97 réponses à ce sujet

[numotsbane]

Why is it always a choice between the widow and the Revenant? Why doesn't the claymore get any love?

WHY?

[tmk]

Because the people who have to choose between Widow and Revenant are playing as soldiers, and Claymore is more of a vanguard weapon.

Modifié par tmk, 13 août 2010 - 07:31 .

[Tokion]

The Geth Shotgun is better than the Claymore by miles. It takes time to get used to the *release to fire* mechanism, but that baby can kill in long and short range...AND it includes alternate fire.

[thq95]

I didn't mind the Revenant too much, but I would trade it for the the spectre assault rifile I had in the first game. Heck, I would trade every piece of equipment I had in ME2 for that thing overpowered or not. 2 fictionless material + Sledgehammer rounds = good times.

[JaegerBane]

termokanden wrote...

The Locust doesn't have the highest dps though, does it? 24 or 25 damage per shot as I recall, and not that insane in RoF.

I'm not arguing that it isn't a good gun. It has incredibly accuracy. But the best? I would rather use the Rev personally.

If we are talking about ME1 guns, what this game is missing is the top spectre sniper rifle with two Rail Extension VIIs and High Explosive Rounds X. Most hilarious gun I've ever used in any game I think. Sure it overheats with every shot, but your target is thrown about 10 feet back and anyone around it just dies. One shot one kill indeed. All that's left is a burning corpse

OniGanon made my point better than I did - realistically, the Locust's combo of reasonable punch per shot, full auto fire and virtually non-existant recoil essentially makes it a very flexible weapon that doesn't do anything particularly badly, has an effective DPS and shines at medium range.

If we're dicussing what the best overall weapon is all things considered, that little monster gets my vote. The rev is a brilliant gun but there's areas where it has quite explicit weaknesses. Any range beyond short requires burst firing over full auto and thereby partially defeating the object of the Rev... and it overlaps to a great degree with the shotgun.

The choice between the Mattock and the Revenant is a real hard one - I genuinely can't, hand on heart, say which I resolutely prefer. And I play a modded Adept, where the decision between Rev and Mattock is actually relevant

Modifié par JaegerBane, 13 août 2010 - 12:13 .

[Super ._. Shepard]

i like it

[Bozorgmehr]

JaegerBane wrote...

The choice between the Mattock and the Revenant is a real hard one - I genuinely can't, hand on heart, say which I resolutely prefer. And I play a modded Adept, where the decision between Rev and Mattock is actually relevant

What's your Adept using at the moment? The Revenant or Mattock? I think the Mattocks is pretty much the perfect (without modding) weapon for the Adept. I really love this new gun - a much better pick compared to the Rev. Only ammo can be a pain - meaning it's Locust-Time

[JaegerBane]

Bozorgmehr wrote...

What's your Adept using at the moment? The Revenant or Mattock? I think the Mattocks is pretty much the perfect (without modding) weapon for the Adept. I really love this new gun - a much better pick compared to the Rev. Only ammo can be a pain - meaning it's Locust-Time

I tried out both (I'm going to restart my current playthrough when LotSB comes out due to this myth about the Adept getting an upgrade...).

I think it really depends on what else you're carrying and how the Adept is playing. It's still a good choice to keep the Locust as it compensates for the low ammo of the Mattock and the low accuracy of the Revenant... so I'd probably say it's down to nothing more than personal preference.

I will say that it's a good idea to go for the Scimitar over the GPS if you're carrying the Mattock, as it does a lot to keep up your short range firepower. GPS is probably a better choice if you're carrying the Revenant.

In terms of firepower I'd say they're more or less equal.

[Bozorgmehr]

JaegerBane wrote...

I tried out both (I'm going to restart my current playthrough when LotSB comes out due to this myth about the Adept getting an upgrade...).

Adept is powerful enough as it is - but a Minagen X3 shot (like medkits) would be nice. Biotics are unbelievable powerful when Shep is intoxicated. Singularities (and even a lvl 1 Throw) change into some Incinerate-Inferno Grenade bomb or something. Uploading a new vid (should be online tonight) where a single Singularity takes out 4 enemies (2 Eclipse Vanguards and 2 Initiates) fully protected!

I think it really depends on what else you're carrying and how the Adept is playing. It's still a good choice to keep the Locust as it compensates for the low ammo of the Mattock and the low accuracy of the Revenant... so I'd probably say it's down to nothing more than personal preference.

I will say that it's a good idea to go for the Scimitar over the GPS if you're carrying the Mattock, as it does a lot to keep up your short range firepower. GPS is probably a better choice if you're carrying the Revenant.

