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Blood Magic

Débuté par captain.subtle , août 14 2010 07:41

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#151
Face of Evil
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:16

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[quote]jln.francisco wrote...
[quote]The mage is casting a spell and only sees the patient after they are 'healed.' He/she never has an opportunity to run any kind of tests to see if the the spell worked as it should. It's the equivalent of your doctor simply asking you if you got better instead of drawing blood to see if your body is reacting as it should. [/quote][/quote]
Tests? It's MAGIC. It either works or it doesn't.

[quote]jln.francisco wrote...

Which likely won't be improved and likely originated elsewhere or under the Tevinters like most magic did. I never claimed they had no knowledge of medicine or the body, just that they had no way of testing theories, examining new treatments or really doing anything medical professionals are supposed to do.[/quote]

And I'm saying that the threat of blood magic outweighs the need for medical advancement. Learning how to cure the common cold is far less important than the rise of a second blood mage-ruled empire. They have healing magic and herbalism to help narrow the gap.
[/quote]

Modifié par Face of Evil, 15 août 2010 - 06:17 .

#152
Riona45
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:18

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Face of Evil wrote...
They have healing magic and herbalism to help narrow the gap.


The availability of healing magic is irrelevant to this discussion, remember?  You more or less decided that yourself.

Modifié par Riona45, 15 août 2010 - 06:19 .

#153
Face of Evil
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:20

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Riona45 wrote...

Healing magic is an irrelevant to this discussion, remember?


No, I meant your point that "healing magic isn't widespread in Thedas" is irrelevant. It is enough that it exists; the people of Thedas aren't reliant on leeches and bonesaws to cure all their ills.

Modifié par Face of Evil, 15 août 2010 - 06:22 .

#154
Guest_jln.francisco_*
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:22

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Tests? It's MAGIC. It either works or it doesn't.




The mages approach magic as if it has some underlying theory to it and is constrained by a set of rules much like the 'physical' world is. It is not a wishing well where you make a request and it happens.



And I'm saying that the threat of blood magic outweighs the need for medical advancement. Learning how to cure the common cold is far less important than the rise of a second blood mage-ruled empire. They have healing magic and herbalism to help narrow the gap.




And of course, the poor get the short end of the stick.



Funny you should mention the common cold though as many of the diseases and infections we don;t take very seriously today could be relied upon to cause several deaths back during the medieval age. I would not be surprised if this were the case in Thedas as plagues aren't unheard of and neither is quarantining.

#155
thegreateski
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:22

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What was the original topic? Blood magic? Good or bad?



This is stupid. Our spells are not meant for getting cats out of trees, making fireworks, or helping little old ladies across the street.



They are made for killing.

#156
Rubbish Hero
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:23

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Face of Evil wrote...I DARE you to make less sense. :huh:


If forum not rule have, crush you with speak.
Regret much you would.

Modifié par Rubbish Hero, 15 août 2010 - 06:23 .

#157
Riona45
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:24

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Face of Evil wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

Healing magic is an irrelevant to this discussion, remember?


No, I meant your point that "healing magic isn't widespread in Thedas" is irrelevant. It is enough that it exists; the people of Thedas aren't reliant on leeches and bonesaws to cure all their ills.


Whatever you say.

Modifié par Riona45, 15 août 2010 - 06:24 .

#158
Riona45
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:26

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thegreateski wrote...

What was the original topic? Blood magic? Good or bad?

This is stupid.


*chuckles*Posted Image

#159
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Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:27

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thegreateski wrote...

What was the original topic? Blood magic? Good or bad?

This is stupid. Our spells are not meant for getting cats out of trees, making fireworks, or helping little old ladies across the street.

They are made for killing.


Thing is blood magic is one of those schools of magic that can do everything from revealing a guilty party to bringing back someone from the brink of death to decimating a whole village by unleashing demons into it. That's probably what makes it so controversial (that and the type of payment that comes with casting a blood magic spell). If it were just pure killkillkill, I think people would be much less likely to oppose it. After all, primal magic is just killkillkill and everyone is fine with that despite how long lasting the effects of things like local quake could be.

