555 réponses à ce sujet

[Siven80]

Devs have already confirmed that cambat, pausing etc is essentially the same as DAO.  So its not hack and slash.

Its just the animation swings are faster and combat actions more responsive. example being you and companions can run upto enemy instead of shuffling forwards like DAo, and abilities are quicker rather than waiting 1.5 secs for an archers ability to shoot like DAO.

Thats what ive read and gathered from Devs, ive not played the Exagerated demo.

I think all the opinions on combat is based on the exaggerated part and people arent realising that.

Modifié par Siven80, 21 août 2010 - 04:09 .

[Ulathar]

Oh and andar is right. The beginning is an over-the-top exaggaration and is supposed to be exactly that and shows that in the combat. Showing Hawke as this ridiculously powerful Warrior/Mage/Rogue which he/she simply wasn't at that point.

[Niarviel]

Systemlord Baal wrote...

Oh and andar is right. The beginning is an over-the-top exaggaration and is supposed to be exactly that and shows that in the combat. Showing Hawke as this ridiculously powerful Warrior/Mage/Rogue which he/she simply wasn't at that point.

Unless that part is a tutorial, i really don't see the point in showing it in the game honestly. So far that part has really drawn alot of speculation and hate towards the game because people just can't seem to grasp the fact it was made up.

[cityzen]

Ok, then it's more or less the system from the first game, but tweaked to react faster to your input, not bad. I was wondering how a H&S would work with a party of 4, without going the ME2 route where the companions are more of an extension of the PC abilities (an extension prone to run into the enemy and die) than independent characters.

Modifié par cityzen, 21 août 2010 - 04:26 .

[FedericoV]

Niarviel wrote...

Systemlord Baal wrote...

Oh and andar is right. The beginning is an over-the-top exaggaration and is supposed to be exactly that and shows that in the combat. Showing Hawke as this ridiculously powerful Warrior/Mage/Rogue which he/she simply wasn't at that point.

Unless that part is a tutorial, i really don't see the point in showing it in the game honestly. So far that part has really drawn alot of speculation and hate towards the game because people just can't seem to grasp the fact it was made up.

That part is even before charachter creation if I get it right. In my opinion, it was shortsighted to show that part since it's causing more alarm than praise (at least it build some hype but I do not thing that BW are so cynical). Having said that, I've not seen any complaint from action oriented players who instead were whining a lot about DA:O after the launch of the game (it's too hard, it's too slow, it's too clunky, etc.). So, maybe they were targeting that audience.

[Ulathar]

Niarviel wrote...

Systemlord Baal wrote...

Oh and andar is right. The beginning is an over-the-top exaggaration and is supposed to be exactly that and shows that in the combat. Showing Hawke as this ridiculously powerful Warrior/Mage/Rogue which he/she simply wasn't at that point.

Unless that part is a tutorial, i really don't see the point in showing it in the game honestly. So far that part has really drawn alot of speculation and hate towards the game because people just can't seem to grasp the fact it was made up.

It's just a tutorial. Once you're done with it, you get to jump ahead in time and see the 2 ppl talking about Hawke. After that they agreed on telling/getting told the real story. Then you get to the character creation. So that exaggarated part is just the (current version) of the tutorial.
Also speaking as someone who was at the exclusive DA2 presentation and has seen more than what can be played at the openly accessable game (or at least can be done in the 15mins), after the creation you'll get to see the beginning of the story how it "really" happened. Some characters (like Flemeth) and possibilities of the dialog system are introduced at that point.

[Thicos]

I want to know about the classes, specializations and spells/talents.

[Ulathar]

Only Male Warrior was availlable so far. Other classes and the Female Gender was locked.

As for abilities and spells....

In the exaggarated part, Hawke had a strong strike and a whirlwind ability. Later it was just the strong strike. Bethany had a Fireball which was pretty strong.

[Niarviel]

Likewise Thicos.



I always found mages to be lacking something, mostly when it came to the Arcane Warrior's, All you could do with them is basic melee attacking which is...sorta dull after a while. And every other class has a basic pair of 2 weapon specs best suited for them. Warriors had Weapon and Shield with Two handed weapons with possible archer abilities, Rogues had the Dual Wield and Archer options, Mages just had different forms of magic and Arcane warrior was really lacking, the Mage turned out to be too much of a supporter in my book.

[Thicos]

Oh thanks for information. Only warriors.

AH no character creation ¬¬





But Niarviel, for Mager, magic is his weapon.

[Niarviel]

Thicos wrote...

