1507 réponses à ce sujet

[tpryan01]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

I love Bioware and their games obviously and obviously they appeal to females when somemone explains them

You know, this is why Radical Feminists are looked don upon by their own gender: it's because they believe that other women are stupid.

lol 

not how to play, but what makes the game worth playing

That's what I was saying. You are assuming that other women need it explained to them. You are assuming every other woman is stupid, consciously or not.

no. if nobody tells you you can play as a women why would you want to research it. 

[tpryan01]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

I simply said that of course you are going to have fewer females playing games where they cannot play as a female (meaning other games not bioware games)

More women saw The Expendables than men.

a. source
b. I like watching men. I don't want to be one. 

[iTomes]

"I cannot use RPGs in general as they are designed to exclude women"
"RPGs do not"

uuuuhhhhmmmm, yes, ill just leave it there... i guess...
1. i think i finally found out why nobody understands you: Because you switch from "marketing" to "in-game-content" bout every 10 seconds.
2. it would propably be polite to reply to the post Saibh made like 20 minutes ago... just a suggestion....

[iTomes]

tpryan01 wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

I love Bioware and their games obviously and obviously they appeal to females when somemone explains them

You know, this is why Radical Feminists are looked don upon by their own gender: it's because they believe that other women are stupid.

lol 

not how to play, but what makes the game worth playing

That's what I was saying. You are assuming that other women need it explained to them. You are assuming every other woman is stupid, consciously or not.

no. if nobody tells you you can play as a women why would you want to research it. 

a) because its a BioWare game.
because gender of the main character propably is not the main point about a game.
c) because you usually get informed that you can play a female, even tough its not always in the trailers, but for example mr. laidlaw said "you can also be female" on the gamescom presentation.

[AlanC9]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

iTomes wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...
....and I cannot use RPGs in general as they are designed to exclude women.

Designed to exclude women?

to be specific they do not offer women the option to play as women and are therefore not encouraging female play

lolwut again???? what are you referring to??

She's referring to the RPGs in her Perceived Reality of Female Oppression.

Hey, maybe she was just psychologically damaged when she tried to play Planescape: Torment. Or maybe Ultima: Ascenscion. 

Were there any other prominent RPGs that don't allow a female PC? Maybe JRPGs? Don't play those myself

[tpryan01]

Saibh wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

but I should retype the same thing on every new page.

Ask me a specific question that has to do with whether bioware's current marketing campaign appeals to a female audience.

Again. You are completely ignoring the argument I made. We are not here to ask you questions and listen to your sage answers. You have not presented your argument well enough if you just have to keep going back to the base arguments being made--that just means that someone is failing to understand the point the other is making. In either case, a change in tactics is needed--either to clarify, or to prove your point, or to present counterpoints.

In layman's terms:

You make an argument.
Someone counters.
You counter.
They counter.
You go back to point a)
They go to point

This is the point where you need to present something new to validate your answer, or someone else needs to jump in and provide another opinion. If you are stuck in a proverbial revolving debate door, you should have the conclusive evidence you need to successfully counter their argument. I have yet to see you do it. I see holes, and I see others pointing them out, but you just go back to point a).

Not all arguments are meant to be 'won', but I see you as someone who believes they are right.

I am gont to take a breather. I think people did get confused as to marketing ref and my personal play tastes.

I just don't see where anyone has denied the basic premise of the OP.  

You should tell people how awesome your product is. 

She's referring to the RPGs in her Perceived Reality of Female Oppression.

when did I intimate I was being oppressed? 

Modifié par tpryan01, 23 août 2010 - 08:12 .

[AlanC9]

tpryan01 wrote...

no. if nobody tells you you can play as a women why would you want to research it. 

Hmm....you're assuming that RPGs don't let you play as a woman, so therefore you don't research to actually find out if RPGs let you play as a woman....

[iTomes]

"Were there any other prominent RPGs that don't allow a female PC? Maybe JRPGs? Don't play those myself"

the witcher, but considering that its about a figure that already has a series of five books and 2 shortnovel collections there wasn't much of a choice. also the "gothic-bealikes" but thats just part of their gameplay (for example two worlds).

[marquiseondore]

AlanC9 wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

no. if nobody tells you you can play as a women why would you want to research it. 

Hmm....you're assuming that RPGs don't let you play as a woman, so therefore you don't research to actually find out if RPGs let you play as a woman....

I only found out you could play a female Shepard during the Bioware Bazaar. 

[Sternchen]

I think women can put them in men´s place, better, than man in women´s. So we have no problem to see our femal avatar instaed of Hawk.

[marquiseondore]

AlanC9 wrote...

Were there any other prominent RPGs that don't allow a female PC? Maybe JRPGs? Don't play those myself

I think Dragon Quest 8.  Most JRPGs let you switch out party members.

[iTomes]

Sternchen wrote...

I think women can put them in men´s place, better, than man in women´s. So we have no problem to see our femal avatar instaed of Hawk.

im mostly playing female characters, so either im an exception conferming the rule or your statement is wrong.

Modifié par iTomes, 23 août 2010 - 08:19 .

[Jean]

iTomes wrote...

Sternchen wrote...

I think women can put them in men´s place, better, than man in women´s. So we have no problem to see our femal avatar instaed of Hawk.

im mostly playing female characters, so either im an exception conferming the rule or your statement is wrong.

I usually play as males with the occasional female, so I must be as well.

