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I want a choice

Débuté par Kengi9 , août 19 2010 10:43

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#101
wwwwowwww
Posté 25 août 2010 - 02:24

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Kengi9 wrote...

I want to make sure that we stay a bit on topic. I hope that we are all in agreement that there should be some gay options.


Nope we don't all agree, sorry.

#102
Guest_Raga_*
Posté 25 août 2010 - 02:27

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Semyaza82 wrote...

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

SteveGarbage wrote...

Everyone bi? No. Maybe additional bi or gay only characters? Fine. Doesn't really interest me, but I don't see why not as long as it makes sense in terms of story and character.


I can see some context for bi characters; it was reasonably well-justified with Zev and Leliana.  With the asari and Kelly...well, they just love everyone.  With the Jade Empire same-sex LIs, it felt like it was just kinda tacked on there.

The one place where I could've seen them making characters bisexual was with some of the more "alien" LIs in Mass Effect 2, specifically Garrus and Tali.  Tali actually had dialogue for it.  Garrus makes some comment about how he's not attracted toward humans per se--just Shepard.  Not only is that incredibly adorkable, it applies equally well to male or female Shep.


I thought the same about the alien romances in ME2 - although i was joking about it before you really would think the if species isn't an issue for someone gender wouldn't be either.

Oh, and you're totally right about the Jade Empire same sex relationships with Sky (mmmmmm, i miss you Sky....) and Silk Fox. We didn't even get to see the big dramatic kiss if it was a gay couple :P


*large wall o' text, apologies in advance*  This is me commenting on the above statements.  For my direct relevant thoughts to what the OP said, you can just read my last paragraph.

Just wanted to clarify something here.  I know you were kidding and I don't want to derail an otherwise unusually useful thread on this topic, but I wanted to point something out.  I certainly can't speak for all women, but I can speak for myself and a few others I know.  Believe it or not there are women that are attracted to Garrus and Thane on a physical level and it is because we perceive them as very masculine, alien or not.  With Garrus, there is the whole mesomorphic appearance of broad shoulders, muscular chest, and slim waist.  And there is the voice and the bearing and a bunch of other stuff.  His personality is attractive sure, but he is also specifically attractive because he is readily identifiable as male.

 In this sense, I think it is understandable that I can see Garrus as attractive, but not Tali as I am straight.  Tali is recognizably female, alien or not.  My point is is that I don't think the whole "if you can get over him being a different species you should be able to get over gender" argument is really accurate, at least not for everybody.  Sure he's another species, but he is also very much still male. Just because I like Garrus doesn't mean I suddenly now have the capacity to find females sexually attractive. Is an otherwise gay man going to suddenly find Tali's gender irrelevant in determining her appeal?  Possibly, but probably not.  My point is that I don't think gender is as immaterial to the alien LIs as some people like to imply.

I think the same logic can be applied from Tali and Garrus' end of things, whatever dialog may exist on the disc. Whether they were once intended to be bi or not is IMO rather immaterial to what they actually are now.  Gender for them does become a factor specifically because it is impossible to pursue a same sex romance with them.  It might just be a weird cut due to time or something, but intention and actuality are not the same thing.  It's not that Tali and Garrus could never ever have been bi.  It's just that in their current manifestation they aren't, and whatever content may have been cut, I don't see how it is unrealistic or unreasonable for them to just be straight.  Does that make sense?  And I think it might be too late in the game to realistically make them otherwise.  If they suddenly became bi in ME3, it would feel like it sort of fell out of the sky to me.  Now, what Bioware should have done with them in ME2 is another thing entirely and possibly up for debate, but it still doesn't change the actuality of what they have done and what Garrus and Tali are right now.  In other words, I think gender does matter to them.

All that aside, I readily support the inclusion of more same-sex romance options.  Especially M/M as that is still the one we have the least examples of in Bioware games.  I would not use such content but I think it should be there for those who would, and I enjoy having squaddies like Zev and Leliana around.  He is unapologetic and upfront about it, and I like having diverse and interesting squadmates.  They're fun to talk to and get to know.  Even if I don't pursue anything, it is still nice for it to be there to add vibrancy and variety.

Modifié par Ragabul the Ontarah, 25 août 2010 - 02:28 .

#103
Arrtis
Posté 25 août 2010 - 02:27

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wwwwowwww wrote...

Kengi9 wrote...

I want to make sure that we stay a bit on topic. I hope that we are all in agreement that there should be some gay options.


Nope we don't all agree, sorry.

I want the option of making a gay person straight though.

#104
Kengi9
Posté 25 août 2010 - 02:37

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Sorry I shouldn't try to generalize things, I have a bad habit of saying we all or ya'll or anything encompassing more then me. If I stepped on anyone's toes, or caused anyone to get riled by my statement I apologize. I understand that it's up to the writers and developers to make the characters as they see fit. I just hope they take the players into consideration as well.



