40 réponses à ce sujet

[termokanden]

I decided to try and see if 2h warriors are as crappy as it seems from reading the forums here, just out of curiosity (I tend to try everything for some reason). Was expecting low dps, low survivability. Crap basically.

I realized that:

1. 2h warriors are supposed to go for the most powerful enemy and neutralize them. You have many tools for this and it can be done while killing them. Knockdowns and stuns surprisingly even work on some bosses. It completely trivializes some fights to just find that dangerous enemy in the back and open with Pommel Strike while your tank mops up the easy mobs.

2. I don't know about actual DPS, but it feels like I'm doing plenty of damage. It's still probably miles behind DW, but it doesn't feel like it, which is good enough for me. At this point my swings are still slow (no Haste yet), but I am one-shotting normal mobs with Mighty Blow or Critical Strike.

3. Unlike with other classes, everything must be timed perfectly to work. You don't start a swing then interrupt it with a power. I wonder how many people have low DPS with 2h because they get this wrong.

4. Talents are incredibly awkward and confusing. For example, it appears that Critical Strike and Mighty Blow do the same thing. Yet Critical Strike is a top tier talent. From what I read, Mighty Blow is actually slightly BETTER. Pure insanity.

5. The early levels are horrible as 2h. It gets MUCH better if you have some DLC items. The armor from Leliana's Song in particular is excellent.

6. Later in the game, 2h wars can do good AoE damage. Particularly in Awakening it is quite insane.

7. Most importantly. You're not just autoattacking with insane DPS. You are using your abilities, and how you use them has a HUGE impact on the game. This makes playing a 2h war fun (to me at least).

Build? Everything's completely obvious here. All points into strength. Go for Death Blow and 2h talents. Champion for the first specialization, whatever you want after that.

[ezrafetch]

2H warriors struggle really early due to lack of talents available for spamming and the lack of stamina which would allow for talent spamming. I still consider 2H the best tank overall simply because Indomitable means no stuns, no knockdowns. 2H Sweep is great CC, and with Reaver/Champion/Templar (any two specs works) you have access to two other great CC skills, which means you can pretty much control the battlefield.

Personally I went with Templar/Reaver since I built mine to tank with 100% Spell Resist: Knight-Commander's Plate, Spellward, Dweomer Runes in my CGM. Also, running as few sustainables as possible seems ideal as it maximizes talent spamming, which ruled out Champion for me.

Modifié par ezrafetch, 23 août 2010 - 11:08 .

[termokanden]

I took Champion for Rally and the AoE knockdown, but I see your point.



As for the struggling, if you have Battledress of the Provocateur and the High Regard of House Dace, you can spam abilities from the beginning.

[DapperDan77]

termokanden wrote...

As for the struggling, if you have Battledress of the Provocateur and the High Regard of House Dace, you can spam abilities from the beginning.

If you're short on stam, the GoA mage belt can help with that too, at least early on, then you can pass it on to your mage when you get something better.

[termokanden]

Yep, I actually wore that for a while too until I got the Archivist's Sash. Now Wynne has it to boost her blood magic

Modifié par termokanden, 24 août 2010 - 12:12 .

[ezrafetch]

termokanden wrote...

As for the struggling, if you have Battledress of the Provocateur and the High Regard of House Dace, you can spam abilities from the beginning.

I didn't have either DLC when I ran my 2H Warrior, so that likely explains a whole lot of it...

[Last Darkness]

The problem most people have is that it starts very difficult and weak, and they auto attack instead of use skills.

[termokanden]

Yep. Even if you have stam at the beginning, you still only have a couple of skills with long cooldowns. Mostly it's autoattack.



Once you get decent strength and most of them, it's much more fun. Haste is also very, very good to have. It was OK early on, but now I'm level 12 and really enjoying my 2h war. Clearly powerful now, and I'm noticing that some fights are easier than I remember them simply because I can knock down and stun everything. Plus a dwarf with a 2-hander looks amazing.