In terms of firepower I'd say they're more or less equal.

Asari Shepard is using the Mattock/Locust/Phalanx setup at the moment - not as veratile as the Widow/Revenant/Scimitar/Locust/HP? build you're using, but she's doing fine

[jbblue05]

numotsbane wrote...

Why is it always a choice between the widow and the Revenant? Why doesn't the claymore get any love?
WHY?

Most people like sitting back and taking enemies down at range.  

I have a modded soldier with Revvy Widow and Claymore and I use the Claymore more then Widow

The Claymore is so beastly in AR  I killed Uvenk and his bodyguards just using the Claymore
I also did the same thing against Enyala? The Asari commando I took her and her personal guard out with the Claymore

I don't need Charge to be effective with shotguns and CQC is so fun

[JaegerBane]

Bozorgmehr wrote...

Adept is powerful enough as it is - but a Minagen X3 shot (like medkits) would be nice. Biotics are unbelievable powerful when Shep is intoxicated. Singularities (and even a lvl 1 Throw) change into some Incinerate-Inferno Grenade bomb or something. Uploading a new vid (should be online tonight) where a single Singularity takes out 4 enemies (2 Eclipse Vanguards and 2 Initiates) fully protected!

Yeah, well, an Adept with a soldier payload is more powerful than chuck norris, so it's not so much a desire for power and more to do with not missing out. Even it's just an extra power or something, it doesn't matter.

It's not like I'm sat twiddling my thumbs - I'm going to play through Starcraft 2 first (that is a seriously fantastic game - the new stuff is really cool but the campaign lets you use updated starcraft 1 units, it just rocks ) so I can wait.

Asari Shepard is using the Mattock/Locust/Phalanx setup at the moment - not as veratile as the Widow/Revenant/Scimitar/Locust/HP? build you're using, but she's doing fine

To be honest, if we're talking about sheer versatility, the best selection I've played with so far is still the Locust/Revenant/Widow/Claymore combo. You've basically got two weapons each for both long and short range that excel at different aspects of it.

The Rev and the Claymore are both highly effective at short range, but the Claymore's better for pop-up attacks and quick shots while the Rev is better for extended fights and sustained fire. Similarly, the Widow is better for single one-shot-kills and traditional sniping while the Locust is better for multiple target long range fighting. 

Considering these guns were never intended to function together, as a whole, they compliment each other incredibly well. They also look pretty cool all loaded onto your back, really badass

[termokanden]

JaegerBane wrote...

If we're dicussing what the best overall weapon is all things considered, that little monster gets my vote. The rev is a brilliant gun but there's areas where it has quite explicit weaknesses. Any range beyond short requires burst firing over full auto and thereby partially defeating the object of the Rev... and it overlaps to a great degree with the shotgun.

There's a myth floating around that you have to be very careful with the Revenant. No you don't, you have to go Rambo with full auto. If you don't, you've picked the wrong gun

You can adjust for recoil instead of letting go of the trigger, by the way. It's really much less trouble than you'd think. Or you can, you know, use Adrenaline Rush like you were meant to do.

I agree that the Locust is a beast by the way. However, I think the Mattock is better, at least in the hands of a soldier.

The choice between the Mattock and the Revenant is a real hard one - I genuinely can't, hand on heart, say which I resolutely prefer. And I play a modded Adept, where the decision between Rev and Mattock is actually relevant

Indeed. This is why it's not really actually a choice for me anymore. I KNOW I want the Widow, I don't know that I would want to use the Revenant.

What about the Claymore? It's cool enough, but it isn't as big of an upgrade as the Widow is. Besides, I think the Geth Plasma Shotgun has more potential than people realize.

[tmk]

JaegerBane wrote...
I'm going to restart my current playthrough when LotSB comes out due to this myth about the Adept getting an upgrade...

The "upgrade" might just be be a second Collector Ship-style specialization choice. In which case it won't even matter for you.

On-topic, I tried going for Mattock-Widow soldier... to be honest, I don't really see that many situations where I really feel the need to switch to Widow over the Mattock. The overwhelming majority of the fights just aren't long-range enough for it (tbh, the only time I ever really felt like I'm sniping in Mass Effect was the Haliat fight in the first game - the rest of the time it feels like using a microscope to hammer a nail). And taking up a whole HAR cycle for a single kill just seems... wasteful.

I imagine it's probably different for the Infiltrator, but for a Soldier I'd much rather prefer the option to carry the Revenant in place of the Widow (that is, to carry Rev and Mattock at the same time).

[termokanden]

Indeed tmk, I feel the same way. Particularly on the xbox where the aim assist makes it very difficult to snipe in AR sometimes.

