12857 réponses à ce sujet

[CalJones]

OMFG! No no no, that won't do at all. He doesn't even have the Theirin nose and chin. Must indeed be a placeholder.

[phaonica]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Oh, wow. That was really good, Phaonica. I like that nothing you said made a difference and he was able to overcome this on his own.

Thanks.  Yeah, he does mostly ignore you, lol.

saruman85 wrote...

phaonica wrote...
Thanks for linking it, Saruman85

No problems - I was hoping you wouldn't be pissed, actually, 'cos I know you didn't list it on YouTube.

Nope, it's perfectly ok.

Most of the coding is in the toolset already, and Maric and KidCailan were clearly supposed to be in it, but there was no dialog written for it at all. I had to make it all up. It didn't turn out half bad, imo.

You're JOKING. You wrote all of that YOURSELF?! That was amazing, phaonica. I tend to be stupidly picky with my dialogues - it's why I can't read much fanfiction beyond the first page - but this was par excellence. Did you quote lines from TST or something? I seem to recall Maric actually telling Loghain he was not Ferelden somewhere...

Anyhoo, excellent work.

Oh goodness. Thank you. I mean, the "Keep him close and he will betray you..." line was a direct quote. And Maric and Loghain did have a conversation in TST about not putting Maric's life above the wellbeing of Ferelden, but I don't think I quoted it. None of that was already in the toolset, though. It's pretty much a fanfiction.

[DragonRacer13]

Phaonica, that is freaking AMAZING and is immediately becoming my new desktop when I get off work today!
And the "supposed" toolset Maric image (which I'd never seen before)... egads! Is it a bad thing that my first instinct was to make the sign of the cross with my fingers as a warding off gesture?

[Sarah1281]

I loved that Cailan totally copied Maric's hairstyle. It's right in line with his desire to be his father.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Oh, wow. That was really good, Phaonica. I like that nothing you said made a difference and he was able to overcome this on his own.

Yea he ranks higher than Sten in terms of Fade badasseness.

Excellent work Phaonica!

[Zjarcal]

phaonica wrote...

And while we're at it, has anyone had any problems using that file and still not getting Loghain to "Friendly"? I removed any conflicting files (from Terra_Ex's mod), but I still can't get his approval to reach "Friendly", no matter how high.

The first thing that comes to mind is that I think ejoslin attached the friendly_eligible flag to a specific line of dialog ... the one where he says "I suppose I shouldn't be surprised by your success..." If you loaded the mod after he says that line, the flag won't be set.

Oh, that could be it since I removed the conflicting file after I had reached warm. Thanks!

And great work on the pic and the fade dream!

[Persephone]

phaonica wrote...

Was playing around with the toolset. Maric on the thone in the Landsmeet chamber, with Loghain at his side.

:wub::wub:
How bittersweet. They were a perfect team. Cutscene, oh please, CUTSCENE!

[Costin_Razvan]

I personally hate Maric to be honest. Alistair I find likable, but Maric who falls for two elves just like that is just well...ugh.

[Addai]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

When you think your country is being led by a complete imbecile, and a foreign army that just a few decades ago was kicked out of your country is amassing at your country's borders with nothing to stop them from coming in, you would worry too.

Besides, it's not like Loghain sent his army to fight them, that would have been crazy. He simply wanted to secure Ferelden's borders, because nothing would have stopped them from coming in. I don't think this is an unreasonable attitude to have. He might have been factually wrong about an actual military invasion, but when it's so murky and unclear, it's not unreasonable for him to fear this very possible outcome.   




(husband)

Its the old saying about "The bird in the hand is better then two in the bush", only inverted or applied in reverse.


Loghain is fighting a fantom, hypothetical war rather than the real one that is nipping at their heels and taking lives.    As I mentioned before (edited in after you posted above) there really are parallels to the mistakes he makes vs. other military leaders.   Like the Germans on D Day keeping 2 panzer divisions locked down in France to fight the supposed "real landings" that were suppose to take place, which were really disinformation on the part of the Allies to keep themsleves from facing a Zerg charge.


