squee though.

[Sarah1281]

Carth- Because saying: I held my dead wife, and screamed for help with my son gone as well, all because my hero, and friend bombed my home as a traitor. - HOW IS THAT WHINY?

I think what annoyed people more was his huge trust issues - justified those they may be - when they didn't feel that they had done anything to deserve it...until they found out that they totally did.

Also as a male gamer I take offence to be painted with the "Cant take a challenge Alpha Male" brush. I actually like in games when people dont just go along with you. Mainly why I like Wrex, Shale, or Alistair.

I like having to earn NPCs' respect. If they just didn't respect you and thought you were clueless the whole game no matter what you did then that would get really annoying, though.

[Giggles_Manically]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Carth- Because saying: I held my dead wife, and screamed for help with my son gone as well, all because my hero, and friend bombed my home as a traitor. - HOW IS THAT WHINY?

I think what annoyed people more was his huge trust issues - justified those they may be - when they didn't feel that they had done anything to deserve it...until they found out that they totally did.

Also as a male gamer I take offence to be painted with the "Cant take a challenge Alpha Male" brush. I actually like in games when people dont just go along with you. Mainly why I like Wrex, Shale, or Alistair.

I like having to earn NPCs' respect. If they just didn't respect you and thought you were clueless the whole game no matter what you did then that would get really annoying, though.

Carth was my third favourite charchter in KOTOR behind Jolee and Canderous.

Taking him to Korriban made me laugh:
So great its a popularity contest?
or "Well not as much as are master can cause , ohh nothing"

Alistair isint whiny also, he is grieving and takes a while to get over it.

[Addai]

Axekix wrote...
I think... I think I just squeed.  It was a very manly squee though.

Did it hurt? 

[mellifera]

Axekix wrote...

Gilsa wrote...

SurelyForth wrote...

I'm a little annoyed that David Gaider considers that all non-Morrigan romances got closure in DAO. Yes, she leaves. But, if you play Awakening, Leliana and Zevran leave AND you're separated from Alistair. And then everyone just disappears without explanation. I really don't see how that's closure.

New post from DG:

David Gaider wrote...

Saibh wrote...
It just feels like this is the conclusion the story of men who romanced Morrigan. 

Consider this:

If you're looking on this only from the romance perspective, out of all the romances in Dragon Age Morrigan's is the only one you never get any personal closure on. Not even a little bit. I understand wanting more from Alistair, Zevran and Leliana but you do at least get something from them... whereas from Morrigan you get nothing (albeit for very good reasons).

So for those men who romanced Morrigan, you might want to cut them some slack.

That said, that's not the only reason to do this DLC-- I would think many people would be curious as to what the future holds regarding Morrigan. And, yes, it takes all the various ending states of Origins into account. And, yes, in case anyone's wondering I wrote the Morrigan part.

I think... I think I just squeed.  It was a very manly squee though.

Keep telling yourself that *has it recorded*

[Sandtigress]

yukidama wrote...

Axekix wrote...

I think... I think I just squeed.  It was a very manly squee though.

Keep telling yourself that *has it recorded*

I wanna hear, I wanna hear!

[Addai]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Also as a male gamer I take offence to be painted with the "Cant take a challenge Alpha Male" brush. I actually like in games when people dont just go along with you. Mainly why I like Wrex, Shale, or Alistair.

The only reason I dont like the Redcliffe scene is that he says killing Connor is an option and perferable. Then if you do that he howls about it, I know why he does it, dosent change the fact that he goes on about it like its all the PCs fault.

Oh fine.    I'm just speculating as to why he said specifically that an older male veteran warrior, mistrustful of the PC's decisions, was not being received well by male players.  You have to admit that the perception at least is that people want the PC to be BAMFest of them all, though that is not only male players.

Modifié par Addai67, 25 août 2010 - 09:18 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Addai67 wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Shame. Alistair would have been much more interesting. To me that is.

He did say specifically that it was male players who weren't reacting well to the sour, mistrustful Alistair.  Too much challenge to their alpha male status as PC, I gather.  And now some of those same guys complain about Alistair being a weak whiner.  *chuckle*  I mean, just look at the rage about the one time that Alistair won't back down, and carry that through the game?  The rage, the rage, I can't imagine it.  Loghain is well received as a companion because he's a whipped dog at that point, the PC has his boot on his neck and he just folds and does a 180 on everything he's said up to that point.

Male players are obviously where the money is, so we have to live with it, fortunately for us it all worked out with Alistair. 

Yea, I gather that many of them are petty.
 
I would have preferred having Alistair like that, but I guess we got Sten.
And the current Alsitair isn't too bad, so no point in focusing on what ifs. 

[Giggles_Manically]

Addai67 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Also as a male gamer I take offence to be painted with the "Cant take a challenge Alpha Male" brush. I actually like in games when people dont just go along with you. Mainly why I like Wrex, Shale, or Alistair.

The only reason I dont like the Redcliffe scene is that he says killing Connor is an option and perferable. Then if you do that he howls about it, I know why he does it, dosent change the fact that he goes on about it like its all the PCs fault.

Oh fine.    I'm just speculating as to why he said specifically that an older male veteran warrior, mistrustful of the PC's decisions, was not being received well by male players.  You have to admit that the perception at least is that people want the PC to be BAMFest of them all, though that is not only male players.

Not to derail but:
IN ME1 when Wrex stood up for the Krogan and the Genophage I got a lot of respect for him.
Unlike some of my friends who do fit that brush, I love when NPCs stand on their own two feet and say HELLZ NO!

Like when Alistair TKOed Loghain in the Landsmeet.
Totally proves that he is a BAMF in that moment right there.

