4454 réponses à ce sujet

[crimzontearz]

IndigoWolfe wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

real world =/= thedas

armor can be found at any weaponsmith's...cheap too depending on the material so...yeah it really does not fly

And the most common armors found on people throughout the game was leather armor and chainmail.

which coincidentally IS better than an apron!

An "apron" which looks a heck of a lot like leather armor.

and does NOT protect her armos, chest and legs........yeah....very VERY useful

It protects her core, which is what an enemy would most likely swing for. A bullet-proof vest does not cover your entire body, it protects the core.

 a bullet proof vest protects your chest....as for the arms she is a melee fighter not a shooter

I forgot to add that she also carries a shield, which --in a non gameplay mindset-- acts as an armor in and of itself.

And when you're in melee combat, you're not focused on hitting the arms, you strike at the core. It's the same principle, except not at a range.

and no you do not.....you strike at anything that you can in order to incapacitate your opponent, if you sever a tendon or a muscle in your opponent's arm then he cannot use it to strike or defend himself. yes your shield arm does NOT need as much cover because well you have the shield but your other arm does

[Crimson Invictus]

This should go well.

[Maria Caliban]

tmp7704 wrote...

Since DA characters have fixed height she isn't really taller than any other human female in the game. But definitely not shapeless.

The woman has already achieved amazon height in my mind. She's 6'1" and if I were searching for a parking spot and came upon a mini-cooper hogging one, she could just lift it up and move it.

But I would only use this in an emergency, like if it's raining and I don't want to get my head wet by walking from the back.

[Lukas Kristjanson]

crimzontearz wrote...

real world =/= thedas

armor can be found at any weaponsmith's...cheap too depending on the material so...yeah it really does not fly

You know, I didn’t think I really had to explain the selective reality of game mechanics versus creating tension by realistically limiting resources, but okay. Yes, you can instantly change your gear in Origins, and every merchant has equipment enough for a battalion. That does not mean that living beings in Thedas have the innate ability to change their clothes in a blink, carry 20 weapons in a backpack at a full run, or strip every dead guy of armour that somehow remains perfectly usable despite the massive injuries that killed the man. You may as well ask why anyone ever dies, what with all the potions they could presumably choke down in any situation. These are all simplifications to allow the player to ignore mundane hassles until they can actually contribute to the tension of the situation, instead of merely complicating it. Tension like the terror of people fleeing with nothing before an enemy they can’t even comprehend, the tenacity of warriors who lose everything before an unrelenting enemy but still stand, or the heartbreak of unavoidable and possibly necessary death.

People also seem to assume that everyone in the game has the same starting point, that it was mandatory "lounge around in your armour" hour at the tavern as everyone calmly waited for the prompt arrival of the darkspawn. But Aveline’s circumstance is different from the Hawkes', and from Wesley’s. Her character will progress according to the situation she finds herself in. And I’m not telling you what that is, because discovery is key to the appeal of what we do. But she is no civilian who dresses for court. Nothing in her character blurb suggests that.

And yeah, I have no doubt that someone will eventually mod massive plate on Aveline or others from the outset, or change their heads to match some elusive standard of appearance. And you know what? Those same people will complain that the drama of their game somehow lacks punch, because what do these characters have to struggle against when they look like they lack for nothing?

Some of you have a fantastical ability to construct a worst-case scenario. You should get into game design.

[IndigoWolfe]

*blah snip*
[quote]IndigoWolfe wrote...

[quote]crimzontearz wrote...

[quote]IndigoWolfe wrote...

It protects her core, which is what an enemy would most likely swing for. A bullet-proof vest does not cover your entire body, it protects the core.

[/quote]

 a bullet proof vest protects your chest....as for the arms she is a melee fighter not a shooter
[/quote]

I forgot to add that she also carries a shield, which --in a non gameplay mindset-- acts as an armor in and of itself.

And when you're in melee combat, you're not focused on hitting the arms, you strike at the core. It's the same principle, except not at a range.