I chose champion for my first spec. Not sure what to choose for the second. Berserker is nice in theory, but it sucks up too much stam. Don't really see the point in Reaver either, so I guess it must be Templar. But then again, apart from being able to wear one piece of armor, there's nothing from Templar I want. Sigh, choices!

[Gnoster]

I finished Origins with my first 2-hander not long ago, and I am soon done with Awakening as well.
In Origins I really enjoyed having Templar and Champion specs, the extra crowd control combined with Rally attack bonus and Templar resistances really meant a lot. In Awakening I have to admit that Champion haven't been used that much, since everything dies way too fast to use that crowd control.
What I am finding somehwat curious in Awakening is that Chasind Great Maul, which is the best dps weapon in Origins seems to be also the best dps weapon in Awakening. That 1.25 strength modifier is when at level 30+ putting the maul over Vigilence in dps, which somehow is a bit of a same as I see it (afterall Vigilence is 2 item levels higher).
Regarding attributes I chose to go 16 Cunning (for Coercion), 30 Willpower to avoid any stamnia problems, and rest into strength - this was Origins. In Awakening I have chosen to level my Dexterity also for a nice bow (not that I use it much, but I have more than enough points for deal enough damage).

Modifié par Gnoster, 24 août 2010 - 11:32 .

[ashwind]

termokanden wrote...
I chose champion for my first spec. Not sure what to choose for the second. Berserker is nice in theory, but it sucks up too much stam. Don't really see the point in Reaver either, so I guess it must be Templar. But then again, apart from being able to wear one piece of armor, there's nothing from Templar I want. Sigh, choices!

I picked Berserker because I gain a passive 2 STR, not much but better than nothing. Later in the game, you can use Berserk always because Stam regen will no longer be a problem. 

[Haplose]

termokanden wrote...
Don't really see the point in Reaver either, so I guess it must be Templar. But then again, apart from being able to wear one piece of armor, there's nothing from Templar I want. Sigh, choices!

Well how about ANOTHER AOE stun - this time long range too! Especially effective vs mages.

[termokanden]

I am going nuts with Chasind Great Maul at the moment. It's a beast of a weapon for sure.

I'm level 14 at the moment and I as far as I can remember I'm currently at 66 strength (unbuffed), having put everything except 1 point into it. There's still one more Mortal Essence tome to buy. In any case, damage is very good and I can spam abilities.

Too many talent points now though!

Haplose wrote...

termokanden wrote...
Don't really see the point in Reaver either, so I guess it must be Templar. But then again, apart from being able to wear one piece of armor, there's nothing from Templar I want. Sigh, choices!

Well how about ANOTHER AOE stun - this time long range too! Especially effective vs mages.

Which one is the AoE stun then? Excuse me if this is a stupid question, I never played a Reaver. From the descriptions, the only crowd control seems to be a targeted (i.e. single target) fear.

There is an AoE stun from Warden's Keep though.

In any case, Berserk just seems infinitely better than Blood Frenzy, given that you have to reach 20% health to get as much of a bonus with Blood Frenzy as Berserk.

Modifié par termokanden, 25 août 2010 - 10:47 .

[DWSmiley]

The +8 damage from berserk is pretty trivial for a two-hander. I'd rather have the crowd/mage control that the other warrior specs offer.

[termokanden]

If you really want to get 100% spell resist, Templar is of course good. Apart from that... meh.



Berserker is for the passive +2 strength. It's negligible. But there's just not that much that's actually good for 2h wars.

[ezrafetch]

Holy Smite (last Templar talent) is an AoE knockdown skill that's super-super- good vs. mages. You can plant it anywhere you want (i.e. across the room) making it a pretty good skill.

[Elhanan]

Berserker dmg bonus may only work on auto-attacks. However, the Stamina restoration bonsus may be quite helpful.

Templar is a good spec for anti-mage/magic.

[Haplose]

termokanden wrote...

