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[Sago_mulch]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Sago_mulch wrote...

fan fic writers should write for money.

I should ignore the troll, I know, but I cannot stand that kind of BS. Some ff writers do write for money, some ff writers don't want to write for money, some are trying to get better before they attempt to do just that. Why can't people just have fun writing without needing to make a ****ing living off of it? That's like saying that people shouldn't cook unless they want to be a chef, people shouldn't play sports unless they're going to be on a professional team, people shouldn't garden unless they're going to start a produce business.

calm down bro, i wasn't trollin', it was just like a comment. i'm sure some fan fiction writers are genuinely good, some don't even have to be good to be popular...thats a good thing..rite?

[Zjarcal]

About bringing up the slavery issue at the Landsmeet, my Dalish brought up the slavery argument first because that's what bothered her the most. She wasn't exactly thinking about which arguments would go better with the nobility, so it could've backfired against her but she didn't care. The same will happen with my CE. It's a good thing all those arguments work in favor of the PC.

The only arguments that I've never brought up are the Cailan "betrayal" and Alistair's bloodline. None of my characters care about either of those.

Modifié par Zjarcal, 10 octobre 2010 - 07:46 .

[phaonica]

Sarah1281 wrote...
 I never bring it up either. It's not like my Wardens don't think anyone would care, they just don't get a chance to. The first thing they mention is the Blight, of course, as that's most pressing. Then it's the poisoning of Eamon since that shows that he's willing to poison nobles (like those voting) and it all pisses off the Chantry because of the blood mage Jowan and the imprisoning a templar. After that it's Howe's kidnapping and torturing of innocents which gets Sighard to mention how his son was taken and leaves the nobles at the Landsmeet wondering what he'd do to their family members. If he had let me go on and not started talking about Anora, I would have addressed the slavery after I was done scaring them with what kinds of things a lack of change could do to them.

Yeah, that does do a pretty good job of scaring the nobles, imo.  I just kind of go with the flow, depending on the character. For example, I know that blaming Loghain for Cailan's death doesn't really help your argument any, but I have characters that will mention it, because that's just what they would do.

[Zjarcal]

Sago_mulch wrote...

calm down bro, i wasn't trollin', it was just like a comment. i'm sure some fan fiction writers are genuinely good, some don't even have to be good to be popular...thats a good thing..rite?

Ehhh... she's not a "bro".

But it's good to know your comment wasn't ill meant.

[Monica21]

Zjarcal wrote...

About bringing up the slavery issue at the Landsmeet, my Dalish brought up the slavery argument first because that's what bothered her the most. She wasn't exactly thinking about which arguments would go better with the nobility, so it could've backfired against her but she didn't care. The same will happen with my CE. It's a good thing all those arguments work in favor of the PC.

The only arguments that I've never brought up the Cailan "betrayal" and Alistair's bloodline as arguments. None of my characters care about either of those.

I brought up Ostagar in my first playthrough and haven't since then. The Landsmeet tied because I backed Anora and the duel went on, but I haven't brought it up since. No one is impressed by whatever you think happened at Ostagar.

[Zjarcal]

Monica21 wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

About bringing up the slavery issue at the Landsmeet, my Dalish brought up the slavery argument first because that's what bothered her the most. She wasn't exactly thinking about which arguments would go better with the nobility, so it could've backfired against her but she didn't care. The same will happen with my CE. It's a good thing all those arguments work in favor of the PC.

The only arguments that I've never brought up the Cailan "betrayal" and Alistair's bloodline as arguments. None of my characters care about either of those.

I brought up Ostagar in my first playthrough and haven't since then. The Landsmeet tied because I backed Anora and the duel went on, but I haven't brought it up since. No one is impressed by whatever you think happened at Ostagar.

I think I also brought it up in my first playthrough, but that was a horrible playthrough from an RP perspective (I was hell bent on putting Alistair on the throne and I hated Anora... ).

One thing I always do is fight the big brawl. I just love it!

Modifié par Zjarcal, 10 octobre 2010 - 07:54 .

[mousestalker]

Sarah1281 wrote...
I hear that kind of 'logic' all the time. God knows whenever my parents hear or see anything that reminds them I write fanfiction they start talking about how much money JK Rowling made.