[/quote]

and no you do not.....you strike at anything that you can in order to incapacitate your opponent, if you sever a tendon or a muscle in your opponent's arm then he cannot use it to strike or defend himself. yes your shield arm does NOT need as much cover because well you have the shield but your other arm does
[/quote]

Like I said earlier; the ability to avoid hits was better than the increased ability to take them.

When fighting with the shield, what you do is place it between yourself and your opponent, thus protecting everything behind it. You can protect both your extremities with one shield.

And speaking in a situational mindset, I don't think darkspawn would exactly have the presence of mind to stratiegically strike at anything that would incapacitate their opponent. They are dangerous because of the taint and their sheer numbers, not martial skill.

Granted, that only applies when fighting darkspawn, however, Lukas seemed to imply that she would not be wearing that same outfit for the entire game.

Modifié par IndigoWolfe, 27 novembre 2010 - 10:22 .

[Rawgrim]

Maria Caliban wrote...

tmp7704 wrote...

Since DA characters have fixed height she isn't really taller than any other human female in the game. But definitely not shapeless.

The woman has already achieved amazon height in my mind. She's 6'1" and if I were searching for a parking spot and came upon a mini-cooper hogging one, she could just lift it up and move it.

But I would only use this in an emergency, like if it's raining and I don't want to get my head wet by walking from the back.

6.1 isnt big. I run into 6.1 tall women every day. Taller too. I am 5.11, and I am bellow average height up here (Norway)

[IndigoWolfe]

Thank you, Lukas.

[In Exile]

Rawgrim wrote...

6.1 isnt big. I run into 6.1 tall women every day. Taller too. I am 5.11, and I am bellow average height up here (Norway)

You are a race of inhuman monster men. I'm 5'8; I couldn't imagine what it would be like to live in a country with the average height of 6'0+.

[Maria Caliban]

Rawgrim wrote...


6.1 isnt big. I run into 6.1 tall women every day. Taller too. I am 5.11, and I am bellow average height up here (Norway)

This is like me basing my notions of regular BMI on the people I met in Texas.

[slimgrin]

Rawgrim wrote...]

6.1 isnt big. I run into 6.1 tall women every day. Taller too. I am 5.11, and I am bellow average height up here (Norway)

Sounds like heaven to me. Norway, here I come.

Edit: Maria, you can't argue with genetics. You seem a tad jealous.

Modifié par slimgrin, 27 novembre 2010 - 10:38 .

[crimzontearz]

Lukas Kristjanson wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

real world =/= thedas

armor can be found at any weaponsmith's...cheap too depending on the material so...yeah it really does not fly

You know, I didn’t think I really had to explain the selective reality of game mechanics versus creating tension by realistically limiting resources, but okay. Yes, you can instantly change your gear in Origins, and every merchant has equipment enough for a battalion. That does not mean that living beings in Thedas have the innate ability to change their clothes in a blink, carry 20 weapons in a backpack at a full run, or strip every dead guy of armour that somehow remains perfectly usable despite the massive injuries that killed the man. You may as well ask why anyone ever dies, what with all the potions they could presumably choke down in any situation. These are all simplifications to allow the player to ignore mundane hassles until they can actually contribute to the tension of the situation, instead of merely complicating it. Tension like the terror of people fleeing with nothing before an enemy they can’t even comprehend, the tenacity of warriors who lose everything before an unrelenting enemy but still stand, or the heartbreak of unavoidable and possibly necessary death.

People also seem to assume that everyone in the game has the same starting point, that it was mandatory "lounge around in your armour" hour at the tavern as everyone calmly waited for the prompt arrival of the darkspawn. But Aveline’s circumstance is different from the Hawkes', and from Wesley’s. Her character will progress according to the situation she finds herself in. And I’m not telling you what that is, because discovery is key to the appeal of what we do. But she is no civilian who dresses for court. Nothing in her character blurb suggests that.

