645 réponses à ce sujet

[Marionetten]

Archereon wrote...

While its a valid enough point in terms of the "mauled bodies" (which dragon age doesn't actually have in high detail), that last part makes him sound rather immature.

I'm sorry, would it have been better if he had used mammaries?

You do realize that you're coming off as the immature one, right?

[Arrtis]

Judging people over the internet!You sir have made a very grave mistake.

[AlexXIV]

On my list of '1000 important things in an RPG' nudity is number 1001. Sorry but I feel safe to say the majority of people doesn't want it and some will even be put off and not buying the game. Especially parents who buy it for their kids.

[term8]

Archereon wrote...

It's either fade to black or nudity otherwise it looks stupid. I'd prefer fade to black.
OP is right tho, isn't DA2 an M rated game? BW stop being bigots. Apparently seeing mauled bodies, rivers of blood,decapitations is ok but a pair of ****** isn't. lol wtf?

To above poster "Read the whole thread."

Here's one of several examples of this.


While its a valid enough point in terms of the "mauled bodies" (which dragon age doesn't actually have in high detail), that last part makes him sound rather immature.

ha ha ha... or perhaps he feels that sex is taken far too seriously, and is suggesting that the cultural need to "make sex very serious"  is ridiculous

[Archereon]

Marionetten wrote...

Archereon wrote...

While its a valid enough point in terms of the "mauled bodies" (which dragon age doesn't actually have in high detail), that last part makes him sound rather immature.

I'm sorry, would it have been better if he had used mammaries?

You do realize that you're coming off as the immature one, right?

"Breasts" maybe?

Saying "******" makes his entire post sound juvenile.  The sheer amount of attention devoted to the sex scenes by some people is rather disturbing (barring the probability that many of them are teenage boys), its like they care more about the sex scene then the actual romance.  (no, I'm not trying to imply anyone who discusses the scenes is a horny 15 year old, just that its likely many of the people that care more about the scenes then the entire romance subplot likely fit into that group.)

Modifié par Archereon, 20 août 2010 - 09:15 .

[Arrtis]

AlexXIV wrote...

On my list of '1000 important things in an RPG' nudity is number 1001. Sorry but I feel safe to say the majority of people doesn't want it and some will even be put off and not buying the game. Especially parents who buy it for their kids.

Parents should not buy it for thier kids.....When it is a M rated game without all of that....MAjority of people will really NOT CARE THAT MUCH.Feel free to claim the majority though.

[Kalfear]

Archereon wrote...

It's either fade to black or nudity otherwise it looks stupid. I'd prefer fade to black.
OP is right tho, isn't DA2 an M rated game? BW stop being bigots. Apparently seeing mauled bodies, rivers of blood,decapitations is ok but a pair of ****** isn't. lol wtf?

To above poster "Read the whole thread."

Here's one of several examples of this.


While its a valid enough point in terms of the "mauled bodies" (which dragon age doesn't actually have in high detail), that last part makes him sound rather immature.

immature coming from his holiness!

funny

And DA:O did in fact have mauled bodies, rivers of blood, and all the other violent stuff.
But we get your meaning
Typical american puritan
Violence ok
sex and nudity EVIL EVIL EVIL

You gotta wonder some times how these types tie their shoes in the morning!

[Marionetten]

AlexXIV wrote...

On my list of '1000 important things in an RPG' nudity is number 1001. Sorry but I feel safe to say the majority of people doesn't want it and some will even be put off and not buying the game. Especially parents who buy it for their kids.

Toggle. It only does everything.

Archereon wrote...

"Breasts" maybe?

Saying "******" makes his entire post sound juvenile.  The sheer amount of attention devoted to the sex scenes by some people is rather disturbing (barring the probability that many of them are teenage boys), its like they care more about the sex scene then the actual romance.

You obsessing over a single word makes you appear extremely juvenile.

Try arguing his point.

Modifié par Marionetten, 20 août 2010 - 09:16 .

[Iokastos]

Archereon wrote...