#160
Face of Evil
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:27

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jln.francisco wrote...

And of course, the poor get the short end of the stick


Oh, so this is a classism debate now, isn't it?

Then yes, I'll take a few peasants dying of infections over the rise of a vicious empire that enslaved the entire world and virtually wiped out the elven civilization.  I prefer a lack of medical knowledge to the possibility of a fricking demon invasion like the one Uldred and Avenus nearly unleashed on the world.

Blood magic is too dangerous to allow mages to practice.

Modifié par Face of Evil, 15 août 2010 - 06:30 .

#161
Riona45
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:29

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jln.francisco wrote...
After all, primal magic is just killkillkill and everyone is fine with that despite how long lasting the effects of things like local quake could be.


Heh.  I guess that means my mage was evil (as per the oh-so intelligent and nuanced standards of the OP) since I designed her as a master elementalist.Posted Image

Modifié par Riona45, 15 août 2010 - 06:32 .

#162
MDarwin
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:29

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Face of Evil wrote...

MDarwin wrote...

Surprises me that people intend to judge Blood Mages as "pure utter Evil" in it's worst form.


Yes, because there are so many examples of "good" blood mages out there. :P

Blood magic might not be evil, like any other magic, but it is incredibly dangerous. Far too dangerous to allow anyone to practice. The Chantry is completely right in its suppression of blood magic.


Sorry but "trust the Chantry"? To me the Chantry is "corupted by power". They do not want to be questiond nor relant.

Sound weird when my PC (a Blood Mage) get's "burned at the stake" after he saved everyone from the Blight.
A fitting end. :P

The U.S. choose to use the nuke to end WW2 and to save countless other lives in needless battles.
I do not think that that was an evil act. Just because something is dangerous, it does not mean it can not be used.

I believe it depends on a given situation and the person, wielding such power. :)

#163
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Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:31

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Face of Evil wrote...

jln.francisco wrote...

And of course, the poor get the short end of the stick


Oh, this is a classism debate now, isn't it?

Then yes, I'll take a few peasants dying of infections over the rise of a vicious empire that enslaved the entire world and virtually wiped out the elven civilization.  I prefer a lack of medical knowledge to the possibility of a fricking demon invasion like the one Uldred and Avenus nearly unleashed on the world.


It wouldn't be a few and I've been making the point from the beginning how magical cures are rare but I can see you're set. All power to you.

#164
thegreateski
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:35

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MDarwin wrote...
Sound weird when my PC (a Blood Mage) get's "burned at the stake" after he saved everyone from the Blight.
A fitting end. :P

You know how it goes.

No good deed goes unpunished.

#165
Face of Evil
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:38

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MDarwin wrote...

[Sorry but "trust the Chantry"? To me the Chantry is "corupted by power".


Says the maleficar willing to make deals with demons to gain forbidden knowledge.

MDarwin wrote...

Sound weird when my PC (a Blood Mage) get's "burned at the stake" after he saved everyone from the Blight.
A fitting end. :P


Hey, I didn't say that the Grey Wardens should be restricted from practicing blood magic, so long as they turn it against the darkspawn.

Ultimately, nothing matters more than defeating the Blight, as that poses a greater risk than any blood mage.

Modifié par Face of Evil, 15 août 2010 - 06:39 .

#166
Riona45
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:43

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Face of Evil wrote...

MDarwin wrote...

[Sorry but "trust the Chantry"? To me the Chantry is "corupted by power".


Says the maleficar willing to make deals with demons to gain forbidden knowledge.


I had no idea MDarwin was a "maleficar" who consorted with demons.  Interesting.

#167
thegreateski
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:43

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I would like to point out that I "bullied" the Demon into teaching me Blood magic.

#168
MDarwin
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:43

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thegreateski wrote...

MDarwin wrote...
Sound weird when my PC (a Blood Mage) get's "burned at the stake" after he saved everyone from the Blight.
A fitting end. :P

You know how it goes.

No good deed goes unpunished.