And yeah, I have no doubt that someone will eventually mod massive plate on Aveline or others from the outset, or change their heads to match some elusive standard of appearance. And you know what? Those same people will complain that the drama of their game somehow lacks punch, because what do these characters have to struggle against when they look like they lack for nothing?

Some of you have a fantastical ability to construct a worst-case scenario. You should get into game design.

aaaaaaaaand Lukas? we know that yet some enjoy mixing real world mechanics with gameplay 

example "oh wow she could have never donned her armor in time" and "omg armor is a **** to find" and so on and so forth where obviously it is YOUR decision (by yours I mean the devs) to put or not to put Aveline up in any armor other than the Apron (which is why this conversation took this particular tangent)

in other words it is perfectly plausible for her to "swap" armor on the fly because, as in other instances, you guys have allowed it for the greater good of the game in spite of the fact that removing and donning such armors takes one half hour/not everyone just walks around in full plate all the time...and therefore it is not a matter of "availability or possibility" but a matter of whether you decide it fit or not....which at this point is rather obvious you do not for whatever reason. Once again.....at this point it does not matter because A: it's a done deal and B: fixed appearance does not make a bad game but it does not mean some of us might not find it silly in specific situations.

also.......your words only seem to confirm the fact her armor will not improve much past what she wears now if you presume someone would mod massive armor on her (or maybe I am being pessimistic and she will wear a nice chainmail set later on).

still

it was also YOUR decision (not yours "YOURS" but yours "the dev's") to have military operatives run around in hich heels and catusuits in the middle of a combat zone in Mass Effect 2.......to this day people are still laughing at it and not just on these boards so given what I've seen before I am not going to hope for much more as long as functionally speaking I CAN improve their stats eough to make Aveline a viable tank which we were already told we can.

[Ammonite]

Qset wrote...

After all I am assuming all characters start around level 1 so her going from blacksmith to warrior during that section sounds solid. Her blacksmith time and husband would have given her some basic warrior type training anyway enough to be level 1.

She was trained in chivalrous combat, likely by her father. Likely from childhood on as well. I mean come on, the dude even named her Aveline. I vote blacksmith day job, w/chevalier training.

Modifié par Ammonite, 27 novembre 2010 - 10:44 .

[tmp7704]

Xewaka wrote...

Why oh why did you give her a sword? I'd be so awesome to have her chrusing faces through the game by the sheer power of fisticuffs...

Unfortunately there is no fist combat in DA2 at all anymore.

Modifié par tmp7704, 27 novembre 2010 - 10:43 .

[Maria Caliban]

While I'm inclined to give BioWare the benefit of the doubt, I can see how people might look at Mass Effect 2 and wonder what warriors characters with a fixed appearance might look like in Dragon Age.

I will point out here that Alavine's outfit is already more practical than Miranda's, Jack's, or Samara's.

[mr_luga]

Lukas Kristjanson wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

real world =/= thedas

armor can be found at any weaponsmith's...cheap too depending on the material so...yeah it really does not fly

-snippy-

And yeah, I have no doubt that someone will eventually mod massive plate on Aveline or others from the outset, or change their heads to match some elusive standard of appearance. And you know what? Those same people will complain that the drama of their game somehow lacks punch, because what do these characters have to struggle against when they look like they lack for nothing?

Wait a sec, does that mean for 10 years Aveline is going to wear THAT outfit? Farm gear? <.<

[Rawgrim]

I think it has been confirmed that Aveline will be wearing armour later in the game. Its somewhere in this thread, I belive.

[crimzontearz]

Rawgrim wrote...

I think it has been confirmed that Aveline will be wearing armour later in the game. Its somewhere in this thread, I belive.

for the 2000th time....no.......the only thing that was said is that she will change appearance it was never said she will wear armor

[crimzontearz]

Maria Caliban wrote...

While I'm inclined to give BioWare the benefit of the doubt, I can see how people might look at Mass Effect 2 and wonder what warriors characters with a fixed appearance might look like in Dragon Age.