Oh thanks for information. Only warriors.
AH no character creation ¬¬


But Niarviel, for Mager, magic is his weapon.

Never said mages didn't have a weapon, i just found them to be lacking something. The Arcane Warrior needed more is all i am saying. Hopefully the setup in the trailer is a Arcane Warrior/Blood Mage sorta combo i am hoping for. Arcane warriors with magical melee abilities.

[DragonRageGT]

FedericoV wrote...
Sorry, it's not you: I have that discussion many times, over and over again, with no result . Honestly I'm a little bit tired to read how piracy is good for PC sales while many good developers close the door or shift for consolle/multyplayer games with PC port.

The problem is that you twist and put words in others people's mouths that were never said to justify a very obtuse opinion. No one ever said that illegally downloaded copies are ok, should be supported and help the companies that produce the goods being downloaded for free. Most important, I am no supporter of piracy and I don't think Semper is either.  But to blame file sharing for low sales is to deny the truth that it does not affect sales at all.

If the product is good it will sell a lot. But no more than the market can absorb it. Perhaps there are more people willing to spend their money for console DA:O than PC owners that sometimes prefer to purchase other stuff, other genres, other games that they could play a DEMO or Beta Test before.

I know that there are adults that own consoles and stuff, just like there are adults that purchase music. But what really keeps the industry going are teenagers. And they are the likely target of most all products in the enterteinment business, specially if they have that "prohibited" aura that "rated M" products have.  And I'd suspect that most teenagers prefer to play their games in Consoles and big wide screen TV's. Just like Justin Bieber is the new NKOTB-menudo-BSB of this generation.

Starcraft 2 is out there, illegal d/l for anyone who whishes it. Does that matter to Blizzard? All ME2 and DA:O DLC's are out there as well. And I dare to dream that the number of decent people that likes to purchase their stuff legitimately vastly surpass the number of scums/poor people/inhabitants of countries under censorship and tirany that cannot get their hands in the legit good by chance or by circunstance.

You assume most PC owners with Internet connection are scumbag pirates. I don't. I have a little more faith in human nature. Good decent people are a lot more discrete and make far less headlights than the other guys though.

But that is still different than saying it causes losses. All those buddies of yours that pirated the game. Would they have bought it if there was no d/l available? Would they think about buying a cheaper version of the physical DVD instead of the full price legit copy? Can they afford the price of the legit product? Can you answer that?

File sharing has been around since mIRC, Napster, iMesh, eMule, etc. Blizzard actually uses the torrent system to distribute their patches and digital downloads.

Many "good" developers close the door of shift to console/mplayer games with PC port (which does not prevent piracy and illegal download at all.. just saying) for the same reason some good musicians do not make it mainstream or change to gospel/religious music to use their talent and make some money with it.

1- They didn't had the "lucky break" (that Mick Jagger once said is almost more important than talent because he knew a million virtuous musicians around the world who would never make it)

2- The product wasn't that good. Or perhaps it might even be that good, only it didn't catch the viral marketing flu and never appealed to the Justin Bieber's audience. And that's the way of the audience. That's the market that most major Labels will try to gain when they audition or release new artists and stuff like games. EA is definitely a major label player and does not settle for "cult" titles and nich segments of the market that may still give them profit, but just profit is not enough.

The most downloaded illegal files are Movies. Do that prevent a good movie release and some with huge, I mean HUGE profit? And what are the most successful titles? The Justin Bieber's audience targeted!I

[Dragon Age1103]

-Semper- wrote...

FedericoV wrote...

PC is the bigger gaming market out there. Pc are the better machine to play and imho hardware configuration issues are not troublesome as some years ago. BW is focusing DA2 development on consolles because the sales were way better on Xbox than PC (not to count PS3). They have stated that in a couple of interview. If I do not count piracy, I cannot understand why DA:O on Xbox outsold the PC version that was simply superior and very friendly in terms of system spec. Piracy is an issue for consolle too, I'm not denying that. I'm only saying that it affects sales less because you have to crack the machine itself and cannot connect to xbox live and so on

sadly that ain't true. gaming market at consoles (and you always have to combine 360 and ps3!) is way bigger than pc. if you look around all these newcomers play on consoles. it's cheaper, it's more comfortable, it's easier and the graphics are more or less the same, let alone the fact that 2 systems adding their sales together to one big clump where pc is a "one man army". the good thing is that the pc market is still a big market and therefore cannot be ignored. if piracy would be an issue then not a single developer would create games for pc just to burn their money! that fact alone (plus a dozen others i wrote in another thread) should be proof enough that piracy has no or just a tiny affect on sales. btw i am still waiting that someone points me to a cash-strapped developer just because of piracy

