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[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Yeah, collectivism sucks big time, but if the Advent are psychics, it might just be a natural development of a psychic dominated culture, since theoretically, their minds would probably be linked in some form.



Other than that, though, the Advent sound more awesome by the minute. I'm a science/tech nut, so I can really dig that.



The TEC's stupidity (which I agree whole heartedly, they should have at least tried to get a slice of that technological pie) is the Advent's gain. And I intend to make them pay for it, too, in true to life evil elf style!



Question: Are there more devious, subtler, less violent methods to take over planets, as opposed to bombing and invading directly? Like, manipulating things behind the scenes, sending in agents provacateur to weaken governments, staging coups, bribery, assassination, ect? I mean, if let's say I find a really juicy planet that's populated, and I want to take it over, but want to do so without overt violence as to avoid damaging valuable infrastructure/resources, is this possible?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...
Question: Are there more devious, subtler, less violent methods to take over planets, as opposed to bombing and invading directly? Like, manipulating things behind the scenes, sending in agents provacateur to weaken governments, staging coups, bribery, assassination, ect? I mean, if let's say I find a really juicy planet that's populated, and I want to take it over, but want to do so without overt violence as to avoid damaging valuable infrastructure/resources, is this possible?

Unfortunately no and yea it sucks.
There are only 2 ways to take over a planet. Bomb the hell out of it, and kill its entire population and destroy all its infrastructure. Or wait until your culture overpowers the other and the planet will revolt and become neutral. The Advent have the most powerful culture so they have an advantage here. But it happens slowly that often it's not worth the wait. 

That's definitely the game's one big flaw.

There are no agents perse, but some capital ships have abilities that are somewhat similar. The Vasari Antorak Marauder has the ability to dispatch an elite strike team that will slow production time. The TEC Sova Carrier can embargo a planet, stealing the pkanet's income rate and grounding all trade and refinery ships. The Advent Revelation can spy on planets from a very big distance.
Each faction has envoys you can send to boost relationship with other factions. They have abilities that will help the other faction, in exchange for a relationship boost.

But that's it. Like I said before, the game is geared more towards combat. The Diplomacy system is not bad, considering how no game even came close to potraying the concept fully well. But the non-military options are very limited.

I usually play somewhat subtly, in the sense that I focus on economy and culture, with a high tech but small fleet at first. With the money and ressources I have, I can influence the black market and raise bounties to attract pirates to attack factions I don't like, allies included. You can also pay factions or pirates to do very specific tasks. But at the end of the day, it's all geared towards military. You can of course bribe factions to like you and it will work to some extent. But if you want a higher relationship, you need to send envoys.

Hopefully the sequel will add agents and other means of expansion.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Diplomacy then. I suppose that's do. At least they let you still be somewhat devious behind the scenes, even with allies. Still, I agree, I like active subversion and intrigue as tools better, since it involves less waste and better long term benefits.



I also prefer subtlety as well, prefering to focus on economy, culture, and tech, since these are long term investments that have applications on multiple fronts, including military ones.



What about weaponry? Are there unconventional means of warfare, such a bio, chemical, nukes, nano-bots, EMPs, ect?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...
What about weaponry? Are there unconventional means of warfare, such a bio, chemical, nukes, nano-bots, EMPs, ect?

Oh yea there are tons of that. Most if not all ships have abilities that involve stuff like that.
The Advent specialize in drone technology (called the anima) and have the best fighters, and in beam technology. The Vasari focus on nano-tech and phase technology. The TEC do have chemical warheads, EMPs...etc.
And there are tons more really. Each capital ships has 4 abilities and they are usually unconventional.

One of my favorites is Hysteria, the ultimate ability to the Advent's Revelation. It turns the population of a planet crazy and they start killing each other.

Also, each faction has one experimental weapon. The TEC have the novalith cannon, which fires a huge warhead that decimate most planets in 2-3 shots (many in one shot). The Vasari have the Kostura cannon, that fires a warhead that damages all enemy ships around a planet, disables all defenses for an extensive period of time and turns the planet into a phase node, which means that you can send your forces to that planet (if they are in another phase node) directly, bypassing conventional phase lines. Perfect for first strike, followed  up by a surgical strike. The Vasari lack siege cruisers to strike at defenses, but they can disable them.

The Advent have the  Deliverance engine. It emphasises Advent power and that's culture. You can fire it at planets and it will spread your culture. If playing against a faction that did not invest heavily in culture and thus can't resist yours, it can easily make planets revolt. Also, when fighting on a planet where your culture is dominant, your fleet recieves a bonus (varies according to factions). So the Deliverance engine is a good way to weaken a culture temporarily while strengthening your own, empowering your fleet in the area in the process.

There are a ton of other technologies and technology trees that you can research and develop. TEchnology for both military and civilian uses.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 janvier 2011 - 03:00 .

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

One of my favorites is Hysteria, the ultimate ability to the Advent's Revelation. It turns the population of a planet crazy and they start killing each other.

:O:O

Just.....awesome. Too full of win for words. Psychological warfare rules!

I like that each faction has weapons and tactics unique to it makes it even more cool. The deliverance engine especially, as that sounds like it is the closest thing to subtle takeover that the game has.

Are there ways to prevent/guard against attemepts by other factions to do the same things to your own planets?

Can't wait to get it now. Every now and then, I make bulk orders of Amazon of books and an occasional game, and I haven't had a good strategy game in years, so i figured I'd ask for recommebndations. This is sounding better and better. It will be a belated birthday gift for me, hopefully make up for a crummy birthday.

[KnightofPhoenix]

When we use histeria, you hear sounds of people shouting and screaming (from space...wow). It's awesomely creepy.

