12857 réponses à ce sujet

[KnightofPhoenix]

After finishing Origins, I didn't think I could like anyone better either. But really, I like Jacques and Letho more (slightly). Still, Loghain is awesome and one of my favorite characters ever. And a very major reason as to why I really like Origins. Without him, I doubt I would have liked it as much.

I am hoping that SC2 will get better. Don't get me wrong, Wings of Liberty is awesome and the presentation is fabulous. It's just the content vis-a-vis story that for now, has me unimpressed.
I am looking forward to Legacy of the Void. The premise of reuniting the Protoss sounds very intriguing. But I do not like the idea of playing Zeratul. I like him a lot, but I prefer him in the role of the wise adviser / badass warrior. He did not have that major a role in SC1 and he was alongside Artanis in Brood War. I'd much rather play as Artanis or someone new who can rise to become the new Hierarch. A rise to power so to speak.

[KnightofPhoenix]

http://starcraft.wik...acy_of_the_Void

They referenced a video where it is mentionned that Zeratul will be the main character. But that could have changed.

[Costin_Razvan]

I'm an old man and I've been gaming for 25 years.

SC2 sucked in it's main story.

Ok sucked would be putting it too harshly, but it definitively was too cliche. Also I've been gaming for 15 years myself and I never a single antagonist to match Jaques in terms of the raw emotion they can garner from the player.

As for the best antagonist in a game, definitively Letho.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Costin_Razvan wrote...
As for the best antagonist in a game, definitively Letho.

I am leaning more and more towards that sentiment. Though perhaps I'd phrase it like this: "Letho is the best implemented antagonist in a video game."

He is awesome and his interaction with Geralt is awesome.
In many ways, Letho is Geralt's opposite. And in other ways, practically the closest thing he has to family and kin.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 29 septembre 2011 - 01:48 .

[Joy Divison]

Isn't Starcraft a RTS, not a RPG? I kind of figured all RTS just give generic factions which don;t really developed because the gameplay is linear and all the focus is on balancing the units.

[Joy Divison]

I don't know if you've played NWN2, but I thought Ammon Jerro was a well developed antagonist.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Starcraft 2 had some RPG elements actually. There were some choices in it (which I found more interesting than choices in a certain RPG). And kind of a level up system with the research tree, where we had to choose between upgrades (can't have all of them).

The presentation and framework is unprecedented when it comes to stories in RTS, as far as I know. Problem is, the actual content was weak imo. The characters were meh for the most part, the dialogue is horribly cliche, and really, not that much happens in most of those missions. We had 30, but most of them were like buffers imo. They were great in terms of gameplay and they are different from each other. But in terms of story I felt they serve no purpose to warrant their presence. In terms of story, i ended up preferring StarCraft 1's 10-15 missions per faction, which ended up being more concise and to the point in terms of story.

And I absolutely hate what they did to Kerrigan. Hopefully she gets to be as badass as she was before in Brood War. Where at her most vulnerable state, she defeated 3 factions.  And I hate what they did to Mengsk. His treatment lacks a lot of subtelty that SC1 had. He is now portrayed as a typical villain, whereas in SC1 I wouldn't call him a villain. 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 29 septembre 2011 - 02:13 .

[Costin_Razvan]

You mean at her most vulnerable state she wiped the floor of the Pro toss, the Dominion and the UEF ( or UEA? Forgot the name ).

[Cobwebmaster]

Loghain's obsession with Orlesian invasion forced him to make the most apalling decisions which resulted in the death of his king and the division of his country at a time when they most needed unison. The way I see it Cailan's death was unfortunate and due (from Loghain's point of view) to his determination to take the field with the Grey Wardens. Loghain Mac Tyr had already decided to take control of the country in an effort to banish the Grey Wardens who he thought could not be trusted and were simply tools of the Orlesian empire. I don't see Loghain as being particularly deep just tunnel visioned, hugely prejudiced, and totally ruthless. While Maric was alive someone had the strength to rein in the more extreme side of his personality The fact that his daughter and Cailan had not produced an heir might have provoked some thought as to a new potential father of a dynasty (maybe even himself) but his military judgement was flawed. In manouvering for the destruction of the Grey Wardens at Ostagar he totally lost the overall plot. As a political strategist he was in my view pretty useless. Rather than woo the only other remaining teryn he decided to let Howe off his leash which he had to know was totally destructive to his overall cause. In addition the vast bulk of Highever's forces were virtually untouched at Ostagar and didn't even form part of the battle strategy. Loghain' tactics were born of panic and paranoia

[Addai]

Not sure what you mean about wooing the only other teyrn. Howe acted alone at Highever, as Gaider confirmed. How is anyone supposed to know that Bryce Cousland's long-time friend was going to stick a knife in his back?  At Ostagar, they had other more immediate problems to worry about than avenging the Couslands, even if Loghain had wanted to do that. After Ostagar, allying with Howe was the only pragmatic thing to do. Howe was already installed in the north and Loghain needed his armies.

Modifié par Addai67, 30 septembre 2011 - 09:25 .

[Costin_Razvan]

Howe was installed in the capital with guards "protecting" the Queen.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 30 septembre 2011 - 09:40 .

[Cobwebmaster]

Howe left Amaranthine to pursue his ambitions as Loghain's toady, The only armies in the North were his. Fergus had the bulk of Teryn Cousland's forces at his disposal. Loghain must have known making Howe his legman and chief ally would alienate the Couslands. Banns' swear loyalty to teryns and elect them not Arls. With all the Teryn of Highever's forces in the field (excepting Howe's own and any lackeys he had bribed on the north coast) Loghain had to know that there was yet again another threat to his rule. With the civil war how on earth did Loghain expect to defeat a Darkspawn Army with what little forces he could muster. The man was an idiot or had at least miscalculated very badly. A strange character flaw for one who was supposed to be a master tactician.

