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[Giggles_Manically]

I could post the pictures of the actual dialouge its just that my net is slow today.



Still the demo was fun and I am actually looking forward to playing DA2.

Smashing into darkspawn as a Sword and Shield warrior was simply awesome.

[Addai]

DA2 is definitely painting black over Loghain. Since the line about Cailan being betrayed wasn't in the actual dialogue choices, it came as a surprise, too. Boooooo.  This did not fit the more nuanced presentation in Origins, where some common folk were blaming the Wardens, many thought Cailan was foolish etc.

I have to say that the demo dampened my enthusiasm, which had been on the rise. I like the changes to mage class a lot, not so much the other ones. I'm resigned that I didn't like combat in DAO, won't like it in DA2, and it will probably be a less memorable and replayable experience overall.  Also, some of the dialogue was just bad and that isn't the only example.  I was disappointed.  But, still looking forward to trying the game.

Modifié par Addai67, 23 février 2011 - 08:27 .

[ZeroDotZero]

Addai67 wrote...

DA2 is definitely painting black over Loghain. Since the line about Cailan being betrayed wasn't in the actual dialogue choices, it came as a surprise, too. Boooooo.  This did not fit the more nuanced presentation in Origins, where some common folk were blaming the Wardens, many thought Cailan was foolish etc.

Hawke or Carver was at Ostagar, and they probably considered Loghain a traitor, and thus they told Varric he betrayed the king. It makes sense to me.

[Addai]

Why should my PC agree with Carver? It's annoying. But, this is a set character so there you go.

[USArmyParatrooper]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Sigh.

You do realize that he wasn't trying to kill Eamon, do you not? He wanted to disable/incapacitate him without killing him. This plan was made before Ostagar, and was carried out before then. And which is why he used Jowan. Poison and things like that are not things Loghain knows anything about. He's a general who was a farmer. He wasn't a mage or herbalist or assasin.

And I don't even think I need to go into why he didn't just go into Redcliffe and attack Eamon. Aside from how politically stupid it would be simply to go in and attack someone openly.

Yes, slavery is a dickish thing to do. So are alot of things that go on in Ferelden. But if you are going to punish Loghain for selling elves into slavery, you may as well punish the Couslands, Eamon, and everyone else who keeps elf servants, as their lot is little better than a slave's.

You're missing the point. Loghain's behavior on multiple counts was considered bad even by Ferelden standards. Why else would he have tied so hard to hide what happened at Ostagar? Why did he poison Eamon in secret, and deny it in the Landsmeet? Why did Eamon get excited about finding proof he was slave driving? You keep saying "that's politics" but the thing is, these things wouldn't be bad politics if they were considered acceptable behavior. Also of note, dialogue in the Landmeet. "We're talking about your crimes here" in references to the things he did.

Also, how is a voluntary, paid employee little better than forcibly ripping someone from their homes and committing them into a lifetime for forced labor? 

And I personally reject the idea of a good and virtuous Warden. They are called "Grey" Wardens for a reason.

I think that's absurd. While being a Warden doesn't automatically make someone virtuous, it certainly doesn't preclude them from being so.

Modifié par USArmyParatrooper, 23 février 2011 - 11:17 .

[USArmyParatrooper]

Addai67 wrote...

Why should my PC agree with Carver? It's annoying. But, this is a set character so there you go.

It wasn't until the 90's that a computer (dubbed  'Deep Blue') managed to defeat the world champion, a man many consider the best chess player that ever lived. The computer was made by IBM and that player was Gary Kasparov.

And now today software has reached a new milestone. Thanks to the geniuses at Bioware, the player character in DA2 has become a better judge of character than any human.

Modifié par USArmyParatrooper, 23 février 2011 - 11:22 .

[Addai]

Software spitting out lines written by someone with a point of view, supposedly my PC's.

But if you're here just to troll, Paratrooper, move on. The Loghain hate threads are over thataway.

Modifié par Addai67, 23 février 2011 - 11:29 .

[USArmyParatrooper]

Addai67 wrote...

