231 réponses à ce sujet

[charmingcharlie]

Ah I miss the good old days when consumers dictated to companies what they wanted rather than the situation now where we have companies like EA dictating to consumers what they can do. I find it baffling that EA are with holding the game from an online store that has 30 million customers, are they intentionally trying to make Dragon Age 2 a flop on the PC ?



I buy all my games via steam, if a game is not on steam then I don't buy it. Since EA/Bioware can't be bothered to support the largest digital distribution platform on the planet then I guess I can't be bothered to support EA/Bioware with my money.

[magicwins]

I find it oddly amusing how people defend Steam so strongly. I'm not knocking its' fans. I've never used it myself (ports blocked), but I believe there was one point of time when people hated it. We've all seen the little animated 'Steam loading' gifs with their hilarious commentary. How they got from there to here is something I'd like to learn. Along with why everyone plays COD. If I ever launched a product, those would be two very useful case studies.

Modifié par magicwins, 08 janvier 2011 - 02:20 .

[Smellylettuce]

Disappointing.. I was seriously considering preordering, but I find my options unpleasant. Maybe next time.

[Cyberfrog81]

I understand convenience. But this seems to be about more than that.

Because I don't understand why BioWare game fans would be more loyal to Steam/Valve - the guys who do next to no work and run off with a chunk of the profit - than to BioWare, the ones who put countless hours of their lives into the product.

[charmingcharlie]

Cyberfrog81 wrote...

Because I don't understand why BioWare game fans would be more loyal to Steam/Valve - the guys who do next to no work and run off with a chunk of the profit - than to BioWare, the ones who put countless hours of their lives into the product.

What you mean like any other place that offers the game for sale ?  Hm lets see gamestop doesn't do anything but sell the game and take a chunk of the profit, you could say the same thing for every place offering the game for sale. Infact is my understanding that they actually make MORE money selling the game via steam than they do selling the game retail.

This is not about "loyalty" here this is about "consumer choice"  I am a consumer I want to buy the game from whomever/where ever I want.  No I don't particularly feel "loyal" to steam but I find the service excellent and it suits my needs and I will use it and I don't appreciate when a company tries to force me to use another service.  Neither do I feel "loyal" to Bioware they make a product and if it meets my needs I will buy it.  Obviously in this case they are not producing a product that meets my needs so I aint buying it.

[Youmu]

Cyberfrog81 wrote...

I understand convenience. But this seems to be about more than that.

Because I don't understand why BioWare game fans would be more loyal to Steam/Valve - the guys who do next to no work and run off with a chunk of the profit - than to BioWare, the ones who put countless hours of their lives into the product.

L'see.

I already own Mass Effect, Mass Effect 2, Dragon Age: Origins+Awakening on Steam. I'd really like to have Dragon Age 2 there with all the other BW games (and the other 300 I have on Steam) c_c

Plus, the alternatives:
GamersGate. Region locked. 
Impulse. Region locked. 
Direct2drive. Do not want.
EAstore. Yeah, no. I've bought few games from them, and the customer service has been flat out terrible, plus the whole site is machine-translated to Finnish, with no option for me to change it to English.

Modifié par Youmu, 08 janvier 2011 - 03:55 .

[Cyberfrog81]

charmingcharlie wrote...

What you mean like any other place that offers the game for sale ?  Hm lets see gamestop doesn't do anything but sell the game and take a chunk of the profit, you could say the same thing for every place offering the game for sale.

Let me clarify. I'm referring to people who say, "Put it on Steam, else I'm not buying!"

Isn't the product more important than who you buy it from?

[vaporie]

MtnSloth wrote...

TonyTheBossDanza123 wrote...
Anyone have this guys email? My guess would be jblincoe@ea.com but I'd rather not email till we're sure.

Isn't it obvious?  They don't want your email.  They don't want anyone's email if it is about something like this.  If you prefer Steam, the BioWare/EA suits don't want to know about it.  Steam support is not their problem; it is our problem.  After all, what right do we have to shop at a store of our choosing?  It is a priviledge to buy their game; we should be thankful they deign to sell to mere pheasants. 

Seriously, dude.  They just don't care.  We are wasting our breathe.

Lol, I think you meant to say peasant.

[Sharuko]

Cyberfrog81 wrote...

I understand convenience. But this seems to be about more than that.