[tuppence95]

<runs around kicking things>    

[maxernst]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

The only reason I dont like the Redcliffe scene is that he says killing Connor is an option and perferable. Then if you do that he howls about it, I know why he does it, dosent change the fact that he goes on about it like its all the PCs fault.

When does he say it's preferable?  IIRC, he advises killing Connor before he knows there are any other options.  The Templars are never told that mages can go into the fade after a demon to save an abomination.  He only learns that when Morrigan or Jowan pipes up.

[RogueWarrior626]

Back to Morrigan for a sec. I truely believe her exit in Origins will play a very serious part in one of the future games to come. Cmon how many witches give birth to a Ancient God. Future DA game?

[DahliaLynn]

Sorry, I realize this is off topic in a sense, just stepping in here for one moment to let you know the Elf version of the kiss is up. *pant*

[Maria13]

RogueWarrior626 wrote...

Back to Morrigan for a sec. I truely believe her exit in Origins will play a very serious part in one of the future games to come. Cmon how many witches give birth to a Ancient God. Future DA game?

OT?

[Maria13]

DahliaLynn wrote...

Sorry, I realize this is off topic in a sense, just stepping in here for one moment to let you know the Elf version of the kiss is up. *pant*

Wow!

[Giggles_Manically]

maxernst wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

The only reason I dont like the Redcliffe scene is that he says killing Connor is an option and perferable. Then if you do that he howls about it, I know why he does it, dosent change the fact that he goes on about it like its all the PCs fault.

When does he say it's preferable?  IIRC, he advises killing Connor before he knows there are any other options.  The Templars are never told that mages can go into the fade after a demon to save an abomination.  He only learns that when Morrigan or Jowan pipes up.

That was in my first run where I didnt know how to use the Litany so no mages, and then told Jowan to get the hell out of dodge.
oops.

[Addai]

DahliaLynn wrote...

Sorry, I realize this is off topic in a sense, just stepping in here for one moment to let you know the Elf version of the kiss is up. *pant*

The squee, it is epic!!!!
Blast that I have 1 1/2 hours left at my %^(@ desk before I can try it out. 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Maria13 wrote...

RogueWarrior626 wrote...

Back to Morrigan for a sec. I truely believe her exit in Origins will play a very serious part in one of the future games to come. Cmon how many witches give birth to a Ancient God. Future DA game?

OT?

It would have been seen as completely on-topic in the previous thread.
But that's because I was a regular member

[maxernst]

Addai67 wrote...

Interesting bit from a David Gaider interview.

I remember Alistair actually is one on Origins I really enjoyed writing just because, most people don’t know this, but we had an entire version of Alistair where he was this grim, veteran warrior. Older and just a very serious type who was very distrustful of you and he wasn’t much fun.
Nobody was liking him because he was being so distrustful. We really wanted to set this up as a romance interest as well as a good buddy for a male player and it wasn’t working.
It was really touching on that Carth (A KOTOR character Gaider also wrote) vibe a little bit much but he really hit a bad note with the male players. So, it came down as one of those revisions where we just couldn’t fix him. There’s something fundamentally wrong here so I had to go back and go, ‘alright how about I just have a little bit more fun with him and maybe the player will too.’ And so I did.
Even though it was painful to make the decision to start all over, it really worked out well I thought. I think Alistair and the fact that he’s fun really came across. He was quite a popular character.

From here.  I'm really glad we got the Alistair we got and not the Loghainistair that was originally conceived!

Ah, so that's why the toolset says Alistair is 32.  The real problem I see with that character is that it doesn't make much sense for him to follow you at all.  He's older, more experienced and the senior warden...why would he allow someone he doesn't trust to lead?

[Eudaemonium]

DahliaLynn wrote...

Sorry, I realize this is off topic in a sense, just stepping in here for one moment to let you know the Elf version of the kiss is up. *pant*

*bows at your feet*

[Eudaemonium]

[quote]Giggles_Manically wrote...

[quote]maxernst wrote...

[quote]Giggles_Manically wrote...

The only reason I dont like the Redcliffe scene is that he says killing Connor is an option and perferable. Then if you do that he howls about it, I know why he does it, dosent change the fact that he goes on about it like its all the PCs fault.[/quote]

When does he say it's preferable?  IIRC, he advises killing Connor before he knows there are any other options.  The Templars are never told that mages can go into the fade after a demon to save an abomination.  He only learns that when Morrigan or Jowan pipes up.

[/quote]
That was in my first run where I didnt know how to use the Litany so no mages, and then told Jowan to get the hell out of dodge.
oops.

He always suggests that in my experience. And you migth not even learn about the Tower option unless you pick certain dialogue options. I think what annoys me is not so much that he freaks when you do it (I mean, you/he just killed a kid), but that he explicitly tells you that you should have done Jowan's ritual instead, when he was so against it as 'blood magic' (not to mention he rips on you if you do it anyway).

Modifié par Eudaemonium, 25 août 2010 - 09:54 .

[DahliaLynn]

lol

Releasing it as a work in progress, since I can no longer work on it and stay sane at the same time. ..I plan on improving on it some time in the future. (just so you know)

[rak72]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

That was in my first run where I didnt know how to use the Litany so no mages, and then told Jowan to get the hell out of dodge.
oops.

I wasn't the only one

Modifié par rak72, 25 août 2010 - 09:54 .

[Zjarcal]

maxernst wrote...
The Templars are never told that mages can go into the fade after a demon to save an abomination. 

Are you sure about this? I find it hard to believe to be honest, but if it were true then it would make me much more willing to cut Alistair some slack in that scenario. As I posted a few pages back, that is my main beef with him, how he suggests one thing first and then yells at you for doing it, but if he really didn't know about the Fade option then that changes everything.

[Sarah1281]

I didn't know how to use the litany on my first playthrough either...so when Wynne said Irving was dead I reloaded.