Software spitting out lines written by someone with a point of view, supposedly my PC's.

But if you're here just to troll, Paratrooper, move on. The Loghain hate threads are over thataway.

Where, can you link me to them? Lighten up. It was a joke.

[PsychoWARD23]

Didn't read all of the thread, but I agree. Him, Andrew Ryan and Saren are the top 3 video game villains this gen in my opinion.

[Addai]

by Milulya

[Addai]

Also by Milulya:

[Giggles_Manically]

Just played the Shogun 2 demo.

Awesome.

Simply awesome.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Nice! I am glad there is a surge in Loghain art, before it was only 2 or 3.

[Addai]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Nice! I am glad there is a surge in Loghain art, before it was only 2 or 3.

Seems to be spurred by the Mac Tir group on dA.  Milulya has done some other Loghains that I like, but if I may say, I think she is getting better and better.  That Ostagar one is powerful.  *inspired*  She also did a very nice Cauthrien.

I'm a little disturbed by what appears to be Architect romance drawings.  lol

Modifié par Addai67, 24 février 2011 - 06:08 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Um...yea. I get that the Architect is an interesting and somewhat tragic character but....yea.

[Addai]

Well, she appears to be a bit of a dystopia fan. There are Charon romance drawings, too, and not everyone could picture ghoul love. Though I *ahem* had a crush on Charon, too.

[CalJones]

Heh, she seems to have interesting tastes. I spotted a Garrus there (squee) and a nice Morrigan.

Yeah I have to say I am a bit dismayed at the negative portrayal of Loghain in DA2. I guess I shouldn't be surprised but for those of us who have delved a bit deeper into his character, it is very disappointing.

[Costin_Razvan]

Yeah I have to say I am a bit dismayed at the negative portrayal of Loghain in DA2. I guess I shouldn't be surprised but for those of us who have delved a bit deeper into his character, it is very disappointing.

There was only ONE sodding ****ing lousy thing that they could have done to ****** me off about Dragon Age 2, and they did it by making Loghain the traitor of the mighty and great King Cailan.

For **** sake Bioware. The gameplay changes are great from my perspective, the voiced character thing, all fine and well, the dialogue wheel OK. The Human Race thing....tolerable.

But making the game so that the bloody people who don't even post on these forums ( just the vast majority of Dragon Age gamers ) who kill Loghain so they can have their "happy" ending with Alistair on the throne just is a spit in the face.

I could have accepted no reference to my Warden or Loghain's retreat at Ostagar in game and that would have been fine as I am not naive enough to expect to see any of my former companions in future DA games ( Anders was a rather big surprise for me, pleasant however ) but to have your PC whom you should have direct control over declare Loghain a traitor is JUST BS

So yes, this is me raging.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 24 février 2011 - 07:37 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

I think people are making too much out of this. I don't think this will lead to the canonization of Alistair as king, nor will it ever be able to convince me that Cailan was anything other than an idiotic pathetic excuse of an adult let alone king.

[Giggles_Manically]

Heh that is what we get with defined heroes in an RPG.

[Costin_Razvan]

The "default" game setting is one where the Warden set Alistair on the throne, or so the wiki says.

There are 2 other choices though. One where the Dalish Warden died while slaying the Archdemon and place Anora and Alistair on the throne and the last one where a DN had Loghain "redeem" himself by killing the Archdemon and also exiled Alistair.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 24 février 2011 - 07:59 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Since I am importing, I don't really care about the "default version". Unless of course importing turns out to be crap.

[Giggles_Manically]

Yeah those three endings are the default ones to import.



Gives us:

The Dark Ritual

Ultimate Sacrifice

Loghain Redeemer ending



Anora solo

Alistair solo

Alistair and Anora.



Wonder if those games will mention Orzamar or the other big choices?

[Costin_Razvan]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Since I am importing, I don't really care about the "default version". Unless of course importing turns out to be crap.

Which is exactly what I am worried about.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Best way to ****** Costin off. When he imports, he will get Alistair unhardened as king and Harrowmont as king