555 réponses à ce sujet

[Lotion Soronarr]

bl00dsh0t wrote...

 I don't think anyone is doubting that the story will be good, and frankly I doubt that bioware will screw up the combat system completely. But I think you guys need to learn some more gamer lingo since the term hack&slash to many is synonomous with diablo type action rpg's where the roleplaying is limited to your skillset and not the personality of the characters. That is why people are getting scared I presume. 

I get that the principle of showing off a high level character tearing stuff up is appealing to alot of people, frankly I enjoyed the battles at the end of origins where you could see that the warden had become a master at darkspawn slaughtering. Of course this happened by sending severely underleveled enemies at the warden and his/her party which in the system for origins just looked silly. In the battle of denerim you pretty much just needed one scattershot to waste 30 darkspawn that then died in very odd and unsatisfying ways. That this is being corrected is appearantly shown in the demo you are desplaying now. 

Still it has to be understandable for you guys that when we who replayed origins more times than we dare to admit to ourselves get somewhat worried when the challenge of battle seems to have been toned to diablo levels of 1 character taking on 40 enemies and slashing through them like butter. Frankly for that I boot up good old diablo 2, DAO was for me to face off against enemies where a mistake in my strategy could lead to the obliteration of my tank/dps/healer too early in the fight. That was excilerating and challenging and it obviously worries me and probably a lot of other DAO veterans that the only thing we hear is about this hawke tearing through the darkspawn like butter while our character, our wardens we built up and got attached to, had to struggle like hell in the earlier levels to match the might of the horde. It frankly cheapens their struggles and screams to us that depth is being tossed out the window for accessebility and mass marktet appeal. 

So just drop the term hack and slash from the vocabulary to market this game in the forums, sure there is a lot of hacking and slashing going on in a game with swords but still remember that we no speak normal, we speak nerd 

I'd rather face 2 skilled and difficult enemies, than 20 useless mooks. Power progression in 99% of games is garbage. Developers can't seem to grasp that massive power progression and epic lootz is NOT needed. Teh game won't fail if it doesn't have that - take the Witcher for example - you got a few swords and 2-3 armor, and minimalistic inventory. Did it suck? Heck no!

[AngryFrozenWater]

chain25 wrote...

Here is the first impression of a German online games mag who was at GamesCom and had a glimpse on DA2.
For Google translation click here 
Dunno what to think yet ...

Thanks for that.

The article talks about the graphics and does not praise it. I really hope we don't get crappy textures again. DAO's texture resolution was bad enough. In 2011 it's time to use the graphics potentential that modern cards have. Anti-aliasing is something I like full support for as well. I am not asking for DX11 tesselation, but bringing the graphics up to date to current hardware is not that odd to ask.

If BW wants to reach that 10 million copies then it has to work on the graphics as well. I feel they now think that reaching a large market can only be achieved by targeting crappy hardware. I think that's a shame. What is called the enthousiast market (the people who buy high-end PCs) is a $9.5 billion market (2009). We are not talking about a small minority here. You can scale graphics features to support both less capable and high end machines. If their current engines cannot do that then their new games should really get rid of such aweful and outdated technology.

Edit: Added an additional argument in the last paragraph.

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 20 août 2010 - 08:56 .

[Layn]

well it might be just my bias but... seriously i still didn't like the dialogue wheel, having a voice for the guy, and having no tactical camera. graphics didn't look too well either, but it might just be early and also the rather bleak environment of that scene.



it was still nice though, and DA2 will surely be a good game. just not the way i'd prefer it to be

[Lucy Glitter]

My experience tells me graphics always need improvement according to first impressions.

[toastymckracker]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

bl00dsh0t wrote...

 I don't think anyone is doubting that the story will be good, and frankly I doubt that bioware will screw up the combat system completely. But I think you guys need to learn some more gamer lingo since the term hack&slash to many is synonomous with diablo type action rpg's where the roleplaying is limited to your skillset and not the personality of the characters. That is why people are getting scared I presume. 

I get that the principle of showing off a high level character tearing stuff up is appealing to alot of people, frankly I enjoyed the battles at the end of origins where you could see that the warden had become a master at darkspawn slaughtering. Of course this happened by sending severely underleveled enemies at the warden and his/her party which in the system for origins just looked silly. In the battle of denerim you pretty much just needed one scattershot to waste 30 darkspawn that then died in very odd and unsatisfying ways. That this is being corrected is appearantly shown in the demo you are desplaying now. 