It's really one of my berserk buttons, I'm afraid.

That was very wrong of you, to link to tvtropes. Very very wrong. That website is the quicksand of the Internet. It just sucks you in, making escape nigh impossible.

[Morwen Eledhwen]

Zjarcal wrote...

The only arguments that I've never brought up are the Cailan "betrayal" and Alistair's bloodline. None of my characters care about either of those.

I've never brought up Alistair's bloodline because I've never supported Alistair as king, which is the only reason why it might matter to anyone. Of the 3 characters I've played so far, my CE cared the least about what happened at Ostagar, because she was only there to escape justice for killing Vaughn. Both my DC and my Mage saw being recruited into the Grey Wardens as a ticket out of their current situation, with which they were both dissatisfied, and an opportunity to become much better --rogues, Mages, people, whatever-- than what their current life's opportunites offered them. So when the Grey Wardens were slaughtered, that pretty much effed their plans and hopes. Of course, the argument is that the Grey Wardens would have been slaughtered if Loghain hadn't quit the field, but my Wardens don't know that. All they know is that Loghain was supposed to attack when they lit the beacon, they lit the beacon, and he left. But their resentment of Loghain had little to do with the death of Cailan; it's just that he's the figurehead in the discussion when you bring up Ostagar. Now, my Mage is considerably less emotional and more mature than my DC was, so she's willing to listen to reason about Ostagar if logical arguments are presented to her. My DC had a temper and held a grudge, and her conversations with Loghain or any of his followers never quite got to the "logical argument" stage. Also, my DC actually liked Cailan when she met him, weird as that idea seems to me now. I swear he wasn't nearly as silly in that first conversation as he has been since.

[phaonica]

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...

My CE was ticked off about the slavery thing and definitely wanted to punish Loghain for it, but she would have accepted recruitment into the Grey Wardens as punishment (especially since he had lost the support of the Landsmeet and been deserted by his daughter already). Except that Alistair threw his hissy fit and my CE was in a relationship with him. . .so yeah. She executed him too.  But she didn't talk to Alistair after that except to (1) tell him that they didn't have a future together, (2) convince him to do the DR so that she wouldn't have to die killing the Archdemon, and (3) leave him at the gates for the final battle.

So she executed Loghain and still broke up with Alistair over it. Damn.

My character felt bad about killing Loghain (and still feels bad about it, when reminded), but not bad enough to lose Alistair.  This character did the DR himself to save them both, but didn't tell Alistair about it, . They had their run-off-as-Wardens ending together (though apparently Alistair was preoccupied with something more important than helping the Wardens run Amaranthine ). Fun times.

[phaonica]

mousestalker wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...
I hear that kind of 'logic' all the time. God knows whenever my parents hear or see anything that reminds them I write fanfiction they start talking about how much money JK Rowling made.

It's really one of my berserk buttons, I'm afraid.

That was very wrong of you, to link to tvtropes. Very very wrong. That website is the quicksand of the Internet. It just sucks you in, making escape nigh impossible.

I agree! Lol.

[Sarah1281]

My character felt bad about killing Loghain (and still feels bad about it, when reminded), but not bad enough to lose Alistair.

The only character I've ever had who killed Loghain so as to not lose Alistair was the one that was hellbent on becoming queen. She felt horrible about it but it was the only way to get what she wanted.

[Sarah1281]

phaonica wrote...

mousestalker wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...
I hear that kind of 'logic' all the time. God knows whenever my parents hear or see anything that reminds them I write fanfiction they start talking about how much money JK Rowling made.

It's really one of my berserk buttons, I'm afraid.

That was very wrong of you, to link to tvtropes. Very very wrong. That website is the quicksand of the Internet. It just sucks you in, making escape nigh impossible.

I agree! Lol.

Oh God. Yesterday I was looking up 1776 on TV tropes and went from that to the American Revolution to Cincinnatus to Never Live It Down to Taylor Swift...about three hours later I discovered 'Growing Up Cullen' which made it all worth it.

[Morwen Eledhwen]

phaonica wrote...

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...