Unfortately Loghain does this to himself from his own delusion and past baggage.   I mean really if they had such a thing as as being put under psychaitric observation to have competence evaluated Loghain should have faced it.

Modifié par Addai67, 12 octobre 2010 - 11:42 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Addai67 wrote...
(husband)
Loghain is fighting a fantom, hypothetical war rather than the real one that is nipping at their heels and taking lives.    As I mentioned before (edited in after you posted above) there really are parallels to the mistakes he makes vs. other military leaders.   Like the Germans on D Day keeping 2 panzer divisions locked down in France to fight the supposed "real landings" that were suppose to take place, which were really disinformation on the part of the Allies to keep themsleves from facing a Zerg charge.

Unfortately Loghain does this to himself from his own delusion and past baggage.   I mean really if they had such a thing as a psychiatric discharge for competence Loghain should have faced it.

Except Loghain was not fighting a war with Orlais. He sent armies there to secure Ferelden's borders and sovereignity, but he did not engage the Orlesians and thus no lives were lost on that front. If he did engage the Orlesians, I would agree with you.

And the comparision isn't pertinent here. Imagine if the Germans didn't put any forces there and the allies did land, how stupid would they have looked? I won't get into the details of this situation, because it's too complicated,

But when at war and when things are murky, sometimes you are forced to secure all potential front lines. "Better be safe than sorry"  is the saying that would fit here. And there is no country that would compromise on its sovereignity. If you want another WW2 example you can see that De Gaulle was extremily worried about British and American forces landing on French territory and that's why he was so adamant about the French Army reaching Paris before any of them, tactics and strategy be damned (and if it wasn't for insubordination, the Germans would have razed the entire city). And that's when they were allies. Imagine if they were enemies from not long ago.

And Loghain admits he made an mistake. But that's what happens. When you are not sure of Orlesian intents, you secure the borders, because nothing would have stopped them from coming in, with or without permission and that's soemthing no state would abide by unless absolutely forced to.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 12 octobre 2010 - 11:44 .

[TJPags]

Addai67 wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

When you think your country is being led by a complete imbecile, and a foreign army that just a few decades ago was kicked out of your country is amassing at your country's borders with nothing to stop them from coming in, you would worry too.

Besides, it's not like Loghain sent his army to fight them, that would have been crazy. He simply wanted to secure Ferelden's borders, because nothing would have stopped them from coming in. I don't think this is an unreasonable attitude to have. He might have been factually wrong about an actual military invasion, but when it's so murky and unclear, it's not unreasonable for him to fear this very possible outcome.   




(husband)

Its the old saying about "The bird in the hand is better then two in the bush", only inverted or applied in reverse.


Loghain is fighting a fantom, hypothetical war rather than the real one that is nipping at their heels and taking lives.    As I mentioned before (edited in after you posted above) there really are parallels to the mistakes he makes vs. other military leaders.   Like the Germans on D Day keeping 2 panzer divisions locked down in France to fight the supposed "real landings" that were suppose to take place, which were really disinformation on the part of the Allies to keep themsleves from facing a Zerg charge.


Unfortately Loghain does this to himself from his own delusion and past baggage.   I mean really if they had such a thing as as being put under psychaitric observation to have competence evaluated Loghain should have faced it.

Well said.
He divided his forces for, really, no reason except his own paranoia.  He didn't like Caillan asking for Orlesian help, and worried about an invasion that wasn't rather than concentrate on the invasion that was.

[Persephone]

TJPags wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

When you think your country is being led by a complete imbecile, and a foreign army that just a few decades ago was kicked out of your country is amassing at your country's borders with nothing to stop them from coming in, you would worry too.