Because I don't understand why BioWare game fans would be more loyal to Steam/Valve - the guys who do next to no work and run off with a chunk of the profit - than to BioWare, the ones who put countless hours of their lives into the product.

I bet you Steam introduced thousands to BioWare games.  I did play older BioWare games but never even played ME1 or DA:O.  Once I saw Mass Effect was on sale through Steam for $5 bucks, without thinking twice I bought it and loved the game one of my favorite games ever.  After my experience with ME1 I purchased DA:O and DA:O Ultimate Edition and ME2 on release and pre-ordered them.

So in a way Steam introduced me to the new BioWare games.  Also, I think of Steam as my console.  I can carry it where ever I go with a user name and password and I am good to go.

EA BioWare took a step forward by brining ME2 and now ME3 to all consoles.  They should not take a step backwards in the PC market.

Modifié par Sharuko, 08 janvier 2011 - 04:22 .

[charmingcharlie]

Cyberfrog81 wrote...
Let me clarify. I'm referring to people who say, "Put it on Steam, else I'm not buying!"

Isn't the product more important than who you buy it from?

No the product isn't more important than who you buy it from, I prefer to buy my games via steam for several reasons to me steam adds several services to the product (such as auto updates) that add value to that product and that is why I want to buy the game from steam.

In my view steam actually EARNS it's take of the sale price by offering me additional services unlike other retailers that just "sell you the game" take a massive cut and offer you diddly squat extra.

I nearly always buy all my games from steam, it seems a bizarre situation that steam is good for 99% of all other developers/publishers.  It was good enough for Bioware when they were selling Mass Effect 1, Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age.  Yet all of a sudden steam with it's 30 million customers and 3 million signing in daily are suddenly "not good enough" but other DD retailers that offer a vastly inferior service are good enough.

This is a massive mistake for both EA and Bioware, they are about to see sales of the PC version flop badly, because outside of the "fans" on this forum I can't see many PC gamers buying it if it isn't on steam.

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 08 janvier 2011 - 04:34 .

[McNoguff]

Cyberfrog81 wrote...

Isn't the product more important than who you buy it from?

'Course it is. I can't speak for anyone else, but I know there will be a steam version(eventually). I'm going to buy the game, and I'm going to buy the game on steam, so I'm a tad bummed that I can't get the "signature" edition as a result. That's all. I don't think anyone's thinking that, in the next three days, due to this forum post, we're going to have a steam pre-order available with the signature edition upgrade. Nor do I think any fans aren't going to buy the game, especially because a steam edition will happen, just not soon enough to preorder.

But! Marketing suits really do want to know what we want, because that's how they get more of our money. Youmu up there says she has 300 steam games, and I have 204, and that firmly ensconces us in the "game purchasers" camp, as well as the "not game pirates" camp. Which is who preorders are designed to woo. We spend money on games-- constantly. And steam is where we do it. So there really are folks at EA who want to hear our stance on this, the fact that we haven't preordered because it's not on steam yet. And maybe, as a result, the next preorder we want *will* be on steam. Instead of a lame-duck service like D2D. And maybe we're barking up the wrong tree! Maybe it's not EA's doing at all. Maybe it's Valve, for some reason or other. But I assure you, this is data they want, the folks who market and distribute the game.

Of course, the marketing suits could take the wrong lesson from this, and decide that since we're likely to buy all the SE DLC anyway, they're getting more of our money if we can't preorder it;-) They say it's twenty dollars worth, and I'm not gonna lie, I'll probably spend that.

I mean, I bought witch hunt. So the suits know I'm easy.

[Crimmsonwind]

I hate the EADM with a passion the likes of which you've never seen (actually, you've been around the forums, you probably have seen the same level of disproportionate rage). It's unresponsive on my computer. I've tried Tech support. I hover over the various buttons and menus. It acknowledged that I am indeed hovering. But I cannot click. So I plunked down a little extra cash and grabbed the DAO Ultimate edition off Steam while it was on sale. I love Steam, it's convenient for me. I know some people don't like it, it doesn't mesh well with their life style. But I am terrible at keeping track of my discs, so my collection is becoming increasingly digital. It fits my lifestyle wonderfully. I switch between computers a lot. (edit) I had bought the physical copy of DAO CE, but I had lost my disc, so I had registered the game key on the EADM. But as long as I have the key registered on here, I get my CE perks, and all the stuff that comes with the DAO Ultimate. Just wanted to make that clear so it didn't sound like I derped over the EADM and just ragebought off Steam.

