37 réponses à ce sujet

[Skyblade012]

The rise of the Weapon DLCs has had a very negative impact on the game's balance, in my opinion.  The Collector ship decision is being massively skewed by the number of various weapons that are exceeding the super-weapons, and the power classes are being a little left behind, since they aren't getting these constant firepower boosts.

My solution to that was to implement six new achievements, with corresponding rewards.

Master Soldier
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as a Soldier
Reward: All new Soldiers start with the Revenant Machine Gun

Master Infiltrator
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as an Infiltrator
Reward: All new Infiltrators start with the Widow Anti-Material Rifle

Master Vanguard
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as a Vanguard
Reward: All new Vanguards start with the Claymore Heavy Shotgun

Master Adept
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as an Adept
Reward: Your Adept's Biotics have increased effectiveness against targets whose defenses are still active

Master Sentinel
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as a Sentinel
Reward:  Your Sentinel's Biotic and Tech powers now have separate cooldowns.

Master Engineer
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as an Engineer
Reward: Don't have one yet, but I'm open to ideas.


This would provide incentive for trying the different classes, and it would rebalance the game to help account for the DLCs.  The achievements don't take effect until after the initial playthrough, so the changes wouldn't overwhelm new players.  But it would give the classes greater utility and flexibility.  The Adept would no longer be so one-note on the higher difficulties where every class has defenses, and able to use their powers more freely.  The Sentinel would be able to combine their Biotics with their Techs, without being able to just steamroller a target by using every ability they had.  And the weapon classes would get access to their higher power weapons without having to use up their Collector Ship choice, leaving them more flexibility when they reach the Collector Ship.

[Sailears]

A well thought out suggestion. I can't see any problem with it.

[Stormy-B]

Skyblade012 wrote...

The rise of the Weapon DLCs has had a very negative impact on the game's balance, in my opinion.  The Collector ship decision is being massively skewed by the number of various weapons that are exceeding the super-weapons, and the power classes are being a little left behind, since they aren't getting these constant firepower boosts.

My solution to that was to implement six new achievements, with corresponding rewards.

Master Soldier
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as a Soldier
Reward: All new Soldiers start with the Revenant Machine Gun

Master Infiltrator
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as an Infiltrator
Reward: All new Infiltrators start with the Widow Anti-Material Rifle

Master Vanguard
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as a Vanguard
Reward: All new Vanguards start with the Claymore Heavy Shotgun

Master Adept
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as an Adept
Reward: Your Adept's Biotics have increased effectiveness against targets whose defenses are still active

Master Sentinel
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as a Sentinel
Reward:  Your Sentinel's Biotic and Tech powers now have separate cooldowns.

Master Engineer
-Complete Mass Effect 2 as an Engineer
Reward: Don't have one yet, but I'm open to ideas.


This would provide incentive for trying the different classes, and it would rebalance the game to help account for the DLCs.  The achievements don't take effect until after the initial playthrough, so the changes wouldn't overwhelm new players.  But it would give the classes greater utility and flexibility.  The Adept would no longer be so one-note on the higher difficulties where every class has defenses, and able to use their powers more freely.  The Sentinel would be able to combine their Biotics with their Techs, without being able to just steamroller a target by using every ability they had.  And the weapon classes would get access to their higher power weapons without having to use up their Collector Ship choice, leaving them more flexibility when they reach the Collector Ship.

Good idea, that's all I have to say. Just great!

[Kronner]

I like the idea for sure! Engineers could get Assault Rifle by default.

[termokanden]

Approve... And disapprove. I like having weapons to look forward to in the game. I would rather have a buffed Revenant that appears later in the game. If you consider Mattock better, surely that holds from the very beginning also.

So, while I like the idea of starting bonuses, I dislike the idea of not having a weapon upgrade to look forward to.

I consider upgrading your gear an entertaining and necessary part of RPGs. It's fun getting new gear. Not so fun when you have the best from the very beginning.

Modifié par termokanden, 17 août 2010 - 09:04 .

[Kronner]

termokanden wrote...

Approve... And disapprove. I like having weapons to look forward to in the game. I would rather have a buffed Revenant that appears later in the game. If you consider Mattock better, surely that holds from the very beginning also.

So, while I like the idea of starting bonuses, I dislike the idea of not having a weapon upgrade to look forward to.

You would still get upgrade either way.