Still it has to be understandable for you guys that when we who replayed origins more times than we dare to admit to ourselves get somewhat worried when the challenge of battle seems to have been toned to diablo levels of 1 character taking on 40 enemies and slashing through them like butter. Frankly for that I boot up good old diablo 2, DAO was for me to face off against enemies where a mistake in my strategy could lead to the obliteration of my tank/dps/healer too early in the fight. That was excilerating and challenging and it obviously worries me and probably a lot of other DAO veterans that the only thing we hear is about this hawke tearing through the darkspawn like butter while our character, our wardens we built up and got attached to, had to struggle like hell in the earlier levels to match the might of the horde. It frankly cheapens their struggles and screams to us that depth is being tossed out the window for accessebility and mass marktet appeal. 

So just drop the term hack and slash from the vocabulary to market this game in the forums, sure there is a lot of hacking and slashing going on in a game with swords but still remember that we no speak normal, we speak nerd 

I'd rather face 2 skilled and difficult enemies, than 20 useless mooks. Power progression in 99% of games is garbage. Developers can't seem to grasp that massive power progression and epic lootz is NOT needed. Teh game won't fail if it doesn't have that - take the Witcher for example - you got a few swords and 2-3 armor, and minimalistic inventory. Did it suck? Heck no!

Well, I'll agree that I'd rather face 2 skilled and difficult enemies and 20 useless henchmen.  However, I can't agree with anything else.  For me and many others, inventory and customization is at least 20% of a good RPG experience.  Besides, isn't power progression one of the many things that defines a good RPG?  Constantly getting the better weapon, the better armor, the more fitting accessory goes hand-in-hand with constantly upgrading your skills and abilities.  IMO, it's part of the total package that a good RPG needs, along with satisfying combat, enjoyable boss fights, interesting characters, and an enthralling story.  Regarding power progression as you put it, sure, a lot of developers don't do it right.  But if a game nails that sense of power progression finally leading up to you gaining equipment that is nothing short of legendary, then it truly adds to the overal experience. 

[Lucy Glitter]

Can anyone tell me if the VO was any good and if there were any hawt males. Thx

[Kalfear]

chain25 wrote...

Here is the first impression of a German online games mag who was at GamesCom and had a glimpse on DA2.
For Google translation click here 
Dunno what to think yet ...

Thanks for that!

I been waiting for a "neutral" site whose reputation hasnt been openly questioned for years to do a reveiw and what you know.

Not terrible (I didnt really think it would be) but not the world beater some here suggest as well.

Still not on my purchase at full price list, will see what other neutral sites have to say!

[chain25]

I am willing to sacrifice a lot for a blasting story and c'mon DAO wasnt so awesome because of its graphics or its gameplay (at least for consoleros as me ... yeah yeah blame me ;-)).
No doubt bioware will manage to come up with yet another epic story but like some of us the only thing I am truly worried about is the limitations due to VO i.e. the conversation wheel.
Never have played ME or ME2 (but will play the latter in Jan 11, yay!) but I just personally dont like choosing dialogue options from intents and maybe some keywords without knowing what the PC actually will say. Kills RP a bit imho and makes talking to your party members way less interesting.

Modifié par chain25, 20 août 2010 - 10:41 .

[Faz432]

Why hasn't anyone who has gone to play the demo taken a video of it?

If you're not allowed then hidden cameras people!...pretend you're James Bond on a secret mission to collect awesomeness!!

Modifié par Faz432, 20 août 2010 - 10:44 .

[FedericoV]

chain25 wrote...

Here is the first impression of a German online games mag who was at GamesCom and had a glimpse on DA2.
For Google translation click here 
Dunno what to think yet ...

The most interesting thing is about camera controll even if the translation is far from perfect. The reviewer have some point. One thing has to be said, even if I'm a supporter of old iso view. The camera in DA:O was great because of its flexibility and so on but in some environments it does not work a lot. In Denerim alleys or everywhere there were different heights on the battlefield, there were problems to have a complete outlook from any angle. It worked perfectly in dungeons or interiors wich are environments that remember more the BG 2D design. But outside from those areas it was far from perfect. So I understand why they want to address those issues even if we will have to wait and see before any judgement.

[jazzy B 3]

Faz432 wrote...

Why hasn't anyone who has gone to play the demo taken a video of it?