bioware only were this surprised that a "classical" rpg sells this good at consoles and that there is a market for these kind of games. they know that they absolutely can't develope another game with the same clunky mechanics which would horribly fail. so they revamp their engine and focus exclusively on consoles to satisfy the bigger market and the weaker systems (of the whole business) out there. the smaller pc market can live with a good console port - that's a fact proven by the last years. as a developer and publisher you absolutely can not ignore one of these 3 markets (pc, 360 and ps3) if you want to form a triple a title*

*: this only works when the game mechanics suits all 3 platforms well. rts or mmorpg will never sale this good on consoles.

  I can't agree with the graphics comment at all. The only reason most consoles games are even close to their PC version in visuals is b/c PC got a cheap poorly made port.  Plus some devs do ignore 1 or even 2 of the other markets. If the game has fun core mechanics & is just well rounded overall it will sell. Examples being most of the work Blizzard & Valve have done. Yes Valve still touches on consoles but I doubt they need to with PC sales.
    My entire point is DA II looks very interesting & I think it will be a good game just not even close to the level that DA:O reached. The new ME2 rip off communication-dialogue system will destroy DA II from the start. It won't make it a bad game but it will make it impossible to reach the same depth as DA:O. I am not a fan of the bright-cartoony-anime ary style but I will have to learn to like it. Entire point being they have changed too much. KotOR is one of my favorite games of all time along with BG II & Morrowind. None of those titles had voice overs for the main characterc b/c real gamers( pc gamers yeah i just said that lol) have a little thing called imagination & don't need a bunch of disc space being wasted with voice overs that drastically limit the dialogue options. It is a shame how much less of an RPG DA II will be compared to the first but this is what the majority of "gamers" want today. MW2, constant remakes that feel just like mW2, a new madden every year that is the same game but they still buy, & RPGs that play themselves involving as little reading or thinking as possible.
   We'll always have DA:O!!!!

[Dragon Age1103]

RageGT wrote...

FedericoV wrote...
Sorry, it's not you: I have that discussion many times, over and over again, with no result . Honestly I'm a little bit tired to read how piracy is good for PC sales while many good developers close the door or shift for consolle/multyplayer games with PC port.

The problem is that you twist and put words in others people's mouths that were never said to justify a very obtuse opinion. No one ever said that illegally downloaded copies are ok, should be supported and help the companies that produce the goods being downloaded for free. Most important, I am no supporter of piracy and I don't think Semper is either.  But to blame file sharing for low sales is to deny the truth that it does not affect sales at all.

If the product is good it will sell a lot. But no more than the market can absorb it. Perhaps there are more people willing to spend their money for console DA:O than PC owners that sometimes prefer to purchase other stuff, other genres, other games that they could play a DEMO or Beta Test before.

I know that there are adults that own consoles and stuff, just like there are adults that purchase music. But what really keeps the industry going are teenagers. And they are the likely target of most all products in the enterteinment business, specially if they have that "prohibited" aura that "rated M" products have.  And I'd suspect that most teenagers prefer to play their games in Consoles and big wide screen TV's. Just like Justin Bieber is the new NKOTB-menudo-BSB of this generation.

Starcraft 2 is out there, illegal d/l for anyone who whishes it. Does that matter to Blizzard? All ME2 and DA:O DLC's are out there as well. And I dare to dream that the number of decent people that likes to purchase their stuff legitimately vastly surpass the number of scums/poor people/inhabitants of countries under censorship and tirany that cannot get their hands in the legit good by chance or by circunstance.

You assume most PC owners with Internet connection are scumbag pirates. I don't. I have a little more faith in human nature. Good decent people are a lot more discrete and make far less headlights than the other guys though.

But that is still different than saying it causes losses. All those buddies of yours that pirated the game. Would they have bought it if there was no d/l available? Would they think about buying a cheaper version of the physical DVD instead of the full price legit copy? Can they afford the price of the legit product? Can you answer that?

File sharing has been around since mIRC, Napster, iMesh, eMule, etc. Blizzard actually uses the torrent system to distribute their patches and digital downloads.

Many "good" developers close the door of shift to console/mplayer games with PC port (which does not prevent piracy and illegal download at all.. just saying) for the same reason some good musicians do not make it mainstream or change to gospel/religious music to use their talent and make some money with it.