My CE was ticked off about the slavery thing and definitely wanted to punish Loghain for it, but she would have accepted recruitment into the Grey Wardens as punishment (especially since he had lost the support of the Landsmeet and been deserted by his daughter already). Except that Alistair threw his hissy fit and my CE was in a relationship with him. . .so yeah. She executed him too.  But she didn't talk to Alistair after that except to (1) tell him that they didn't have a future together, (2) convince him to do the DR so that she wouldn't have to die killing the Archdemon, and (3) leave him at the gates for the final battle.

So she executed Loghain and still broke up with Alistair over it. Damn.

Yeah, she (I) just couldn't look at him after that.

Although apparently "I don't think we have a future together" does not necessarily a breakup speech make. I chose that option in the "So where do you think this is going with us?" dialogue rather than "I think we should end this", because she had invested a lot in the relationship (including killing Loghain) and she did at least appreciate the benefits of close companionship while the Blight campaign was going on. So "I don't think we have a future together", to my CE, meant "You've got me as long as this Blight lasts and then I'm sodding off home with Sten" (which she did, taking Zevran with her as well). Alistair, on the other hand, took it to mean "We might die in this Blight and even if we don't, we're Grey Wardens and we'll die of the taint anyway, so we shouldn't really think too far ahead or talk about marriage or children or anything". Then in the Epilogue --despite his being left at the Gates and absent from the post-coronation scene where my Warden made her travel arrangements-- it turns out he tagged along with us after all.  Can't a guy take a hint. . .?

Modifié par Morwen Eledhwen, 10 octobre 2010 - 08:13 .

[phaonica]

Sarah1281 wrote...

My character felt bad about killing Loghain (and still feels bad about it, when reminded), but not bad enough to lose Alistair.

The only character I've ever had who killed Loghain so as to not lose Alistair was the one that was hellbent on becoming queen. She felt horrible about it but it was the only way to get what she wanted.

Yeah, that was pretty much my character's thinking, too, that Loghain had to die for him to get what he wanted. He and Alistair had been kind of avoiding the conversation that had to do with their obvious need for a breakup once Alistair became king, but then Anora showed up and conveniently fixed that problem so that Alistair didn't have to become king after all. Once they had allowed themselves to hope that they might get to stay together, my character couldn't convince himself to give that up to save Loghain.

[Addai]

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...

Zjarcal wrote. . .

That's also why I'm a bit hesitant to read it, since I also haven't read the books.

Well, Addai's ff keeps a lot of the backstory-related stuff separate, so you can read the bits about the relationship between Loghain and his new bride without being ambushed. Or if backstory-related stuff does creep in, it doesn't announce itself like "HEY, POSSIBLE SPOILER COMING UP" but it's obvious enough so that your eyes can skip over it.

And Addai, I hope you don't take offense that I am skipping bits of your ff. I wasn't going to read it at all except so many people from this thread liked it so much. I promise that when I no longer have fear of spoilers I'll go back and read the whole thing. 

Oh no, not offended.  Honestly with this one, I assumed no one would read it and a lot of people would hate it, so anything above that and I figure I'm ahead of the curve.    And it definitely is spoilerific for the books, especially TST.  I don't even think about that I guess, since I assume most of the people who would read it have already read the novels.

You should read the novels, BTW!  Good stuff.

[Addai]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Oh God. Yesterday I was looking up 1776 on TV tropes and went from that to the American Revolution to Cincinnatus to Never Live It Down to Taylor Swift...about three hours later I discovered 'Growing Up Cullen' which made it all worth it.

I think I'm immune, but I'm immune to a lot of popular culture (much to my husband's dismay).

On topic fanart!



 

[Elhanan]

Growing Up Cailan! Glorious!

Modifié par Elhanan, 10 octobre 2010 - 11:08 .

[Addai]

Elhanan wrote...

Growing Up Cailan! Glorious!

??  You're talking about the drawing?  That's Maric and Loghain.

[Morwen Eledhwen]

Addai67 wrote...

You should read the novels, BTW!  Good stuff.

I took a peek at TST through the "Look Inside!" feature on Amazon, and frankly wasn't impressed with the quality of the writing. I'll still read it, just for the backstory knowledge and to know what people are referring to in discussions and fanfics , but I'll have to work myself up to do it. And I also want to get through this run of DA:O with Loghain without knowing more details of his backstory than I can help.