However, since I can't use the Revenant and the Mattock at the same time and prefer the Mattock, I went with the Widow.

The Widow to me is a fun weapon, the Mattock is the workhorse.

Modifié par termokanden, 13 août 2010 - 07:42 .

[Bozorgmehr]

termokanden wrote...

There's a myth floating around that you have to be very careful with the Revenant. No you don't, you have to go Rambo with full auto. If you don't, you've picked the wrong gun

You can adjust for recoil instead of letting go of the trigger, by the way. It's really much less trouble than you'd think. Or you can, you know, use Adrenaline Rush like you were meant to do.

JaegerBane is playing with an Adept - Adepts cannot use AR; thus accuracy is limited, you're not going to hit much Rambo style. Revenant is meant to be used by Soldiers and is less effective when used by other classes. But it still is a formidable weapon.

I agree that the Locust is a beast by the way. However, I think the Mattock is better, at least in the hands of a soldier.

Mattocks is better with all classes. Only Revenant is better in the hands of a Soldier; and maybe Mantis and Widow for 1S1K-ing (on par with Infiltrator).

What about the Claymore? It's cool enough, but it isn't as big of an upgrade as the Widow is. Besides, I think the Geth Plasma Shotgun has more potential than people realize.

Claymore is the most powerful weapon in ME2, no other gun can come close (with reload trick of course). GPS is a great weapon though, much more versatile and very good for equiping squadies. I like the GPS performance, but don't like the sound - feels like an upgraded BB gun once you're used to the noise of the Claymore

JaegerBane wrote...

Yeah, well, an Adept with a soldier payload is more powerful than chuck norris, so it's not so much a desire
for power and more to do with not missing out. Even it's just an extra power or something, it doesn't matter.

It's not like I'm sat twiddling my thumbs - I'm going to play through Starcraft 2 first (that is a seriously fantastic game - the new stuff is really cool but the campaign lets you use updated starcraft 1 units, it just rocks [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/grin.png[/smilie]) so I can wait.

Thinking to buy Starcraft 2 myself, but at the moment I love playing ME2 too much (haven't even installed the DAO; Awakening after 4 months [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/andy.png[/smilie] ) - too bad you can't play SC2 with ME2 races.

To be honest, if we're talking about sheer versatility, the best selectionI've played with so far is still the Locust/Revenant/Widow/Claymore combo. You've basically got two weapons each for both long and short range that excel at different aspects of it.

The Rev and the Claymore are both highly effective at short range, but the Claymore's better for pop-up attacks and quick shots while the Rev is better for extended fights and sustained fire. Similarly, the Widow is better for single one-shot-kills and traditional sniping while the Locust is better for multiple target long range fighting. 

Considering these guns were never intended to function together, as a whole, they compliment each other incredibly well. They also look pretty cool all loaded onto your back, really badass [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/devil.png[/smilie]

Still gotta give the Widow a try on my Adept, just to see if it's possibe to 1S1K enemies. Have to say I liked the Viper till Mattock became available. You can watch the Viper in action in my new vid (check my sig)

Modifié par Bozorgmehr, 13 août 2010 - 07:52 .

[termokanden]

Bozorgmehr wrote...

JaegerBane is playing with an Adept - Adepts cannot use AR; thus accuracy is limited, you're not going to hit much Rambo style. Revenant is meant to be used by Soldiers and is less effective when used by other classes. But it still is a formidable weapon.

Sure. I consider balance issues without taking modding into account. But yeah I completely agree, would only ever consider the Revenant for a soldier.

Claymore is the most powerful weapon in ME2, no other gun can come close (with reload trick of course). GPS is a great weapon though, much more versatile and very good for equiping squadies. I like the GPS performance, but don't like the sound - feels like an upgraded BB gun once you're used to the noise of the Claymore

Yes the Claymore is awesome and it most certainly goes boom. I don't particularly like using the reload trick though. I want to play the game as it was meant to be played. The Claymore is supposed to be that slow to compensate for its massive power.

[JaegerBane]

termokanden wrote...
Sure. I consider balance issues without taking modding into account. But yeah I completely agree, would only ever consider the Revenant for a soldier.

Same. If we're discussing relative effectiveness specific to an Adept, I'd agree the Mattock pulls way ahead as it doesn't require much from the character to use to max effect. The Rev demands big risks be taken to get close and AR to use at medium range in a truly effective fashion, while the Mattock requires little more than an ability to aim.

Yes the Claymore is awesome and it most certainly goes boom. I don't particularly like using the reload trick though. I want to play the game as it was meant to be played. The Claymore is supposed to be that slow to compensate for its massive power.