1- They didn't had the "lucky break" (that Mick Jagger once said is almost more important than talent because he knew a million virtuous musicians around the world who would never make it)

2- The product wasn't that good. Or perhaps it might even be that good, only it didn't catch the viral marketing flu and never appealed to the Justin Bieber's audience. And that's the way of the audience. That's the market that most major Labels will try to gain when they audition or release new artists and stuff like games. EA is definitely a major label player and does not settle for "cult" titles and nich segments of the market that may still give them profit, but just profit is not enough.

The most downloaded illegal files are Movies. Do that prevent a good movie release and some with huge, I mean HUGE profit? And what are the most successful titles? The Justin Bieber's audience targeted!I

  I really enjoyed reading your view on piracy. Most ppl will never admit piracy isn't a big issue considering most things pirated(from my personal experience with ppl) are things(songs, movies, games) that person would of never bought in the first place.

[Bryy_Miller]

People think that just because they are "knowledgable" about piracy, it is okay to pirate. Just like people think it's okay to smoke weed in front of cops on 420.

[DragonRageGT]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

People think that just because they are "knowledgable" about piracy, it is okay to pirate. Just like people think it's okay to smoke weed in front of cops on 420.

What's 420? Well, anyone thinking that is clearly "stoned"!

But again, where is it said that "it is ok to pirate"? What I've said, in short, is that blaming file sharing of illegal copied games for the switch to the console audience that DA2 has taken is like covering the sun with a sieve.

They are going "the way of the audience". They want a Justin Bieber... not a cult band like "Heart" that even being one of the greatest, has not made into the Hall of Fame.

[Poaches]

I'd say; #1 delusion of console fans and marketeers : piracy on consoles doesn't happen.

Its a simple fact that pirating console games are incredibly easy these days, easier than PC/Mac's; and the only ones getting caught are the ones stupid enough to log onto xbox live playing them. 

Modifié par Poaches, 21 août 2010 - 06:38 .

[filetemo]

the only people who doesn't download games for free is because they aren't savvy enough to know how to do it, how to apply a crack and so on.That's why console gamers pirate less.

And according to internet forums, there's a 0.00001% of righteous gamers who buy games because they "really want to support the industry"

[FedericoV]

RageGT wrote...


The problem is that you twist and put words in others people's mouths that were never said to justify a very obtuse opinion. No one ever said that illegally downloaded copies are ok, should be supported and help the companies that produce the goods being downloaded for free. Most important, I am no supporter of piracy and I don't think Semper is either.  But to blame file sharing for low sales is to deny the truth that it does not affect sales at all.

Never done that. Maybe is just my english that is not good enough (seriously) since it's not my native language. I was wrong starting that argument in that thread all along and I apologize once again for going OT or being too rude, but it was for the love of DA:O, classical RPGs and PC gaming. I know that you are not supporting piracy by any means. I respect your view but still I'm not persuaded by it. You could write an essay of 10 pages and still, I would not change my mind . Maybe my opinion is obtuse as you say, but I think that's not the case, since I was supporting your view before I changed my mind on the subject some years ago. If you want I can give you (privately) the link of a discussion I founded in a board making a random search on google about the topic. It's enlightening.

[Rake21]

filetemo wrote...

the only people who doesn't download games for free is because they aren't savvy enough to know how to do it, how to apply a crack and so on.That's why console gamers pirate less.
And according to internet forums, there's a 0.00001% of righteous gamers who buy games because they "really want to support the industry"

Why support an industry that we all care about and enjoy when we can cripple it, not only financially, but also in terms of the quality of games that come out because developers need to produce more to make ends meet? 

Piracy is great, ain't it?

Where did this sense of entitlement come from?  What makes people think that they deserve something like a videogame for free?

[MoneyDeluxe]

filetemo wrote...

the only people who doesn't download games for free is because they aren't savvy enough to know how to do it, how to apply a crack and so on.That's why console gamers pirate less.
And according to internet forums, there's a 0.00001% of righteous gamers who buy games because they "really want to support the industry"

Modifié par MoneyDeluxe, 21 août 2010 - 07:52 .

[Estel78]

RageGT wrote...

Many "good" developers close the door of shift to console/mplayer games with PC port (which does not prevent piracy and illegal download at all.. just saying)

Fact is it is easier to pirate on PC than on consoles, you download the game, install a crack and that's basically it. On XBox 360 you have to modify the console itself, which is not that hard, granted, but it's still something not everyone is comfortable with, plus there are always the odds that you get caught which results in you getting banned from XBox Live. As far as i know it's even more of a hassle on the PS3.