Thanks

#105
scootermcgaffin
Posté 25 août 2010 - 03:26

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nhsk wrote...

I don't want to begin a major conversation over where it is happening as it inappropriate for a board dedicated to DA2 and not everything else, but I can rephrase it to a more unsubtle way.

I'm tired of listening to people whine over gay rights and wanting gay people everywhere, not just in DA2. And yes, I do have some gay friends and aquintances that think the same. But enough of that for this board.

This is a funny post.

"So, here's my opinion BUT I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOURS STOP TALKING ABOUT IT NOW"

Anyway, same-sex romances are important, and I hope to see an increase in their quality, if not their quantity, in DA2.

Modifié par scootermcgaffin, 25 août 2010 - 03:28 .

#106
Arrtis
Posté 25 août 2010 - 03:31

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scootermcgaffin wrote...

nhsk wrote...

I don't want to begin a major conversation over where it is happening as it inappropriate for a board dedicated to DA2 and not everything else, but I can rephrase it to a more unsubtle way.

I'm tired of listening to people whine over gay rights and wanting gay people everywhere, not just in DA2. And yes, I do have some gay friends and aquintances that think the same. But enough of that for this board.

This is a funny post.

"So, here's my opinion BUT I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOURS STOP TALKING ABOUT IT NOW"

Anyway, same-sex romances are important, and I hope to see an increase in their quality, if not their quantity, in DA2.

Why are they important?
ME does well without them.

#107
Riona45
Posté 25 août 2010 - 03:31

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The previous DA featured gay romances and gay characters, so it's entirely possible that such things are in the cards for DA2.  In my opinion, that is a good thing.Posted Image

It will probably be a while before the devs talk about any romances, though.

#108
scootermcgaffin
Posté 25 août 2010 - 03:34

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They are important because they increase persons visibility of LGB people. Which is important for a whole host of societal reasons. It normalizes it which is a good thing because it advances (sorry nhsk I'm gonna say it!) gay rights.

And yes, a video game can do that. Obviously, same sex romances in Dragon Age will not make or break the entire gay rights movement, but media influences people and its disingenuous to suggest otherwise.

edit: And, beyond that, it's important for gay people playing games--especially younger ones--to see themselves represented as something more than a stereotype, joke, or side character that exists to be killed off.

Modifié par scootermcgaffin, 25 août 2010 - 03:43 .

#109
BrandonMotz
Posté 25 août 2010 - 03:35

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I understand what the poster is saying, however, that would mean that in order to be gay with whomever she wanted to, Bioware would have to make each character to have homosexual tendencies.

That does not seem like it would be plausible in any "realistic" kind of way. What I hear her saying is that every character should be gay just because she wants them to be.

How would it sound if it were posted the other way around with someone saying that characters should only be hetero-sexual?

IMHO it is much better to only have some characters gay just for the simple logic that not everyone is gay nor does everyone want to be.

Bioware should keep it just as it is now.

#110
Daur
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:01

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It didnt happen in the mass effect series because you are playing a set character, Shepard, in DA2 you will not have this option because you play a set character, Hawke, you HAD this option in DA:O only because you did NOT play a set character, the unknown and unnamed warden

#111
scootermcgaffin
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:05

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What if the set character, Hawke, is gay?

Oh man imagine the outrage.

#112
Daur
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:06

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scootermcgaffin wrote...

What if the set character, Hawke, is gay?
Oh man imagine the outrage.

In that case I would accept it, no big deal Posted Image

#113
Rogue Unit
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:09

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scootermcgaffin wrote...

What if the set character, Hawke, is gay?
Oh man imagine the outrage.


I'M NOT BUYING THIS GAME. Stomp, stomp, slam!

Seriously, though I wouldn't buy this game if that was the case. I wouldn't waste time raging over it either.

#114
Guest_Raga_*
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:16

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scootermcgaffin wrote...

What if the set character, Hawke, is gay?
Oh man imagine the outrage.


Frankly, I have no idea what I would do.  My initial reaction would be a mix of :huh: and :blink: and then I'd just have to sit on it and think for a bit.  Beens it's a Bioware game, I'm pretty sure I would play it, but I really have no idea how I might feel about it.

#115
Lawrence- Mage of the Grey Wardens
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:22

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No! You're gonna play as a white, straight, male or female human or you're not gonna play.





DEAL WITH IT!!!!





{100% not serious}

#116
Daur
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:23

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Lawrence- Mage of the Grey Wardens wrote...

No! You're gonna play as a white, straight, male or female human or you're not gonna play.


DEAL WITH IT!!!!


