12857 réponses à ce sujet

[Chewin]

@Jedimaster88 Need help finding the book?

Modifié par Chewin3, 21 juin 2011 - 06:03 .

[Addai]

We don't know how much Maric told Loghain. He was being a bit secretive at the end of The Calling- mainly about his baby with an Orlesian Warden mage. Maric didn't know much about them himself really, just that they were needed because he was afraid Flemeth's prophecy would turn out to be true.

Incidentally, Flemeth also said about Loghain, in Loghain's hearing, "keep him close and he will betray you, each time worse than the last." One reason Loghain was so reluctant to believe that the darkspawn attacks were actually a Blight was that if Flemeth's prophecy about the Blight were true, her prophecy about him might be true as well. He didn't want to face the idea that he had or could betray his closest friend.

[Jedimaster88]

Chewin3 thanks for the link. Its good to know I can find it in my homecountry. Maybe I will buy it someday.

[Bleachrude]

Makes me wonder that didnt Maric tell Loghain about what he experienced with the wardens? You would think he saw pretty well why they are needed and would tell about it to his friend. Then again the wardens dont exactly share their secrets. This actually makes me also wonder how does Anora know about the joining in the landsmeet.

Anora knowing about the joining AND blurting it out loud during the landsmeet  is a big WTF for me too...best explanation I've heard is that all the heads of states and the Divines (black and white) are told certain grey warden secrets...

Of course, given the Calling, I don't think Maric knew about the joining so there's evidence AGAINST the above explanation...

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

But at the very least some people in Origins sounded intelligent. In DA2, we didn't get even that, let alone people being shown as competent.

Yes, I'm rather glad I didn't buy a copy back home, rather wait until I see it discounted somewhere. Winning the game because everyone against me is a com-lete moron, and those for me partially so, really feels....hollow.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Jedimaster88 wrote...

I see. Well those circumstances do give good reasons for his behavior. Thanks for the info.

Makes me wonder that didnt Maric tell Loghain about what he experienced with the wardens? You would think he saw pretty well why they are needed and would tell about it to his friend. Then again the wardens dont exactly share their secrets. This actually makes me also wonder how does Anora know about the joining in the landsmeet.

And given that Orlesian Wardens almost got Maric kidnapped and killed involving a plot by the Orlesian govornment themselves, it makes even more sense why Loghain is supicious and untrusting of the Grey Wardens. They haven't exactly got the best track record in Ferelden.

[Bleachrude]

Er, that wasn't part of the Orlesian government was it?.

The Orlesian first enchanter was working with the Architect which would've worked in Orlais benefit but I don't remember the Emperor or the actual Orlesian government working with the First Enchanter...

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Bleachrude wrote...

Er, that wasn't part of the Orlesian government was it?.

The Orlesian first enchanter was working with the Architect which would've worked in Orlais benefit but I don't remember the Emperor or the actual Orlesian government working with the First Enchanter...

The orlesian First Enchanter is pretty much as subtle an agent for the govornment of Orlais as anyone. I highly doubt Celene or members of her court were not in on it. Someone as high profile as the First Enchanter of the Circle in the most powerful nation in Thedas is not going to be far removed from the Orlesian court. Plus, the Chantry is pretty much a tool of the Orlesian govornment, and by extentions, so are the Circles.

[MKDAWUSS]

One thing I hope they return to in the DA series is the political elements. I thought that was one of the stronger subplots of DAO and DAA, be it the Landsmeet or managing Amaranthine's nobility. The main storyline seems to have gone from Wardens-Darkspawn to Mages-Templars, which, IMO isn't quite as interesting as Queens and Emperors and war and politics. I'd rather have Loghain planning for war against the Arishok's army than Templars fighting abominations...

But I'm probably in the minority, so...

[Addai]

The mage-templar conflict could have been interesting, if it had been presented less as a result of Fade- and lyrium-induced mass hysteria and more of a political/ social/ religious fracture.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Yep. I agree. The mage/templar conflict is one of the most interesting things in the DA universe, but from what I've seen of DA2, they really clowned what could have been a serious dilema full of mystery and intrigue.

[Bleachrude]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Bleachrude wrote...