I will point out here that Alavine's outfit is already more practical than Miranda's, Jack's, or Samara's.

and we thank god for that

[Rawgrim]

Nope. One of the Devs replied to someone saying that a warrior wearing clothes and not armour, would be stupid. The Dev said that Aveline would agree. Pretty much a confirmation that one.

[tmp7704]

Lukas Kristjanson wrote...

You know, I didn’t think I really had to explain the selective reality of game mechanics versus creating tension by realistically limiting resources, but okay.

But to be fair, when the first game has practically everyone combat-able down to the simplest bandit NPCs... always come equipped in proper armour no matter their possible financial situation (or other circumstances) And when it also appears to be case for NPCs in DA2 other than companions which we got to see on the screenshots so far... then i'd argue this attempt to create tension may not really work very well -- if just because given what game continually shows the player otherwise, this one instance of realism comes across gimmicky and somewhat forced. And that draws attention from the intended tension towards the oddity of such selective realism, instead.

It's sort of like meeting the only character in Thedas who has to actually regularly eat to live, because the writer wanted to stress there's shortage of food and so the character has to starve through part of the game. If that makes sense.

Modifié par tmp7704, 27 novembre 2010 - 11:05 .

[crimzontearz]

Rawgrim wrote...

Nope. One of the Devs replied to someone saying that a warrior wearing clothes and not armour, would be stupid. The Dev said that Aveline would agree. Pretty much a confirmation that one.

no because in the same thread he reponded to the poster commented that wearing the same clothes for 10 years was stupid and he replied "and so she won't"...also read above....."someone will mod a massive plate on her" what does that hiny at?




also wait a minute....MODDING? does that mean they will release an updated toolset?

[Rawgrim]

Dont think so. Gaider (I think it was) said that people modded BG2 as well, and that didnt come with a toolset. But I have also heard some mention of there not being a new toolset, but an updated version of the old one. So take your pick.Nothing is absolutely confirmed either way.

[Sigil_Beguiler123]

crimzontearz wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

Nope. One of the Devs replied to someone saying that a warrior wearing clothes and not armour, would be stupid. The Dev said that Aveline would agree. Pretty much a confirmation that one.

no because in the same thread he reponded to the poster commented that wearing the same clothes for 10 years was stupid and he replied "and so she won't"...also read above....."someone will mod a massive plate on her" what does that hiny at?




also wait a minute....MODDING? does that mean they will release an updated toolset?

Specifically Lukas said, "will eventually mod massive plate on Aveline or others from the outset." If anything for myself that points more toward Aveline getting armour then not.

[crimzontearz]

Sigil_Beguiler123 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

Nope. One of the Devs replied to someone saying that a warrior wearing clothes and not armour, would be stupid. The Dev said that Aveline would agree. Pretty much a confirmation that one.

no because in the same thread he reponded to the poster commented that wearing the same clothes for 10 years was stupid and he replied "and so she won't"...also read above....."someone will mod a massive plate on her" what does that hiny at?




also wait a minute....MODDING? does that mean they will release an updated toolset?

Specifically Lukas said, "will eventually mod massive plate on Aveline or others from the outset." If anything for myself that points more toward Aveline getting armour then not.

pardon me sigil..I am modding illiterate so I will have to take your word

[Aermas]

Alright, I'm not going to waste time quoting everyone so here goes.

When in combat you usually end up striking for the head & the arms, & the legs, no one thinks to protect their legs enough. These are the easiest to hit & will debilitate your opponent faster than hacking at the core, movies & TV shows where the hero slices the enemy in the gut & he falls are inaccurate.

Her apron cannot be used for smithing, the front of the chest has no protection, neither does her arms, if anyone has ever tried to smith their own armor you would know this.

If you are a Champion & a hero & have influence & have so much money from questing & have killed many many people you could have looted, you should be able to rustle up a suit of nice armor

Modifié par Aermas, 27 novembre 2010 - 11:44 .