Tell me about it! The "chants" can do more harm to you, than Blood Magic. :D :P

#169
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Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:44

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Says the maleficar willing to make deals with demons to gain forbidden knowledge.



Not necessarily. I don't see why you couldn't have learned it from Morrigan (she actually does know blood magic. The Dark Ritual is supposed to involve it) or some other Maleficar along the way. You can role play it any way you want since the specialization remains unlocked after you earn it. I like to think my mage was one of Blood Mages who tried to usurp power but was conscripted before those events occurred and was therefore far from the Circle when it all went down.

And besides, none of that diminishes the fact you just saved them from certain death at great risk and expense to yourself. Clearing a Tower full of abominations and demons is a lot to ask for from a party of what could only be a little over a half dozen.

Modifié par jln.francisco, 15 août 2010 - 06:46 .

#170
Face of Evil
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:48

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Riona45 wrote...

I had no idea MDarwin was a "maleficar" who consorted with demons.  Interesting.


Oh, stop trying to be cute. I'm not saying the "real" MDarwin bargained with demons (although he might have, I can't say what MDarwin gets up to in his/her free time). But the only way his/her character in the game learned blood magic in the original game was by bargaining with Connor's demon.

Modifié par Face of Evil, 15 août 2010 - 06:51 .

#171
thegreateski
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:49

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Face of Evil wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

I had no idea MDarwin was a "maleficar" who consorted with demons.  Interesting.


Oh, stop trying to be cute. I'm not speaking literally, obviously. But the only way he learned blood magic in the original game was by bullying and killing Connor's demon.

Fixt

#172
Riona45
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:50

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Face of Evil wrote...


Oh, stop trying to be cute.


I don't have to try when I already am. Posted Image 

I'm not speaking literally, obviously. But the only way he learned blood magic in the original game was by bargaining with Connor's demon.


Apparently what was said above is correct--you can intimidate the demon into giving you blood magic, no "bargaining" required.

#173
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Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:52

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Face of Evil wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

I had no idea MDarwin was a "maleficar" who consorted with demons.  Interesting.


Oh, stop trying to be cute. I'm not speaking literally, obviously. But the only way he learned blood magic in the original game was by bargaining with Connor's demon.


That's the only way to unlock the specialization but your mage has plenty of in character opportunities before that to pick up blood magic. There is supposed to be a whole section devoted to it in the Circle Library before Irving confiscates them all and except for the more difficult rituals it would be the same as Spirit Magic except using blood as the power behind it.

#174
Face of Evil
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:53

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thegreateski wrote...

I would like to point out that I "bullied" the Demon into teaching me Blood magic.


Still let the demon go scott free after killing a bunch of people in exchange for a power-up. That's just a lesser shade of evil in my book. :devil:

Riona45 wrote...

I don't have to try when I already am. Posted Image 


No doubt. ;)

Modifié par Face of Evil, 15 août 2010 - 06:55 .

#175
MDarwin
Posté 15 août 2010 - 06:53

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Face of Evil wrote...

MDarwin wrote...

[Sorry but "trust the Chantry"? To me the Chantry is "corupted by power".


**Says the maleficar willing to make deals with demons to gain forbidden knowledge.

MDarwin wrote...

Sound weird when my PC (a Blood Mage) get's "burned at the stake" after he saved everyone from the Blight.
A fitting end. :P


*Hey, I didn't say that the Grey Wardens should be restricted from practicing blood magic, so long as they turn it against the darkspawn.

Ultimately, nothing matters more than defeating the Blight, as that poses a greater risk than any blood mage.


Then Wynn should be "classified as an abomination" too. After all she is possesed. :P I do not think that the Chantry/Templars would classify her as a "good abomination". And therfore would let her be a member of the circle. :?

*I do not imply that you said that. Which brings up the question: What sort of ending should it be, if all know that I a Blood Mage ended the Blight? :blink:  <_<   :P

** Irving? In the circle has a book concerning the "art of Blood Magic". "Bad Boy" :o  :o  :P

Modifié par MDarwin, 15 août 2010 - 07:21 .

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