The Vasari mothership can drain a planet, killing it and extracting ressources as well. Cool stuff.

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...
Are there ways to prevent/guard against attemepts by other factions to do the same things to your own planets?

The ways to counter culture is by culture. Culture also has a cultural resistance with it.
Also, each capital ship provides a culture resistance (the Vasari are the best in this, but have the weakest culture). So having capital ships in orbit deters the population from dissenting.

Also, the Star bases have an upgrade that essentially makes the government / administration of a planet reside in it. So you cannot lose control of a planet unless the star base is destroyed. It can still be bombarded, to reduce tax income. But you will not lose control. Same applies to culture. They can't rebel if you have a star base with the appropriate upgrade in orbit.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

I'm definitely going to have to try all three factions. The Advent sounds the most interesting for me, being a technophile, but the other factions sound like they have some pretty wicked weaponry of their own, as well as unique ways to obliterate their enemies.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

I'm definitely going to have to try all three factions. The Advent sounds the most interesting for me, being a technophile, but the other factions sound like they have some pretty wicked weaponry of their own, as well as unique ways to obliterate their enemies.

It's one of the rare few games where I like and enjoy all factions.
Especially since all three have something that I like, vis a vis style, ambience and lore.

[Costin_Razvan]

You two could always try a 4x game like Europa Universalis or Hearts of Iron. Those do get into quite a lot of politics.



Personally I don't really care about subtle takeovers and/or politicking in games. I vastly prefer having a good fight on my hands, throwing myself in a head on challenge against a foe on the field and crushing them under my feet.



As for Sins...I tried it and gave up. Not that I don't like it or anything, but I have a rule in that I only play on the hardest difficulty ( only exceptions are Total War games where I refuse to play on VH in battles but do so in campaign ). I literary got my ass kicked by the AI.



I was impressed by the fact the AI has no advantage over you in terms of economy, it's just good by itself at building an empire. Thing is I don't really like games where you have no story and are asked to build your own ( I really hate sandbox games ).

[KnightofPhoenix]

Yea, I started on medium difficult and then rose up. Diplomacy adds two new difficulties. Cruel and Vicious. And **** are they hard lol.

But I think it's my style of play that makes it easier. I generally play on big maps, so no rushing. Take my time and build an economy and then keep those nasty pirates away from me as I expand slowly but surely. Plus high tech fleet. Diplomacy makes it easier as I generally end up making peace with everyone and play divide and conquer.

So yea, I am more of a Sins person. You Costin on the otherhand are more of a Starcraft person lol. I suck at it.

[Giggles_Manically]

I enjoyed playing SC2 on my friends computer.



Fun and its awesome to see the game change based on your choices.



Although every time I think of Tosh I hear:

COMA PLAY DOLLS WITH ME MISTA RAYNAH!

[KnightofPhoenix]

Did the game really change that much according to our choices?

Eh, from what I remember, the only change was either ghosts or specters in your arsenal.

[Giggles_Manically]

It was more how you would get different missions and cutscenes based on your choice.



I was iffy about helping Nova over Tosh but I just howled with laughter seeing that guy get thrown around by the voodoo doll.

[Costin_Razvan]

So yea, I am more of a Sins person. You Costin on the otherhand are more of a Starcraft person lol. I suck at it.

You are Talleyrand while I am Napoleon. "Chuckle".

[Morwen Eledhwen]

What? No one has remarked that we are on page 300?



Loghain disapproves -50 and goes off to drink himself into a stupor.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...

What? No one has remarked that we are on page 300?

Loghain disapproves -50 and goes off to drink himself into a stupor.

Yay! Loggy's getting drunk, so we can take advantage of him!

[Giggles_Manically]

Poor Loghain.



Having to choose between a life time in Orlais or a life time with Skadi.....

That would indeed suck.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Poor Loghain.

Having to choose between a life time in Orlais or a life time with Skadi.....
That would indeed suck.

Not in the slightest. My "daggers and all" are far more enjoyable than Orlesian ones.

[Giggles_Manically]

Yeah.



I can still see him putting on a foppish cap and running for the border screaming.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Yeah.

I can still see him putting on a foppish cap and running for the border screaming.

In Skadi's Dungeon, no one can year you scream.

[Giggles_Manically]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Yeah.

I can still see him putting on a foppish cap and running for the border screaming.

In Skadi's Dungeon, no one can year you scream.

HAH!

You forget that Simon T/Loghain can melt steel with his voice, and rock with a glare!
See if you can stop him when he starts talking, slowly, and very seriously.

Or gives you a look.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Giggles_Manically wrote...
HAH!

You forget that Simon T/Loghain can melt steel with his voice, and rock with a glare!
See if you can stop him when he starts talking, slowly, and very seriously.

Or gives you a look.

Pheh. You forget who you are dealing with. When Skadi says you will stay,  you WILL stay. I am beyond such mortal manipulations.

Well, except kittens. If Loghain were to suddenly produce, out of thin air, a basket full of purring, frolicing kittens, I would be forced to accept a comprimise. But whipping out kittens is a total cheese tactic, and well beneath his talents.

[Giggles_Manically]

When you are pushed... you must do whatever it takes to survive.



Although..., how would you get close to Loghain I mean one line or eyebrow raise... and oh... I forget I was talking about Skadi here.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

When you are pushed... you must do whatever it takes to survive.

Although..., how would you get close to Loghain I mean one line or eyebrow raise... and oh... I forget I was talking about Skadi here.

You are learning, young grasshopper.

[Zjarcal]

Morwen Eledhwen wrote...

What? No one has remarked that we are on page 300?

I was going to mention it but judging by the amount of posts that had gone on I figured no one cared...

Look, Loghain is sad.