If you're not allowed then hidden cameras people!...pretend you're James Bond on a secret mission to collect awesomeness!!

I believe that there were threats of disembowlment (possibly with the blow-up hawke sword-staff) if anyone was caught videoing the demo.

TanithAeyrs wrote...

The truth comes out; Sandal is the DM.

Bravo Mike.

Enchantment!

Also yay for the rulebook version of events, which seems to alay a lot of peoples fears.  I expected it to be like that from the descriptions people were giving, but others seemed to need the reassurance in non-bro-speak.

[Daryn Mercio]

http://comic-con.gam...age-ii-hands-on

That seems like the best review I've read

[Faz432]

jazzy B 3 wrote...

Faz432 wrote...

Why hasn't anyone who has gone to play the demo taken a video of it?

If you're not allowed then hidden cameras people!...pretend you're James Bond on a secret mission to collect awesomeness!!

I believe that there were threats of disembowlment (possibly with the blow-up hawke sword-staff) if anyone was caught videoing the demo.

Sometimes the ultimate sacrifice has to be made for the greater good.

[danien.grey]

Lucy_Glitter wrote...

Can anyone tell me if the VO was any good and if there were any hawt males. Thx

What she said.


Edit: ...errr, replace "males" with "females".

Modifié par danien.grey, 20 août 2010 - 11:58 .

[Brockololly]

chain25 wrote...

Here is the first impression of a German online games mag who was at GamesCom and had a glimpse on DA2.
For Google translation click here 
Dunno what to think yet ...

Nice find.

I know the camera for the PC is a work in progress but this preview highlights it as well as others, that it seems sort of insincere. The German article says that BioWare was calling the PC's camera "Tactical camera 2.0", when given the fact that it doesn't zoom out anymore like Origins and can only pan around that its at best "Tactical camera 0.5".

And again, they mention how BioWare is claiming part of the reason for eliminating the old school isometric view is because the textures will be so much better, yet they were not impressed by the textures in the demo.

Its hard to be too critical if the camera is really in flux as much as its being portrayed as, but these textures better be pretty astounding if thats the excuse for not having the iso view.

[alexmasterson123]

Brockololly wrote...

Dragon Age 2 PC: No toolset, no isometric view- no sale../../../images/forum/emoticons/angry.png

You missed off 'no common sense'.

[Nerevar-as]

The new engine hasn´t impressed me so far either. I didn´t find the Origins graphics bad however, they kind of fitted with the atmosphere of the game. Is like when some people complained Fallout 3 had worse graphics than Gears of War. Backgrounds vs places you could really go to.



The removal of the iso view is puzzling. Can´t the new engine handle it at all (according to one of the devs even the normal zoom out is troubling) or do they ignore it cause it is only for one system, the one with lowest sales? They already did that in ME2, with no keyboard bindings in PC version (great irony, ME1, which was a port, was much better ME2, developed at the same time).

[DragonRageGT]

Daryn Mercio wrote...

http://comic-con.gam...age-ii-hands-on
That seems like the best review I've read

Added link to the URL for the lazy ones like me just click it i/o copy/paste which is too troublesome!

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Thanks for that.

The article talks about the graphics and does not praise it. I really hope we don't get crappy textures again. DAO's texture resolution was bad enough. In 2011 it's time to use the graphics potentential that modern cards have. Anti-aliasing is something I like full support for as well. I am not asking for DX11 tesselation, but bringing the graphics up to date to current hardware is not that odd to ask.

If BW wants to reach that 10 million copies then it has to work on the graphics as well. I feel they now think that reaching a large market can only be achieved by targeting crappy hardware. I think that's a shame. What is called the enthousiast market (the people who buy high-end PCs) is a $9.5 billion market (2009). We are not talking about a small minority here. You can scale graphics features to support both less capable and high end machines. If their current engines cannot do that then their new games should really get rid of such aweful and outdated technology.

Edit: Added an additional argument in the last paragraph.

Can't argue with that. And also don't forget that good gpx cards are very cheap these days. 150 bucks where I live (75 in the US?) for a GeForce 240 GT 1GB DDR5 seems cheap compared with a few years ago when they might reach 2,000. (considering that we pay like 100% extra for import taxes). And my 9600GT 512MB DDR5 still can handle very well most games I play or intend to.

[DragonRageGT]

Nerevar-as wrote...