It's either fade to black or nudity otherwise it looks stupid. I'd prefer fade to black.
OP is right tho, isn't DA2 an M rated game? BW stop being bigots. Apparently seeing mauled bodies, rivers of blood,decapitations is ok but a pair of ****** isn't. lol wtf?

To above poster "Read the whole thread."

Here's one of several examples of this.


While its a valid enough point in terms of the "mauled bodies" (which dragon age doesn't actually have in high detail), that last part makes him sound rather immature.

English is not my mother language.. but then again should I say bosom/breast to prove (?) my maturity? <_< Next time I'll call them bongos...

[Archereon]

Kalfear wrote...

Archereon wrote...

It's either fade to black or nudity otherwise it looks stupid. I'd prefer fade to black.
OP is right tho, isn't DA2 an M rated game? BW stop being bigots. Apparently seeing mauled bodies, rivers of blood,decapitations is ok but a pair of ****** isn't. lol wtf?

To above poster "Read the whole thread."

Here's one of several examples of this.


While its a valid enough point in terms of the "mauled bodies" (which dragon age doesn't actually have in high detail), that last part makes him sound rather immature.

immature coming from his holiness!

funny

And DA:O did in fact have mauled bodies, rivers of blood, and all the other violent stuff.
But we get your meaning
Typical american puritan
Violence ok
sex and nudity EVIL EVIL EVIL

You gotta wonder some times how these types tie their shoes in the morning!

3 points.

I don't believe in god, don't think sex is evil, and don't think nuditity is evil.  I just find the motivations of many of the people asking for disguised pornography (no, full frontal is not necessarily porn, but I having a nagging suspicion that at least several of the people asking for that want it taken to extremes) rather dubious.

Modifié par Archereon, 20 août 2010 - 09:21 .

[tmp7704]

Marionetten wrote...

No, it's just clearly wrong.

Frankly, I think we're gonna make it this time. We haven't put more or less nudity and violence into The Witcher 2. It's just I think things have changed slightly. From what I recall around 2007 not too many games showed nipples for example. Now it's so common that I just think the mindset has shifted and since we've stayed the same - it might work this time around. By the way - we have redesigned the visual aspect of sex in the game. You won't have "collectible" cards this time - we've presented things with cinematics, and additionally we bound all threads with the storyline.

So, to get it straight: "we have no less and no more nudity compared to our previous game where we had a few static drawings of naked women and cutscenes that showed nothing. Except oh, the static drawings are gone and it's now all in the cutscenes so hopefully no one takes objection because it's no different than before and times maybe have changed"

I'm not sure how they --or you-- imagine going from "static drawing of naked woman" to "cutscene of people having sex" without "putting more or less nudity in the game" is "staying the same". Just common sense would dictate that --sexual acts being perceived more risque subject to show than a nude lone figure-- if you aim to "stay the same" it'd require showing less simply to offset that extra impact (and that's not even going into difference having things animated makes from a static drawing)

Guess we'll have to wait and see what that quote really translates into. Including the rating.

[AlexXIV]

Arrtis wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

On my list of '1000 important things in an RPG' nudity is number 1001. Sorry but I feel safe to say the majority of people doesn't want it and some will even be put off and not buying the game. Especially parents who buy it for their kids.

Parents should not buy it for thier kids.....When it is a M rated game without all of that....MAjority of people will really NOT CARE THAT MUCH.Feel free to claim the majority though.

A majority that doesn't care isn't exactly a reason to put it in. Question is, will they sell more with full nudity or without? I think without.

[tybbiesniffer]

AntiChri5 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

AntiChri5 wrote...

Kalfear wrote...

AntiChri5 wrote...

Odd. I would have described the way it was handled in the Witcher as adolescent.

From what I seen most children cant get past "ohhh their nakid on the cards" mentality so not surprised that you call it adolescent.

Adults Ive shown it to get a chuckle and enjoy the actual adult content for a change!