I was going to preorder DA2, but I've got enough games to keep me busy for a few months. Hopefully by then, it'll be on Steam. Maybe I'll wait even longer, see if there's something akin to the DAO Ultimate edition, and get that during the holidays.

Modifié par Crimmsonwind, 08 janvier 2011 - 04:51 .

[Crimmsonwind]

vilnii wrote...

People who use Steam are really spoiled by the convenience...

Well excuuuuse me, princess!

[Alxarx]

@Priestly

Well that's upsetting =[ 

Modifié par Alxarx, 08 janvier 2011 - 05:17 .

[Morbo]

I don't understand why so many people living in the Eurozone are so eager to buy *new* games from Steam (it's a different situation with older titles that have already gone done a lot in price).

New games on Steam here tend to cost €49.99, so basically the RRP, or the same price most High Street shops (or brick and mortar, whatever you wanna call it) use.
Now take online retailers...on Amazon.co.uk, Dragon Age 2 goes for £24.99 atm, which equals to about €30. That's 40%, FORTY, cheaper than it would be on Steam (if it were available there). And £24.99 is really not an uncommon price for new PC games on online retailers such as Amazon (the best ones seem to be located in the UK, though they usually ship all over Europe).

Well, I could understand it if you don't have a credit card, or some other means of payment accepted in such stores, but otherwise...
And I guess the situation in America and other parts of the world is probably very different too.

[Youmu]

Morbo wrote...

I don't understand why so many people living in the Eurozone are so eager to buy *new* games from Steam (it's a different situation with older titles that have already gone done a lot in price).

I have them gifted from UK or US, personally. The price difference that way isn't much, and I won't have to wait for the physical game to be mailed.

[McNoguff]

magicwins wrote...

I find it oddly amusing how people defend Steam so strongly.... I believe there was one point of time when people hated it. We've all seen the little animated 'Steam loading' gifs with their hilarious commentary. How they got from there to here is something I'd like to learn.

Last paragraph has short version if you don't want to read all that... words. Gushing commences in 3, 2, 1...


Valve, as a company, has a business model of constant improvement. In the case of, say, TF2, there was almost no product there when it came out, only four maps, but it was perfectly balanced with the promise of more to come. Now the product is almost twice the size, many more maps, playmodes, and enhancements(and hats!), and all of that was free for people who bought the orange box back in '07. The product keeps getting better, without charging a dime more. L4D, L4D2, same story. And a five year old game like HL2 got an awesome engine overhaul in 2010 because they were releasing a mac version with more features. They didn't have to do that, but they did.

Before HL2 released, we didn't have a crystal ball to see into the future and know this was their plan. Steam was buggy, wouldn't work on some connections, and was the only way to play the best game of 2004. Even if you bought HL2 at retail, it then registered to steam, which was required to play it, etc. The future did not look bright.

Now, Steam is the epitome of digital distribution models. Amazon, iTunes, and the Zune store all fail to compare, let alone the other services out there for games. The DRM is elegant and non-restrictive(unless developers add 3rd party DRM, which they are required to disclose on the product page!), the games are available on any machine you can log into, and there is an ongoing commitment to making it better all the time. They're constantly adding features and platforms and client updates.

Valve is the only company-- only company-- that has earned gamers' trust by continually improving and shaping their products to the changing needs of the community. They seem to have this idea that if they do right but us, we'll do right by them. They come by our loyalty(and our money) honestly.

[charmingcharlie]

Morbo wrote...

I don't understand why so many people living in the Eurozone are so eager to buy *new* games from Steam (it's a different situation with older titles that have already gone done a lot in price)

Then you obviously value price over convienence and there is nothing wrong with that.  I buy new games from steam for several reasons.  Firstly I do not like DVD media, I don't need that rubbish cluttering up my house and I certainly don't want to have to keep a DVD in my drive just to play a game.  Secondly purchasing games from online retailers requires me to be present when the product is delivered to my house.  Now 9 times out of 10 I am not there and if I miss it I have to do a whole lot of crap to get it redelivered or pick it up.  Not to mention the fact the postal system is crap in this country.