Besides, it's not like Loghain sent his army to fight them, that would have been crazy. He simply wanted to secure Ferelden's borders, because nothing would have stopped them from coming in. I don't think this is an unreasonable attitude to have. He might have been factually wrong about an actual military invasion, but when it's so murky and unclear, it's not unreasonable for him to fear this very possible outcome.   




(husband)

Its the old saying about "The bird in the hand is better then two in the bush", only inverted or applied in reverse.


Loghain is fighting a fantom, hypothetical war rather than the real one that is nipping at their heels and taking lives.    As I mentioned before (edited in after you posted above) there really are parallels to the mistakes he makes vs. other military leaders.   Like the Germans on D Day keeping 2 panzer divisions locked down in France to fight the supposed "real landings" that were suppose to take place, which were really disinformation on the part of the Allies to keep themsleves from facing a Zerg charge.


Unfortately Loghain does this to himself from his own delusion and past baggage.   I mean really if they had such a thing as as being put under psychaitric observation to have competence evaluated Loghain should have faced it.

Well said.
He divided his forces for, really, no reason except his own paranoia.  He didn't like Caillan asking for Orlesian help, and worried about an invasion that wasn't rather than concentrate on the invasion that was.

Only that his paranoia, as you call it, is later revealed to be entirely correct.

[TJPags]

Persephone wrote...

TJPags wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

When you think your country is being led by a complete imbecile, and a foreign army that just a few decades ago was kicked out of your country is amassing at your country's borders with nothing to stop them from coming in, you would worry too.

Besides, it's not like Loghain sent his army to fight them, that would have been crazy. He simply wanted to secure Ferelden's borders, because nothing would have stopped them from coming in. I don't think this is an unreasonable attitude to have. He might have been factually wrong about an actual military invasion, but when it's so murky and unclear, it's not unreasonable for him to fear this very possible outcome.   




(husband)

Its the old saying about "The bird in the hand is better then two in the bush", only inverted or applied in reverse.


Loghain is fighting a fantom, hypothetical war rather than the real one that is nipping at their heels and taking lives.    As I mentioned before (edited in after you posted above) there really are parallels to the mistakes he makes vs. other military leaders.   Like the Germans on D Day keeping 2 panzer divisions locked down in France to fight the supposed "real landings" that were suppose to take place, which were really disinformation on the part of the Allies to keep themsleves from facing a Zerg charge.


Unfortately Loghain does this to himself from his own delusion and past baggage.   I mean really if they had such a thing as as being put under psychaitric observation to have competence evaluated Loghain should have faced it.

Well said.
He divided his forces for, really, no reason except his own paranoia.  He didn't like Caillan asking for Orlesian help, and worried about an invasion that wasn't rather than concentrate on the invasion that was.

Only that his paranoia, as you call it, is later revealed to be entirely correct.

Umm, sorry, but what?  When did Orlais invade?  Did I miss that part of the game? 

[Giggles_Manically]

They were not planning a military invasion.



Celene was just planning on marrying Cailan, and winning Fereldan without a military coup.

D Gaider said this was the original plot, and this was shown in RtO with the notes.

[TJPags]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

They were not planning a military invasion.

Celene was just planning on marrying Cailan, and winning Fereldan without a military coup.
D Gaider said this was the original plot, and this was shown in RtO with the notes.

Yes, but this is not Word of God - or so it has been explained to me, since it didn't make it into the game.

So all we have is the letters in RtO - and in those, Caillan seems fine with the idea.  I don't remember the exact wording of the letters, but I'm pretty sure it's at least vague as to whose idea it was. 

It's not like Celene kidnapped him, drugged him, and had him sign a marriage contract while under the influence.

And besides - military invasion is exactly what we're talking about here.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

They were not planning a military invasion.

Celene was just planning on marrying Cailan, and winning Fereldan without a military coup.
D Gaider said this was the original plot, and this was shown in RtO with the notes.

The Orlesian army "saving" Ferelden from the blight and being there would have helped jsutify Celene's marriage.