Er, that wasn't part of the Orlesian government was it?.

The Orlesian first enchanter was working with the Architect which would've worked in Orlais benefit but I don't remember the Emperor or the actual Orlesian government working with the First Enchanter...

The orlesian First Enchanter is pretty much as subtle an agent for the govornment of Orlais as anyone. I highly doubt Celene or members of her court were not in on it. Someone as high profile as the First Enchanter of the Circle in the most powerful nation in Thedas is not going to be far removed from the Orlesian court. Plus, the Chantry is pretty much a tool of the Orlesian govornment, and by extentions, so are the Circles.

Um, the first enchanter was of the Ferelden Circle/tower...maybe I missed it but where did it state anything about the Orlesian circle having correspondence with Femille?

[CalJones]

In the Calling.

[Addai]

I come bearing arts.    This is a commission done for me by MaevesChild called Many Mistakes.

[Morwen Eledhwen]

Addai67 wrote...

I come bearing arts.    This is a commission done for me by MaevesChild called Many Mistakes.

*snip*

Wow. I think this is my favorite of the Loghains she's done. And poor Ellie looks so sad. For some reason her hair and the earring kind of say it all for her.

Modifié par Morwen Eledhwen, 24 juin 2011 - 03:45 .

[Addai]

The story's been fairly melancholy so it fits the mood.  We made a pact we'd do another one later on and that one will be happier. And saucier, potentially. 

Modifié par Addai67, 24 juin 2011 - 04:16 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

What would their marriage be a mistake? Did Cailan go crazy(ier) and ask for Orlesians to invade, just out of spite?

[Addai]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

What would their marriage be a mistake? Did Cailan go crazy(ier) and ask for Orlesians to invade, just out of spite?

She was just having self doubt in that chapter.  I do recall that it was after a run-in with Cailan.  Of course.  :innocent:

The mood of the painting in general is meant to show that they're close but that events are driving them apart.

[CalJones]

Very nice. But she does need a hug, doesn't she?

[astreqwerty]

i think the worst part of dao is loghain...he was so terribly written and reasonated that his stupidly one dimensional character didnt emanate any form of moral dillema..all i can say about this poor accident of biowares otherwise brilliant writting is : kill it with fire!!

so no i never betray alistair(imo siding with loghain is the utter definition of betrayal..)plus i dont see how his existense serves as and aid to the battle against the blight either)

[Addai]

astreqwerty wrote...

i think the worst part of dao is loghain...he was so terribly written and reasonated that his stupidly one dimensional character didnt emanate any form of moral dillema..all i can say about this poor accident of biowares otherwise brilliant writting is : kill it with fire!!

so no i never betray alistair(imo siding with loghain is the utter definition of betrayal..)plus i dont see how his existense serves as and aid to the battle against the blight either)

Modifié par Addai67, 26 juin 2011 - 05:16 .

[Bleachrude]

I think the one thing that proves Loghain was wrong is that the Orlesians didn't invade right after Ostagar.

(I've read fanfics where 5-10 years later, the writers will have an Orlais vs Ferelden fight and of course Ferelden wins, but this ignores the fact that the BEST time for Orlais to invade is right as the Archdemon/horde is moving on Denerim.

Every year afterwards gives Ferelden time to recover AND it's not like the Orlesians haven't used the Blight itself to expand (the Anderfels for example) so they KNOW the best time to invade/save a land is during a Blight.

Why wait so long then? Unless you have Celene assassinated, THEN I can see crazy Orlesian emperor invading...

[CalJones]

Heh heh.

Regarding the Orlesians, he's not that wrong. If you import a save into DA2 where Alistair is king, you can talk to Alistair in Act 3 and he'll mention that the Orlesians are plotting something. As they saying goes, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

[Jedimaster88]

He doesnt mean every Orlesians. He says something like "apparently some orlesians think it would be grand to have their lost province back". He also mentions that empress Celene is doing her best, which makes me think that she doesnt approve with those "some".

[Addai]

If spared, there is a dialogue where Loghain agrees that there was no immediate threat on the border. He calls his assessment that there was "a tactical error." It's still a very reasonable assumption to have made, given Orlais' history.