So you could have Revenant/Widow on a Soldier for instance. Or Claymore/Mattock on a Vanguard etc.

[termokanden]

Yeah, but I still like the choice component of it. Not many would pick the Claymore for a soldier, and few vanguards would pick up a sniper rifle.



In any case, I wish there were MORE gear upgrades to look forward to.

[Bozorgmehr]

After completing ME2 you can import your character and replay with all weapons and abilities you already have (having the option to get another bonus weapon / training on Collector ship is great though). I like the suggestions for Adepts and Sentinel, but they're powerful enough without.



I must say your idea is very well balanced, it doesn't make the game too easy and/or Shep too powerful. Too bad it isn't possible to mod ME2 to implement such a system to see how it works. Still a nice suggestion to implement in ME3.

[Kronner]

It would also make the classes more interesting, for example Infiltrator with Widow and Shotgun could be played in a completly different ways during single mission. "A second advanced weapons training" would be just awesome for diversity of the game. Soldiers would not lose anything, Adrenaline Rush makes them the ultimate combat class no matter what weapon they use.

[TheBestClass]

Good ideas. Maybe the Engineer's bonus could be an extra effect on enemies you've personally made defenseless. Say you take out a normal mercs shields by either overloading them or shooting at them. Maybe the bonus could be disabling his shield's ability to recharge or make his weapon overheat with every couple of shots you fire at him. If you just stripped a Vanguard's defenses then maybe she can't use biotics for a while. If you did the same with an enemy Engineer, he can't use his tech powers.

[Skyblade012]

I really think the added flexibility and utility are something that would add a lot of fun to the classes.

Adepts have needed that buff for a long time, so that they have some reason to use something besides Singularity.

Sentinels should be able to use Biotic and Tech powers separately anyway. One is a cooldown of the user's own body, the other of the omnitool's systems, so why are they tied together?

And the weapon classes would be more unique and fun with a little more added flexibility with the Collector Ship decision.

I just haven't played Engineer enough to figure out what they need.  Having the achievement would make me more likely to play Engineer, and added incentive is always good.  But, since the bonus would only apply to the Engineer class, I wouldn't have to do it to buff up my Soldier.

Modifié par Skyblade012, 17 août 2010 - 10:48 .

[termokanden]

Engineers need something better than Cryo Blast and some kind of synergy between tech skills. But this is already true even without giving other classes buffs.

Drone is a powerhouse of an ability, but other than that Engineers aren't really any good.

Modifié par termokanden, 17 août 2010 - 10:24 .

[Kronner]

Skyblade012 wrote...

I really think the added flexibility and utility are something that would add a lot of fun to the classes.

Adepts have needed that buff for a long time, so that they have some reason to use something besides Singularity.

Vanguards should be able to use Biotic and Tech powers separately anyway. One is a cooldown of the user's own body, the other of the omnitool's systems, so why are they tied together?

And the weapon classes would be more unique and fun with a little more added flexibility with the Collector Ship decision.

I just haven't played Engineer enough to figure out what they need.  Having the achievement would make me more likely to play Engineer, and added incentive is always good.  But, since the bonus would only apply to the Engineer class, I wouldn't have to do it to buff up my Soldier.

You mean Sentinels.
Anyways, Sentinels should get weapon instead of separate cooldowns imho, they are already invincible tanks (even on Insanity) so giving them separate cooldowns would be too powerful. Adding extra weapon would only add variety.

[termokanden]

That buff gives sentinels too much power. Means they can spam biotics and still refresh Tech Armor.

Modifié par termokanden, 17 août 2010 - 10:48 .

[Skyblade012]

Engineers have Overload to take out Shields, Incinerate to take out Armor, Drone for all-purpose awesomeness. I'm just not sure how to best modify their class.



I didn't mind giving the Sentinels more ability utility, because I felt that they should be an ability based class, and giving them more free rein over their biotics would leave them a little less of a "Tech Armor Soldier". I use Tech Armor and my weapons as a Sentinel. But Sentinels aren't a Combat hybrid class, they're based around Biotics and Tech. So why don't they use their other abilities more? Because the abilities are always on cooldown and you need to be ready to refresh Tech Armor when it drops.



It's not quite as bad as the Engineers using just Singularity the whole game, but it was still a little one-note when I played the Sentinel.

[termokanden]

Well that's how you pay for not getting behind cover enough as a sentinel. Then you have to keep refreshing tech armor and can't use your other abilites. If you could do both at once, well, I just think that sounds massively overpowered.