For me Ostagar was the opportunity for Loghain to destroy the Grey Wardens and thus eliminate the threat of Orlesian incursion via the Grey Wardens and their support divisions. Any other casualties were collateral damage as far as he was concerned. With darkspawn numbers known to be growing how on earth could he possibly sacrifice so many? His plan was always to abandon any forces fighting with the Grey Wardens. When he failed to convince Cailan to command the reserve troops or let the Grey Wardens be the sole sacrifice he was unable to change his strategy. The loss of so many troops was catastrophic. Had he given support to enable Cailan's withdrawal he could have pulled his coup d'etat and still have a considerable force at his disposal. However his course was already set having neutralised Redcliffe's arl ( which I assume was one of his arlings), and deliberately neutered the Circle Magi. Also Addai67. Howe was not Cousland's long time friend there was a lot of bad feeling between the two familiesafter the Orlais fight and the seizure of Harper's Ford which was part of Amaranthine's arling. Even though the Howes were vassals of the Teryn of Highever they still initially sided with Orlais during the rebellion, whereas the Cousland's supported Maric and the rebellion from the outset. That incident only went back one generation to Bryce's parents. I think the "right" thing for Loghain to do was to arrest Howe for his treachery and have him executed. His reputation as the hero of Ferelden would carry him through that and would bind Fergus Cousland and the Banns to him. After all an Arl is basically only a sort of high echelon Bann given extra lands and favour by his Teryn

[Addai]

There were no Couslands when Loghain makes Howe his ally (at least that anybody knows of). There's no sign Loghain and Howe had any connection at all prior to Ostagar, and after Ostagar all the Couslands are dead or missing. Meanwhile Howe is occupying the north and Denerim as well, and his forces were untouched by Ostagar.

I'm not sure you've played the Cousland origin if you think Howe and Bryce Cousland weren't friends. It was Rendon who turned Amaranthine over to the rebels, opposing his own father. They were both survivors of the White River battle. Howe was Bryce's liegeman, and in the origin story they talk like old pals. It's kind of irrelevant, though. The point being that Howe acted alone and there's no evidence that anyone could have expected his betrayal ahead of time if Cousland himself didn't know.

At Ostagar Loghain made a calculation that he could not fight the Orlesians and darkspawn if all his army got shredded trying to save Cailan. You can believe he always intended to destroy the GWs, but there's nothing that supports that so it's pure speculation.

Modifié par Addai67, 01 octobre 2011 - 06:00 .

[Addai]

Poisoning Eamon was in anticipation of a showdown with Cailan over Orlais. It was removing a supporter. Gaider has said that's the reason he did it.

[Addai]

I don't see any reason not to believe him. He's the lead writer. lol If he doesn't know, who does?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Hanz54321 wrote...

Regardless, Loghain made a calculated risk.  He bet that with Cailan and the Wardens slain and Eamon unable to challenge Anora's throne, the Bannorn would see the very thing you are pointing out.  The Bannorn would see that the Darkspawn are the bigger threat and that now was not the time for petty politics.  The Bannorn would join forces, follow Loghain and attack the Darkspawn in unison.

It was a good bet by Loghain.

That's what makes him naive and politically stupid.
He was betting that the banns that kill each other for trees are rational. He was betting on the bannorn, that bowed down to the Orlesian invaders without giving a fight, to unite to save a country they care nothing for. He was betting on the same bannorn that he knew made every single Landsmeet after independence a chaotic mess.

No one should bet on these idiots being rational and of being capable of understanding what is happening. They should have been manipulated and their leader killed and not just incapacitated.

That's the difference between Loghain and Bhelen. And why the latter is the great leader while the former is not. Bhelen understands his environment and surroundings and how they work.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 02 octobre 2011 - 02:45 .

[billy the squid]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Hanz54321 wrote...

Regardless, Loghain made a calculated risk.  He bet that with Cailan and the Wardens slain and Eamon unable to challenge Anora's throne, the Bannorn would see the very thing you are pointing out.  The Bannorn would see that the Darkspawn are the bigger threat and that now was not the time for petty politics.  The Bannorn would join forces, follow Loghain and attack the Darkspawn in unison.

It was a good bet by Loghain.

That's what makes him naive and politically stupid.
He was betting that the banns that kill each other for trees are rational. He was betting on the bannorn, that bowed down to the Orlesian invaders without giving a fight, to unite to save a country they care nothing for. He was betting on the same bannorn that he knew made every single Landsmeet after independence a chaotic mess.

No one should bet on these idiots being rational and of being capable of understanding what is happening. They should have been manipulated and their leader killed and not just incapacitated.

This is actually part of the reason I tend to align myself with Anora and make her Queen, when playing as a Cousland.

Become king Consort, Teryn of Gwaren and Commander of the Grey giving me control of Amaranthine, I wouldn't have minded the Warden's playing a greater role as they seem to do in the Anderfels, but combined with Anora as Queen, you have a lot of potential political clout. In addition  I spare Logahin, good man if short sighted and politically naive, but also Ferelden's greatest general, a useful ally. As well as hopefully securing your brother's support in Highever.

With that on your side you might have enough power to bring the Bannorn to heel, making them effectively a rubber stamp body, were there is no negative control within the Landsmeet.

Modifié par billy the squid, 02 octobre 2011 - 02:41 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Yes. Back in the day when I cared, I put quite a bit of thought into how to turn Ferelden from being a mess to having a system that is more rational and efficient, as one can see in my Arcturus blog.

A major reason why I do not want Alistair on the throne, he is the least likely to change the status quo. He lacks vision, at least on a macro level.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 02 octobre 2011 - 02:50 .