Haplose wrote...

termokanden wrote...
Don't really see the point in Reaver either, so I guess it must be Templar. But then again, apart from being able to wear one piece of armor, there's nothing from Templar I want. Sigh, choices!

Well how about ANOTHER AOE stun - this time long range too! Especially effective vs mages.

Which one is the AoE stun then? Excuse me if this is a stupid question, I never played a Reaver. From the descriptions, the only crowd control seems to be a targeted (i.e. single target) fear.

There is an AoE stun from Warden's Keep though.

In any case, Berserk just seems infinitely better than Blood Frenzy, given that you have to reach 20% health to get as much of a bonus with Blood Frenzy as Berserk.

Like ezrafetch wrote, it would be Templar's Holy Smite.

[termokanden]

Oh I thought you meant Reaver actually. Point taken then, you do get that from Templar.

Elhanan wrote...

Berserker dmg bonus may only work on auto-attacks. However, the Stamina restoration bonsus may be quite helpful.
Templar is a good spec for anti-mage/magic.

I was under the impression that Berserk costs you 1 stam/sec even with Constraint, and that there are no bonuses when you are not berserking.

[ezrafetch]

termokanden wrote...

Elhanan wrote...

Berserker dmg bonus may only work on auto-attacks. However, the Stamina restoration bonsus may be quite helpful.
Templar is a good spec for anti-mage/magic.

I was under the impression that Berserk costs you 1 stam/sec even with Constraint, and that there are no bonuses when you are not berserking.

Berserk imposes a stamina regeneration penalty which Constraint reduces.  Resilience adds health regeneration.  Oddly enough, according to the wikia, Constraint on consoles adds enough stamina renegeration to offset Berserk and then some.  Should have known this (I'm on 360)...I would've picked up Berserker instead of Reaver.

[termokanden]

I'm on the PC however, so for me using berserk is strictly a stam loss.



Odd that there is a difference.

[ezrafetch]

termokanden wrote...

I'm on the PC however, so for me using berserk is strictly a stam loss.

Odd that there is a difference.

I'm guessing that the difference is because they toned difficulty down a bit for consoles, and one way was increasing stamina regeneration for consoles on various items and skills.  It gets rather silly, especially for Arcane Warriors...I've hit around +19 mana regeneration/sec...

That being said with Constraint, Berserk only makes you lose 1 stamina/sec which is already offset by the 2nd tier of the Combat Mastery skill.  So it's not like it's difficult to still regenerate mana for attacks.

Modifié par ezrafetch, 25 août 2010 - 10:41 .

[termokanden]

Indeed. The fatigue will probably have a greater impact. I also find berserk annoying. I do not use mods, and so I am stuck with a version that turns itself off automatically and is put on cooldown.

[beancounter501]

That is my main gripe with Zerker - the stupid animation you have to launch at the start of every battle. I find the best spot for a Two Hand Warrior is in the lead, charge right into a room and unleash a Sweep, then War Cry. Spending time Zerking means either the whole party has to wait for the animation or I can not lead in with that character. IF you don't mind some micro you can move the second the Berserk icon shows up, which will break the animation and save you a second or two.



For me the best 2 Hand specs are Champion/Templar or Champion/Reaver. Freightning Appearance is good early on, but late game I can kill so fast there is no need for a single target lockdown. Rather have the group stuns from Champion and Templar.

[Last Darkness]

Berserk on twohanded warriors is completly useless. After I complete my Berserk Manga armor mod and comining it with the dragon slayer sword mod im considering making a optional file for it that changes berserk to be more lucrative to all types of warriors, not just two handed. For starters I wanna change it so that it has a health regen penalty but a nice stam regen element to make it more in line with the concept of berserking. I also am conidering dropping the damage bonus in favour for a Str bonus or something since you only need about 14 Str to = +8 damage so this would allow it to apply to skills.

[termokanden]

A major gripe I have with all melee is that sometimes you are stuck in the finishing move animation in the middle of a large fight. Really annoying!



What's even worse is that for 2-handers the move is clearly for sharp weapons and doesn't really fit a maul.