Again, same. I don't do the reload trick because, personally, I think it looks silly. Even considering this though, the Claymore ranks as probably the best pop-up-blast weapon in the game, simply because it packs that much power into a single shot. The only gun that can compete is the GPS, and that requires charging.

[JaegerBane]

Bozorgmehr wrote...

Thinking to buy Starcraft 2 myself, but at the moment I love playing ME2 too much (haven't even installed the DAO; Awakening after 4 months [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/andy.png[/smilie] ) - too bad you can't play SC2 with ME2 races.

As I say, I'd like to get the chance to see what this Adept upgrade is. I think another poster said that it might just be an extra weapon choice or something... frankly, I hope it's more than this (as that's hardly an original upgrade for the Adept specifically). Even if it's just an extra cooldown reduction thingy or something... it'd just be nice to know I'm not missing out.

It's not like I'm bored - I don't think I've ever played an RTS with such an original campaign. They've got missions that are inspired by everything from Dune to I Am Legend (and I'm only 1/3 through). And the new units are brilliant, my fave so far is the Diamondback Hovertank. Apparently the ship's dwarf-ish engineer is voice acted by the same guy who did Saren, and that Helfer girl voices Sarah Kerrigan (I think - she's got a stereo voice thanks to being infested, but it certainly sounds like Number Six)

Still gotta give the Widow a try on my Adept, just to see if it's possibe to 1S1K enemies. Have to say I liked the Viper till Mattock became available. You can watch the Viper in action in my new vid (check my sig)

To be honest, the testing I did on my Widow/Mattock adept indicated that it's supremely flexible. The Mattock kind of rains on the Viper's parade, especially with biotic classes - I've never considered the scope issue to be any more than an irritant, but having the Mattock to pepper long range enemies Viper-style and the Widow to 1S1K everything else (particularly with Warp Ammo) made the Adept feel very versatile.

If he's packing the Locust and the Scimitar, he's effectively got varied and flexible arsenal that excels at all ranges.

Once LotSB comes out, I think I'll play through with the Mattock/Widow/Locust/Scimitar set up, and see how it goes.

Modifié par JaegerBane, 14 août 2010 - 09:41 .

[Kronner]

termokanden wrote...

Yes the Claymore is awesome and it most certainly goes boom. I don't particularly like using the reload trick though. I want to play the game as it was meant to be played. The Claymore is supposed to be that slow to compensate for its massive power.

According to Christina Norman's post, the reload trick is supposed to be in the game. Works with all weapons, though the Claymore clearly benefits the most from this trick. If you believe her or not is up to you obviously.

[Super ._. Shepard]

reload trick is easy when you get the hang of it

[OniGanon]

On the subject of Adept bonus weapon, without modding, I think the GPS's mid-range shield stripping ability would add more to the class than the Mattock. Also helps free up the bonus skill so you can take Warp Ammo or whatever instead of the usual Energy Drain.

[JaegerBane]

OniGanon wrote...

On the subject of Adept bonus weapon, without modding, I think the GPS's mid-range shield stripping ability would add more to the class than the Mattock. Also helps free up the bonus skill so you can take Warp Ammo or whatever instead of the usual Energy Drain.

I'd be more inclined to take the Mattock if the purpose is to shield strip. It's certainly not a poor choice for the task and, unlike the GPS, just requires you to have sight of your enemy - it hits more or less instantly, so range doesn't matter.

[Athenau]

Lol, I love how posters on the wiki say the Mattock is "bad" at close combat. The Reaper IFF mission is a complete joke with a Mattock toting Soldier. Three AR shots to the leg gib a husk, and you can strip the armor from three or four in one go to set them up for Jack's shockwave.

This weapon is just better at everything than all the other AR's.  Seriously.

Modifié par Athenau, 14 août 2010 - 03:54 .

[JaegerBane]

Athenau wrote...

Lol, I love how posters on the wiki say the Mattock is "bad" at close combat. The Reaper IFF mission is a complete joke with a Mattock toting Soldier. Three AR shots to the leg gib a husk, and you can strip the armor from three or four in one go to set them up for Jack's shockwave.

This weapon is just better at everything than all the other AR's.  Seriously.

Who's saying it's bad at short range?

[Athenau]

The geniuses here:

http://masseffect.wi...ki/M-96_Mattock
"As it lacks full automatic fire, it is not recommended for close-range fighting against large waves of attackers, especially husks."

The Mattock is fantastic against husks. These people are clueless.

Modifié par Athenau, 14 août 2010 - 04:00 .