Because no country on Earth sends its army without benefiting.

[Giggles_Manically]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

They were not planning a military invasion.

Celene was just planning on marrying Cailan, and winning Fereldan without a military coup.
D Gaider said this was the original plot, and this was shown in RtO with the notes.

The Orlesian army "saving" Ferelden from the blight and being there would have helped jsutify Celene's marriage.

Because no country on Earth sends its army without benefiting.

Calian was an even bigger retard to me after RtO (if that was even possible)
He was marrying a bloody empress of the huge empire next door.
Ues your head man! 

[KnightofPhoenix]

TJPags wrote...

Yes, but this is not Word of God - or so it has been explained to me, since it didn't make it into the game.

So all we have is the letters in RtO - and in those, Caillan seems fine with the idea.  I don't remember the exact wording of the letters, but I'm pretty sure it's at least vague as to whose idea it was. 

Yes, it is the word of God. Celene was planing to marry Calain. What didn't make it in the game is Celene being in Denerim and Loghain knowing about it before Ostagar.

[mousestalker]

Loghain and the Blight

[Giggles_Manically]

Duncan Facepalm is win.

[KnightofPhoenix]

It would have been closer to the truth if it was "Ah yes, blight". Loghain knows there are darkspawn.

[TJPags]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

TJPags wrote...

Yes, but this is not Word of God - or so it has been explained to me, since it didn't make it into the game.

So all we have is the letters in RtO - and in those, Caillan seems fine with the idea.  I don't remember the exact wording of the letters, but I'm pretty sure it's at least vague as to whose idea it was. 

Yes, it is the word of God. Celene was planing to marry Calain. What didn't make it in the game is Celene being in Denerim and Loghain knowing about it before Ostagar.

So Caillan was planning to marry Celene . .  .that's a given. 

Got it.
 
Still no invasion.

[Persephone]

TJPags wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

They were not planning a military invasion.

Celene was just planning on marrying Cailan, and winning Fereldan without a military coup.
D Gaider said this was the original plot, and this was shown in RtO with the notes.

Yes, but this is not Word of God - or so it has been explained to me, since it didn't make it into the game.

So all we have is the letters in RtO - and in those, Caillan seems fine with the idea.  I don't remember the exact wording of the letters, but I'm pretty sure it's at least vague as to whose idea it was. 

It's not like Celene kidnapped him, drugged him, and had him sign a marriage contract while under the influence.

And besides - military invasion is exactly what we're talking about here.

It is not. Whether by war or by a vow at the altar, Orlais would swallow Ferelden like a cat would a canary. That's politics. To suggest that Celene's motives were luv or offering to save her country's former slaves....that strikes me as seriously naive. And a king being fine with betraying his (loyal) wife who ruled for him and with betraying his country to its arch enemy doesn't make it any less idiotic and despicable.

[KnightofPhoenix]

TJPags wrote...
So Caillan was planning to marry Celene . .  .that's a given. 

Got it.
 
Still no invasion.

There are other ways to control a country other than direct military invasion. Whether it was planned or not, the result of such a union would have been the subordination of the weaker country to the stronger one. 

[Sarah1281]

TJPags wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

TJPags wrote...

Yes, but this is not Word of God - or so it has been explained to me, since it didn't make it into the game.

So all we have is the letters in RtO - and in those, Caillan seems fine with the idea.  I don't remember the exact wording of the letters, but I'm pretty sure it's at least vague as to whose idea it was. 

Yes, it is the word of God. Celene was planing to marry Calain. What didn't make it in the game is Celene being in Denerim and Loghain knowing about it before Ostagar.

So Caillan was planning to marry Celene . .  .that's a given. 

Got it.
 
Still no invasion.

 Loghain didn't just fear an Orlesian invasion. He feared that Orlais would try to retake Ferelden and an invasion seemed to him the most likely way that they could do it. He would be just as appalled if Cailan had lived long enough to try to marry Celene.