{100% not serious}

Except for the white part you are 100% correct

#117
scootermcgaffin
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:27

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Man, I've been forced to play straight, white males in 99% of the games I've played. You'll need to find a new threat. :P

#118
Riona45
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:29

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scootermcgaffin wrote...

What if the set character, Hawke, is gay?
Oh man imagine the outrage.


I would still play.

And Hawke is NOT a "set character." 

#119
Daur
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:33

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Riona45 wrote...

scootermcgaffin wrote...

What if the set character, Hawke, is gay?
Oh man imagine the outrage.


I would still play.

And Hawke is NOT a "set character." 

sorry I meant set as shepard is set, a defined character who's gender, look, personality etc are chosen by the player.....but since they are a CHARACTER (we are a named being here not unnamed warden) there will be limitations placed by bioware on Hawke just like there were on shepard (example being he/she could not be gay even though liara appears female)Posted Image

#120
Lawrence- Mage of the Grey Wardens
Posté 25 août 2010 - 05:34

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Daur wrote...

Lawrence- Mage of the Grey Wardens wrote...

No! You're gonna play as a white, straight, male or female human or you're not gonna play.


DEAL WITH IT!!!!


{100% not serious}

Except for the white part you are 100% correct


I meant the bigoted act wasn't serious.

I don't hate gays and I actually think it would be pretty nifty is Bioware put some of these kinds people in the game (black people too please! lmao).

I know, I know. Putting gay people in culture makes kids gay, but I'm willing to risk it in the interest of inclusion. 

lmfao

This is 2010. I thought all the bigots would have died off or been educated by now or something.

Jeeze people, is it really that odd to think people might want really badly to see other people like them in the games they play?

And on a related note, imagine if there was only 2 straight characters...Okay I admit, even I wouldn't play that game. lol

Modifié par Lawrence- Mage of the Grey Wardens, 25 août 2010 - 05:34 .

#121
nhsk
Posté 25 août 2010 - 10:35

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scootermcgaffin wrote...

nhsk wrote...

I don't want to begin a major conversation over where it is happening as it inappropriate for a board dedicated to DA2 and not everything else, but I can rephrase it to a more unsubtle way.

I'm tired of listening to people whine over gay rights and wanting gay people everywhere, not just in DA2. And yes, I do have some gay friends and aquintances that think the same. But enough of that for this board.

This is a funny post.

"So, here's my opinion BUT I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOURS STOP TALKING ABOUT IT NOW"

Anyway, same-sex romances are important, and I hope to see an increase in their quality, if not their quantity, in DA2.


I didn't say that, I said that what I meant with "Gayification of everything in the name of equality" was not something we should delve further into, as it is a civil rights / political discussion not suited for this board.
I don't mind the occasional bi or gay character, but I mind if everyone is open to everyone. What you think about that, is your right to say. I just don't want to have this cheesy feel to it with everyone being romancable (is that even a word?) like ME2 was, and certainly I do not want my Garrus to be gay as well as I don't want to have my Alistair to be just to please everyone. Now if Alistair had been gay from the start, and only gay. Not Bi or anything it would have been fine as well, but all this that everyone must swing both ways irritates me and it is not something I wan't personally and thus I try to argue against it.
I feels weird in the sense that I don't find it believable.

#122
wwwwowwww
Posté 25 août 2010 - 10:44

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scootermcgaffin wrote...



Anyway, same-sex romances are important, and I hope to see an increase in their quality, if not their quantity, in DA2.


Why exactly are they important? Curious about this one.

I mean I don't care either way but I don't get why it's important.

#123
GameBoyish
Posté 25 août 2010 - 10:52

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I think more choices of bi characters would be good. But obviously not just everyone, right? I mean, like IRL when you like someone, they don't necessarily have the same sexual orientation as yourself. I'm a straight gal but I have been falling for an online friend of mine, a boy who's in hormone replacement therapy (he's becoming a girl). I like him still T_T

#124
DarkSpiral
Posté 25 août 2010 - 10:54

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wwwwowwww wrote...

scootermcgaffin wrote...



Anyway, same-sex romances are important, and I hope to see an increase in their quality, if not their quantity, in DA2.


Why exactly are they important? Curious about this one.

I mean I don't care either way but I don't get why it's important.


So that people who are gay can have a main character that is easier for them to identify with.  So that straight people can push their boundaries a little bit, if they want.  Because more options is usually a good thing.

Just off the top of my head.

#125
scootermcgaffin
Posté 25 août 2010 - 10:55

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wwwwowwww wrote...

scootermcgaffin wrote...



Anyway, same-sex romances are important, and I hope to see an increase in their quality, if not their quantity, in DA2.


Why exactly are they important? Curious about this one.

I mean I don't care either way but I don't get why it's important.

Seriously, man, like two posts after that one I explained why. :P

But, yeah, essentially what DarkSpiral said.
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