The new engine hasn´t impressed me so far either. I didn´t find the Origins graphics bad however, they kind of fitted with the atmosphere of the game. Is like when some people complained Fallout 3 had worse graphics than Gears of War. Backgrounds vs places you could really go to.

The removal of the iso view is puzzling. Can´t the new engine handle it at all (according to one of the devs even the normal zoom out is troubling) or do they ignore it cause it is only for one system, the one with lowest sales? They already did that in ME2, with no keyboard bindings in PC version (great irony, ME1, which was a port, was much better ME2, developed at the same time).

That sounds like "reducing costs at the expense of quality", really. Sure, there were a few areas where the zoom out camera would not work properly, like in some Denerim Alley areas but don;t forget how well it worker everywhere else. Specially for a fun far away scouting of the area with the zoom out and a few turns with the camera. I could reach way farther than the default. And it helped me to kick azz in NM. Specially playing Hardcore style. I hate injuries and death much more! No death or restart. Simply. "Play it like a man would!" (the Gothic HC players motto -  damn, that is a tough game to play HC!)

[alexmasterson123]

"The removal of the iso view is puzzling"



To me, it's puzzling that people are so upset about the change. Take Brockololly up there. No isometric camera, no sale? He'd have probably played two games in the last decade.

[Luke Bioware]

I loved it, but I'll have to organize my thoughts for my (Dutch) article first. Maybe I'll summarize my opinion here later .

E: they asked you not to film anything indeed. I don't want any beef with BioWare so I listened .

Modifié par Luke Bioware, 20 août 2010 - 01:00 .

[Nerevar-as]

RageGT wrote...

Nerevar-as wrote...

The new engine hasn´t impressed me so far either. I didn´t find the Origins graphics bad however, they kind of fitted with the atmosphere of the game. Is like when some people complained Fallout 3 had worse graphics than Gears of War. Backgrounds vs places you could really go to.

The removal of the iso view is puzzling. Can´t the new engine handle it at all (according to one of the devs even the normal zoom out is troubling) or do they ignore it cause it is only for one system, the one with lowest sales? They already did that in ME2, with no keyboard bindings in PC version (great irony, ME1, which was a port, was much better ME2, developed at the same time).

That sounds like "reducing costs at the expense of quality", really. Sure, there were a few areas where the zoom out camera would not work properly, like in some Denerim Alley areas but don;t forget how well it worker everywhere else. Specially for a fun far away scouting of the area with the zoom out and a few turns with the camera. I could reach way farther than the default. And it helped me to kick azz in NM. Specially playing Hardcore style. I hate injuries and death much more! No death or restart. Simply. "Play it like a man would!" (the Gothic HC players motto -  damn, that is a tough game to play HC!)

Gothic in HC? Ah, the good times.   Nightmare is a walk in the park compared to that, save for the Harvester from GoA. Hope the difficulty levels in DA2 are better adjusted. I want a challenge, having to exploit the character´s skills and capabilities to their best.

Modifié par Nerevar-as, 20 août 2010 - 01:05 .

[Luke Bioware]

I did have one minor gripe I'd like to ask you guys about already. Did anyone encounter a converstation where there were more options than 'investigate', 'nice', 'cheeky' and '****' (something like that)? Maybe I didn't get far enough into the demo, but I did click away the scenes without Hawke in them to check out as much as I could .

Hawke also speaks some lines without you choosing anything. ME didn't do that right? Not a complaint really, but I was just wondering about that.

Modifié par Luke Bioware, 20 août 2010 - 01:07 .

[alexmasterson123]

Luke Bioware wrote...

I did have one minor gripe I'd like to ask you guys about already. Did anyone encounter a converstation where there were more options than 'investigate', 'nice', 'cheeky' and '****' (something like that)? Maybe I didn't get far enough into the demo, but I did click away the scenes without Hawke in them to check out as much as I could .

Hawke also speaks some lines without you choosing anything. ME didn't do that right? Not a complaint really, but I was just wondering about that.

While you're here, could you do what nobody else, bizarrely, has, and tell us about the Hawke VO? 

[Luke Bioware]

I got a Jesus vibe from him (his look) and his voice sounds almost formal, absolutely not annoying. I'm no expert, but I thought I heard a hint of 'Britishness'. Hard to put a finger on him/it and 'typecast' it to some person. To long, didn't read: good voice.

(Someone could come in here and tell me I'm way off. Played it two days ago, not yesterday.)

Modifié par Luke Bioware, 20 août 2010 - 01:19 .