I think the adept's bonus ability is far more fair. It gives you a slight edge for playing insanity for example, which is probably a goal for many people after they played through the game on a lower difficulty.

[IMNWME]

Tech Armor is a tech power. Tech and biotic powers on separate cool-downs? So you're saying I could spam Area Reave while also spamming Tech Armor at the same time?



Yes, I like it, let's do it.

[Omega-202]

Skyblade012 wrote...

The rise of the Weapon DLCs has had a very negative impact on the game's balance, in my opinion.  The Collector ship decision is being massively skewed by the number of various weapons that are exceeding the super-weapons, and the power classes are being a little left behind, since they aren't getting these constant firepower boosts.

I think that quite possibly everyone in this thread is missing part of the REASON that the DLC weapons and armors are so powerful.

BioWare has made these weapons and downloadables so good (AKA better than the already included weapons) is so that there is a reason to BUY these bundles.

They're trying to sell us these items.  Why would they release DLC that includes weapons that are just as good or inferior?  How many sets do you think they'd sell?

They're not likely to give us easier access to competitive weapons when they could sell us the DLC items.  

[PrinceLionheart]

 With Engineer I'd say Master over Tech allowing you to have seperate cooldowns on each skill. 

[ODST Steve]

Engineer: Overdrive Able to interrupt a powers cooldown to use another power but it then increase total time by 50%



add both cooldowns together then increase that number by half of total and that would be cooldown.

[PWENER]

I love it.

[ODST Steve]

BTW this is my favorite post to ever hit the strategy forum.

[Jians]

I'm guessing the shared power cooldown is hardcoded into the engine so that would be a nightmare to implement. But if I'm wrong a simple mod should do the trick without having to resort to a dev patch.

DLC Armor with +power damage and +cooldown reduction is probably what you're more likely to be looking for. And that should be pretty easy to mod.

Modifié par Jians, 18 août 2010 - 02:07 .

[ODST Steve]

Jians wrote...

I'm guessing the shared power cooldown is hardcoded into the engine so that would be a nightmare to implement. But if I'm wrong a simple mod should do the trick without having to resort to a dev patch.

DLC Armor with +power damage and +cooldown reduction is probably what you're more likely to be looking for. And that should be pretty easy to mod.

I don't care how hard this would be to make. I thinks this Idea is too cool to let down.

[Skyblade012]

Omega-202 wrote...

Skyblade012 wrote...

The rise of the Weapon DLCs has had a very negative impact on the game's balance, in my opinion.  The Collector ship decision is being massively skewed by the number of various weapons that are exceeding the super-weapons, and the power classes are being a little left behind, since they aren't getting these constant firepower boosts.

I think that quite possibly everyone in this thread is missing part of the REASON that the DLC weapons and armors are so powerful.

BioWare has made these weapons and downloadables so good (AKA better than the already included weapons) is so that there is a reason to BUY these bundles.

They're trying to sell us these items.  Why would they release DLC that includes weapons that are just as good or inferior?  How many sets do you think they'd sell?

They're not likely to give us easier access to competitive weapons when they could sell us the DLC items.  

Yes, but it is destroying the point of the Collector ship choice.  Take the Revenant.  The Mattock is a vastly superior rifle.  Why would any Soldier bother investing their choice in the Revenant?

As more and more better and better weapons come out, those choices will become more and more one-sided.  That's fine.  But, eventually, you won't find a Soldier out there who doesn't just pick up Submachine guns because the Revenant, Claymore, and Widow will be vastly inferior to everything else we have.

Then too, while the combat classes get better and better weapons, the gameplay of the ability classes is getting skewed.  They will be relying more and more on weapons because the weapons keep getting better, while they haven't gotten any new or improved abilities.

This is an attempt to alleviate some of that trouble.  Giving the soon-to-be-ignored weapons to the classes they are best suited to as a default will keep those weapons in the game.  It was a big deal to get a new weapon at the Collector Ship when you only had two other versions of that weapon.  When you have twenty five versions of each weapon, you won't feel any draw to them.

And by giving a few enhancements to the ability users, we will keep their classes playing the way they should.



Edit:  And, yeah, I can see giving Engineers an ability similar to the Soldier's Adrenaline Burst from ME1.  Resets your cooldowns, but can't be used too often.

Modifié par Skyblade012, 18 août 2010 - 03:35 .