Now I could just go into town and buy the game from a retail shop, all assuming I can find any shop actually selling the PC version (most retailers don't bother because the majority of PC gamers buy online or via steam).  However taking transportation and time into accounts purchasing a game from a retailer isn't any cheaper than buying it from steam.

With steam I pre-order it and when it is launched I leave my PC to download it over night and hey presto the game is there ready and waiting for me in the morning.  I don't need to worry about installing the game, I don't need to mess about with DVD's and I never have to worry about patching the game because steam does it all for me.

Steam has transformed the way I and millions of others buy games and it is quite astonishing that EA and Bioware have cut out the number one digital distribution service on the PC.

[MtnSloth]

vaporie wrote...

MtnSloth wrote...

TonyTheBossDanza123 wrote...
Anyone have this guys email? My guess would be jblincoe@ea.com but I'd rather not email till we're sure.

Isn't it obvious?  They don't want your email.  They don't want anyone's email if it is about something like this.  If you prefer Steam, the BioWare/EA suits don't want to know about it.  Steam support is not their problem; it is our problem.  After all, what right do we have to shop at a store of our choosing?  It is a priviledge to buy their game; we should be thankful they deign to sell to mere pheasants. 

Seriously, dude.  They just don't care.  We are wasting our breathe.

Lol, I think you meant to say peasant.

LOL.  Ooops.  Yep. 

Modifié par MtnSloth, 08 janvier 2011 - 07:45 .

[MtnSloth]

magicwins wrote...
I find it oddly amusing how people defend Steam so strongly. I'm not knocking its' fans. I've never used it myself (ports blocked), but I believe there was one point of time when people hated it. We've all seen the little animated 'Steam loading' gifs with their hilarious commentary. How they got from there to here is something I'd like to learn. Along with why everyone plays COD. If I ever launched a product, those would be two very useful case studies.

So . . . you had absolutely no idea that Steam is a big deal in PC gaming?  Now that is oddly amusing . . .

We are not just defending Steam.  We are defending our right to choose.  It may be true that some wouldn't care enough to post if someone other than Steam was being left out; but that only underscores the point that gamers who prefer Steam may do so for a reason. 

Modifié par MtnSloth, 08 janvier 2011 - 07:47 .

[Sharuko]

Steam users are in the millions, they are power gamers, they are EA BioWare's target audience.  Steam not only acts as a gaming platform but an advertising platform for developers. Please don't go out of your way to ****** them off.

Modifié par Sharuko, 08 janvier 2011 - 07:55 .

[MtnSloth]

Ympulse wrote...
 . . . . Seriously, Steam was deemed not profitable by EA/Bio, and thus is not being used. Fullstop. Stop asking corporations to lose potential money.

Assuming you have accurate information, didn't you mean to say that the deal wouldn't be profitable enough?

I can't imagine that the games being sold on Steam are being sold at a loss; and I'm not just talking about the discount titles.  There are more than a few new releases on Steam, and those companies are apparently not committing corporate suicide by selling on Steam.

But thank-you for setting the record straight.  I don't know how I missed it!  This is not about customers, not about making great games, and not about providing a solid entertainment experience; it is just about greed.  Thank-you so very much for making explicit what was previously merely implied.

[Crimmsonwind]

Yeah, I remember having serious issues with Steam, and I was appalled when it came with my copy of FEAR 2. I hated looking at that ugly army-green abomination. I stopped playing for a while, came back when I decided to buy L4D, and I've been happy ever since. No connection problems, no download issues, nothing. They've given me no reason to not trust them. They have good deals, they're reliable, you can uninstall and reinstall as many times as you need to, this is good for me. I like this. People who don't like Steam are allowed to not like Steam (even if I think their reasons might be silly). But it's still a storefront, and I'd love to see EA realize that their Download Manager, and their own Store and it's policies, frankly, suck. EA still has a stigma attached to it for some people (cough... me). If they would sell some more products through Steam, a venue that people trust and swear by, people (cough... me again) would be willing to overlook the Eye of Sauron EA logo attached to the game. Plus it's a great way of getting people to impulse buy.

I guess what it comes down to for me is I don't see a reason why they shouldn't be selling on Steam along with all the other sites and stores.

Modifié par Crimmsonwind, 08 janvier 2011 - 08:04 .