To many people take the cards far to serious (americans it seems), they are just a side game for laughs, nothing more nothing less. A little momento. If you find yourself going back to the cards and exciting yourself to them, well then you have issues and not using the cards as they were intended.

Not just the cards, but the overall ease of it.

I remember hearing how Geralt was a mutant, a disfigured freak.

How does he interact with women?

"Heres some Tulips!"

"Wow lets have sex!"

"I saved you!"

Meet me over there tomorrow so we can have sex!"

"Heres a glove!"

"Wow lets have sex!"

Im up to act two, and have only encountered one woman with an even vaugely reasonable chest.

 To be fair, some of those ladies you were sleeping with for gifts happened to be hookers. So its not a real stretch.

Actually, i deliberatly omitted the prostitute(s) from my rant (because anyone shocked that a prostitute will sleep with you for goods/money needs a slap upside the head). I was specifically refferring to an unnamed npc in chapter 1 (the tulips), a woman you escort home one night in chapter 1, and a woman named "gossip" (the glove).
Usually all Geralt has to do is wave his hand and their tearing their clothes off.

Do Witchers get Jedi powers?

No, but they are barren in a setting/world we can assume doesn't have birth control.  

[term8]

I think one the biggest problem with arguing a point like this is that some have an inability to understand how nudity can be used for anything other than sexual arousal.

[Marionetten]

tmp7704 wrote...

So, to get it straight: "we have no less and no more nudity compared to our previous game where we had a few static drawings of naked women and cutscenes that showed nothing. Except oh, the static drawings are gone and it's now all in the cutscenes so hopefully no one takes objection because it's no different than before and times maybe have changed"

Don't be daft. You know as well as I do that The Witcher had full frontal nudity in-game. The statement means exactly what it says. That they aren't cutting anything out. They are just replacing the sex cards with actual scenes. We've already gotten a taste of the Triss one. Buttshot and all.

Modifié par Marionetten, 20 août 2010 - 09:25 .

[AlexXIV]

term8 wrote...

I think one the biggest problem with arguing a point like this is that some have an inability to understand how nudity can be used for anything other than sexual arousal.

Right, I'd like to know.

[Archereon]

term8 wrote...

I think one the biggest problem with arguing a point like this is that some have an inability to understand how nudity can be used for anything other than sexual arousal.

Unfortunately, many people only seem to want it for that.  (particularly those that agonize over the sex scenes and care more about them then the entire romance/see the romance as an annoyance on the way to the scene.)

[Heavenblade]

Censorship will be eternal with our current political system simply because a loud puritan few will always yell, kick, scream, and cry like infantile idiots the second something THEY don't approve of gets any kind of screen time.
Whether it's nudity, incest, violence, blasphemy, whatever.... someone somewhere will complain and whine like a selfish child, and if that complainer has the full backing of a powerful political lobbying group, then EVERYONE suffers as the elite pander to the loudest (as the loudest get the most media coverage.)

Whenever a game company self-censors, they are effectively eroding the foundations of freedom EVERYWHERE by encouraging this kind of behavior.

Modifié par Heavenblade, 20 août 2010 - 09:24 .

[NatOreN]

Heavenblade wrote...

Censorship will be eternal with our current political system simply because a loud puritan few will always yell, kick, scream, and cry like infantile idiots the second something THEY don't approve of gets any kind of screen time.
Whether it's nudity, incest, violence, blasphemy, whatever.... someone somewhere will complain and whine like a selfish child, and if that complainer has the full backing of a powerful political lobbying group, then EVERYONE suffers as the elite pander to the loudest (as the loudest get the most media coverage.)

Whenever a game company self-censors, they are effectively eroding the foundations of freedom EVERYWHERE by encouraging this kind of behavior.

I support this post.

[Seifz]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

Marionetten wrote...

I'm not sure we can blame restrictions and media when CD Projekt ( a far smaller developer ) is doing it.

Self-censorship is a horrible thing. I wish BioWare and EA could move past it.