[Addai]

What was it that you didn't like? The style is a bit too modern in tone for me at times, but overall it's a great story with characters that just get me *right there*. Same with The Calling really, but I think I like TST better because the subject of the rebellion is more interesting to me than the darkspawn.

[Morwen Eledhwen]

Addai67 wrote...

What was it that you didn't like? The style is a bit too modern in tone for me at times, but overall it's a great story with characters that just get me *right there*. Same with The Calling really, but I think I like TST better because the subject of the rebellion is more interesting to me than the darkspawn.

I had no problem with the story; I will be reading it for that and the characters. It's the style. To quote Amadeus. . ."too many notes." It just seems obvious to me that it's written by someone who's used to thinking audio/visually and is trying to record in prose form every single thought, nuance or flicker of emotion, plus each individual thrust, parry, slice, dice, crunch and grunt of each battle. Your writing gets the narrative across but lets the reader be his or her own camera person and foley artist, as it were.

Again, this is from the dozen or so pages I got to read through Amazon's "Look Inside!" feature. But that's about how much of any book I read before I decide whether I want to buy it or not.

Modifié par Morwen Eledhwen, 11 octobre 2010 - 02:11 .

[Monica21]

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...
I took a peek at TST through the "Look Inside!" feature on Amazon, and frankly wasn't impressed with the quality of the writing. I'll still read it, just for the backstory knowledge and to know what people are referring to in discussions and fanfics , but I'll have to work myself up to do it. And I also want to get through this run of DA:O with Loghain without knowing more details of his backstory than I can help.

Well, it's important to remember that Gaider is a game developer and not an author, and he only had a short window to write both books. I have no doubt that they could have been better, but as prequels to a video game they're very good. BioWare could have hired someone like Bethesda did, but I prefer Gaider's vision and his "voice" to someone else's.

[Morwen Eledhwen]

Monica21 wrote...

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...
I took a peek at TST through the "Look Inside!" feature on Amazon, and frankly wasn't impressed with the quality of the writing. I'll still read it, just for the backstory knowledge and to know what people are referring to in discussions and fanfics , but I'll have to work myself up to do it. And I also want to get through this run of DA:O with Loghain without knowing more details of his backstory than I can help.

Well, it's important to remember that Gaider is a game developer and not an author, and he only had a short window to write both books. I have no doubt that they could have been better, but as prequels to a video game they're very good. BioWare could have hired someone like Bethesda did, but I prefer Gaider's vision and his "voice" to someone else's.

I accept that, and I agree with you that having the story from its source is a good thing. This is why I will still read TST anyway. If it wasn't the story it was, I wouldn't bother.

[Addai]

I see. I thought he handled the narrative well, and it's tough to write battles. What I would wish for is a bit more nuance to the Orlesians. But I loved both novels and would read anything DG wrote. His characters are just.... well, you all know.

My kingdom for a Stolen Throne DLC. I know it'll never happen, but if the Maker is taking requests...

Modifié par Addai67, 11 octobre 2010 - 02:18 .

[Monica21]

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...

Monica21 wrote...

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...
I took a peek at TST through the "Look Inside!" feature on Amazon, and frankly wasn't impressed with the quality of the writing. I'll still read it, just for the backstory knowledge and to know what people are referring to in discussions and fanfics , but I'll have to work myself up to do it. And I also want to get through this run of DA:O with Loghain without knowing more details of his backstory than I can help.

Well, it's important to remember that Gaider is a game developer and not an author, and he only had a short window to write both books. I have no doubt that they could have been better, but as prequels to a video game they're very good. BioWare could have hired someone like Bethesda did, but I prefer Gaider's vision and his "voice" to someone else's.

I accept that, and I agree with you that having the story from its source is a good thing. This is why I will still read TST anyway. If it wasn't the story it was, I wouldn't bother.

If it is the writing that is bothersome, then skip The Calling. The book is very heavy on the Maric and Duncan side, and is really only interesting if you want to compare the Architect's goals in TC versus Awakening, and if you're interested in a fledgling Warden named Duncan. Although, I have to admit that the Loghain's brief appearance in both the beginning and end steal the show. (Or book, as it were.)

Modifié par Monica21, 11 octobre 2010 - 02:21 .