[Saibh]

tpryan01 wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

I love Bioware and their games obviously and obviously they appeal to females when somemone explains them

You know, this is why Radical Feminists are looked don upon by their own gender: it's because they believe that other women are stupid.

lol 

not how to play, but what makes the game worth playing

That's what I was saying. You are assuming that other women need it explained to them. You are assuming every other woman is stupid, consciously or not.

no. if nobody tells you you can play as a women why would you want to research it. 

Because you're a gamer. Video games appeal to gamers. Like I said earlier, I don't personally believe video game trailers are meant to be seen on TV, save the spots, because I never see them there. They don't really go into depth about what the game is like. They're so abstract that they'd better have some sort of theme to them (THIS IS THE NEW ****, amirite?) if people want to make the connection in their heads. Also, I'd like to point out that when I saw the JE trailers, I didn't realize that Wu was playable--I thought she was a party member, because seeing multiple player characters in the same trailer is plain confusing.

The industry ropes in new players generally by word of mouth. Your friends are playing games, they like games, they have you play games, you become a gamer. Video game marketing is meant to appeal to those who already play games. Generally you find out more about a game by doing research. You hear about it somehow, and you look it up. I detailed this all earlier.

[AlanC9]

iTomes wrote...

"Were there any other prominent RPGs that don't allow a female PC? Maybe JRPGs? Don't play those myself"
the witcher, but considering that its about a figure that already has a series of five books and 2 shortnovel collections there wasn't much of a choice. also the "gothic-bealikes" but thats just part of their gameplay (for example two worlds).

Whoops! I guess I was blocking out that one because of all of the threads lately

[Maverick827]

In this day and age you should just assume you can play both genders in RPGs rather than assuming you can only play one. If a week before the game comes out you read a preview saying otherwise, that is when you can be disappointed.

[Bryy_Miller]

tpryan01 wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...



I love Bioware and their games obviously and obviously they appeal to females when somemone explains them

You know, this is why Radical Feminists are looked don upon by their own gender: it's because they believe that other women are stupid.

lol



not how to play, but what makes the game worth playing

That's what I was saying. You are assuming that other women need it explained to them. You are assuming every other woman is stupid, consciously or not.

no. if nobody tells you you can play as a women why would you want to research it.

That is amazing logic. "Why would you do research yourself if nobody tells you anything".

tpryan01 wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

tpryan01 wrote...



I simply said that of course you are going to have fewer females playing games where they cannot play as a female (meaning other games not bioware games)

More women saw The Expendables than men.

a. source

The fact that you are even asking for a source says a lot, really.

tpryan01 wrote...



when did I intimate I was being oppressed?

In every single one of your posts.

[AlanC9]

Anyone remember the KotOR commercial? I thought Bastila was a PC when I first saw it. I guess that's one way to handle this issue.

[marquiseondore]

The majority of my purchases are spontaneous. I scan the game covers, read the back. If I'm looking through amazon, I read the descriptions.

In the case of Mass Effect I wouldn't have known you could play a female Shepard. 

[Bryy_Miller]

marquiseondore wrote...

In the case of Mass Effect I wouldn't have known you could play a female Shepard. 

omg it is proof of tpryan's claims!

[Wolfarcher28x]

tpryan01 wrote...

One problem I had with the marketing of DAO and ME and ME2 was that until I was told by a male (months after the game came out) that I could play as a female I had no idea that it was possible.

I understand that it is mentioned in articles about the game, but in all marketing materials the featured character is male as it has been in ME, ME2, DA:O and DA:O-A.

To be clear I really don't care what the specifics of what the female hawke will look like.

I am only concerned in how more NEW female gamers can be brought into the game.

This is a thread about marketing, not accusations of offense.

Have you tried showing any of the DA2 marketing materials to female gamers not familiar with DA:O?

What was their response?

dude settle down

[marquiseondore]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

marquiseondore wrote...

In the case of Mass Effect I wouldn't have known you could play a female Shepard. 

omg it is proof of tpryan's claims!

Shocking I know. To be fair, I don't think most games would make that distintion. It's not a deterrent, though in Mass Effect's case had I not known I would have passed this game up because of the way male Shepard looks.

[AlanC9]

tpryan01 wrote...

"I cannot use RPGs in general as they are designed to exclude women"
RPGs that do not offer a female mode are more difficult for a female to relate to than one with a female model.

Right. The problem with this "argument" is that only a tiny minority of RPGs require a male PC. The Witcher, Planescape, Ultima: Ascension... I'll add Wizardry IV because you have to play as Werdna. Any others?

Modifié par AlanC9, 23 août 2010 - 08:57 .

[Saibh]

marquiseondore wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

marquiseondore wrote...

In the case of Mass Effect I wouldn't have known you could play a female Shepard. 

omg it is proof of tpryan's claims!

Shocking I know. To be fair, I don't think most games would make that distintion. It's not a deterrent, though in Mass Effect's case had I not known I would have passed this game up because of the way male Shepard looks.

Okay, well, that's you. Like I said, the industry is interested in selling games to gamers. Generally, gamers research topics before buying the game. Reading the back of the box is--and I don't mean this with any insult--one of the things we learn early on not to buy a game on the basis of. Some gamers rely solely on word of mouth, and that's a very valid way to buy a game, too.

In all cases, yes, I think it would benefit to see a femHawke trailer. Not a Blur one, mind you. I think, however, the problem people are having with this thread is some of the women's sense of entitlement, without understanding of the various machinations that go on for video game marketing.