CD Projekt's primary user base is in Europe, though. I'd rather avoid bland generalizations if I can but even so, the nudity isn't such a big deal over here, as long as it's contextual and tasteful as opposed to pornographic. The fact that the European PEGI rating system for games does have an 18+ rating and that stores carry those on equal terms as the lesser ratings also helps.

On the other hand, we're all about the pornographic nudity here in the States!  I never understood why people think the US is full of prudes while sexuality and nudity are more accepted in Europe.  Have you been to the US?  Bah!

We've got plenty of artistic nudity, too.  The only time people get upset about nudity is when it's put into a product that their children are likely to use.  M rating or no, children are going to play DA2.  You can blame parents for letting their children use products that the ESRB recommends for 17+, but the simpler solution is to just not put nudity in video games.  There are plenty of ways to create an authentic scene without it.

That's not to defend BioWare's horrible implementation in DA:O!  They can do better.

Ideally the PC build of DA2 would thus be the "Director's Cut" because of this, but I don't think EA and BioWare are brave enough to go down that route.

It has nothing to do with being brave and everything to do with dollars.  Almost every major retailer in the US won't sell AO games on their shelves.  That includes GameStop, Best Buy, Wal-Mart, and all the rest.  The only way that BioWare/EA could sell a "Director's Cut" with an AO rating is through their own website and (possibly) some D2D services.  I'm not sure if Steam would allow it.  Regardless, the limited market hardly seems worth the extra resources spent making some "more realistic" sex scenes.

Two things would need to happen first - the ESRB system would need revision so that the divide was at age 18, where gamers become "legal" to buy their own stuff, and Gamestop and other chains would need to be convinced to re-tool their policy to judge each game based on its own merits, rather than just a blanket ban...I wish all you US gamers the best in your efforts towards making these things happen (hey, optimist!) :happy:

No, the ESRB just needs to adjust the M (17+) rating to more closely match the NC-17 rating that films have.  That wouldn't get stores to carry the games, though.  That would just be bad policy.  Stores like GameStop are often very small and are frequented by young children.  Larger stores like Best Buy and Wal-Mart just don't carry anything that's NC-17, AO, etc. because they want to appeal to families with children.  If Wal-Mart started carrying AO games, they'd lose a lot of revenue.  There's no incentive for them to reassess their blanket ban on such products.

And seriously, stop acting like Europe is some magical place where sex and nudity are okay while the US is some land full of prudes.  There's plenty of sex and nudity to be found here.  Indeed, I'd say that I encounter something sexual or sexually suggestive far more often here than I ever did in the UK, Germany, or elsewhere.  The people making a big deal out of nudity here are a very, very small minority.  Mostly, they're religious fanatics and people who just want to be on TV.  You know, the "think of the children" types.  Idiots, really.  The vast majority of us are just fine with sex and nudity.   Hell, look at where most of the porn comes from! 

[Archereon]

After re-reading this thread, I believe I owe its posters an apology. Somehow, when I first looked through this thread, I got the impression there were far more saying things along the lines of "Come on, give us ******! @_@" then there actually were. While I feel that full nudity is unnecessary, I would not be dead set against it if it is done maturely, rather than done in a manner obviously meant to please the adolescent male crowd.

[term8]

AlexXIV wrote...

term8 wrote...

I think one the biggest problem with arguing a point like this is that some have an inability to understand how nudity can be used for anything other than sexual arousal.

Right, I'd like to know.

why did michelangelo sculpt david in the nude?

[Dave of Canada]

AlexXIV wrote...

On my list of '1000 important things in an RPG' nudity is number 1001. Sorry but I feel safe to say the majority of people doesn't want it and some will even be put off and not buying the game. Especially parents who buy it for their kids.

The game is rated M already, parents who purchase those games shouldn't be outraged when mature content is shown to them. While I'm not for the full blown nudity, I find it outrageous when parents freak out about those sorts of things in games when they were the one who didn't read the ESRB (or whatever) warning.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 20 août 2010 - 09:33 .