You can repeat all you want that pirating also happens on consoles, it doesn't change the fact that publishers make the bulk of their money from console sales or else they would not have made consoles their lead SKU, companies go where the money is. It would be wrong to solely blame pirates for that but they definitely factor in. The main reason, though, is simply that nowadays people are predominantly using consoles for their gaming, at least in the western world (and Japan). You either accept that or not (and waste time whining about it on the internet).

Modifié par Estel78, 21 août 2010 - 08:02 .

[Slayer299]

filetemo wrote...

the only people who doesn't download games for free is because they aren't savvy enough to know how to do it, how to apply a crack and so on.That's why console gamers pirate less.
And according to internet forums, there's a 0.00001% of righteous gamers who buy games because they "really want to support the industry"

Then I guess I'm part of that 0.00001%, because even though I know how to d/l pirated PC games and play them I don't because I choose *not* to.

[DragonRageGT]

Rake21 wrote...

filetemo wrote...

the only people who doesn't download games for free is because they aren't savvy enough to know how to do it, how to apply a crack and so on.That's why console gamers pirate less.
And according to internet forums, there's a 0.00001% of righteous gamers who buy games because they "really want to support the industry"

Why support an industry that we all care about and enjoy when we can cripple it, not only financially, but also in terms of the quality of games that come out because developers need to produce more to make ends meet? 

Piracy is great, ain't it?

Where did this sense of entitlement come from?  What makes people think that they deserve something like a videogame for free?

Rake, basically you are replying to a false premise. filetemo throwed lots of b/s. Don't bite the bait. "According to internet forums"? Which Forums? I'd say that the low percentage is the people who d/l for free but they need to think everyone else do it too because of the guilt. Like a drug addict thinks it's the most natural thing in the world to use drugs and everyone does it. It's actually proven that only 10% of the world population can suffer of the disease of addiction and of that, about 2% can recover.

I'd say that no more than 10% of the total sales of a PC game is the number of downloaded copies too. So, The Witcher, which CD Projekt stated they sold at least 1.5 million copies, would have 150,000 copies pirated or downloaded for free. That's a huge number right there but that would never be sales for them, thus it cannot cripple them at all.

What cripples them are the illegal disk copies that are SOLD in the streets, pressed in China along with Movies and Console games DVD's, Louis Vitton purses, Rolex watches (well, some are not pirated.. some they call Bolex), Duracell batteries, Ray-Ban sunglasses, Pioneer car stereo system, the list is huge...

That cripples them all because the money made with those sales is not going to the legit owners but to a very well orginized machine of corruption. But that really cripples them because to sell them, they need someone who buy them and those spending money with such forgeries are the ones who are denying the legit producers a sale.

Is it so hard to understand it? But because I don't buy this "free d/l is what hurts the industry" b/s it DOES NOT mean I support it. I buy my stuff legally, like I believe most people do. Because it feels good. I don't want a medal for that. It's nothing extraordinaire. But I can afford it and I'm a very regular person which would feel bad doing otherwise. If the product is good, I gladly pay for it. Like me, many regular persons do the same.

Only that finding a escape goat for the flaws of the industry does not make it true either. If DA:O hadn't sold well for the PC they wouldn't even release DA2 for the PC. Specially a dumbed down version that is aimed at the console market because, like I said, that's where the Major Label players like EA want to make the big bucks.

See, I'm a musician and I really don't like "Axé" music. Ivete Sangalo is playin in the Madison Square Garden in NYC next week or so. She's the best selling artist in Brazil and her music puts millions to dance. As a Label owner, no matter how much I disgust "axé music" , I'd make sure to have some in my catalog because that is where the money is. No point in releasing only classical or metal or jazz when the "justin bieber audience" in my country wants Ivete Sangalo and her axé music.

And that's clearly what EA is doing. That phrase in Mike Laidlaw's interview is a lot more meaningful than it seems:  "Now, the game mainly sold on console, so we're going the way of the audience". Well, that's the way of the audience. The Justin Bieber audience!

[Nerevar-as]

filetemo wrote...

the only people who doesn't download games for free is because they aren't savvy enough to know how to do it, how to apply a crack and so on.That's why console gamers pirate less.
And according to internet forums, there's a 0.00001% of righteous gamers who buy games because they "really want to support the industry"

OK, either you are sarcastic or you just said we are either thieves or stupid (PC player here, by the way).

THANKS A LOT.